PREDICTION: Microsoft will lose hard on this generation.

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BeaviSKY

Member
May 30, 2013
28
0
0
Madden NFL 09 was the last game to come out for the Xbox. Microsoft shut down their servers a year after the last game for the Xbox came out.

Madden 09 would've released in Summer of '08 so it was closer to 2 years. But it's still a valid question.

And maybe someone went over this already, but Major Nelson said they wouldn't be bricking consoles when the day for shutting down XB One's Live service comes. I'm positive they wouldn't go that route. But the details could be sticky, especially with older (by then) consoles that might not be getting frequent use anymore.
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
Yeah, it's pretty hard to believe people are taking Sony, master of the DRM Virus as the lesser of these two evils. LOL

Who are these people, because he was the only one that brought up Sony in regards to that point/conversation.
 

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
Lets estimate a 7 year life cycle for the next console generation.

Xbone $500, you still need a basic PC $400, and seven years of Live 7 x $60 = $420. $500 + $400 + $420 = $1320 before we even include the games. $1320 makes a decent gaming computer plus a video card upgrade later.

Now let us add in the cost of games. PC games start $10 less, and usually $20 less with early sales, if you are willing to wait for months you can get games for as little as $10 to $20. So $20 less per game seems a reasonable average savings.

If you buy one PC game a month, you save $1680 over a 7 year period. If you are a casual gamer and only buy two games a year that's still $280 in savings by buying PC games.

So if you buy a game a month you can spend $1320 + $1680 = $3000 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer. If you are a casual gamer who only buys a couple of title a year, you can spend $1320 + $280 = $1600 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer.

When you add in the cost of games and Live, PC gaming can be cheaper than console gaming.

There's a big flaw here in saying that you still need a PC, because many console owners do not have a pc. However, that is pretty similar to the crazy people saying everyone in the world should have always on fast internet 24/7 as well that never goes out, so I'll give it to you.
 

torpid

Lifer
Sep 14, 2003
11,631
11
76
Lets estimate a 7 year life cycle for the next console generation.

Xbone $500, you still need a basic PC $400, and seven years of Live 7 x $60 = $420. $500 + $400 + $420 = $1320 before we even include the games. $1320 makes a decent gaming computer plus a video card upgrade later.

Now let us add in the cost of games. PC games start $10 less, and usually $20 less with early sales, if you are willing to wait for months you can get games for as little as $10 to $20. So $20 less per game seems a reasonable average savings.

If you buy one PC game a month, you save $1680 over a 7 year period. If you are a casual gamer and only buy two games a year that's still $280 in savings by buying PC games.

So if you buy a game a month you can spend $1320 + $1680 = $3000 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer. If you are a casual gamer who only buys a couple of title a year, you can spend $1320 + $280 = $1600 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer.

When you add in the cost of games and Live, PC gaming can be cheaper than console gaming.

A lot of assumptions there. If I already have a PC why do I still need to buy one? And I may or may not need XBox Live, depending on my needs.
 

Tweak155

Lifer
Sep 23, 2003
11,448
262
126
Lets estimate a 7 year life cycle for the next console generation.

Xbone $500, you still need a basic PC $400, and seven years of Live 7 x $60 = $420. $500 + $400 + $420 = $1320 before we even include the games. $1320 makes a decent gaming computer plus a video card upgrade later.

Now let us add in the cost of games. PC games start $10 less, and usually $20 less with early sales, if you are willing to wait for months you can get games for as little as $10 to $20. So $20 less per game seems a reasonable average savings.

If you buy one PC game a month, you save $1680 over a 7 year period. If you are a casual game and only buy two games a year that's still $280 in savings by buying PC games.

So if you buy a game a month you can spend $1320 + $1680 = $3000 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer. If you are a casual game who only buys a couple of title a year, you can spend $1320 + $280 = $1600 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer.

When you add in the cost of games and Live, PC gaming is cheaper than console gaming.

Considering Live does more than just enable multiplayer (and doesn't have to cost $60), and you don't have to pay full price for either set of games, not everyone needs a computer (not to mention this has ZERO impact on the cost of the console), this is pretty moot. You set the max price possible for everything console, and went pretty lenient on PC, a must to make any sort of valid point.

But yeah, keep on truckin'.
 

BeaviSKY

Member
May 30, 2013
28
0
0
Who are these people, because he was the only one that brought up Sony in regards to that point/conversation.

