Pretested CPUs - A Stroll Down Memory Lane

TankGuys

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2005
1,080
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There's a handful of reasons why a business like that is bound to fail, sadly.

So I buy a lot of 10 chips, and spend a few hours testing them all. The few gems I find that are monster overclockers will get a premium, yes. What about the average chips? Will I be able to sell them for any premium at all, since they are used now and are no better than average? Even worse, what about the total crap overclockers that I'm bound to find. Who would ever pay a premium for them? In fact, I'd have to sell them at a huge loss, because nobody wants to buy a used chip that overclocks like garbage.

Then consider the time investment. Even if the above resulted in a profit, is it worth the hours of testing involved?

Lastly, how do you "certify" the results? What happens when you get a chip to 3.4Ghz and your customer can only hit 3? Do you refund money? Do you do an exchange? Do you just tell them it's their rig or methods and tell them to deal with it?

Ultimately, there already is a market for this stuff - it's called buying an i7 940 instead of a 920 There simply isn't, to my understanding, a viable business model for doing pre-testing.

Heck, I don't even turn a profit selling on straight stepping selection. It's a vicious market out there
 

Rubycon

Madame President
Aug 10, 2005
17,768
485
126
LOL 940s were the worst of the bunch. I never had one that reliably did > 3.8 w/HT ON. My testing is quite a bit more stringent than most, however.

People did this and made money for a while. See thing is they were most likely in the biz of building desktops (another dying breed) and could use the "bum" chips as OEM parts in machines supported solely by themselves.

The biggest problem as you said is people not being able to get advertised speeds either because their board/psu/ram cannot deliver or their overclocking abilities are not exactly kosher.

The PC Nut example shows how they probably pushed the chip to the limit as the reviewer did but ultimately backed off some to allow for a safety cushion as selling them at 99% of max would eat up profits quickly due to a barrage of returns/complaints.
 

TankGuys

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2005
1,080
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LOL 940s were the worst of the bunch.

haha yea I mean in a generic sense, if you want a faster chip you can buy the faster models


See thing is they were most likely in the biz of building desktops (another dying breed) and could use the "bum" chips as OEM parts in machines supported solely by themselves.

That part makes sense. So long as you had a constructive, profitable outlet for the "bad" chips the system would work better. It's still a cut-throat business, but that would definitely help!


The biggest problem as you said is people not being able to get advertised speeds either because their board/psu/ram cannot deliver or their overclocking abilities are not exactly kosher.

The PC Nut example shows how they probably pushed the chip to the limit as the reviewer did but ultimately backed off some to allow for a safety cushion as selling them at 99% of max would eat up profits quickly due to a barrage of returns/complaints.

Yea that's a big concern. The problem I see is labeling them below what they actually do means you'd have fewer "great" chips to advertise, so it'd put even more downward pressure on your margins. Ultimately, if you had the ideal setup to do this, yea, it's likely possible - but I'd be willing to wager there are far more profitable ventures for the time/effort involved.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,450
10,119
126
I never bought pre-tested CPUs, but some CPUs that I bought for a company that I was working for (well, not bought, more like picked out, and the boss paid for them), had heatsinks pre-attached. They were sold as Pentium 100s, I think, but now that I know more, I have a feeling that they were Pentium 75s or 90s.
 

stag3

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2005
3,624
0
76
oh wow i remember pcnut and buying the pre tested cpu's
i feel old, whatever happened to them? bk ? out of business?
 

vanilla guerilla

Senior member
Oct 26, 2009
343
0
0
remember a company called step thermodynamics? they sold guaranteed overclockers also, but for wholsesale price. but you had to buy one of their proprietary coolers or tecs with it. they also sold guaranteed overclocked memory. the athlon pretty much put them out of business.
 

Rubycon

Madame President
Aug 10, 2005
17,768
485
126
Yea that's a big concern. The problem I see is labeling them below what they actually do means you'd have fewer "great" chips to advertise, so it'd put even more downward pressure on your margins. Ultimately, if you had the ideal setup to do this, yea, it's likely possible - but I'd be willing to wager there are far more profitable ventures for the time/effort involved.

I think for anyone to be in this market today they have to love hardware considering the efforts and compensation received.

I never bought pre-tested CPUs, but some CPUs that I bought for a company that I was working for (well, not bought, more like picked out, and the boss paid for them), had heatsinks pre-attached. They were sold as Pentium 100s, I think, but now that I know more, I have a feeling that they were Pentium 75s or 90s.

