PREDICTION: Microsoft will lose hard on this generation.

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erwos

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2005
4,778
0
76
Easy to dodge that rethort by calling Atari "not a major player". See how this game is played?
Why would I deny that? It's a great example. It can happen. But it's not exactly common.

Also, the irony of the DivX comparison is that people accept EXACTLY THAT with streaming video movie rentals now. Food for thought.
 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,775
0
76
It's Microsoft, they will keep throwing money at it no matter what.

If they really want to save their investment in the XboxOne they should just stop charging for Live. It would offset the cost difference of PS4 and stop charging people for basically nothing, which is what you get for any of these online "services". Oh but they give you free games! No, they give you games you already bought months ago or didn't buy because you really didn't want it.

Time to wake up people, in a country where money rules the only way to vote against corporate BS is NOT TO GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
If they really want to save their investment in the XboxOne they should just stop charging for Live. It would offset the cost difference of PS4 and stop charging people for basically nothing, which is what you get for any of these online "services". Oh but they give you free games! No, they give you games you already bought months ago or didn't buy because you really didn't want it.

Time to wake up people, in a country where money rules the only way to vote against corporate BS is NOT TO GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY.

But but but all my friends will have the latest Call of Doody and make fun of me if I dont!
 

Tweak155

Lifer
Sep 23, 2003
11,448
262
126
Why would I deny that? It's a great example. It can happen. But it's not exactly common.

Also, the irony of the DivX comparison is that people accept EXACTLY THAT with streaming video movie rentals now. Food for thought.

Because you're difficult.
 

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
Shareholders will determine if the Xbone is a failure, and if they do and kill the product like Microsoft did with the Kiln. The the losers will be everyone who now has a 500 dollar brick sitting at home since the DRM servers will get shut down.

I'd comfortably bet a large sum of money that this will not happen with X1.

It's currently looking like the X1 will be in second place at launch, but it's a software-driven device so MS can fix everything except the less powerful GPU later on.

They recovered from taking a $1 billion dollar charge for the RRoD disaster, they can always spend another billion to re-negotiate their terms with publishers to drop some DRM featues, or to toss a bunch of goodies at consumers to get them to buy.

Bundles with 3 free first-party games, or a $150 price cut? They can do either or both if they have to.

Loosen the DRM death-grip? Publishers say MS came up with it on their own and surprised the publishers with the authenticate-to-resell scheme. So this apparently was not something forced by the publishers, and could change.

MS has a long history in development of falling on their face with Bob, Clippy, ME, Vista, 8, ... but then picking themselves back up again.

I'm not buying an X1 at launch, but I see zero chance of MS giving up the living room even if the X1 fails as badly as Surface RT or is as hated as Win8 and Vista.
 
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smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
I'd comfortably bet a large sum of money that this will not happen with X1.

It's currently looking like the X1 will be in second place at launch, but it's a software-driven device so MS can fix everything except the less powerful GPU later on.

They recovered from taking a $1 billion dollar charge for the RRoD disaster, they can always spend another billion to re-negotiate their terms with publishers to drop some DRM featues, or to toss a bunch of goodies at consumers to get them to buy.

Bundles with 3 free first-party games, or a $150 price cut? They can do either or both if they have to.

Loosen the DRM death-grip? Publishers say MS came up with it on their own and surprised the publishers with the authenticate-to-resell scheme. So this apparently was not something forced by the publishers, and could change.

MS has a long history in development of falling on their face with Bob, Clippy, ME, Vista, 8, ... but then picking themselves back up again.

I'm not buying an X1 at launch, but I see zero chance of MS giving up the living room even if the X1 fails as badly as Surface RT or is as hated as Win8 and Vista.

Vista was not MS's fault. The completely rewrote the driver model and hardware makers failed to write drivers on this new model, but they recovered.

Also, can you link the publishers saying it was MS who did this? Not that I don't believe it. MS is transitioning to the DD / software license model and this system is kind of a hybrid model to between the current console model and the current PC model.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
NM, I read more of the article.

Who knows who actually knew and who didn't. From some of, it seems the deactivation stuff might have hit them off guard, but that doesn't mean the activation did.
 

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
I wouldn't be surprised if MS had started off with a 100% no used disc Steam model, then came up with this "use our servers at a GameStop to transfer disc ownership for resale" idea at the last minute, on their own.

The article above is circumstantial evidence of that, since if they had planned it all along you'd expect that at least one publisher would have been ready to confirm that disc resales were allowed during E3. Right now we only know that MS plans to offer the server support for used sales by launch time, not whether any publishers will allow it or what the cost will be. Will the transfer fee be $0? $1? $10? We just don't know.
 
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BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,540
16
0
Vista was not MS's fault. The completely rewrote the driver model and hardware makers failed to write drivers on this new model, but they recovered.

You'll say anything to defend MS and blame someone else won't you?

If MS didn't give developers enough time, that is still Microsoft's fault.

An even bigger issue is MS lowering its standards for "Vista Ready," to computers who could barely run it, and couldn't run the Aero interface at all.

