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Tiamat

Lifer
Nov 25, 2003
14,068
5
71
700$ headphones can be and usually is much superior to 700$ speakers in terms of sound quality since the room is taken out of the equation (the variable which wreaks the most havok with sound). However, Stereo through stereo speakers will always sound better, to me than stereo through headphones assuming both are at least of decent quality because the headphones give me that "sound inside my head" feeling which I do not like. Binaural through headphones sounds superior than stereo through stereo speakers in my opinion however. For headphone listening, binaural is where its at!

Nanostuff, do you have a collection of binaural recordings? If not, you *need* to get your some!
 

NanoStuff

Banned
Mar 23, 2006
2,981
1
0
That's working backwards, I don't choose music based on whether it's binaural or not, unfortunately nothing is binaural, nothing worth listening to anyways. I use steinberg's externalizer plugin, which amongst other things has a pinna filter and crossfeed. It's the only such plugin I've found that doesn't manage to destroy the sound through it's process. All HRTFs I've tried, including Kemar cause serious problems. It doesn't completely 'externalize' the sound, but it's a big plus anyhow, pretty much essential.
 

Tiamat

Lifer
Nov 25, 2003
14,068
5
71
Originally posted by: NanoStuff
That's working backwards, I don't choose music based on whether it's binaural or not, unfortunately nothing is binaural, nothing worth listening to anyways. I use steinberg's externalizer plugin, which amongst other things has a pinna filter and crossfeed. It's the only such plugin I've found that doesn't manage to destroy the sound through it's process. All HRTFs I've tried, including Kemar cause serious problems. It doesn't completely 'externalize' the sound, but it's a big plus anyhow, pretty much essential.

Well, you are definitely entitled to your opinion. Mine is such that I ensure that the source is the most beneficial state for the output device I choose - if I am able to, then I seek out what I like. I never stated that I chose music based on binaural or not, rather, I simply stated that it exists and can sound excellent on headphones. Stereo just does not sound good through headphones over extended listening periods do to the "in your head" type sound. I listen to a lot of symphonic music, and there are few that are in binaural, especially from Milwaukee Symphony Orchestra. These recordings produce a nice soundstage without the in-your-head type sound. Because there arent many, I stick with stereo playback on my stereo and I get much more enjoyment out of this type of setup.

Now, this thread is about pics, lets just leave it at that. If you would like to continue this conversation, which may be considered interesting to others, it would be better to start a new thread. Afterall, we do now have a dedicated forum for these things finally and I do not want this thread to be derailed.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,949
16,208
126
Originally posted by: Maiora
One day, I would like to own a pair of Duntech Sovereign and a pair of old Tannoy Westminster.

I have a pair of Sovereigns on one of my systems. They were a good match for my FM Acoustics Resolution 811 amp.

Bastardo! Stop gloating...
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,949
16,208
126
Originally posted by: NanoStuff
If I understand your definition of tight, it means high resolution. So yes electrostats are about as tight as you can get. The thing here is, you can adjust the sound to your preference, if it's too 'tight', you can 'untighten' it with customization/plugins, you can't make a slowly responsive speaker faster however, it's a physical limitation. I like my audio to be 'reference', that is to properly reproduce source material without adding coloration, which is why I prefer pro audio over home audio. You can put any number of names on a speaker that cannot faithfully reproduce source material. You can call it warm, soft, 'untight', 'british sounding', but all of those are really the same thing, a speaker that distorts the input signal.

One day you will get a pair of Duntechs or Tannoys, because they're apparently not too tight for you, I however will one day rid myself of speakers and headphones altogether and get myself an audio input device that surpasses natural hearing itself. This will most likely be a cochlear, cochlear nucleus or auditory nerve implant. They already surpass natural hearing in at least one fundamental aspect, minimum perceivable amplitude differences between two sounds. The cause for this is the bypass of cochlear compression, or the mechanical conduction in the cochlear fluid, and possibly the entire conduction from the tympanic membrane up. Still ways to go, but that's sound quality that can't even be imagined. While I do prefer headphones at the moment, in reality any headphone or speaker to date is a crude air stirring device that could never ever at least match the perception of a real life sound, much less surpass it in objective sound quality. Neither speakers or headphones can or will get much better than what they are today, the only direction left to go is small, internal and non-mechanical. Headphones just happen to be closer to that ideal than speakers I've always considered the idea of 5 or worse, 7 speakers an absurd solution for two ears.

Nope, tight as in it sounds forced. Not too natural. I don't really see any difference between heaphones and speakers. They make sound exactly the same way. You prefer to emit sound right in your ear, I prefer not to.

Given current technology, going multiple speakers was just to make the speaker's job easier.

Of course nothing will surpass 'Matrix' type connection to your brain, but I am not sure I want to do that

 

NanoStuff

Banned
Mar 23, 2006
2,981
1
0
Originally posted by: sdifox
Nope, tight as in it sounds forced.
If reproducing input accurately is 'forcing', fine then, I like my music 'forced' . Doesn't get any more natural than giving what you're getting. Unless by natural you mean you want your speaker to sound like a tree.