Yes remarking was commonplace in the 90s. Some OEMs would just cover them up. Laser remarking overseas brought on the locked multipliers from the P55C forward. Stupid scammers.

remember a company called step thermodynamics? they sold guaranteed overclockers also, but for wholsesale price. but you had to buy one of their proprietary coolers or tecs with it. they also sold guaranteed overclocked memory. the athlon pretty much put them out of business.


Haha yes I remember them. Celeron 366>550 called a step 550? Ah the good ole Celeron A series. In 1998 a Celeron 300A set you back under $200 and the average OC was 450/466 - 504 if you were lucky. The fastest Pentium II was 450MHz and that cost $800. Talk about a bargain!

Sidewinder computers was also selling them IIRC.

That's when Alpha came out with pin heatsinks, then Swiftech came out with their version - HUGE copper slab with smooth aluminum pins.
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
1,001
126
Since we're going down memory lane regarding overclocked CPU's...

Remember this company, Kryotech?

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kryotech,137.html

Only $2200 and you get a 1 year warranty!

*edit - Reading through the Tom's review now for old times sake. I remember everyone mentioning how a 300 watt power supply is now needed to run a PC after the Athlon launched, that was kind of a big deal. Now a 300 watt power supply can't even power some video cards.
 
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MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
76
Back in the day, I bought a pretested 300A. Can't remember what I paid, but it wasn't much more than an untested chip, maybe $30-40. I rode that sucker to 504MHz and used it for 6 years in various machines.
 

formulav8

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2000
7,004
522
126
Actually, compuwiz1 went out of business on purpose. Anandtech changed the rules for those who sell as a business and were required to advertise as a sponsor on Anandtech. They gave those a certain amount of time to finish up their inventory and current trades.

He was very popular during the Athlon Thunderbird days


Jason
 

Rubycon

Madame President
Aug 10, 2005
17,768
485
126
Back in the day, I bought a pretested 300A. Can't remember what I paid, but it wasn't much more than an untested chip, maybe $30-40. I rode that sucker to 504MHz and used it for 6 years in various machines.

Yes the top picks doing 504 were grand indeed! Faster than any PII at the time. (I suppose you could get a 450 higher but at four times the price!) Abit BX6/BX6R2 was flawless on 112MHz FSB.

RE: Compuwiz...

Here was the original site on archive.org!

http://web.archive.org/web/20010417090317/http://compuwiz-tech.safeshopper.com/
 
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Rich3077

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
518
0
0
Remember this company, Kryotech?

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kryotech,137.html

Only $2200 and you get a 1 year warranty!

I remember them well as I bought one. I think my first one was 800 Mhz.. then the compressor took a dump so they replaced the whole PC with the 1 Ghz model. Once I got the new 1 Ghz I took it to a hardware store and traded it for hardware.

They where good people to do business with.
 

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
22,377
2
81
Heh, I used to sell OC-tested Celeron 366 chips BITD at my computer shop. Don't think I quite made it to 100 chips, but the final number that we tested was somewhere between 60-80, maybe. It was a calculated risk that paid off reasonably. We bought them by the tray and the premium ones at 2.0v would fetch around $30 extra. Ones that needed voltage would get around $10-20 more depending on how much voltage. The rest we sold at stock speeds as part of systems and upgrades to non-overclockers. It gave us something to do during slack times and people absolutely got something for the extra money because there was a lot of variability even among chips sharing the same tray. I think roughly maybe 1/3 was a stock voltage OC and 1/3 needed voltage, with the remaining 1/3 not able to hit 550MHz stable no matter what.

We also offered HSFs with them. We sourced some cheap mystery units that were huge and did a great job, but didn't quite fit normal socket 370 due to the ZIF lever. I filed half of one edge with a hand rasp on every single one of these things.

I think I still have one of these Celerons in the garage - one that OC'd at stock voltage. Too bad all the capable motherboards I have are dead. Stupid bulging caps.
 

stag3

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2005
3,624
0
76
yea i had my celeron 300a @ 504
then i had a p2 300 sl2w8 @ 504
and finally dual celeron 366s @ 550 on my abit bp6
 

Spoooon

Lifer
Mar 3, 2000
11,565
203
106
I remember them. I also remember soldering my Athlon 850 to run at 1GHz and it was cooled with an Alpha heatsink and a pair of whiny YS Tech 60MM fans!

