PSA: Dog/Cat Pet Owners

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Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
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651
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and so you have to go with the supposed reality that millions of cats fail to reach age 4 being fed meow mix

and its not that owners would cash out big in lawsuits. class action lawsuits are what lawyers go for, the last tainted case from china bagged millions of dollars in settlement, if meow mix were poisoning its customers, there would be millions more for the taking.

Do you even have any pets?

It's quite possible the crap in meow mix exacerbated the cat's health issues(ie. high phosphorus content) The class action lawsuits against the companies that killed pets with their tainted foods from China have been forced to correct their errors. So, yes the lawsuits have benefited customers.

A little research would reveal a class action lawsuit against Canidae for changing their food formula(in order to save a buck) that caused numerous dog illnesses and deaths.
 
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JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
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Well, cheap ass food can mess up a pet... there's no denying it. My coworker fed his kitten meow mix and it died at age 3 of kidney failure. The vet confirmed that it was the meow mix that killed it.

We've been feeding our dog one of the worst foods on that list for years. She has been having suffering from lack of energy, skin problems, constant licking, she constantly smells, diarrhea (which leads to accidents in the house if we're not home when she has to go), and strange gastric noises coming from her while she is laying down.

I changed her food a few days ago and we have noticed a change in her already. She isn't licking herself raw in areas, she actually eats all her food instead of picking at it (we only feed her once a day), her coat looks better, and she seems to have more energy.

The ONLY thing we feed her is dry dog food and water. She doesn't get table scraps or people food ever (well, maybe some scraps of meat or chicken or fish every once in a great while-nothing with seasoning on it though).
 
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SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,929
142
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Vets like any other professional can be of dubious quality, or simply tell an owner what they want to hear or are simply quacks. Even on humans real doctors make mistakes, or are incompetent. For whatever reason, the vet had a thing against certain pet food, i'm sure there are doctors who are against eating meat as well. Hell, there was a doctor who was against vaccinations even. Until you bring out actual science it just really doesn't wash. There are millions of animals probably eating this so called cheap food, and if it were as bad as claimed, the death rates would be atrocious. It would be a pet cat apocalypse, and after decades i'm sure the patterns would emerge and people no matter how dim, would catch on.

google up what causes mineral deposits in pets kidneys btw. everything from anti freeze to bacteria to rat poison. pulling a food diagnosis out of the air is pretty dubious.

And never ever underestimate the power of greed, lawyers and class action lawsuits.

A kitten doesn't get minerals on its kidneys from just breathing and my buddy loved that cat so much he had a pic of it in his cube. It didn't have an infection, it was simply sick due to renal failure. It was only alive for 36 months and never went outside, the only variables are food/water/genetics. The vet tested its blood and did all types of testing on its kidneys to find out why it was having problems. The vet is also a pretty well respected one in the area and while she does push Science Diet cat food I still doubt she'd just make up something about crappy cat food. If it wasn't kidney disease or water, then that only leaves the food variable. There is nothing else that could have caused it in 36 months.
 

torpid

Lifer
Sep 14, 2003
11,631
11
76
The pet food that was under recall caused kidney failure as I recall. Are you sure it wasn't fed a tainted pet food with melamine? Crappy pet food is crappy because of the long-term implications, which do supposedly include increase risk of CRF late in life. But, no food should kill a cat in 3 years without unusual circumstances.
 

thescreensavers

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2005
9,930
2
81
We've been feeding our dog one of the worst foods on that list for years. She has been having suffering from lack of energy, skin problems, constant licking, she constantly smells, diarrhea (which leads to accidents in the house if we're not home when she has to go), and strange gastric noises coming from her while she is laying down.

I changed her food a few days ago and we have noticed a change in her already. She isn't licking herself raw in areas, she actually eats all her food instead of picking at it (we only feed her once a day), her coat looks better, and she seems to have more energy.

The ONLY thing we feed her is dry dog food and water. She doesn't get table scraps or people food ever (well, maybe some scraps of meat or chicken or fish every once in a great while-nothing with seasoning on it though).

What food did you switch too what were you using before?
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
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What food did you switch too what were you using before?