More of a general observation about the tone of this debate. Not just here, but elsewhere. As if Sony's some kind of consumer rights advocate or something. As has been pointed out...Sony's going to be utilizing DRM in the near future, if not immediately. If they allow game installs, they will DRM it. You can bank on that.

I just don't understand the point of giving them credit for a stance they're inevitably going to break.
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
More of a general observation about the tone of this debate. Not just here, but elsewhere. As if Sony's some kind of consumer rights advocate or something. As has been pointed out...Sony's going to be utilizing DRM in the near future, if not immediately. If they allow game installs, they will DRM it. You can bank on that.

I just don't understand the point of giving them credit for a stance they're inevitably going to break.

While I agree that we will be in a total digital future, it isn't now so we can't act like we know what is going to happen in the next gen.

As it stands now, Sony can allow installs and handle it just like the 360 currently does, this is a guess but it is the most logical and simple one as well. You install the game but have to have the disc in the machine for a check to make sure you actually own it. If it is a download, it will be tied to your PSN account and just have to log into it (and if it works like it does currently on the PS3 you don't even need to be on your PSN account to play the game downloaded onto the system).

So Sony isn't utilizing DRM in the near future or immediately as they already stated that the PS4 is going to work just like the PS360 in terms of DRM.

Sony doesn't have a clean track record either and when the time comes (possibly on the PS5) and they go full digital, we will see what their decisions are and how they plan to go about it. As it is now though, Sony is sticking with the same model we have been using on console gaming since it started.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
Yes, but that really isn't the comparison he's making. He's trying to say that PC's require upgrades while consoles don't and you get the same game, but what he's not really going into is that unless those same console games were made only for PC, or enhanced to have higher requirements, then there is no upgrade required at all. He's also failing to notice that most console games of last gen were not 1080p whereas all PC games could be. That alone may not justify the "cost", but it still invalidates his comparison.

BioShock Infinite came out on Xbox 360 and PC. If you can find me a PC from 2005 that cost $700 that can play BioShock Infinite at a comparable level to PC, I will concede my argument.

The fact that games don't run native at 1080p means nothing to console gamers. I don't care if it runs 240x200, as long as it looks good scaled to 1080 on my TV 10ft away and runs smoothly. Console gamers don't give a crap about numbers. PC gamers only do because they are 8 inches from their monitor, and even then, they cry about color reproduction or response time.

And I just checked: BioShock Infinite requires at least an 8800 GT, which came out after the Xbox 360 and probably cost about the time. I only know the GTX cost $650 because I bought it. =(
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
The 8800 GT was cheap I remember, I think it was like $200 maybe a little bit more, but right around that when it came out.
 

BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,540
16
0
The 8800GT came out roughly TWO YEARS after the 360.

The 8xxx series though came out in 2006 the same year as the PS3, only a year after the 360. I think an 8800GTX could do anything an 8800GT could do, 8800GTS wasn't too far behind.

A 360 from 2005 most likely died a long time ago, RRoD, and isn't around to play any games.
 
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KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
I didn't believe it so I went to Google/Bing and typed it in and got the same results lol

 

BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,540
16
0
Speaking of Bioshock Infinite, it was on sale for $29.99 on Steam less than a month after it came out. How much was it new on the 360?
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
Speaking of Bioshock Infinite, it was on sale for $29.99 on Steam less than a month after it came out. How much was it new on the 360?

Don't forget the amount of insane preorder deals that all the digital distributors were offering. Anyone that preordered it on the PC at a digital distro got Xcom Enemy Unknown at the very least, and in the vast majority of cases got more games (Bioshock 1/2 or both), credit, coupons, or some kind of combination of them all.
 

colonelciller

Senior member
Sep 29, 2012
915
0
0
I don't know why people call it grammar police/nazi. It's just a simple way of calling out someone's idiocy when it comes to basic spelling. If you cannot even spell a few simple words that you should have learned by the time you reach 3rd grade, how are people going to give you any credibility to your argument.

I am not the shining beacon when it comes to grammar or spelling, as English is not my first language, but it is still easy for me to discredit an adult who cannot spell a few basic, frequently-used words.

