I don't think he's trying to bring you over to his side. Lost causes are a drain, ya know? I don't blame him for not trying.
25%? Please! She wouldn't have jeopardized the country, its allies, the environment, health, education, people of color, women 75% of what Trump has done. And if you're honest with yourself you know that's true. Very few people thought Hillary was without flaw and that is absolutely a realistic way to elect an official. What the Cultists have done has endangered not only the people they want to hurt but also themselves. I preferred Bernie myself but when the options were Trump or Hillary... Hands down Hillary! Status quo would have been a hell of a lot better than the misery Trump and Putin are visiting upon us. But by all means stay on your side of the fence, the extreme wedgie must be exhilarating... stimulating?
I completely understand and agree with your point, but I understand Bob's point as well.
He said
"I hope that moderate Democrats learned the lesson from 2016... it's going to take more than "Vote for us, she's at least 25% less crooked than Trump!" to win the next election."
And this echo's my feelings exactly. The big thing many democrats on this board seem to keep forgetting is that people don't vote. This country is a liberal country, and all things being equal, the democrats should be winning most of the time. I can go through issue by issue and show where studies have absolutely shown most of the US is on the same page, whether it's abortion, health care, etc etc.
Since I was born, 7 of the 8 elections that have taken place have had more votes for the democratic nominee (popular vote), including this last one and the one in 2000 when W was elected. Only in 2004 did a republican win the popular vote. That means most people are voting for the democrats.
The issue lies in the 3rd party voters (Jill Stein, libertarian, etc) which become wasted votes along with the millions upon millions of people who didn't vote at all. With the latter obviously being a much larger problem.
How are the democrats going to affect change if the best they can offer is the 2nd most hated candidate in the history of this country? Sure, Trump just happened to be the 1st most hated candidate in the history of this country, so it made sense that the democrats should match that up against the 2nd most hated, and roll the dice. Right?
The DNC should be winning almost all the time, if they weren't so ignorant of the people who don't votte. They would have won with Hillary any way, if they weren't so stupid. We can go over the numerous mistakes she made, some of which were blatantly stupid to anyone with a brain, its not important, but the facts should always be known. The people who don't vote, don't vote for a reason, and Hillary made voting for a lot of people seem irrelevant.
If we isolate ourselves, as liberals, as democrats, as whatever you ascribe to be, away from the faults of the DNC, the democratic party and the democratic nominations, we simply look like cultists like the GOP undoubtedly is. That's not who we are. We won't be winning votes from those people who aren't voting (namely people my age). We are about the facts, even if they are facts we don't like. Hillary was as corrupt a politician as we've ever seen, with 2 decades of it to back up anyone who looks at her record. She was not the person America wanted and now we are all paying the price because of their hubris. They didn't think they could lose. They were wrong.
What is it about other people on the left that can't see the criticism with the dems and Hillary and simply admit that its true? You can both hate Hillary, and have voted for her - and wish she was president. While also hate the DNC and the democrats for putting you in that situation to begin with, and hate them even more for helping to elect Trump. Because make no mistake, the DNC and the democrats are, even in some small part, responsible for Trump winning by putting up Hillary against him, or at the very least for not campaigning more in the states that would have made it harder to lose.