 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,949
16,208
126
Originally posted by: NanoStuff
Originally posted by: sdifox
Nope, tight as in it sounds forced.
If reproducing input accurately is 'forcing', fine then, I like my music 'forced' . Doesn't get any more natural than giving what you're getting. Unless by natural you mean you want your speaker to sound like a tree.

Essentially, when you have a small enclosure, you have to overload the driver to produce desired SPL. That is what I mean by forced. You are squeezing out the sound. It sounds like it is taking a lot of effort to get that sound out, that is what I am referring as tight. I want accuracy, but not at the extend of having to push the driver to the limit to get it.
 

NanoStuff

Banned
Mar 23, 2006
2,981
1
0
Originally posted by: sdifox
Essentially, when you have a small enclosure, you have to overload the driver to produce desired SPL. That is what I mean by forced. You are squeezing out the sound. It sounds like it is taking a lot of effort to get that sound out, that is what I am referring as tight. I want accuracy, but not at the extend of having to push the driver to the limit to get it.

No, when you have a small enclosure you have high acoustic suspension, with an equivalent Cas mechanical suspension of the driver, you have a speaker with high damping. This reduces sensitivity, naturally, but only to the extent that a long decay would increase efficiency, which is roughly 1dB, at a very substantial trade-off to sound quality. You may want to read about displacement, compliance, Qts and so on of speakers and understand how this relates to objective performance measurements. All you're really doing by describing it as tight and natural is using abstract terms for complex phenomena you do not understand. I could for example call my headphones transparent and snappy, but this is just as meaningless to you as tight and natural is to me.

It further confuses the situation when you say Genelecs are amongst the only monitors you like. Genelecs are high quality speakers, they have about as clear a transfer function as pretty much any top speaker available. This is a necessity because they are monitors, and such is a requirement for monitoring purposes, yet from what you said, I see no indication that you would like these speakers. It only demonstrates the ambiguity of your terms for tight and natural, and perhaps suggests that there was a large factor of source material and room influence affecting your decision, making it very incomparable.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,949
16,208
126
Originally posted by: NanoStuff
Originally posted by: sdifox
Essentially, when you have a small enclosure, you have to overload the driver to produce desired SPL. That is what I mean by forced. You are squeezing out the sound. It sounds like it is taking a lot of effort to get that sound out, that is what I am referring as tight. I want accuracy, but not at the extend of having to push the driver to the limit to get it.

No, when you have a small enclosure you have high acoustic suspension, with an equivalent Cas mechanical suspension of the driver, you have a speaker with high damping. This reduces sensitivity, naturally, but only to the extent that a long decay would increase efficiency, which is roughly 1dB, at a very substantial trade-off to sound quality. You may want to read about displacement, compliance, Qts and so on of speakers and understand how this relates to objective performance measurements. All you're really doing by describing it as tight and natural is using abstract terms for complex phenomena you do not understand. I could for example call my headphones transparent and snappy, but this is just as meaningless to you as tight and natural is to me.

It further confuses the situation when you say Genelecs are amongst the only monitors you like. Genelecs are high quality speakers, they have about as clear a transfer function as pretty much any top speaker available. This is a necessity because they are monitors, and such is a requirement for monitoring purposes, yet from what you said, I see no indication that you would like these speakers. It only demonstrates the ambiguity of your terms for tight and natural, and perhaps suggests that there was a large factor of source material and room influence affecting your decision, making it very incomparable.

I liked the Genelecs when I heard them in a studio setup, doesn't mean I would buy them. I am not big fans of near field monitors, since they don't suit my listening configuration.

And you don't think it is possible that I like different kinds of speakers? All speakers have colouration, same with headphones, you just have to pick the colourations that agree with you.

Trust me, I don't depend on room mode to decide what speakers I like and what speakers I don't like.
 

vshah

Lifer
Sep 20, 2003
19,003
24
81
a few more pics for the thread
this is at home in new delhi...setup at college is much more modest.

front: b&w matrix 802 s2
center: b&w htm7
front speakers, covers off
sub: asw675
side: dm604 s3
604 - covers off
rear - dm600 s3
naked babies

av cabinet: right side
top to bottom: denon 4306
xbox (xbmc)
shitty dvd player
nad cd player
shitty satellite box
tape deck

av cabinet: left side
top left: junk of wires, some sennheiser wireless headphones for nighttime (since its right next to the bedroom)
top right: denon direct drive turntable (under a cover)
bottom left: active servo voltage regulator
bottom right: a router, lots of wires, etc.

panny ae700u
front of room
back of room
screen down

2nd screen for quick tv etc.

