Question for the X1800XT owners

[Matt2]

Originally posted by: M0RPH

Originally posted by: Rollo

I've heard nothing about these parts yet, just repeating what I've read.

Let's see, with these rumors and also the rumor that they would be beefing up their shader processing, this baby should be able to render a life-size hologram of Jessica Alba in 8192x2048x2048 resolution with full AA/AF. I can't wait!

Sounds like your R520 rumors that this entire forum had to swallow for 8 months.

What video card are you running anyways M0RPH? For some reason I can see you running a Radeon 32mb.

 

[Munky]

All flaming aside, there were hints last fall that the r580 would follow shortly after the r520, that it would lanch in early 2006, and what the specs of it would be. The funny part is that some people posted the very same information on this forum back then, and got ignored by the majority because it just didnt seem likely for Ati to scrap the r520 only 3 months after the launch. Even I didnt think back in October that the r580 would launch as early as January, but at least I had an idea of what the specs would be.

Bottom line: when someone posts an unlikely scenario/idea, they might just be onto something we dont know... case in point: the g71. Most people are just expecting a 32 pipe 700mhz card based on rumors and known concepts. And as unlikely as it may seem, the g71 may turn out completely different from what the rumor mill predicted, just like the r520 and r580 turned out different from what people were expecting to be 24 or 32 pipe cards.

 

[Tom]

Are there sales numbers of these things ? Like is there a reason to think there are all that many people who bought x1800XTs instead of 7800 series cards ?

I would be surprised to learn that the x1800xt has been the dominant card, marketshare-wise, anyone have any facts ?

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Matt2
Captain obvious huh?

You must have missed the millions of threads stating that the 7800 series wasnt worth it and to wait for the R520.

Really? I don't remember those kind of threads. Just did a search for "wait for r520" but didn't come up with anything. THere were however lots of threads pimping the R580. I'm not flaming or anything, I just don't remember people saying wait for the R520 over the 7800. Hell if I had the money at the time I would have definitely gone for a 7800GT.

I think it was pretty obvious with all the reviews that were done by various sites that the 7800 was THE king for quite a while.

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: Matt2

What video card are you running anyways M0RPH? For some reason I can see you running a Radeon 32mb.

I have a vanilla X800. Yeah, I only buy what I need to play the few games that I'm into. I'm not a heavy gamer. I still like to talk and debate about this stuff. I hope you're not going to tell me that my opinion on these things doesn't matter because I don't own one of these high-end cards. That would make you a video snob like someone else here.

Anyway, I'll probably buy a 1900XT once it comes down to $350 where it should be.

 

[Alaa]

i see many ATi fans happy that ATi has the lead for 1 month ..what a joke!! nvidia had it for 6 months, i cant see any difference now between ati and nvidia ati has 5-10 more fps and thats not much to make ppl who like to buy nvidia cards turn to ati or atiers turn to nvidia, stable period......

 

[NYHoustonman]

Originally posted by: Alaa
i see many ATi fans happy that ATi has the lead for 1 month ..what a joke!! nvidia had it for 6 months, i cant see any difference now between ati and nvidia ati has 5-10 more fps and thats not much to make ppl who like to buy nvidia cards turn to ati or atiers turn to nvidia, stable period......

ATI had a lead before that too >.>. The fact is, ATI has the fastest offering available (single core) right now, I don't see why everyone is getting so worked up over this. A thread recommending that people wait for the next latest and greatest video card is different from a thread proclaiming a certain video card isn't the fastest available at the time (and even now, it may be wise to hold off on the x1900 if you can, to see what NVidia responds with).

 

[thilanliyan]

If the rumoured specs are true, the 7900 will probably beat the x1900. Now hopefully a newer game such as Elder Scrolls: Oblivion will use lots of shaders keeping the x1900 from losing too badly. It will be an interesting couple of months.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

I would simply convince myself that it has value as a soon to be rare "collector's item", and that it performs just fine for the lowered settings I would settle for and cling to my "ATI owns all no matter what" ways because I feel it is my sacred calling to be that someone who has to counter the current trend of nVidia fanboyism no matter how foolish it makes me look.

Kidding asside I would be upset if I flopped down $500 because I can't afford it in the first place, ofcourse I'd want the faster X1900. However I didn't make that poor decision because I don't buy things I can't afford. If I had that kind of money to throw away on hardware I probably wouldn't care, it wouldn't be too hard to sell/give away that old card and upgrade to the newer X1900, which we all heard rumors of by the time the overly delayed X1800 got here. Of which if I could spend $500 on my video cards without hesitation I would have already had a 7800GTX and wouldn't have waited for the X1800 in the first place to be dissapointed about an X1900.

