Q6600 vs E6850 (Short term [12 months])

[bryanW1995]

I recently went from an fx55 to an opteron 180 with no windows reinstall and no problems. In fact, I ended up getting a new mobo, too, so you should be fine with just a new cpu.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues
stupid question, but if upgrading from a core2 e6400 to a quad core Q6600 will it be best to reinstall windows from scratch?

im thinking no, but wanting feedback.

nah you wont have to.

Originally posted by: Genison
I made a decision!!! Man, has this been eating my lunch for the past several days. I decided to go with an E6850. Here's the conclusion I came to:

Look at the benchmarks on Tom's article http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/07/16/cpu_charts_2007/

1. If you take down the score of the E6850 compared to the Q6600 at stock speeds, add it up and you'll see that in everything that isn't heavily dependent on Quad cores, the E6850 is a good 13-20% faster.

2. On those areas where Quad is better, the Q6600 will overtake the E6850 by a small margin. This is an exception in some areas like encoding and what not, but I really don't mind waiting a few more minutes for encoding to finish. Realistically, it's just time.

3. Now, keeping in mind the 600 Mhz difference between the two, overclocking is probably going to be about the same difference. Top speeds of an E6850 seem to be at 4 GHz possibly, 3.8 GHz being very likely. Top speed of a Q6600 on air is probably going to top out at 3.4...maybe 3.6 Ghz? As far as games go, you're talking no more than 10% gain between the two overclocked chips on the games that profess to use Quads effectively.

4. Finally, let's be honest. If I'm mostly interested in games, Crysis is the first I've heard that will use quad cores with a real difference. By that time, if a quad makes that much difference, finding a G0 at $250 is very likely and the difference of selling a used E6850 and buying an "older" G0 Q6600 is probably very negligible. I'm willing to have fun with more speed now and possibly pay another $50-$75 on top for the boost when it will really make a difference.

5. Oh yes...Penryn. Do I really want a faux quad chip or one that's really designed from the ground up as one? In a year or less, prices for a Penryn will reflect what we're seeing today for quads. By then, multi-core games will be much more prevalent.


HA! I broke the code on my own analytical indecision!!

Oh, and I just bought an E6850 from Mwave for $302 after shipping. Poo on you Newegg.

Heres where your logic is flawed. @ the same speed, the Quad's pull slightly ahead in SuperPI, and other sysandra. That means, the Quads are slightly faster clock per clock, but not by a big margin.

Another area where your flawed is if you do encoding, or you multi task like no other, or you use programs which use all 4 cores. Then your E6850 @ 4.0ghz, will get spanked hardcore by my X3210 @ 3.375ghz.

And i would hold your breath on 4ghz. A lot of those pictures which show off 4ghz on air, doesnt have it long enough to run a stability test. And there pushing voltage way beyond whats recomended on AIR.

 

[Genison]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
not trying to bust your bubble, but with that memory/mobo combo you will probably end up at the same oc using the e6750 and save $100 while you're at it. it's not too late to cancel...you can send me a $50 chili's gift certificate and pocket the extra savings

Not really. One extra multiplier gives me more to work with rather than having to depend solely on bus speed. Eh, we'll see. It was budgeted already, so I can afford it.

 

[Genison]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Heres where your logic is flawed. @ the same speed, the Quad's pull slightly ahead in SuperPI, and other sysandra. That means, the Quads are slightly faster clock per clock, but not by a big margin.

Exactly. Not a big margin. Real world performance is not SuperPI and Sandra dependent.

Another area where your flawed is if you do encoding, or you multi task like no other, or you use programs which use all 4 cores. Then your E6850 @ 4.0ghz, will get spanked hardcore by my X3210 @ 3.375ghz.

Yes, but I already mentioned encoding is not what I need the most. Besides, it's a matter of time and I don't mind waiting. Also, I mentioned nothing I use needs 4 cores. Wasted power and heat. I would much rather wait for Penryn when I can utilize four cores more efficiently. I probably won't even be going to Vista exclusively until another service pack is released.