 

btdvox

Member
Jun 8, 2005
193
0
0
My 3 setups (from best to worst)
http://i44.photobucket.com/alb...15/btdvox/P5180017.jpg
http://i44.photobucket.com/alb...15/btdvox/P5180016.jpg (New samsung HLT 5687LED DLP this years model)
http://i44.photobucket.com/alb...15/btdvox/PICT0006.jpg
(This got replaced with this years Samsung HPT4254 because of a hdmi defect) I moved the PS3 to the DLP set up.
The wife's setup: http://i44.photobucket.com/alb...15/btdvox/PICT0043.jpg Toshiba 32 " LCD + wii

Overall I never liked Rear Projection TV's but the LED DLP I bought beats them all incl the Plasma to me. The plasma barely gets used now its more for Decor I guess. the LED DLP has faboulus blacks and color, and watching HD DVD's and Blu rays and not to mention gaming is awesome.
It also acts as a really really nice Computer Display @1080p and has minimal overscan using the "Just Scan" mode. less then 3% id say.

sorry for the bad photos, I have the oldest camera in the world lol.
 

Tiamat

Lifer
Nov 25, 2003
14,068
5
71
I never really liked running bridged mode with my amp. The trade-off of more headroom and summed distortion was leaning towards the latter as I never really listened loud enough continuously to take full advantage of the headroom gain.

You couldn't hook up your NAD amps to the denon's preouts? Or did you just not have the real estate to house the amps?
 

agibby5

Senior member
Jun 23, 2004
990
0
76
Originally posted by: Tiamat
Originally posted by: agibby5
Here's my temporary setup until I get my own house/apartment (at my Dad's):


From afar

Computer section (rig internals)

Entertainment Section

Thats pretty neat for a temp setup! What I ended up doing, as you can see from my pix, is combining my computer w/ "ht". I found having a dedicated computer monitor and TV was too cumbersome (took up too much space). So far, its working well.


I like mine together like this simply because I have a VGA hooked up right from teh PC to the HDTV. I like watching movies on a nice screen

Yeah its temporary in that I will have the same equipment (most likely) and will just have a different location to put it all. I wanted to make note of the temporary setup since it looks like its really jammed into such a small space. (My room is like 9ft x 11ft and currently houses me and my girlfirend.)
 

vshah

Lifer
Sep 20, 2003
19,003
24
81
Originally posted by: Tiamat
I never really liked running bridged mode with my amp. The trade-off of more headroom and summed distortion was leaning towards the latter as I never really listened loud enough continuously to take full advantage of the headroom gain.

You couldn't hook up your NAD amps to the denon's preouts? Or did you just not have the real estate to house the amps?

real estate was one concern, and also those amps are usa 115v models, the system is in india right now, (220v). the denon reciever is local, and even though we have a step down transformer for a few other things i wouldn't feel comfortable running two power amps off it. voltage fluctuates too much, even with a stabilizer. so they're packed away safe and sound until my parents move back to the states in a few years.
 

krotchy

Golden Member
Mar 29, 2006
1,942
0
76
Ok, finally got time to upload my setup here. Been kinda busy with moving and work the last couple months and have been MIA on the forums mostly. Anyways, heres my setup

Pic 1
Pic 2

Current Setup:

TV :
Philips 47PFL7422D/37 47in 1080p LCD TV with Perfect Pixel Plus HD

HTPC:
SilverStone LC16M Silver Case w/Imon VFD and Remote
Windows Vista 64 Bit
ATI Radeon HD 2600XT
Asus A8N32-SLI Deluxe
AMD FX-60 cooled with Zerotherm BTF90
SATA 18x DVD Drive
WD Raptor 74GB Boot Drive
Western Digital Elements 500GB External Media Drive (I move this between bedroom and here with all my media)

Amp/Speakers - Onkyo HTS-590S Home Theater in a Box

Other Components:
Nintendo Wii
Xbox 360
Comcast HD-DVR
Logitech Harmony 676 Remote Control
Logitech LX710 Wireless Keyboard + Laser Mouse

To Do List:
Get a better audio system with powered sub. Most likely I am going to go with an Onkyo 605 or 705 Receiver as I do like their Receivers alot. Not sure about speakers yet, but I know I want a powered sub. My current HTIB will go nicely in my bedroom on my computer. My biggest issue is the shape of the room will be complicated for getting a 7.1 System up and running, but If I mount the speakers on the wall it might be doable. I am still looking into it.

Sell the Raptor boot drive in the HTPC and replace it with 2-4 500GB+ drives for media storage, possibly Raid 1 or 1-0. (LC16M holds 6 drives technically, although 4 comfortably for airflow))

Get a PS3 and an Internal HD-DVD drive for the HTPC to get dual format playing abilities. This will likely be last by a lot because I am waiting for prices and format wars to stabilize a bit.
 

jpeyton

Moderator in SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones
Moderator
Aug 23, 2003
25,375
142
116
Originally posted by: krotchy
To Do List:
Add to this: rearrange my room.

Having your TV significantly off axis from both seating positions is less than ideal.
 
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