 

[Pete]

Originally posted by: Matt2
You must have missed the millions of threads stating that the 7800 series wasnt worth it and to wait for the R520.

Am I reading a different forum, or did I just miss the "millions" of threads dissing the 7800? If this forum really did have millions of such threads, it'd be such a lost cause that none of us would waste out time posting here.

This thread is pretty funny. In fact, the whole idea of computer part depreciation is pretty funny, unless you upgrade every single cycle and spend enough time to know to sell your high-end card right before the next gen launches. (I'm kind of surprised no one's brought up the 5800 to 5900 transition, though. Um, whoops.) And I'd probably pity more than sympathize with an OEM/AIB that had worse info re: R580 than us forum-goers. That's assuming ATI didn't tell them anything, which I suppose is possible if they're not a fan of pleasing their customers.

 

[Pete]

Originally posted by: RobertR1
If you believe the 7800GTX 512 will have appreciation vs. depreceation over the course of it's lifespan, you should stop talking.

The people who're paying $900 for a card that gets beat by a cheaper card are fools, not smart decision makers.

A x1800xt user might lose $100-$300 but a 7800GTX 512 owner stands to lose $300-600+ on their purchase if they choose to follow a refresh upgrade cycle.

The 7800GTX 512 has a much more negative economic effect if you choose to upgrade to a 7900GTX, considering the street price of the 7800GTX 512. This street price will drop like a brick once the 7900 series cards arrive. Only a die hard or uninformed buyer would pay $900 for a 7800GTX 512 today.

QFT.

 

[lopri]

Well.. To be 100% honest if I were given a choice to pick a GTX 512 or a X1900XTX, I'd pick a GTX 512 without a second thought. Don't get me wrong I believe the X1900XTX is faster than GTX 512 in general and ATI's image quality is great. I've owned many of ATI cards in the past.

However, there is something other than just speed.

1. ATI really need to hire some industrial designers.. Their boards, coolers, stickers, even the logos and advertisements.. ugh.. why can't they hire some top-notch designers? They sure can afford to do so, I believe.
2. I love the GTX 512 cooler. It keeps the card very cool (My max never goes above 60C) and extremely quiet. One more thing I can actually clean the dust off the fans! Believe it or not it's a big deal for me. I don't think it'd be easy to clean the fans on X1900s. Lower GPU temps = lower system temps = better CPU OC
3. Have you tried OC GTX 512s? It goes easily above 625/1800. Not sure how it'd compare to X1900XTX stock, but I have a feeling that it'll be close. Of course I have no idea how XTX will OC, but given the information on its temps, I wouldn't want to OC much higher than its stock speed.
4. I still have some reservation on ATI's drivers. You just can't predict where the quirks will show up. (Age of Empires 3, Black and White 2, etc.) System level compatibility also seems sometimes questionable. (Especially with those AIW cards) It could be a result of NV's marketing (TWIMTBP) or incompetency of ATI drivers team, but regardless I just don't want to have such occasions at all. I was extremely temped to get an R520 cards when it came out, but I'm so relieved that I didn't buy one. I'm currently playing Age of Empires.
5. I wanted dual card setup. The choice is quite obvious. Does anyone own a cross-fire motherboard?

Just my thought.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: BouZouki
I had the GTX for a few months while it was the fastest and the best but guess what, it doesn't have the throne anymore.

That depends on the game and the setting, but the X1900XTX is in general slightly faster.

At BF2 and FEAR, it's got a good margin of difference.

BTW- we'll be expecting you to buy a 7900GTX in five weeks when you X1900 "doesn't have the throne anymore".

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: M0RPH

Originally posted by: Matt2

What video card are you running anyways M0RPH? For some reason I can see you running a Radeon 32mb.

I have a vanilla X800. Yeah, I only buy what I need to play the few games that I'm into. I'm not a heavy gamer. I still like to talk and debate about this stuff. I hope you're not going to tell me that my opinion on these things doesn't matter because I don't own one of these high-end cards. That would make you a video snob like someone else here.

No, it would make him someone who prefers to discuss the cards with someone who's actually seen one.

There's nothing wrong with playing "fantasy football", but the guys who have old cards that don't support any of the features being discussed are on shakey ground trying to say "Angle dependent AA and HDR+AA are the key IQ features to have!" when they don't seem to care enough to have them and have never actually seen them.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: lopri
Well.. To be 100% honest if I were given a choice to pick a GTX 512 or a X1900XTX, I'd pick a GTX 512 without a second thought. Don't get me wrong I believe the X1900XTX is faster than GTX 512 in general and ATI's image quality is great. I've owned many of ATI cards in the past.