And i would hold your breath on 4ghz. A lot of those pictures which show off 4ghz on air, doesnt have it long enough to run a stability test. And there pushing voltage way beyond whats recomended on AIR.

Yes, that's true, but the same holds true for Quad as well. The point is heat and voltage is going to keep them both separated by a fair gap if the same cooling method is used.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Genison

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Heres where your logic is flawed. @ the same speed, the Quad's pull slightly ahead in SuperPI, and other sysandra. That means, the Quads are slightly faster clock per clock, but not by a big margin.

Exactly. Not a big margin. Real world performance is not SuperPI and Sandra dependent.

Another area where your flawed is if you do encoding, or you multi task like no other, or you use programs which use all 4 cores. Then your E6850 @ 4.0ghz, will get spanked hardcore by my X3210 @ 3.375ghz.

Yes, but I already mentioned encoding is not what I need the most. Besides, it's a matter of time and I don't mind waiting. Also, I mentioned nothing I use needs 4 cores. Wasted power and heat. I would much rather wait for Penryn when I can utilize four cores more efficiently. I probably won't even be going to Vista exclusively until another service pack is released.

And i would hold your breath on 4ghz. A lot of those pictures which show off 4ghz on air, doesnt have it long enough to run a stability test. And there pushing voltage way beyond whats recomended on AIR.

Yes, that's true, but the same holds true for Quad as well. The point is heat and voltage is going to keep them both separated by a fair gap if the same cooling method is used.

WoW... you got me there...

I guess you made the right decision in your case.

 

[btdvox]

Bought my new system:

Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 G0 Stepping (SLA9****) (I assume this is G0)
Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme(made sure it was a flat base)
1X Scythe S-Flex SFF21F for Heatsink
EVGA Geforce 8800 Ultra
ASUS P5K Premium wifi-ap Mainboard
Crucial Ballistix Tracer PC2-8500 2X1GBkit
CoolerMaster CM Stacker832
4X Scythe S-Flex SFF21E for side fan assembly
1X Coolermaster LED 120MM case fan (for lower front)
Pioneer DVR-212DVD RW
1XWestern Digital Raptor X
Enermax Galaxy 1000W PSU
Creative X-Fi Audio
Flashcard reader
Reclusa Keyboard and MX Revolution Mouse
Vista home premium and Kapersky internet security


Should be a rocking system, Cool too
I'm not gonna build it myself, got NCIX to do it, tech said hes gonna test it for awhile and that I chose really good parts. Cant wait to run some games and have a fast comp for basic apps! Crysis here I come!!!

PS- They had wicked deals this week for any Canadians looking at this thread. I got the 8800 Ultra for 589 and E6850 for 298 CDN which is a wicked price.

 

[Blazer7]

Guys, the G0 Q6600 is already available. Are there any other differences besides the TDP ?

?new energy eficient? Q6600 (G0)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/...701&catid=6&subcat=793

 

[Genison]

Originally posted by: aigomorla


WoW... you got me there...

I guess you made the right decision in your case.

I admit, it is really tempting to go with a Q6600 simply for bragging rights. Who doesn't want to be able to say they've got a quad core system? Who doesn't want to post a pic of Sandra showing how it utterly destroys every other CPU in it's database? But for practical reasons, I'm going to wait for Penryn.

 

[Genison]

So here's what I have so far:

ORDERED

E6850
Seagate 7200.10 320 GB
Apevia X-Pleasure-BK
Dell 2407WFP
Foxcon 8800GTX board @ 630/2000
Antec Treo 650W

STILL DECIDING

Abit or Gigabyte P35


DECIDED BUT NOT ORDERED

2 GB Crucial Ballistix PC8500 DDR2
LP DVDRW SATA
Samsung DVDRW


RECEIVED: Nuttin

 

[aigomorla]

Guys, DO me a big favor please.

When you get your G0's can you load up CORETEMP, and tell me what it says next to VID.

