R260/270/280/290/290x Review thread

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RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
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Ya pretty amazing how most of the forum was way off on R9 290/X prices. For weeks people thought R9 290X would be $649-699. Now with 290 at $399, 780 is too expensive and 780Ti at $699 makes no sense since you might as well get 2x R9 290s for $100 more! Spectacular price/performance. The noise and temperatures will be fixed shortly with after-market versions. I bet we'll have $410-430 after-market R9 290s. Now the R9 290X seems too expensive too. Pretty amazing that in a period of 6 months AMD has brought GTX780's performance level from $649 to just $399. Competition FTW!

Titan is only 3% faster at 1600P.



I didn't think AMD/NV would deliver a card with ~ Titan level of performance at $399 until December of 2014 but it just happened! At this rate we can expect Titan performance at $299 by end of 2014? Most likely

As I said for many months now that $399-449 770 2-4GB cards were an extreme rip-off and finally AMD puts the nail in that card's coffin. 770 4GB is selling for around $389 after a price cut. 770 and 780 both need price drops again.
 
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StinkyPinky

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2002
6,883
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So the card sounds like a foghorn? I mean, the performance is unbelievable for the price but it's not worth it if you have a card screaming all the time. Any chance Anand got a dud card?
 

Saylick

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2012
3,504
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Anandtech said:
As a result rather than having a 5% clockspeed deficit as the official specs for these cards would indicate, the 290 for all intents and purposes clocks higher than the 290X. Which means that its clockspeed advantage is now offsetting the loss of shader/texturing performance due to the CU reduction, while providing a clockspeed greater than the 290X for the equally configured front-end and back-end. In practice this means that 290 has over 100% of 290X’s ROP/geometry performance, 100% of the memory bandwidth, and at least 91% of the shading performance.

So in games where we’re not significantly shader bound, and Metro at 2560 appears to be one such case, the 290 can trade blows with the 290X despite its inherent disadvantage. Now as we’ll see this is not going to be the case in every game, as not every game GPU bound in the same manner and not every game throttles on the 290X by the same degree, but it sets up a very interesting performance scenario. By pushing the 290 this hard, and by throwing any noise considerations out the window, AMD has created a card that can not only threaten the GTX 780, but can threaten the 290X too. As we’ll see by the end of our benchmarks, the 290 is only going to trail the 290X by an average of 3% at 2560x1440.

I think it's pretty clear that the 290 is to the 290X what the 780 is to Titan. The gap between the two is too small to justify another $150 imo.

Ya pretty amazing how most of the forum was way off on R9 290/X prices. For weeks people thought R9 290X would be $649-699. Now with 290 at $399, 780 is too expensive and 780Ti at $699 makes no sense since you might as well get 2x R9 290s for $100 more! Spectacular price/performance. The noise and temperatures will be fixed shortly with after-market versions. I bet we'll have $410-430 after-market R9 290s. Now the R9 290X seems too expensive too. Pretty amazing that in a period of 6 months AMD has brought GTX780's performance level from $649 to just $399. Competition FTW!

Agreed. I gotta hand it to AMD for bringing competition back to the table. I recall making a few posts back before the specs were released about the 290X being 3X Bonaire and you guessed it as 2X Pitcairn thumbsup: for that, btw). That lead to price discussions with the general consensus being $650 for 290X and $500-550 for 290. Hindsight 20-20 but I'm glad it turned out the way it did. I look forward to seeing aftermarket 290s.

With that said, $700 GTX 780 Ti seems ridiculous at the moment, especially if it will only be ~20% faster than the 290. Even if you were to justify its price in relation to Titan, Titan was majorly overpriced, so $700 ONLY looks proper IF you assume that Titan was properly priced to begin with, which it wasn't from the get-go. You could even apply the same thinking to the 780. Sure, it looked great at $650 when the Titan was at $1000, but it was clear that nVidia was milking the heck out of them, and to this day they been milking GK110 for all that its been worth. Smart move by them, however, to soak up as much consumer surplus as they could before they are forced to lower prices due to competition, but it doesn't look well from a reputation POV in my mind.
 
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RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
So the card sounds like a foghorn? I mean, the performance is unbelievable for the price but it's not worth it if you have a card screaming all the time. Any chance Anand got a dud card?

