Q815021 Hotfix May Cause CD Writing Failure

[prosaic]

I thought I would post about a problem that might, or might not, affect any of the workstations that you folks support. Microsoft seems to be having a small problem getting adequate regression testing done on their hotfixes lately. There was a Q811493 patch which Microsoft has admitted caused "some" Windows XP SP1 systems to suffer performance issues. Microsoft re-released a fixed version of the patch and placed it into the critical updates category yesterday. (It had been demoted to the regular Windows update category until the fix.) I grabbed it and installed it on my systems. It no longer causes either of my Sony P4 Digital Studio workstations at home nor my Toshiba Libretto sub-notebook to slow to a crawl. That's the good news.

Now for the bad news. Microsoft also issued a Q815021 hotfix yesterday which was also included in the critical updates category for my systems. I also grabbed it this morning and installed it on one workstation at home and on my portable system. Through a process of trial and error as I was trying to do my danged job today I learned that the Q815021 hotfix was causing failure of the Libretto's ability to write CDs, using either the built-in Windows XP capability or my third party burning software (Ahead's Nero). I uninstalled the Q815021 patch from the Libretto, and all was well with the system's CD writing capabilities once again. I reinstalled it, and CD writing went away, uninstalled it again, and CD writing started working again.

So, in case anyone wants to compare notes --

Toshiba Libretto L5 (running a Transmeta Crusoe processor, not Intel)
Windows XP SP1 with all Critical Updates (save one) applied
Ahead Nero 5.5.10.28
Iomega Predator CD-RW drive, connected via USB

I will have to wait until I get home today to find out if the IDE-connected writers on the workstations there were adversely affected, also.

- prosaic

 

[Need4Speed]

mmmmm....all these hotfix problems...its like russian roulette with your OS

 

[prosaic]

Yeah, I'm beginning to get a little irked.

It wouldn't take a whole lot more of this sort of thing to get me to consider the alternatives. Only non-Windows item I could replace the Sony Digital Studios with (for anything even approximately affordable) would be Macintosh stuff. I wonder if Linux or BSD could be made to work on my little Libretto with its 1280x600 display.

Seriously, I have had a good ride with Windows 2000 and XP, but it doesn't take a lot of this sort of thing to have a guy like me looking elsewhere. I love all the doodads available in Windows. I'd keep the Windows boxes around for games and stuff if it came to that. But I don't need multi-media for the research and writing.

- prosaic

 

[bacillus]

thanks for that!
installed that hotfix yesterday but have tried burning any cdrs since.

 

[prosaic]

Originally posted by: bacillus
thanks for that!
installed that hotfix yesterday but have tried burning any cdrs since.

I'd be interested to learn if others see the same issue as a result of the hotfix. I'm going to post back to this thread when I find out if my IDE writers were similarly affected.

It's weird. I would never have thought that particular hotfix would have any affect whatsoever on optical storage drives.

- prosaic

 

[prosaic]

If you'll forgive me for talking to myself -- I realized it would have been a good idea to tell you what symptoms I saw. They are unusual.

The failure of CD writing was not a frank, outright failure. I got no application popups (other that Erasure Failure) and nothing in the Event Viewer. No indication of failure of the CD writing process whatsoever.

Longer version. I write daily backups (non-verified) of all data on my work sub-notebook to CD-RW media. I also copy the data via network connection to a workstation at home. I write weekly VERIFIED CD-R copies of all data. Today was a non-verified CD-RW backup day. The first hint I had of trouble occurred when I tried to copy some files from one of my backup CD-RWs onto a Windows 95 machine at a client's office. His machine couldn't read some of the files. I figured maybe it was a media compatibility problem. I wrote a CD-R. No dice. I tried copying files back off of the CD-RW and the CD-R media onto my own system. Some files worked, and some didn't. I tried erasing the CD-RW. I got an erasure failure warning from Nero. I tried Windows built-in CD writing. I tried it. Same results. Notice that the CD writing software never seemed to fail. The story I got from the system was, essentially, that the media was bad.

Then I tried earlier backups done before the application of the hotfix. I can read all of them on my system, all of them on the Windows 95 system. Hmmmm.