This is the startup voltage required for the Quads. Great B3's will have a startup voltage around 1.2875 Xeon's also have simular startup voltages.

Bad B3's will have this number in 1.312 or so.

My ES has a VID of 1.2275

 

[Markfw]

OK, what version of coretemp ? My 94 version say 1.325, none of the above.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Markfw900
OK, what version of coretemp ? My 94 version say 1.325, none of the above.

ack...

mark you got one of the bad B3's then.

As i said, the good B3's under VID in coretemp 0.95 or 0.94 will report the CPU start voltage.

My Xeon's and Q's all list the VID start voltage at 1.2875


Actually i was mistaken:

My X3220 VID: 1.2750
http://i125.photobucket.com/al...aigomorla/NewTemps.jpg

My Q6600 B3 Vid: 1.2875
http://i125.photobucket.com/al...73/aigomorla/Q6600.jpg


You guys need to wait for a screenie of my ES. My main rig is currently down. Replacing the PSU to a TT 1200W, and some other tweeks to the waterloop. But the VID reported it as 1.2280 or something near that.

 

[Diogenes2]

Originally posted by: aigomorla But the VID reported it as 1.2280 or something near that.

That sounds right .. The G0 stepping is supposed to give lower power draw,
so a lower VID makes sense ..

My B3 is 1.26 ..

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Genison
So here's what I have so far:

ORDERED

E6850
Seagate 7200.10 320 GB
Apevia X-Pleasure-BK
Dell 2407WFP
Foxcon 8800GTX board @ 630/2000
Antec Treo 650W

STILL DECIDING

Abit or Gigabyte P35


DECIDED BUT NOT ORDERED

2 GB Crucial Ballistix PC8500 DDR2
LP DVDRW SATA
Samsung DVDRW


RECEIVED: Nuttin

go with the gigabyte. Its almost no contest against the abit. Abit board i like is the IP35-E. They make great cruncher boards at a very nice price of 119.00 But if your going to use it as a main rig, the gigabyte P35-DS3P is my first pick for a cheap P35 board. And gigabyte P35-DQ6 for high end.

the back of the board speaks for itself.
http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/13-128-046-05.jpg

The only board i would even think over the DQ6 would be the P5K-Premium. However im done with P35's I have my eyes on the X38.


OH, make sure you test that DELL for dead pixils as soon as you get it. I heard they had a really really bad batch which made them take it off there web site for a while.

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: Genison
So here's what I have so far:

ORDERED

E6850
Seagate 7200.10 320 GB
Apevia X-Pleasure-BK
Dell 2407WFP
Foxcon 8800GTX board @ 630/2000
Antec Treo 650W

STILL DECIDING

Abit or Gigabyte P35


DECIDED BUT NOT ORDERED

2 GB Crucial Ballistix PC8500 DDR2
LP DVDRW SATA
Samsung DVDRW


RECEIVED: Nuttin

Be careful on the crucial ballistix. I got my pc 8500 ballistix 2x1gb for $89.99 AR but they are WAY higher now. They do have 2x1 gb pc 6400 ballistix 4-4-4-12 for 74.99 at newegg right now, however. I think that the cheapest pc 8500 2x1 gb is 110AR or so now, and ballistix are quite a bit higher than that. I've heard many people state that pc 8500 is often just pc 6400 4-4-4-12 that is oc'd.

 

[bryanW1995]

I'm hearing more and more negatives about the ip35 pro. I sure hope I don't regret that $40 I saved by not getting the dq6...

 

[btdvox]

I just bought the P5K Premium, its awesome board, easy to put a HSF on too.

 

[imported_Buckfutter]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
I'm hearing more and more negatives about the ip35 pro. I sure hope I don't regret that $40 I saved by not getting the dq6...

Bad things? Like what?

The board is on its way here now. I hope i wont regret it now.

/Buckfutter.

