President is really winding up the anti-immigrant crowd - order to end birthright citizenship

[Fanatical Meat]

Both Canada and Mexico do it? In the Americas birthright citizenship is the rule, not the exception.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jus_soli

I remember this from a thread two years ago. Canada does it but I think there are some restrictions but I can’t remember and I could be wrong. Regardless most other countries on the planet follow a bloodline type citizenship.
Again not really sure of the pros vs cons of either but I’m all for an honest discussion.
Unfortunately this President and our current Congress is not capable of having an honest discussion.

 

[HomerJS]

Googled it:

"an instance of invading a country or region with an armed force."

It's the primary definition every single time.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/invasion
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/invasion
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/invasion
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/invasion
https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/invasion
https://www.thefreedictionary.com/invasion
https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/invasion
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/invasion

Only a terrified fool would characterise the approach of unarmed people with no hostile or military objective towards the country with the most powerful and well-equipped military force as an invasion. The idea is utterly absurd.

What the hell is wrong with you? Introducing facts into this conversation.

So Trump is sending 5200 troops to the border to stop what will be a few hundred people if and when they get here in a month. Didn't we have less troops deployed in Afganistan to combat ISIS?

 

[Homerboy]

If we're tossing the 14th Amendment out the window, what's protecting the 2nd?

 

[Paul98]

Funny thing is that the argument that they are falsely trying to use for the 14th, actually would work against the 2nd.... But we won't talk about about that

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Not a legal scholar here but the 14th amendment does say that "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

Regardless of what Trump says, I would think it takes more than an executive order to take away a constitutional right.

I found this the best article so far. It wasn't always interpreted as it has been since the 60's and the piece goes into that. I'm not sure how courts will decide this.

https://www.axios.com/trump-birthri...der-0cf4285a-16c6-48f2-a933-bd71fd72ea82.html

 

[brycejones]

There is nothing short sighted about him. The POWER of the PRESIDENT SHALL NOT BE QUESTIONED!!!!!!!!!!

Blood and soil, etc, etc, etc.

 

[Zorba]

It is obviously just his opinion. Like I said, hopefully Trump has the judges he needs. Anchor babies are not a good thing, just another example of how today's left of common sense left has abandoned reason just to be anti-anything-the-right-is-for, even if they're for common sense.

So now you admit you are pro activist judges? And executive orders? I guess as long as they agree with what you want...

 

[brycejones]

I remember this from a thread two years ago. Canada does it but I think there are some restrictions but I can’t remember and I could be wrong. Regardless most other countries on the planet follow a bloodline type citizenship.
Again not really sure of the pros vs cons of either but I’m all for an honest discussion.
Unfortunately this President and our current Congress is not capable of having an honest discussion.

For a group of people who harp constantly on how "exceptional" America is and therefore should be different from the rest of the world its interesting to suddenly make the argument that American should be the same as the rest of the world.

 

[brycejones]

So now you admit you are pro activist judges? And executive orders? I guess as long as they agree with what you want...

I can't believe slowspyder was dishonest is in his disapproval of activist judges.

 

[Vic]

So now you admit you are pro activist judges? And executive orders? I guess as long as they agree with what you want...

Hey, it's just 'common sense.' :disgust;

 

[fskimospy]

I found this the best article so far. It wasn't always interpreted as it has been since the 60's and the piece goes into that. I'm not sure how courts will decide this.

https://www.axios.com/trump-birthri...der-0cf4285a-16c6-48f2-a933-bd71fd72ea82.html

I’m not sure how good a piece this is as some of what they are quoting is demonstrably wrong:

John Eastman, a constitutional scholar and director of Chapman University's Center for Constitutional Jurisprudence, told "Axios on HBO" that the Constitution has been misapplied over the past 40 or so years. He says the line "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" originally referred to people with full, political allegiance to the U.S. — green card holders and citizens.

First, ‘green card holders’ (presumably meaning legal permanent resident status) didn’t exist when the 14th amendment was passed and there was no such thing as illegal immigration then.

Second, the congressional record clearly shows that the individuals passing the 14th amendment considered and acknowledged the fact that it would confer citizenship on the children of aliens. Here’s a good piece that discusses it at length:

https://www.gibsondunn.com/wp-content/uploads/documents/publications/Ho-DefiningAmerican.pdf

In short some people at the time of enactment were AGAINST granting citizenship to those individuals but they all agreed that’s what it would do.

 

[Greenman]

Everyone within the boundaries of the United States is subject to the jurisdiction of its laws. The only exception to this is the children of diplomats as they are expressly places outside of the jurisdiction of the US.

Michael Anton is either very stupid or very dishonest. Or both!

Has that interpretation ever been tested in court?

 

[K1052]

Has that interpretation ever been tested in court?

yes

 

[SlowSpyder]

perfect match to slow

so if he does do this and it passes judicial muster then we basically have no constitution.

More melodrama. I mean, all the liberals are experts on what the 2A really means, right? If there is an interpretation that fits that can stop anchor babies, that's great for America. Of course the left won't want that, those are people that can potentially help run the Democrat plantation.