However, there is something other than just speed.

1. ATI really need to hire some industrial designers.. Their boards, coolers, stickers, even the logos and advertisements.. ugh.. why can't they hire some top-notch designers? They sure can afford to do so, I believe.
2. I love the GTX 512 cooler. It keeps the card very cool (My max never goes above 60C) and extremely quiet. One more thing I can actually clean the dust off the fans! Believe it or not it's a big deal for me. I don't think it'd be easy to clean the fans on X1900s. Lower GPU temps = lower system temps = better CPU OC
3. Have you tried OC GTX 512s? It goes easily above 625/1800. Not sure how it'd compare to X1900XTX stock, but I have a feeling that it'll be close. Of course I have no idea how XTX will OC, but given the information on its temps, I wouldn't want to OC much higher than its stock speed.
4. I still have some reservation on ATI's drivers. You just can't predict where the quirks will show up. (Age of Empires 3, Black and White 2, etc.) System level compatibility also seems sometimes questionable. (Especially with those AIW cards) It could be a result of NV's marketing (TWIMTBP) or incompetency of ATI drivers team, but regardless I just don't want to have such occasions at all. I was extremely temped to get an R520 cards when it came out, but I'm so relieved that I didn't buy one. I'm currently playing Age of Empires.
5. I wanted dual card setup. The choice is quite obvious. Does anyone own a cross-fire motherboard?

Just my thought.

Lopri,
You have clearly forgotten that the 512GTXs are not available when you bought your two.
Also, little fans in big cases spinning fast and loud are the way of the future, nVidia was unaware ATI fans prefer heat and noise when they put that Quadro cooler on the 512s.

Carry on.

 

[n7]

I am extremely happy i got my X1800XT.

Heck, i got mine only days before the X1900XT/X launched.
I paid less for my X1800XT than 7800GTs cost though, so that could be why

I was playing FEAR last night @ 1600x1200 4x AA, 8x AF, everything maxed. Yeah, i'm happy

 

[Munky]

Originally posted by: lopri
Well.. To be 100% honest if I were given a choice to pick a GTX 512 or a X1900XTX, I'd pick a GTX 512 without a second thought. Don't get me wrong I believe the X1900XTX is faster than GTX 512 in general and ATI's image quality is great. I've owned many of ATI cards in the past.

However, there is something other than just speed.

1. ATI really need to hire some industrial designers.. Their boards, coolers, stickers, even the logos and advertisements.. ugh.. why can't they hire some top-notch designers? They sure can afford to do so, I believe.
2. I love the GTX 512 cooler. It keeps the card very cool (My max never goes above 60C) and extremely quiet. One more thing I can actually clean the dust off the fans! Believe it or not it's a big deal for me. I don't think it'd be easy to clean the fans on X1900s. Lower GPU temps = lower system temps = better CPU OC
3. Have you tried OC GTX 512s? It goes easily above 625/1800. Not sure how it'd compare to X1900XTX stock, but I have a feeling that it'll be close. Of course I have no idea how XTX will OC, but given the information on its temps, I wouldn't want to OC much higher than its stock speed.
4. I still have some reservation on ATI's drivers. You just can't predict where the quirks will show up. (Age of Empires 3, Black and White 2, etc.) System level compatibility also seems sometimes questionable. (Especially with those AIW cards) It could be a result of NV's marketing (TWIMTBP) or incompetency of ATI drivers team, but regardless I just don't want to have such occasions at all. I was extremely temped to get an R520 cards when it came out, but I'm so relieved that I didn't buy one. I'm currently playing Age of Empires.
5. I wanted dual card setup. The choice is quite obvious. Does anyone own a cross-fire motherboard?

Just my thought.

I havent had a 512gtx, but I know there was a 600mhz version released by one vendor, and that one had to resort to watercooling. So I dont see how it could easily OC to 625mhz on stock air cooling.

Also, not to spoil the party or anything, but if the rumored specs of the g71 are true, there's a very real possibility it will still lose in games like FEAR. Someone quote me on this when the benches are in

 

[BroadbandGamer]

My kids P4 2.53 died two weeks before the X1900 release. I knew ATI was coming out with a new card but didn't think it was going to be much better then the X1800 XT. I didn't want my kid using my PC for the next two weeks so I decided it was time for him to go PCIe and I picked him up a X1800 XT for $450 (after rebate) from zipzoomfly. Well, the day ATI released/announced the X1900 XTX I put his brand new X1800 XT up on ebay (ZZF wouldn't take it back). I sold it for $400. I lost about $100. So yeah, I was a little pissed. I'm over it now. My kid has my old 7800 GTX and I have a brand new X1900 XTX.