We were feeding her Pedigree-Large Breed dry dog food, you know, the shit you can buy from Walmart and Costco in a 50lb bag for $20...it was given a rating of 1 on the site you linked, it is corn based and has meat by-products but no actual meat in it as far as I can tell.

Old Food:
The primary ingredient in this food is corn. Corn is a difficult to digest grain of limited value in dog food, and which is also commonly associated with food allergies. Even if this had been a good quality grain, we would still note that grains are an unnatural foodstuff for canines, and that dog food products should be based on meat rather than grain. Corn gluten meal, further down the ingredient list, is also low quality. This is defined as that part of the commercial shelled corn that remains after the extraction of the larger portion of the starch, gluten, and term by the processes employed in the wet milling manufacture of corn starch or syrup. In plain English, the remains of corn after most of the nutritious bits have been removed.

Meat and bone meal is an extremely low quality ingredient. It is the rendered product from mammal tissues, including bone, exclusive of blood, hair, hoof, horn, hide trimmings, manure, stomach and rumen contents, except in such amounts as may occur unavoidably in good processing practices. We would have greater confidence in this ingredient as fertilizer than as a dog food ingredient.

The next ingredient is byproducts. It is impossible to ascertain the quality of by-products and these are usually products that are of such low quality as to be rejected for use in the human food chain, or else are those parts that have so little value that they cannot be used elsewhere in either the human or pet food industries. The AAFCO definition of chicken by-product meal is “consisting of the ground, rendered, clean parts of the carcass of slaughtered chicken, such as necks, feet, undeveloped eggs and intestines, exclusive of feathers, except in such amounts as might occur unavoidable in good processing practice.”

Animal fat is an ingredient of unidentified origin for which it is impossible to determine species, source or quality. Unidentified ingredients are usually very low quality. AAFCO define this asobtained from the tissues of mammals and/or poultry in the commercial processes of rendering or extracting. It consists predominantly of glyceride esters of fatty acids and contains no additions of free fatty acids. If an antioxidant is used, the common name or names must be indicated, followed by the words "used as a preservative".

This product uses chemical preservatives. BHA and BHT are allowed in dog food products but are banned or heavily regulated in human food production due to the belief that they are carcinogenic.

The next ingredient is wheat flour. In dog food products, this is commonly a byproduct (think floorsweepings) of human food production and is a grain fragment we consider primarily filler. Wheat is believed by many to be the leading cause of food allergy problems in dog foods. Wheat mill run is a further grain byproduct.

Beet pulp is a controversial filler. It is a by-product, being dried residue from sugar beets which has been cleaned and extracted in the process of manufacturing sugar. It is a controversial ingredient in dog food, claimed by some manufacturers to be a good source of fibre, and derided by others as an ingredient added to slow down the transition of rancid animal fats and causing stress to kidney and liver in the process. We note that beet pulp is an ingredient that commonly causes problems for dogs, including allergies and ear infections, and prefer not to see it used in dog food. There are less controversial products around if additional fibre is required.

There is no excuse for adding artificial colorings to dog food products.

Overall, this is one of the lowest quality products reviewed on this site. It receives a 1* rating due to the unavailability of anything lower.

I picked up a 30lb bag of Blue Buffalo Chicken and Brown Rice from Petco. This food does contain meat and they gave it a yes recommendation so I tried it out and our dog loves it. It was given a 4 star rating and is listed as a premium dry dog food.

New Food:
The first ingredient in the food is a named meat product, as is the second. Since the first is chicken inclusive of its water content (about 80&#37 and once that is removed it is likely that this ingredient would be more accurately placed somewhat further down the ingredient list (ingredients are listed in order of weight). Note that this is an example of the practice of “splitting” (see note on main page), but in this case serves to increase our level of confidence in the amount of meat product in the food.

The next four ingredients are all grains. All are quality grains, but the food starts to look rather grain heavy. We appreciate the use of whole vegetables in the food. There is a good range of probiotics also.

Overall this product appears to use good quality ingredients, but it suffers somewhat from excessive inclusion of grains and not really enough meat. A 4* rating is given, but adding meat to this diet would be beneficial in most cases.