 

[AlucardX]

Originally posted by: Buckfutter

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
I'm hearing more and more negatives about the ip35 pro. I sure hope I don't regret that $40 I saved by not getting the dq6...

Bad things? Like what?

The board is on its way here now. I hope i wont regret it now.

/Buckfutter.

i ordered a IP35 myself, I've read nothing but great things about the IP35 series from Abit.

the only thing i can think of is dual POST coldboot issue, and sideways SATA plugs on the IP35 Pro which can cause headaches in some cases.

 

[btdvox]

new supcom bench with Quadcore enabled again, e6850 beats the q6600 (even at Stock!)

http://www.neoseeker.com/resourcelink.html?rlid=152920

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: btdvox
new supcom bench with Quadcore enabled again, e6850 beats the q6600 (even at Stock!)

http://www.neoseeker.com/resourcelink.html?rlid=152920

At the same clock speed, the Q6600 would win.

 

[bryanW1995]

aigomorla just put up his opinion, and he has more quad cores than Gordon Moore. Also, Serpent Royal has stated the same thing several times. I ordered the ip35 pro because of tons of good reviews, and these two don't seem to be against that board so much as in favor of the ip 35e and/or various p35 ds3 mobos. I took a long time to decide between a ds3r for 135, an ip35 pro for 190, or a dq6 for 230. I was very excited and confident of my decision until now. Of course, all will become clear to me soon enough when my e6750 shows up. According to fedex it will be here tomorrow...hopefully I will be able to give you guys the good news sunday.

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Originally posted by: btdvox
new supcom bench with Quadcore enabled again, e6850 beats the q6600 (even at Stock!)

http://www.neoseeker.com/resourcelink.html?rlid=152920

At the same clock speed, the Q6600 would win.

yes, but how many q6600's will be within 500 mhz of the same speed of an e6850? Take the same mobo/cooling/etc and it will probably be at least the 600 mhz difference in stock speed, if not more. How many g0 q6600's will be within 400 mhz of my e6750 once I'm done with it? 5%? 10 % maybe?

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Originally posted by: btdvox
new supcom bench with Quadcore enabled again, e6850 beats the q6600 (even at Stock!)

http://www.neoseeker.com/resourcelink.html?rlid=152920

At the same clock speed, the Q6600 would win.

yes, but how many q6600's will be within 500 mhz of the same speed of an e6850? Take the same mobo/cooling/etc and it will probably be at least the 600 mhz difference in stock speed, if not more. How many g0 q6600's will be within 400 mhz of my e6750 once I'm done with it? 5%? 10 % maybe?

Well, why done you wait and see what you get your 6850 up to, and what some people get their G0 Q6600's up to, then bench. Unless the software can't use all 4 cores, the Q6600 would have to win by a landslide.

 

[SunAngel]

I am soo , I need some concurrence on my issue.

Several immature years ago when I was heavily into DVD ripping and DivX transcoding, I had a Windows XP machine with an Intel P4 3.4GHz Northwood processor, an Asus P4C800-E motherboard, and 4 sticks of 512MB Corsair XMS DDR-400 2-3-2-6 memory. Everything ran at stock speed. With that setup I could encode movies in DivX about half the time it took to watch the movie.

I just recently tore down a system with Vista Home Premium 32-bit, an Intel DG965OT motherboard, an Intel Core 2 Duo e6300 processor, and 2 sticks of 1GB Adata DDR2-800 5-5-5-18 memory. With that system, it took exactly the same time to encode the movie as it took to watch the movie.

Now, I kept all the same components except the e6300 and replaced it was a Q6600. My encode times are now back down to half the time it takes to watch the movie.

It is really ironic isn't it? I threw away a perfectly good P4 system, because Core 2 Duo and Core 2 Quad were supposed to be these revolutionary products. In the end, what did I get? I got the same performance and foolishly stuffed several hundred dollars down the drain in replacement parts. Why did I do this? I started reading Anandtech, Tom's Hardware Guide, and HardOCP.

Thanks fellas, and take care.