Then again, someone just enjoy the thrill of trolling.

grammar Nazis are douchebags. there is no excuse for grammar nazi douchery and there is no "discrediting" of anyone when the grammar nazi tactic is used. it does reveal the grammar nazi as an insecure douche though.
 

colonelciller

Senior member
Sep 29, 2012
915
0
0
I didn't believe it so I went to Google/Bing and typed it in and got the same results lol


the sad sad desparation of microsoft to rescue the failing reputation of their xbone DRM-infested NSA-backdoored orwellian-nightmare MPAA-wet-dream machine... always listening, always watching
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,931
5,803
126
Lets estimate a 7 year life cycle for the next console generation.

Xbone $500, you still need a basic PC $400, and seven years of Live 7 x $60 = $420. $500 + $400 + $420 = $1320 before we even include the games. $1320 makes a decent gaming computer plus a video card upgrade later.

Now let us add in the cost of games. PC games start $10 less, and usually $20 less with early sales, if you are willing to wait for months you can get games for as little as $10 to $20. So $20 less per game seems a reasonable average savings.

If you buy one PC game a month, you save $1680 over a 7 year period. If you are a casual gamer and only buy two games a year that's still $280 in savings by buying PC games.

So if you buy a game a month you can spend $1320 + $1680 = $3000 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer. If you are a casual gamer who only buys a couple of title a year, you can spend $1320 + $280 = $1600 on your PC over 7 years and still not be spending more than a console gamer.

When you add in the cost of games and Live, PC gaming can be cheaper than console gaming.

what about those of us who are at a computer all day at a desk at work and want to plop down on a power recliner with a 120" screen to play games when we get home, instead of coming home and sitting at a desk to play a pc game on a 27" monitor? you can't use the same "basic pc" that you use for everything else.

and let's not forget that pc games are typically designed to be controlled with a kb/m, which even if you had that hooked up in an entertainment center, isn't the most ergonomical setup either.

i'm just glad that i don't have to compare this vs. that and can enjoy any game i want to play no matter what format it comes in. but without people who needed to pick sides, these forums would be as dead as they were before e3!
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
what about those of us who are at a computer all day at a desk at work and want to plop down on a power recliner with a 120" screen to play games when we get home, instead of coming home and sitting at a desk to play a pc game on a 27" monitor? you can't use the same "basic pc" that you use for everything else.

and let's not forget that pc games are typically designed to be controlled with a kb/m, which even if you had that hooked up in an entertainment center, isn't the most ergonomical setup either.

i'm just glad that i don't have to compare this vs. that and can enjoy any game i want to play no matter what format it comes in. but without people who needed to pick sides, these forums would be as dead as they were before e3!

What about those of us with a PC hooked up to the TV?

Almost every game released these days has native Xbox 360 controller support from the developer. You don't have to use a KB/mouse but for some titles it might be preferred.
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
what about those of us who are at a computer all day at a desk at work and want to plop down on a power recliner with a 120" screen to play games when we get home, instead of coming home and sitting at a desk to play a pc game on a 27" monitor? you can't use the same "basic pc" that you use for everything else.

and let's not forget that pc games are typically designed to be controlled with a kb/m, which even if you had that hooked up in an entertainment center, isn't the most ergonomical setup either.

i'm just glad that i don't have to compare this vs. that and can enjoy any game i want to play no matter what format it comes in. but without people who needed to pick sides, these forums would be as dead as they were before e3!

Steam Big Picture mode is pretty fantastic for that actually. I have a HTPC in my living room that has all my Steam BP games on it and it is just like gaming on a console when I turn Big picture mode on. I personally don't use it that often just because I prefer sitting at my PC to game but when I am sick or something, it is great to have the option to lay down on the couch and fire it up.
 

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
Yea my PC is hooked to my 70" granted, not all PC games are designed to be played at a distance, and also I have to share the TV with the wife So I end up playing (on the couch) with a monitor anyway. My setup is pretty fly for a middle aged guy.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,931
5,803
126
Steam Big Picture mode is pretty fantastic for that actually. I have a HTPC in my living room that has all my Steam BP games on it and it is just like gaming on a console when I turn Big picture mode on. I personally don't use it that often just because I prefer sitting at my PC to game but when I am sick or something, it is great to have the option to lay down on the couch and fire it up.

i'm sure if there were exclusive pc games that i wanted to play i'd have a decked out htpc to game on. but there isn't. the only games i'd play on pc are on console too.
 

KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
i'm sure if there were exclusive pc games that i wanted to play i'd have a decked out htpc to game on. but there isn't. the only games i'd play on pc are on console too.

Personally even if the PC didn't have the most games available and all its games were console ports I'd stick pick it over a console. Mods are a fantastic thing to have.
 
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