Surprisingly enough IAMS was rated poorly on the site you linked. I always thought that was decent stuff, although, our dog never digested that well either.
 
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thescreensavers

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2005
9,930
2
81
^ thats great news that your dog is doing better on the new healthier food.

Yea I always thought Iams was good and all the ones that you see on TV lol.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,472
867
126
^ thats great news that your dog is doing better on the new healthier food.

Yea I always thought Iams was good and all the ones that you see on TV lol.

It's funny, we spend money on vet bills, toys, baths and grooming, we walk them regularly, and give them love as pet owners and then we feed them absolute shit and wonder why they aren't healthy.

Read some of the things that are in crappy dog food...it's frightening really. I read this to my wife the other day and she cringed.

Meat and bone meal is an extremely low quality ingredient. It is the rendered product from mammal tissues, including bone, exclusive of blood, hair, hoof, horn, hide trimmings, manure, stomach and rumen contents, except in such amounts as may occur unavoidably in good processing practices. We would have greater confidence in this ingredient as fertilizer than as a dog food ingredient.

The next ingredient is byproducts. It is impossible to ascertain the quality of by-products and these are usually products that are of such low quality as to be rejected for use in the human food chain, or else are those parts that have so little value that they cannot be used elsewhere in either the human or pet food industries. The AAFCO definition of chicken by-product meal is “consisting of the ground, rendered, clean parts of the carcass of slaughtered chicken, such as necks, feet, undeveloped eggs and intestines, exclusive of feathers, except in such amounts as might occur unavoidable in good processing practice.”

Animal fat is an ingredient of unidentified origin for which it is impossible to determine species, source or quality. Unidentified ingredients are usually very low quality. AAFCO define this asobtained from the tissues of mammals and/or poultry in the commercial processes of rendering or extracting. It consists predominantly of glyceride esters of fatty acids and contains no additions of free fatty acids. If an antioxidant is used, the common name or names must be indicated, followed by the words "used as a preservative".

This product uses chemical preservatives. BHA and BHT are allowed in dog food products but are banned or heavily regulated in human food production due to the belief that they are carcinogenic.

The next ingredient is wheat flour. In dog food products, this is commonly a byproduct (think floorsweepings) of human food production and is a grain fragment we consider primarily filler. Wheat is believed by many to be the leading cause of food allergy problems in dog foods. Wheat mill run is a further grain byproduct.

Anyway, thanks for posting this, it was a real eye opener. I even told my neighbor about it who has a small dog, he feeds her IAMS.

She thanks you too.
 
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GoodRevrnd

Diamond Member
Dec 27, 2001
6,803
581
126
Top 10 Ingredients in Meow Mix Dry Cat Food

1. Ground yellow corn: (Minus 1 point) filler used to drive up the protein content of pet food. Major source of pet allergies, often toxic to dogs.
2. Corn gluten meal (Minus 1 point): Waste product, cheap, non-nutritive filler but used as protein source -- can cause allergies and sugar imbalance.
3. Chicken by-product meal (Minus 1 point): Ground up carcasses, internal organs, beaks, feet. Concentrated.
4. Soybean meal (Minus 1 point): Dogs can not digest soybeans, can bloat/die.
5. Beef tallow preserved with mixed-tocopherols (source of vitamin E) (Minus 1 point): Beef tallow can be used restaurant fat! Misleading with "natural" Vitamin E preservative added. Indicates very poor quality product.
6. Turkey by-product meal (Minus 1 point): Can include carcass, feet, beaks and diseased turkey organs, tumors.
7. Salmon Meal (Minus 1 point): Concentrated source of protein and a few fatty acids (oil has been pressed out) but can add mercury to the diet.
8. Ocean fish meal (Plus 1 point): Quality cold water fish, highly nutritious, high in fatty acids. Concentrated.
9. Brewers dried yeast (Minus 1 point): Waste product (used for flavoring, protein, B-vitamins) which can become very toxic to the liver causes allergies and arthritis.
10. Phosphoric acid (Minus 1 point): A sequestering agent for rendered animal fats -- implies poor quality fats are used, source of phosphorous.
While I'm not disagreeing that meow mix isn't shit, the food review site that does all those crazy minus points is also complete garbage. A lot of her reasoning for praising or blasting various ingredients is completely baseless.
 

thescreensavers

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2005
9,930
2
81
It's funny, we spend money on vet bills, toys, baths and grooming, we walk them regularly, and give them love as pet owners and then we feed them absolute shit and wonder why they aren't healthy.

