R520 has 16pipelines

[GTaudiophile]

The silver lining to all this is that John Carmack is now using an XB360 as his future dev platform because of the ATI graphics. In his words, it's where the industry is going. So, ATI has a true ace up their sleeves there. R600 should be pretty impressive.

What ATI is doing well:

1) Being honest by waiting to release until they have enough stock to put cards on store shelves instead of paper releasing. They finally are learning their lesson the hard way.
2) Their CATALYST driver suite has come ALONG way!

What ATI is not doing well:

1) Not throwing any carrots to their fan base in terms of "leaked" performance numbers and the like.
2) CEOs are possibly up to illegal activity which does not reflect well on the company.
3) Releasing WAY too many iterations of the same card with a different name. This only confuses the customer and possibly dilutes brand image.
4) Motherboard chipsets (RS480) have been so-so at best from what I've read. There's a lot of room for improvement there.
5) Referring to #3, they've let their inventories spiral out of control. If anything, long ago, they should have simplified their line-up, made fewer versions, and kept a closer eye on inventory.

 

[Creig]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile

What ATI is not doing well:

2) CEOs are possibly up to illegal activity which does not reflect well on the company.

4) Motherboard chipsets (RS480) have been so-so at best from what I've read. There's a lot of room for improvement there.

2) That's the fault of individuals. You can hardly put the blame for their actions on the company as a whole.

4) The RS480 has excellent performance, not so-so. I don't know where you got your information from.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2269&p=22

For their first effort at an AMD Athlon 64 chipset, we can only say we are beyond impressed with the ATI RX480/RS480 chipset. No matter how we compare the performance the ATI RX480 is competitive or a bit faster than the best Socket 939 boards we have tested at AnandTech. That in itself would be reason enough to suggest a long, hard look at the ATI RX480 chipset, but there's more. ATI also did their homework in this go round; delivering a board that will excite any enthusiast who gives it a whirl. nVidia got to their position of prominence in the AMD world with solid boards that catered to Enthusiasts. ATI appears to finally understand that pleasing the OEM market is not the same as exciting Enthusiasts. The ATI Bullhead is a monster overclocker with amazing performance, and ATI deserves huge praise for their efforts and their results with their first AMD chipset.

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: DidlySquat

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: AmberClad

So the R520 is the GPU world's version of the Prescott?

Yep, think "inefficient design"

Well there goes my plans of foregoing the 7800s and waiting around for a 32 pipe R520 . 7800 here I come. I'll still wait a bit until the R520 are actually released. You never know...

Why ? I just bought the XFX 7800 GTX PC (490/1300) for less then $500. Based on price history of the 6800U and GT, I don't think the 7800GTX is going to become much cheaper, especially that it is not threatened by R520 any more. Also I have the SLI upgrade path, just as an option if it ever makes sense to use it.

your name seems fitting for you

ATi is being tighter than a nun's chuff with R520 details yet you somehow know that 7800GTX will quash it with ease? keep dreaming. ATI arent stupid. theyre not gonna pull a NV30

 

[Gamingphreek]

Im very sure Nvidia didn't mess up on NV30 on purpose lol. If ATI is indeed having problems, then we could see ATI make a chip that isn't quite up to par (Please dont misinterpret this, im not saying they did or they will, im saying it is possible).

-Kevin

 

[StrangerGuy]

Just FYI, I did a few calculations on the raw fillrates of the 7800GTX and a R520 @ 700MHz.

7800GTX: 24 pipes @ 430MHz = 10320 Mtexels/sec

R520 @ 700MHz: 16 pipes = 11220 Mtexels/sec

And both are pretty close. (Yeah, I do know raw fillrate numbers mean little in the real-world...)

 

[ddogg]

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: DidlySquat

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: AmberClad

So the R520 is the GPU world's version of the Prescott?

Yep, think "inefficient design"

Well there goes my plans of foregoing the 7800s and waiting around for a 32 pipe R520 . 7800 here I come. I'll still wait a bit until the R520 are actually released. You never know...