After-market versions should be what $10-30 more? Sometimes after-market cards have no premiums at all (R9 280X Windforce 3x for example). Drop an after-market cooler on the R9 290 and you are still making R9 290X, 780 and Titan seem overpriced. The only thing saving the 780 now is the 3-game holiday bundle that is going to end on November 26th. 780 will need another $70-80 price cut after that. NV needs to reconsider the $699 price for 780Ti. It seems completely outrageous. It's going to end up like 4870 vs. GTX280 all over again if NV goes with it.

In TechReport's review, in 99th percentile FPS, the Titan cannot beat the $399 R9 290!



After-market R9 290 are definitely the one to wait for. After-market cooler fixed 480's noise and temperatures and the same will happen for R9 290s.



R9 290 is performing very well in BF4 even without Mantle.

 
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chimaxi83

Diamond Member
May 18, 2003
5,456
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So the card sounds like a foghorn? I mean, the performance is unbelievable for the price but it's not worth it if you have a card screaming all the time. Any chance Anand got a dud card?

No, I'm sure the card reviewed was just fine. At anything beyond ~55% fan, it's annoyingly loud. Wouldn't bother someone wearing a headset, but it's definitely loud when that fan cranks up.

Are all these reviews using launch 290X numbers against 290 with the latest driver? If so I guess 290X will be getting a boost as well.
 

SimianR

Senior member
Mar 10, 2011
609
16
81
No, I'm sure the card reviewed was just fine. At anything beyond ~55% fan, it's annoyingly loud. Wouldn't bother someone wearing a headset, but it's definitely loud when that fan cranks up.

Are all these reviews using launch 290X numbers against 290 with the latest driver? If so I guess 290X will be getting a boost as well.

Hmm, to me it looks like what the driver "fix" actually did was use a more aggressive fan profile on the 290 - not sure there were any gains on the 290X.

From Techpowerup:

AMD released a second driver, which we used, after the initial driver provided to reviewers. It yields additional performance to beat the GTX 780 by increasing maximum fan speed from 40% to 47%. The fan is unfortunately also much noisier, so much so that noise output might actually turn into a real dealbreaker for many.

AMD also confirmed that this "new" driver adheres to the way this product is designed to work, and its changes will be included in all future drivers. The driver does not affect the fan speed/performance ratio of any other AMD product.

Anyway, at $400 this card is a good deal. If I were to buy one I would probably adjust the target temperature/fan profile to a more appropriate sound level though, even at the cost of a bit of performance.
 

Teizo

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2010
1,271
31
91
So the card sounds like a foghorn? I mean, the performance is unbelievable for the price but it's not worth it if you have a card screaming all the time. Any chance Anand got a dud card?

Yeah, another wonderful card absolutely murdered by a crappy heatsink/cooler. Hopefully these AIB cards come soon and can get heat and noise under control.

Are all these reviews using launch 290X numbers against 290 with the latest driver? If so I guess 290X will be getting a boost as well.

It only affects the 290. Makes me wonder by doing so if AMD has given up on the 290X. They pretty much rendered it almost inept by placing this card $150 less given it is so close to it performance wise...and they claim it is a permanent update as well.
 
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Vesku

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2005
3,743
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From Anandtech GTX 480 review:

"Meanwhile let’s talk about the other factors: price, power, and noise. At $500 the GTX 480 is the world’s fastest single-GPU card, but it’s not a value proposition. The price gap between it and the Radeon 5870 is well above the current performance gap, but this has always been true about the high-end. Bigger than price though is the tradeoff for going with the GTX 480 and its much bigger GPU – it’s hotter, it’s noisier, and it’s more power hungry, all for 10-15% more performance. If you need the fastest thing you can get then the choice is clear, otherwise you’ll have some thinking to decide what you want and what you’re willing to live with in return."

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2977/...x-470-6-months-late-was-it-worth-the-wait-/20

From Anandtech Radeon 290 review:

" The problem is that while the 290 is a fantastic card and a fantastic story on a price/performance basis, in chasing that victory AMD has thrown caution into the wind and thrown out any kind of balance between performance and noise. At 57.2dB the 290 is a loud card. A very loud card. An unreasonably loud card. AMD has quite simply prioritized performance over noise, and these high noise levels are the price of doing so.

To get right to the point then, this is one of a handful of cards we’ve ever had to recommend against. The performance for the price is stunning, but we cannot in good faith recommend a card this loud when any other card is going to be significantly quieter. There comes a point where a video card is simply too loud for what it does, and with the 290 AMD has reached it."