Read some of the things that are in crappy dog food...it's frightening really. I read this to my wife the other day and she cringed.


Anyway, thanks for posting this, it was a real eye opener. I even told my neighbor about it who has a small dog, he feeds her IAMS.

She thanks you too.

, Yea I read tons of stuff on my current dog food, and so thats why I want to change it, A mom and pops pet shop which I will now always go and support since they are extremely knowledgeable and helpful, Sell all the premium foods and also have the same consensus of what people say online about the food my dogs eating.

I just need to keep an eye on her pH of her Urine.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
84
91
A kitten doesn't get minerals on its kidneys from just breathing and my buddy loved that cat so much he had a pic of it in his cube. It didn't have an infection, it was simply sick due to renal failure. It was only alive for 36 months and never went outside, the only variables are food/water/genetics. The vet tested its blood and did all types of testing on its kidneys to find out why it was having problems. The vet is also a pretty well respected one in the area and while she does push Science Diet cat food I still doubt she'd just make up something about crappy cat food. If it wasn't kidney disease or water, then that only leaves the food variable. There is nothing else that could have caused it in 36 months.

Yea, she never did any testing as you said, she just spewed out her favored answer to your question. for all you know she was just trying to "do you some good" trying to get you to buy more expensive food next time regardless of the actual cause of the death. you aren't very good at the whole science thing are you the only variable left isn't food, esp when no tests were done. people die from diseases and bad genetics all the time, the vet was going to spend exactly as much time and effort diagnosing death of a pet as its worth, very little. give you an easy answer and move on. some vets are probably unlikely to want to admit they don't know the cause to a grieving owner esp when nothing can be done at that point. so you were fed an answer, someone to blame. the vet wasn't going to go dr house on you, and you couldn't afford it anyways probably.


Do you even have any pets?

It's quite possible the crap in meow mix exacerbated the cat's health issues(ie. high phosphorus content) The class action lawsuits against the companies that killed pets with their tainted foods from China have been forced to correct their errors. So, yes the lawsuits have benefited customers.

A little research would reveal a class action lawsuit against Canidae for changing their food formula(in order to save a buck) that caused numerous dog illnesses and deaths.

Yea its quite possible the pet owner lives in a toxic house for all your know. Whats more likely, one pet owner has bad luck with their pet or that millions of cheap food cat owners are missing the fact that their pets are all dying within 2-3 years

talk about hysteria really


What the fuck are you talking about here? The average age for an outdoor cat is 2 years...it's not really a debate. If the outdoor cat is properly fed and taken to a vet when ill then it pushes up to about 5 years.

The thing is pet food doesn't have to be that great over a 5 year life expectancy. This is how a lot of things that affect people living 80+ years today weren't issues when people only lived 20-30 years.

Indoor only cats can live 18-20 years...again this is proven. Around 8-9 or so dietary problems start to set in. Diabetes and pet obesity are more prevalent today.




yeah a vet is going to risk ruining his livelihood lying to his clients over something that he isn't responsible for.

It's clear you feel the crappiest and cheapest foods for pets are totally wholesome for them. Do you also feel eating fast food is also totally wholesome for humans? Come on, by your own argument if it weren't they'd outlaw it.