So I uninstalled the most recent hotfix (Q815021) I applied. I retested. Everything works. I reinstalled the hotfix. Same symptoms returned. I uninstalled the hotfix. The symptoms went away.

I think that's a confirmed issue with the hotfix and this particular system. I'm currently beginning testing on a desktop system with an IDE-connected DVD/CD writer at home. I'll post back with results.

- prosaic

 

[prosaic]

Okay, this is just getting too weird. I got home and tested a workstation that had the same Q815021 hotfix applied this morning. It writes and verifies CD-RWs just fine via Nero. It's a very different system than the portable:

Pentium IV vs. Transmeta Crusoe
Windows XP Home Edition SP1 vs. Windows XP Professional SP1
IDE-connected Pioneer DVR-104 DVD/CD-RW vs. USB-connected Iomega Predator USB2 CD-RW (connected to a USB1 port on the PC)

Both systems have SP1 and all critical and Windows updates (including the revised 811493) installed. They have virtually identical applications and utility software installed, except that the Pentium IV system also has a slew of video capture and burning software installed.

I'm going to test the Veritas backup software next to see if it was adversely affected, but I'm beginning to suspect that this is either a problem with compatibility of the patch with the Iomega Predator CD-RW drive or, perhaps more generally, with USB-connected CD-RW drives.

I hope other people with similar and diverse configurations will test to see what effects, if any, the patch may have had on their systems' ability to write CDs.

- prosaic

 

[mikecel79]

I've burned 4 CDs today since having it installed. No problems with any of them. This is on a WinXP SP1 machine. I will try my Win2k machine tommorrow.

 

[prosaic]

I'd appreciate it if people responding in this thread would include information about the type of writable drive (USB, IDE, SCSI) as well as the operating system and service pack level. I'm thinking this issue is probably going to involve USB drives only. It may even be specific to one or two particular drive makes or models.

Oh yeah, and please state whether or not you used verification after the write and / or whether or not you actuallly copied files successfully from the target CD back to your system. Please remember that the burns I performed with the affected machine gave no indication whatsoever of being bad until I tried to copy files from the target CDs.

- prosaic

 

[mikecel79]

Realized after I posted I forgot the config. I'm using a IDE TDK 48X burner. I used both Windows to burn a CD (music CD from Media Player) and Nero to burn a few data CD. I know the music CD is fine since I listened to the whole thing in my car. I was also able to copy all data from the CDs to my PC at work with no problems.

At work I have a SCSI and a USB drive I will try to burn to. These would be on a Win2k machine.

 

[prosaic]

Great, thanks for the information.

I'm thinking that this will be specific to WinXP SP1 and USB drives, but who knows? I have now tested two more WinXP SP1 systems with IDE drives with no problems. Only the system with the USB writer was affected out of our four Windows machines. (We don't have any other Windows versions in the house.)

- prosaic

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Originally posted by: prosaic
I wonder if Linux or BSD could be made to work on my little Libretto with its 1280x600 display.

I'm fairly confident they would

 

[prosaic]

This is a post-weekend bump to see if anyone with a USB-connected CD writer has encountered problems writing good CDs following application of the Q815021 to a WinXP SP1 (or other) system.

Thanks.

- prosaic

 

[prosaic]

continuing the tradition of talking (mostly) to myself...

Microsoft amended the security bulletin and knowledge base article re Q815021 on 05/30/2003. Just for grins I decided to see if my luck with it would change. To give myself the best chance (I hoped) of success, I uninstalled Nero before re-applying this critical update via the Windows update site. I applied the patch, then installed Nero, then tested. It works now.

I examined the revised article and saw no mention whatsoever of users having reported problems with the patch, nor is there any stipulation that the patch itself might have been revised since 05/28/2003 when the revised patch was first released.

I just thought I would post this information in case it might be helpful to someone else who happens to experience the same issues. I don't know whether Microsoft changed something in the installation procedure, or in the patch itself, or if I just had an unassociated error on my system that got fixed when I uninstalled Nero then re-installed it. But Nero is behaving itself now on my USB-connected Predator CD-RW drive.