There was also the issue of it losing files. A file system that loses files is not a good thing.

There were more issues, like security, DRM, battery drain, missing features, etc., and they were almost all Microsoft's fault.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
54
91

I haven't read those yet...but wouldn't any significant structure change mean that the XBONE would be pushed back several months at least?

I would think it's too late to change hardware specifications....but software is just a firmware update. But I just don't see how they could change something major like that and still keep a release on schedule.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,939
5,814
126

WWOOWWW if this is true!! i said it over and over in the post e3 threads that there is simply NO WAY that ms could go on without making changes to the drm, kinect being forced, or no price reduction.

EDIT:

giantbomb website getting hammered i can't get on it. did see the post on his twitter just now as well.

https://twitter.com/giantbomb
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
I haven't read those yet...but wouldn't any significant structure change mean that the XBONE would be pushed back several months at least?

I would think it's too late to change hardware specifications....but software is just a firmware update. But I just don't see how they could change something major like that and still keep a release on schedule.

No cause all these policies are in software, tied to the OS and Xbox Live. Simply remove the checks and whatnot.

I'm thinking it's a check list, the system goes down the list real quick and if something is amiss it gives a message to the user. Just remove that.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
Update on June 19, 2013: As a result of feedback from the Xbox community, we have changed certain policies for Xbox One reflected in this blog. Some of this information is no longer accurate — please check here for the latest.

http://news.xbox.com/2013/05/qa

NOTE: Update page is NOT live yet!
 

CPA

Elite Member
Nov 19, 2001
30,322
4
0
This per Kotaku:

Citing multiple sources, GiantBomb says Microsoft has decided to remove a laundry list of Xbox One restrictions that customers considered negative:

  • No more always online requirement
  • The console no longer has to check in every 24 hours
  • All game discs will work on Xbox One as they do on Xbox 360
  • Authentication is no longer necessary
  • An Internet connection is only required when initially setting up the console
  • All downloaded games will function the same when online or offline
  • No additional restrictions on trading games or loaning discs
  • Region locks have been dropped
 

Hugo Drax

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2011
5,647
47
91
This per Kotaku:

Citing multiple sources, GiantBomb says Microsoft has decided to remove a laundry list of Xbox One restrictions that customers considered negative:

  • No more always online requirement
  • The console no longer has to check in every 24 hours
  • All game discs will work on Xbox One as they do on Xbox 360
  • Authentication is no longer necessary
  • An Internet connection is only required when initially setting up the console
  • All downloaded games will function the same when online or offline
  • No additional restrictions on trading games or loaning discs
  • Region locks have been dropped


Looks like the wised up. It would have been an EPIC FAIL on Microsoft's part to release the console with all those lockdowns. Someone is going to get canned for pushing this idea internally.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Why would I deny that? It's a great example. It can happen. But it's not exactly common.

Also, the irony of the DivX comparison is that people accept EXACTLY THAT with streaming video movie rentals now. Food for thought.

Wrong.

People accept that when they pay $8/mo for a service, that when they no longer pay for that service they are no longer able to use it.

What people do not accept is paying $20 per disc at a store which then ceases to function even though their player and the disc are still perfectly fine, and the only reason it doesn't work is because someone in an office 2000 miles away decided they no longer wanted people to watch that movie.
 

Hugo Drax

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2011
5,647
47
91
Wrong.

People accept that when they pay $8/mo for a service, that when they no longer pay for that service they are no longer able to use it.

What people do not accept is paying $20 per disc at a store which then ceases to function even though their player and the disc are still perfectly fine, and the only reason it doesn't work is because someone in an office 2000 miles away decided they no longer wanted people to watch that movie.

not only that but when you bought a 20 dollar DivX disk, it marries the disk to your specific player/account. And you could not lend the disk to someone else. Just like Xbox One. you could not lend or sell it used. DivX failed.

I remember the uproar it got when it came out.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
Last week at E3, the excitement, creativity and future of our industry was on display for a global audience.

For us, the future comes in the form of Xbox One, a system designed to be the best place to play games this year and for many years to come. As is our heritage with Xbox, we designed a system that could take full advantage of advances in technology in order to deliver a breakthrough in game play and entertainment. We imagined a new set of benefits such as easier roaming, family sharing, and new ways to try and buy games. We believe in the benefits of a connected, digital future.

Since unveiling our plans for Xbox One, my team and I have heard directly from many of you, read your comments and listened to your feedback. I would like to take the opportunity today to thank you for your assistance in helping us to reshape the future of Xbox One.

You told us how much you loved the flexibility you have today with games delivered on disc. The ability to lend, share, and resell these games at your discretion is of incredible importance to you. Also important to you is the freedom to play offline, for any length of time, anywhere in the world.

So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:

An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games – After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today – There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console -- there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, taking feedback and delivering a great product for you later this year.
Boom!
 

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
Sounds reasonable:

Discs work just like 360, PS3, PS4.

Digital works just like 360, PS3, PS4 - no sharing or transfers.
 
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