Did you go to college at all? I am sort of curious looking at your logic methods.

lol you are talking about total strays. a quick google comes up with more like 3-5 years for an out door cat. Anyways if you are willing to concede that an outdoor cat has such a low life span, why are you spending your time pointing fingers at pet food,clearly pet owners letting their cats roam is far more harmful than any cheap food effect you are claiming. anyways it still relies on the dodgy assumption that every pet owner using cheap food lets their cat out to roam. even if only 50% of cats get to roam thats still millions on cheap food, if such low life span were common it would come out.

you talk about college lol, you don't pass the logic test at all. pets can eat raw and wild food and even garbage for the very reason of their low life span. It takes DECADES for humans to build up toxins to harmful levels much of the time, pets just don't live that long regardless.

once again, comparing humans to cats and dogs. its pathetic dude. humans don't subsist on a single source of food, if they and it were mcdonalds did you'd have a point,but they don't. humans live so far longer than pets that we have the privileged of having toxins build up in our bodies, its entirely different. our digestive systems are entirely different, if you went around licking everything you saw from garbage cans to peoples feet like dogs do you'd spend your time over the porcelain throne spewing your guts out from all the infections you'd get. not just shorter lives, but their digestive tracts are much shorter, they can withstand things we cannot. so if you are going to make claims that things are comparable, if X is good for me its good for the dog, just do a flip of that and see how well that works. go lick the toilets a bit at the public restrooms and see how well you get by.

you want to talk science? its a very easy test to do actually. If the expensive pet food manufacturers really wanted to hammer the nail in on pet foods they'd do life span testing in a scientific way to prove their claims. But like other quackery claims, rarely does anyone actually bother to actually do actual tests. instead you get fud and pseudo science.

You are a fool claiming the vet risks anything by making that claim. op can't check jacksh*t. vets have a far lower standard than what you are claiming. and as i said, quality varies within any profession. even with doctors you've had folks claim that vaccinations cause autism. being that the vet said nothing that will upset groups like peta, nothing would come of it anyways.
 
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alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
lol you are talking about total strays. a quick google comes up with more like 3-5 years for an out door cat. Anyways if you are willing to concede that an outdoor cat has such a low life span, why are you spending your time pointing fingers at pet food,clearly pet owners letting their cats roam is far more harmful than any cheap food effect you are claiming. anyways it still relies on the dodgy assumption that every pet owner using cheap food lets their cat out to roam. even if only 50% of cats get to roam thats still millions on cheap food, if such low life span were common it would come out.

you talk about college lol, you don't pass the logic test at all. pets can eat raw and wild food and even garbage for the very reason of their low life span. It takes DECADES for humans to build up toxins to harmful levels much of the time, pets just don't live that long regardless.

once again, comparing humans to cats and dogs. its pathetic dude. humans don't subsist on a single source of food, if they and it were mcdonalds did you'd have a point,but they don't. humans live so far longer than pets that we have the privileged of having toxins build up in our bodies, its entirely different. our digestive systems are entirely different, if you went around licking everything you saw from garbage cans to peoples feet like dogs do you'd spend your time over the porcelain throne spewing your guts out from all the infections you'd get. not just shorter lives, but their digestive tracts are much shorter, they can withstand things we cannot. so if you are going to make claims that things are comparable, if X is good for me its good for the dog, just do a flip of that and see how well that works. go lick the toilets a bit at the public restrooms and see how well you get by.

you want to talk science? its a very easy test to do actually. If the expensive pet food manufacturers really wanted to hammer the nail in on pet foods they'd do life span testing in a scientific way to prove their claims. But like other quackery claims, rarely does anyone actually bother to actually do actual tests. instead you get fud and pseudo science.

You are a fool claiming the vet risks anything by making that claim. op can't check jacksh*t. vets have a far lower standard than what you are claiming. and as i said, quality varies within any profession. even with doctors you've had folks claim that vaccinations cause autism. being that the vet said nothing that will upset groups like peta, nothing would come of it anyways.

You are trolling. I stated 2-5 years as a life expectancy for an outdoor cat. 2 years is the average, and yes it includes ferals...but also 'pets'.

You realize there are parent's trying to sue over Happy Meals right now. There isn't much money in lawsuits for pets...that's the reason why you don't see any.

The recent food poisoning was a proven problem, no one got rich because their dog or cat died due to it.

It's clear you are in an argument for just shits and giggles and really know nothing about the issue.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
84
91
Lol you don't even know if you are trying to support your own point anymore it seems

Lawyers did get millions out of the pet food industry from that last china poisoning f*ckup actually so you don't know what you are talking about.