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7481/the-amd-radeon-r9-290-review/17

Hmmmmm, I note that the GTX 480 was not one of the "handful" recommended against. Granted this reference card is not to my taste but the disparity in tone between the two loud reference design reviews, by the same author, actually leaves me sympathetic to the 290. It actually gives more performance for less money while being loud yet gets a drastically more negative conclusion than a card that gave more performance for more money while being loud.
 
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Feb 19, 2009
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45% fanspeed for AMD blowers is the acceptable limit, beyond that it gets annoying for me.

The R290 is an excellent performer for the price certainly, and 47% fan cap does not take it into the obscene level in terms of noise. Waiting for a good custom AIB card and I will most likely grab it!!

Edit: This card at this price, really obsoletes the entire line up above it. Even the R290X is a hard sell, when its only 7% slower while being $150 cheaper.. not to mention its 7% slower because of the artificial cap of ~950mhz boost. Clock for clock, the difference would be what, 2-3%??
 
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Saylick

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2012
3,504
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From Anandtech GTX 480 review:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2977/...x-470-6-months-late-was-it-worth-the-wait-/20

"Meanwhile let’s talk about the other factors: price, power, and noise. At $500 the GTX 480 is the world’s fastest single-GPU card, but it’s not a value proposition. The price gap between it and the Radeon 5870 is well above the current performance gap, but this has always been true about the high-end. Bigger than price though is the tradeoff for going with the GTX 480 and its much bigger GPU – it’s hotter, it’s noisier, and it’s more power hungry, all for 10-15% more performance. If you need the fastest thing you can get then the choice is clear, otherwise you’ll have some thinking to decide what you want and what you’re willing to live with in return."

From Anandtech Radeon 290 review:

" The problem is that while the 290 is a fantastic card and a fantastic story on a price/performance basis, in chasing that victory AMD has thrown caution into the wind and thrown out any kind of balance between performance and noise. At 57.2dB the 290 is a loud card. A very loud card. An unreasonably loud card. AMD has quite simply prioritized performance over noise, and these high noise levels are the price of doing so.

To get right to the point then, this is one of a handful of cards we’ve ever had to recommend against. The performance for the price is stunning, but we cannot in good faith recommend a card this loud when any other card is going to be significantly quieter. There comes a point where a video card is simply too loud for what it does, and with the 290 AMD has reached it."

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7481/the-amd-radeon-r9-290-review/17

Hmmmmm. Granted this reference card is not to my taste but the disparity in tone between the two loud reference design reviews, by the same author, actually leaves me sympathetic to the 290. It actually gives more performance for less money while being loud yet gets a drastically more negative conclusion than a card that gave more performance for more money while being loud.

I think it's just an indication of how low-noise performance has become more and more relevant today than it was a few years ago, which I find interesting when you consider that it was nVidia who made the first real push at placing low-noise performance as an important parameter for video cards.
 

Teizo

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2010
1,271
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http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-r9-290-review-benchmark,3659-19.html

Tom's HW apparently slapped on an Accelero XIII on their 290 sample. There are a couple of videos as well for sound comparison purposes, and all I have say is this: 290 reference cooler, i.e. hairdryer vs. 290 + AXIII = night v. day.

Either way, this ought to be a taste of whats to come...



Gigabyte must be drooling right now. Their Windforce cooler is pretty much the same thing almost...and that AXIII does make an absolutely wonderful difference.
 

Vesku

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2005
3,743
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I think it's just an indication of how low-noise performance has become more and more relevant today than it was a few years ago, which I find interesting when you consider that it was nVidia who made the first real push at placing low-noise performance as an important parameter for video cards.

I really don't think the attitude among actual gamers has changed so drastically in 3 years time. But yes there has been quite a change among reviewers.
 

Saylick

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2012
3,504
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I really don't think the attitude among actual gamers has changed so drastically in 3 years time. But yes there has been quite a change among reviewers.

I would agree that reviewers currently place more importance on noise than they used to, but I would disagree that gamers think the same way as they used to. I don't know if it can be attributed to nVidia's big push for noise performance, if people now genuinely understand and value the benefits of a low-noise card, or maybe a combination of both, but I personally find myself reading numerous forum posts - from various forums, for that matter - about how X card is too noisy, or Y card is worth the money because it is less noisy. With that said, I truly believe there has been a noticeable change in attitude towards noise performance across the entire community.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
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Gigabyte must be drooling right now. Their Windforce cooler is pretty much the same thing almost...and that AXIII does make an absolutely wonderful difference.