- prosaic

 

[mikecel79]

Prosiac I just had the chance to test a 4x Iomega USB drive on a WinXP machine and I had no problems using it. However this machine did not have Nero on it. Only Easy CD-Creator 5 and the built-in burning with XP. I tried both and had no problems with boths discs I made.

 

[prosaic]

Thank you for that information. I have a feeling that my issue may have been a result of this specific type of USB-connected CD writer. I don't have another brand of external writer to test with, so I'm left with a bit of a mystery.

But at least I'm patched, and the sucker is working again!

Thanks again!

- prosaic

 

[tigerwannabe]

i have this hotfix installed and just tried to burn a cd several days after installing it--no luck, won't burn a thing. my burner is an hp 9100.
i'm gonna remove the hotfix and see if it revives my burner. i can read from the burner ok. when i try to burn, the thing times out according to the event log. it also stops the "imapi cd-burning com service". i can restart the service ok, but when i try to burn, windows stops the service.

 

[prosaic]

It sounds like this could be the same issue that I had. Really erratic results with CD burning attempts with Nero, and even with the built-in burning features -- though that packet-writing stuff is, IMO, always somewhat less than rock-solid. Good luck! I hope you'll post back with your results. I'm having much better behavior from my portable system following the little uninstall/reinstall two-step dance.

- prosaic

 

[tigerwannabe]

more info...i removed the hotfix & all was well with my burner. i did get a message during the removal(i removed it via add/remove programs) that a hotfix for internet explorer may not work properly without the 815021 installed. i forgot to write down the hotfix #
but ie seems to be doing ok.

 

[tigerwannabe]

prosaic, i'm gonna reinstall the hotfix & install nero to see what happens. the only burning i tried to do with the hotfix installed was with xp's built-in burning software.

 

[tigerwannabe]

more weirdness i reinstalled the hotfix and tried to burn using xp's built-in software--burned fine. i installed nero burning software and it is burning fine right now. i don't understand it but my burner seems to be working now.

 

[prosaic]

Yup, I think that a) Microsoft may have fixed the installation procedure at the Windows Update site, or b) simply re-installing the Nero software may fix it, or c) both. I'm inclined toward possibility c. Sounds like we had almost exactly the same experience.

- prosaic

 

[Lord Evermore]

I never had any burning problem at all after installing it. Guess I'm probably the "most computers" that aren't affected according to MS spinsters.

The errors about updates that might not work when you uninstall are rather misleading. They don't actually mean that the update has any affect at all on the other fixes, it just means "hey, you installed these items after you installed this patch you're removing" as a warning that removing the patch might modify a file that one of the other updates uses. One would hope Microsoft has the sense to not make their patches modify shared files in ways that make the file unusable for others.

 

[prosaic]

Yes, one would hope, wouldn't one?

I can attest from personal knowledge that the way Windows File Protection works could still stand a little tweaking. An example would be the NTDLL.DLL file. Both Q811493 and Q815021 updated this file, with Q815021 installing the latest version. If you uninstall Q815021 the NTDLL.DLL version reverts to what was installed before Q811493 instead of reverting to the version that was installed by Q811493. If the file has important functionality that pertains to Q811493 (And, if it doesn't, then why was it included in the patch?) one would think that the WFP / uninstall procedure combination would protect the system from reversion to the pre-Q811493 version of the file. This is the only case I have checked into. I have no idea whether or not removal of other patches which share specific file update paths causes similar reversions. But if this is common it would seem to have implications for system behavior and security.

Perhaps they don't worry about maintaining file versions during patch removal, figuring that it'll all get fixed in the next SP. Doesn't seem like a good idea to me, though.

- prosaic

 

[RalfHutter]

I finally got around to trying this. I installed 815021 (along with the much-reviled 811493) on 6-7-03 but didn't try burning an CDrs untill yesterday. My burner is an external Plextor 40x USB 2.0 and I use Nero. I burned 4 music CDs yesterday, the source for all 4 was mp3s. All four Cdrs work fine on three different CD players that I tried them on, one regular Sony home audio player, one built into a boom box and my car player. So I'd say that for me at least, this hotfix hasn't affected my CD burning at all.