Lol, arguing for giggles? You should know..you haven't brought anything more than fud to the table. You've got no evidence at all, like all quackery, claims without evidence..highly dubious. but theres always some sucker out there to believe. esp when it comes to health claims.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
126
Lol you don't even know if you are trying to support your own point anymore it seems

Lawyers did get millions out of the pet food industry from that last china poisoning f*ckup actually so you don't know what you are talking about.

Lol, arguing for giggles? You should know..you haven't brought anything more than fud to the table. You've got no evidence at all, like all quackery, claims without evidence..highly dubious. but theres always some sucker out there to believe. esp when it comes to health claims.

Do you even own a dog or pet? Or just trolling?
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
84
91
Do you even own a dog or pet? Or just trolling?

Do you realize the fact of pet ownership isn't equivalent to a scientific study on food nutrition?

Whether or not i have a pet is of no concern to you. I could tell you anything i wished after all. That you go there only shows you've got no real argument left. All you've got left is fud.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
Lol you don't even know if you are trying to support your own point anymore it seems

Lawyers did get millions out of the pet food industry from that last china poisoning f*ckup actually so you don't know what you are talking about.

Lol, arguing for giggles? You should know..you haven't brought anything more than fud to the table. You've got no evidence at all, like all quackery, claims without evidence..highly dubious. but theres always some sucker out there to believe. esp when it comes to health claims.

You don't need a research paper to know eating marshmallows only will lead to health issues.

Lawyers did make millions, but no pet owners did...hence short of a class action of that size no one is interested.

Like I have said above, there isn't much easily found on this. Like I said above MOST vets don't even get a nutritional class in school and those that do it's usually a pet-food manufacturer's seminar.

Your problem is you simply don't understand things without someone else outlining them for you.

To say a poor quality pet food is just as healthy for a pet as a high quality one is ignorant at best. To think a corn based diet is OK for obligate carnivore is delusional at best. To think this needs to be proven to one's self via a research paper online is foolhardy at best.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
oh and btw I was not only a Zoology major...I worked for one of the top vets in probably the whole country. I have seen first hand the results of these unproven yet 'healthy' cheap food diets.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
126
Do you realize the fact of pet ownership isn't equivalent to a scientific study on food nutrition?

Whether or not i have a pet is of no concern to you. I could tell you anything i wished after all. That you go there only shows you've got no real argument left. All you've got left is fud.

Thanks for trolling! You don't own a dog or pet, yet decide to spew your ignorance here. Go away with your fud, no one cares.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
84
91
Thanks for trolling! You don't own a dog or pet, yet decide to spew your ignorance here. Go away with your fud, no one cares.

Lol, troll harder mr caveman.
I wasn't dignifying with a response your backhanded aspersion that if anyone disagreed with you it was because they dislike pets. As if you'd really back down if i said my pets were fine and live happy long lives on cheap food. Its anecdotal evidence. But you know this, you are just trolling.

oh and btw I was not only a Zoology major...I worked for one of the top vets in probably the whole country. I have seen first hand the results of these unproven yet 'healthy' cheap food diets.
oh, and you've done long term scientific studies proving your assertions, or are you just pulling sh*t out of your keester. Guess which pets come to the vet..oh yes, the sick ones. You have a sample size that is meaningless from a self selected group. You really can't talk about anything with scientific certainty, never mind all the fud you are spewing.
"i worked with a vet" please...


You don't need a research paper to know eating marshmallows only will lead to health issues.
Lawyers did make millions, but no pet owners did...hence short of a class action of that size no one is interested.
Like I have said above, there isn't much easily found on this. Like I said above MOST vets don't even get a nutritional class in school and those that do it's usually a pet-food manufacturer's seminar.
Your problem is you simply don't understand things without someone else outlining them for you.
To say a poor quality pet food is just as healthy for a pet as a high quality one is ignorant at best. To think a corn based diet is OK for obligate carnivore is delusional at best. To think this needs to be proven to one's self via a research paper online is foolhardy at best.

You are the one making claims that cheap food is dangerous. You are the one that bears the responsibility to bring proof for your extraordinary claims. Basic logic backs me up in a way it doesn't for you, if millions of cats were suffering from this cat food there would be an epidemic of pet deaths across the country that could not be ignored. So unless you bring proof, theres every likelyhood your claims are based on gross exaggeration. You talk about not understanding things, but you don't seem to understand the basics about logic or the scientific process.
 