I still have my goldfingers device and the cover for my old Athlon 650.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,425
8,388
126
That's when Alpha came out with pin heatsinks, then Swiftech came out with their version - HUGE copper slab with smooth aluminum pins.

i had one of those huge copper slabs. holy crap that thing was heavy. i'm not entirely sure that my big tower coolers outweigh that thing.

and to top it off was a 80x38 delta SHE fan. 68 CFM at 48.5 ear-piercing decibels. sounded like a vacuum cleaner.


edit: mugen 2 outweighs the MC462 by about 1/4 of an lb. of course, that's in big, thin, and spaced fins (though there is a sizable block at the bottom), so it feels lighter due to the much lower density. the big 120 mm fan on the mugen 2 doesn't move any more air than that delta screamer did, despite having about 4x the area.
 
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Rubycon

Madame President
Aug 10, 2005
17,768
485
126
I still have my goldfingers device and the cover for my old Athlon 650.

Cheater!

i had one of those huge copper slabs. holy crap that thing was heavy. i'm not entirely sure that my big tower coolers outweigh that thing.

and to top it off was a 80x38 delta SHE fan. 68 CFM at 48.5 ear-piercing decibels. sounded like a vacuum cleaner.


edit: mugen 2 outweighs the MC462 by about 1/4 of an lb. of course, that's in big, thin, and spaced fins (though there is a sizable block at the bottom), so it feels lighter due to the much lower density. the big 120 mm fan on the mugen 2 doesn't move any more air than that delta screamer did, despite having about 4x the area.

The MCX-462 had a more favorable center of gravity than modern day coolers, however. Swiftech actually tested ruggedness by mounting one to a duron (naked core) and throwing the system out a second storey window! The chassis was trashed but the CPU was OK!
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
21,808
11,164
136
That sure brings back memories. A friend of mine who is not exactly PC hardware-savvy got a 300A @ 450 built by a geek friend of his at college, and the OC lasted for 3 years. Once he was back from college, I had to diagnose and fix instability problems that started cropping up unexpectedly. All I did was drop the volts and lower the FSB and bam, the thing started working again. It was slow as balls at 300 mhz, but at least it would boot.

But as far as overclocking-as-a-business goes, I've long contemplated the subject, since I think it would be a fun way to do business even if the margins would not be great.

The main problems I see with "pre-testing" these days is really the same problem it has always had: what do you do with the bum chips? If you can milk some vendor's RMA system to cherry-pick the good chips and return the bad ones, then you have to mark up the good chips enough to offset the time and money it took to test all the chips and pay the applicable restocking fees. Clearly this is not quite as feasible as buying chips by the try and plunking the "bad" ones into OEM systems, but being a system builder these days . . . shew. That's a whole 'nother ball of wax.

Anyway, the end results of your efforts will be that a few people that wanted great chips would get what they wanted at a premium, and everyone else dealing with the retail channel would have to hope they didn't get one of your duds when buying OEM/open box. I think some people still do this, but I'd feel kinda oogy about returning chips like that when they worked as advertised.

Another problem I see is that, with so much of the system being crammed into the CPU package (cores, northbridge/uncore, memory controller, IGP), are you going to test only the maximum core speed for the CPU? Or are you going to test everything?

Then there's the question as to whether or not the buyer will even know what the heck to do with the chip once they've bought it, which is a scary prospect considering how volt-sensitive these chips are getting at 32nm. Imagine selling a pre-testing 980X to someone, only for them to pop the chip via excess VTT. What a mess that would be . . .

I'm sure there are ways around all that, but again, it'd be a lot of effort for very little reward and a lot of potential liability. You'd pretty much have to include all sorts of caveats with your pre-testing, such as specifying certified motherboard(s), RAM, and cooling. Then you'd have to specify voltage limits with whatever product guarantee you offered. Everything would have to be structured very carefully in the best legal-ese possible.

There are probably better ways to leverage overclocking-as-a-business than pre-testing, but I haven't quite sorted out what that might be.
 

TankGuys

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2005
1,080
0
0
This thread has made me consider this again. I may have a way to make this work now... hmm...
 

Gillbot

Lifer
Jan 11, 2001
28,830
17
81
remember a company called step thermodynamics? they sold guaranteed overclockers also, but for wholsesale price. but you had to buy one of their proprietary coolers or tecs with it. they also sold guaranteed overclocked memory. the athlon pretty much put them out of business.

I still have a STEP Thermodynamics P233mmx that STILL WORKS!
 
Jan 27, 2009
182
0
0
@DrMrLordX

In my opinion the only safe way of selling a modern overclocked chip is to sell as a bundle with the motherboard and RAM. The stipulation being, if you assemble the system and boot you will get the overclock you paid for but if you change the BIOS settings in any way then the overclock is no longer guaranteed. I know at least one large enthusiast vendor does this in the UK. I think it is mighty brave of them and I would definitely not buy one of their stock systems for fear of getting a nail of a CPU included
 
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