 

[KeepItRed]

Originally posted by: Rollo
Summary says it, I'm wondering what the guys who held out for the launch of the X1800XT, paid $500+ for it, think about it being discontinued 2 months later due to a far superior product being launched at the same price point?

That would annoy me, personally.

Which leads to the next question:
When will X1800XTs be fire-saled at $400? A trip to Pricewatch shows them "selling" for $494+, if you can believe that.

I will NOT reply to flames in this thread, I'm interested in what the X1800XT guys think about it.

Food for thought: If you think consumers are pissed, what about OEMs who have been preparing X1800XT PEs?! They're obsolete before they hit the market!

Discontinued? I don't see it...

 

[fstime]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: BouZouki
I had the GTX for a few months while it was the fastest and the best but guess what, it doesn't have the throne anymore.

That depends on the game and the setting, but the X1900XTX is in general slightly faster.

At BF2 and FEAR, it's got a good margin of difference.

BTW- we'll be expecting you to buy a 7900GTX in five weeks when you X1900 "doesn't have the throne anymore".

I'm happy with this card for now, I like to switch it up once and a while, not every 2 days.

 

[RussianSensation]

I still dont understand how 7800GTX 256 mb can be selling for $450-460. Also, I would welcome G71 beating the crap out of X1900XTX cards. If it didnt win upon introduction in March, that is not progress.

 

[jim1976]

Teh new BollywOOd production

 

[Killrose]

"Three 512 GTXs sold this weekend for $760., $900., and $976.. Those cards actually appreciated in value"


Just proves the 'ol P.T.Barnum theorum about a sucker being born everyminute. I'm sure the sellers were happy to dump those cards and turn around and buy a much faster X1900XTX for hundreds less.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: KeepItRed

Originally posted by: Rollo
Summary says it, I'm wondering what the guys who held out for the launch of the X1800XT, paid $500+ for it, think about it being discontinued 2 months later due to a far superior product being launched at the same price point?

That would annoy me, personally.

Which leads to the next question:
When will X1800XTs be fire-saled at $400? A trip to Pricewatch shows them "selling" for $494+, if you can believe that.

I will NOT reply to flames in this thread, I'm interested in what the X1800XT guys think about it.

Food for thought: If you think consumers are pissed, what about OEMs who have been preparing X1800XT PEs?! They're obsolete before they hit the market!

Discontinued? I don't see it...

Google is your friend KeepItRed-

http://compreviews.about.com/b/a/239071.htm

The major development was moving from 16 pixel shaders in the now discontinued X1800 ] to 48 for the X1900. This has helped catapult ATI to being the fastest graphics card on the market. But even with this single card performance, those looking to use multiple graphics cards would be better served by the NVIDIA SLI over the ATI CrossFire.

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Rollo
Google is your friend KeepItRed-

http://compreviews.about.com/b/a/239071.htm

The major development was moving from 16 pixel shaders in the now discontinued X1800 ] to 48 for the X1900. This has helped catapult ATI to being the fastest graphics card on the market. But even with this single card performance, those looking to use multiple graphics cards would be better served by the NVIDIA SLI over the ATI CrossFire.

Um... because some random guy on About.com is clearly the definitive source for graphics card news. Right.

I don't really understand the point of this thread. Unless you jumped on an X1800 almost the day they came out, there were at least rumors that ATI would have new cards launching near the end of January. And it's not like anyone buying a brand-new, premium-priced high-end video card should expect it to hold value very well. Okay, so your card lost $100 in value over 3 months instead of losing it over 6 months.

Dear God, no. Anything but that.

I also don't recall this level of concern in cases such as the R9800/9600 cards replacing the R9700/9500s, or the FX5900/5700s replacing the 5800/5600s, or the RX850s replacing the X800s, etc. etc. I realize the timing is quicker than usual, but honestly, ANY card is going to be replaced by something faster over time, and 'refresh' parts were to be expected relatively soon after the launch of R520. If the X1900s are faster and don't really cost much more to manufacture... then ATI should transition over to them and phase out the X1800s. There's nothing particularly unusual about this, since we've seen both ATI and NVIDIA do similar things before.

Rollo, you also seem to be harping on how the 7800GTX "Ultra" 512MB has gone *up* in value since release. This is a VERY unusual situation, which occurred because the supply is so limited and (until last week) it was the fastest available single card. It is a *rare* video card that is a 'good investment', let alone one that won't drop in value like a rock within 3-6 months. Nobody should buy high-end video cards expecting to make money on them (unless you get some killer deal right after launch and can turn around and resell them immediately).