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thescreensavers

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2005
9,930
2
81
oh and btw I was not only a Zoology major...I worked for one of the top vets in probably the whole country. I have seen first hand the results of these unproven yet 'healthy' cheap food diets.

Yep, We went to a vet once which just wanted to make money, he did not care if out dog was in pain. My dog had about 4 bladder infections and she was given antibiotics, we thought that was all it needed, but no one told us that we should also change her diet, so she got a bladder stone which we had removed and on this 2 star food Royal Canin SO 14 which is some urinary food with tons of grains.

We went to the vet to talk about the food change and she was just like Corn is ok for dogs and the food fine blah blah. She is not getting stones any more... but her hair is looking like crap and has spots missing. She took some blood test which I dont think will find anything.

But we are switching to Wellness Core Ocean and going to be giving her a Cranberry supplement.

We just bought some PH strips and we will monitor and log her Urines PH every day for about a week at the same time everyday, with her current food. Then we will change her food and after she has been fully switched to it after a few days we will do the same and check her pH level. If everything stays good then thats the diet we will be feeding her.

When I asked our current vet about testing Urines PH she is like that wont tell you anything but you can do that. I dont get why she something that stupid. Crystals and stones form when the urine is either too acidic or Alkaline. So if its neutral there should be no problem.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
126
Lol, troll harder mr caveman.
I wasn't dignifying with a response your backhanded aspersion that if anyone disagreed with you it was because they dislike pets. As if you'd really back down if i said my pets were fine and live happy long lives on cheap food. Its anecdotal evidence. But you know this, you are just trolling.

LOL. Now, you finally say you have pets. Sure.

So, you feed your pets cheap food. You don't care what the ingredients are? They are all the same and you don't care what's in the food? Don't care that a cat is mainly being fed corn and grains high in phosphorus from a cheap food when they are carnivores?

Again, if you really had pets you would have given your experience with your pets and the kind of food you feed them.

Reported

edit - quick google search on meow mix, kidney disease.
 
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0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
84
91
LOL. Now, you finally saw you have pets. Sure.

So, you feed your pets cheap food. You don't care what the ingredients are? They are all the same and you don't care what's in the food? Don't care that a cat is mainly being fed corn and grains high in phosphorus from a cheap food when they are carnivores?

Again, if you really had pets you would have given your experience with your pets and the kind of food you feed them.

Reported

I never confirm or deny, because that line of argument is disingenuous to its core. You might have an excessive attachment to your pet because you are lonely and have used it as a child or family replacement for all i know. and that emotional connection might lead you to treat it like a human a lavish it with excess. But thats not scientific thinking or reasoning that holds water. If what you are claiming is true and those foods are as dangerous as claimed studies would easily be done to confirm this. This would be a great way to totally dominate market share by discrediting your competitors totally. And don't even pretend they don't have the cash, the yuppie pet owner/organic market is extremely lucrative. So really you are only left with the idea that the healthy food companies enjoy being marginal players, they just can't be bothered to prove their claims for whatever reason.

and lol at your google search, anecdotal claims of kidney failure. Yea because you know..pets aren't supposed to die of organ failure, their springs just wind down and they fall over. How do you think they die naturally anyways...organ failure! when a pet dies its always too soon, and looking for blame is an easy way to divert feelings of grief.
 
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Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
126

Little boy. Go away and let adults discuss. You must be so lonely and pathetic to spend time in a thread where you don't even own a dog nor any other pets. You sound a lot like fleabag.

You can't seem to understand that a carnivore(cat) shouldn't be fed mainly corn and grains, high in phosphorus. You've never observed the results of feeding a pet different brands/ingredients of food and how it may effect their energy level, skin/coat, allergic reactions, stools, etc...

You have some ignorant assumption that all foods are the same, regardless of ingredients and that any pet will be fine on it. I bet you can't comprehend that a dog sled racer needs to feed their dogs something better than grocery store brand dog kibble. A highly active dog, dog with food allergies, dog with kidney issues, etc. have different nutritional needs.
 
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