 

[Vic]

For a group of people who harp constantly on how "exceptional" America is and therefore should be different from the rest of the world its interesting to suddenly make the argument that American should be the same as the rest of the world.

This isn't sudden. There was some right winger meme floating around before the 2016 election where they were lamenting that America wasn't more like North Korea and Iran.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

For a group of people who harp constantly on how "exceptional" America is and therefore should be different from the rest of the world its interesting to suddenly make the argument that American should be the same as the rest of the world.

I don’t think I’ve ever made that claim, please correct me if I’m wrong the search feature works wonderfully
I know I’ve said “we’re better than that” regarding some stuff.

 

[Greenman]

yes

Got a link or a name? I'd like to read the final ruling.

 

[SlowSpyder]

in·va·sion
/inˈvāZHən/
noun

1. an instance of invading a country or region with an armed force.
   "the Allied invasion of Normandy"
   synonyms: occupation, capture, seizure, annexation, annexing, takeover; More
   
   
   • an incursion by a large number of people or things into a place or sphere of activity.
     "stadium guards are preparing for another invasion of fans"
     synonyms: influx, inundation, flood, rush, torrent, deluge, avalanche, juggernaut
     "an invasion of tourists"
   • an unwelcome intrusion into another's domain.
     "random drug testing of employees is an unwarranted invasion of privacy"
     synonyms: violation, infringement, interruption, intrusion, encroachment, disturbance, disruption, breach
     "an invasion of my privacy

Not that hard guys. Glad we have a president in office with the backbone to stand up for America.

 

[fskimospy]

More melodrama. I mean, all the liberals are experts on what the 2A really means, right? If there is an interpretation that fits that can stop anchor babies, that's great for America. Of course the left won't want that, those are people that can potentially help run the Democrat plantation.

Great, so from now on no more complaints about people interpreting the second amendment to apply to militia and such. If you’re willing to discount the absolutely plain meaning of the 14th amendment where we have the people enacting it talking exactly about how it would confer birthright citizenship to alien children, then you clearly aren’t someone who cares about textualism or original meaning.

 

[Vic]

More melodrama. I mean, all the liberals are experts on what the 2A really means, right? If there is an interpretation that fits that can stop anchor babies, that's great for America. Of course the left won't want that, those are people that can potentially help run the Democrat plantation.

You're not nearly as smart as you seem to think you are. For one, you don't seem to know anything about the Constitution and its history. And second, how does legal citizenship help the 'Democratic plantation?'

 

[DrunkenSano]

I'm one of those who is in full agreement that the anchor baby issue needs to be fixed, and the "danger" isn't from our southern counterparts. It's from the Chinese that keeps pumping out babies in the states, they are the future enemy, not our Mexican neighbors. That item of the constitution needs to be changed where only babies born by legal immigrants (who has been working for a certain number of years in the states) or citizens of the US will have full citizenship from birth.

This is definitely an easier constitutional item to fix than the second amendment. The biggest hurdle of the second is how do you disarm the armed populace without creating a violent civil war. I am sure there are many out there who literally mean it when they say, "You can take my guns from my cold, dead hands."

 

[Vic]

Great, so from now on no more complaints about people interpreting the second amendment to apply to militia and such. If you’re willing to discount the absolutely plain meaning of the 14th amendment where we have the people enacting it talking exactly about how it would confer birthright citizenship to alien children, then you clearly aren’t someone who cares about textualism or original meaning.

Are you implying that right wingers aren't really 'strict constititionalists?'

*pearls*

 

[Vic]

in·va·sion
/inˈvāZHən/
noun

1. an instance of invading a country or region with an armed force.
   "the Allied invasion of Normandy"
   synonyms: occupation, capture, seizure, annexation, annexing, takeover; More
   
   
   • an incursion by a large number of people or things into a place or sphere of activity.
     "stadium guards are preparing for another invasion of fans"
     synonyms: influx, inundation, flood, rush, torrent, deluge, avalanche, juggernaut
     "an invasion of tourists"
   • an unwelcome intrusion into another's domain.
     "random drug testing of employees is an unwarranted invasion of privacy"
     synonyms: violation, infringement, interruption, intrusion, encroachment, disturbance, disruption, breach
     "an invasion of my privacy

Not that hard guys. Glad we have a president in office with the backbone to stand up for America.

Wasn't this 'invasion' rhetoric what led someone to shoot up a synagogue just a few days ago?

 

[Vic]

And yaknow, I'm starting to think the Republicans weren't being completely honest when they said they only wanted to stop illegal immigration..

 

[SlowSpyder]

Great, so from now on no more complaints about people interpreting the second amendment to apply to militia and such. If you’re willing to discount the absolutely plain meaning of the 14th amendment where we have the people enacting it talking exactly about how it would confer birthright citizenship to alien children, then you clearly aren’t someone who cares about textualism or original meaning.

A militia is an armed force created from civilians. You think there is room for interpretation there, I don't. I think there is room to stop anchor babies in the interpretation of the 14th. Guess we just see it differently.

I really hope Trump can stop this madness. It is good for America and seeing him set the left off in a tizzy over things that are good for America is always fun for me.