Makes it all the more obvious that AMD should not have skimped on their blower cooler. I'm STILL scratching my head over that - and I was pretty excited about the 290/290X prior to launch. Whoever made that decision at AMD needs to have his/her head examined, especially considering the additional performance headroom given with more robust cooling.

At a minimum, they should have given AIB partners the green light to produce aftermarket cards from day one. Even with the reference PCB, better cooling produces tangible results without having to resort to 45%+ fan with the plastic blower that AMD is using. Ugh. Still, excellent performance for the price. I think they will sell a ton of cards with this assuming NV doesn't do another price adjustment. But this card could have been so much more.
 
Feb 19, 2009
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I really don't think the attitude among actual gamers has changed so drastically in 3 years time. But yes there has been quite a change among reviewers.

AMD seems to encourage their partners to come up with fancy cooling, to build a brand, ie. MSI twin frozor, Asus DCII etc, because of this, they keep their reference models basic on the HSF but go with good components on the VRMs and caps, so that reference board + water cooling becomes beastly and is a valid choice. One of the most frequent things people often state in the past is that AMD seems to "over-engineer" their reference PCB but the cooling is horrible.
 

Vesku

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2005
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I would agree that reviewers currently place more importance on noise than they used to, but I would disagree that gamers think the same way as they used to. I don't know if it can be attributed to nVidia's big push for noise performance, if people now genuinely understand and value the benefits of a low-noise card, or maybe a combination of both, but I personally find myself reading numerous forum posts - from various forums, for that matter - about how X card is too noisy, or Y card is worth the money because it is less noisy. With that said, I truly believe there has been a noticeable change in attitude towards noise performance across the entire community.

Not buying it, sure the marketing is there and that results in more reviews and posts about it. But I'd need some actual consumer evidence that after ~20-30 years of pushing for performance suddenly "quiet" is more important. I think marketing, and to a much lesser extent actual electricity price rises and an aging gaming demographic, has made power and noise a bigger factor but I don't think performance has been knocked off its pedestal.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
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AMD seems to encourage their partners to come up with fancy cooling, to build a brand, ie. MSI twin frozor, Asus DCII etc, because of this, they keep their reference models basic on the HSF but go with good components on the VRMs and caps, so that reference board + water cooling becomes beastly and is a valid choice. One of the most frequent things people often state in the past is that AMD seems to "over-engineer" their reference PCB but the cooling is horrible.

While I think the 290 is the new value king by a mile, and will sell a ton of cards - I don't think this AMD philosophy is the proper one. If it is, they need to change it. The GPU landscape has changed, people value quietness now especially considering the new popularity of super small form factors. And with those small form factors, aftermarket is simply not an option.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
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Not buying it, sure the marketing is there and that results in more reviews and posts about it. But I'd need some actual consumer evidence that after ~20-30 years of pushing for performance suddenly "quiet" is more important. I think marketing, and to a much lesser extent actual electricity price rises and an aging gaming demographic, has made power and noise a bigger factor but I don't think performance has been knocked off its pedestal.

I think it's pretty obvious you're wrong. Go look at newegg reviews of the 7970s with tons of complaints about noise - most 7950/7970s have 4 star reviews while the GTX 780 generally has 5 star across the board because of all metrics. Nearly every review there lists noise as a metric they value. Heck, nearly every user review I see anywhere mentions noise as a metric they value. Nobody wants a dust buster anymore. The day of the GTX 480 is over, and we don't want it back - apparently AMD isn't aware of this.

This isn't 1999 anymore. People VALUE quietness as much as you refuse to acknowledge it. Stop defending AMD for this nonsense. THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE PUT THAT STUPID CHEAP COOLER ON THE 290/290X. PERIOD. The performance of both cards is outstanding, yet you can be guaranteed that some buyers will steer towards GTX because of the objectively worse blower cooler employed by AMD. This is something they could have prevented entirely, but now we're scratching our heads as to why they didn't.

Note that I still think the 290 is an outstanding card merely for the performance and price. It's the definite new value king of the hill. But , it could have been so much more.
 
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3DVagabond

Lifer
Aug 10, 2009
11,951
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[H]ocp

...and Brent doesn't think the noise is an issue.
Fan noise at 47% is negligible, we heard the fan, but it was nowhere near annoying or loud while gaming. Even when we increased it to manual of 100% it did not increase much beyond 50% while gaming.
 
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