Why ? I just bought the XFX 7800 GTX PC (490/1300) for less then $500. Based on price history of the 6800U and GT, I don't think the 7800GTX is going to become much cheaper, especially that it is not threatened by R520 any more. Also I have the SLI upgrade path, just as an option if it ever makes sense to use it.

your name seems fitting for you

ATi is being tighter than a nun's chuff with R520 details yet you somehow know that 7800GTX will quash it with ease? keep dreaming. ATI arent stupid. theyre not gonna pull a NV30

geez do you think NV wanted to release the "NV30" like we all knew it?? NO!! do you thing Intel was stupid to let AMD have the performance crown?? NO once again! No company is stupid in releasing underperforming stuff. Problems/circumstances arise that cause such unfortunate releases.

 

[KeepItRed]

Originally posted by: lein
I got a quick question - What is an "extreme pipe"?

lol that's a good question. Maybe a pipeline inside a pipeline , or their just saying "EXTREME!!!!!" to make it sound addicting and powerful.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: KeepItRed

Originally posted by: lein
I got a quick question - What is an "extreme pipe"?

lol that's a good question. Maybe a pipeline inside a pipeline , or their just saying "EXTREME!!!!!" to make it sound addicting and powerful.

Extreme Pipe


:laugh:

 

[flexy]

Originally posted by: lifeguard1999
Who cares whether it has 16 pipes or 32? As long as it is competitive, that is all that matters. Bring on the competition and bring down the price.

i agree.

also...what counts is then what performance hit a card like that will have ONCE all the eye candy is activated, antialiasing modes, AF etc....and whether the IQ is superior to the other card. Plain number of pipes doesnt mean anything.

 

[flexy]

>>>
I bet you that ATi's R520 will end up slightly faster than the 7800GTX but then Nvidia
>>>

if NOT - what would be the point in GETTING one ?

Sorry..this would be 2years' old logic - if the performance would be identical to 7800 then i'd RATHER go with 7800 just to know i have a bit more mature tech since i COULD expect issues with R520 since it's the first SM3.0 card by ATI.

One thing to really look at would be image quality issues (shimmering ????) and AA/AF performance - AND - FEATURES.

say: H.264 hardware decoding/encoding (actually interesting), FSAA/ transparent Texture AA....right now MY priority would be texture AA since, even with a X850, most games look like &&&& because huge parts of the image are NOT antialiased...and a good/working transparent texture antialising which FINALLY would get rid of ALL jaggies would be a major seller for me !

Edit: ANd lets not forget the $$$ - the 7800 is already surprisingly "cheap"....so a R520 on par with 7800 for $499 or so....who would buy it ? Not me....

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: ddogg

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: DidlySquat

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: AmberClad

So the R520 is the GPU world's version of the Prescott?

Yep, think "inefficient design"

Well there goes my plans of foregoing the 7800s and waiting around for a 32 pipe R520 . 7800 here I come. I'll still wait a bit until the R520 are actually released. You never know...

Why ? I just bought the XFX 7800 GTX PC (490/1300) for less then $500. Based on price history of the 6800U and GT, I don't think the 7800GTX is going to become much cheaper, especially that it is not threatened by R520 any more. Also I have the SLI upgrade path, just as an option if it ever makes sense to use it.

your name seems fitting for you

ATi is being tighter than a nun's chuff with R520 details yet you somehow know that 7800GTX will quash it with ease? keep dreaming. ATI arent stupid. theyre not gonna pull a NV30

geez do you think NV wanted to release the "NV30" like we all knew it?? NO!! do you thing Intel was stupid to let AMD have the performance crown?? NO once again! No company is stupid in releasing underperforming stuff. Problems/circumstances arise that cause such unfortunate releases.

how about a nice warm cup of STFU!

i aint silly man, i know companies dont willingly produce crap (maybe lexmark) i know comapies make a hash of things every now an then and they have to live with it, but once its been done they'll learn from it and it wont happen. their competitors will also learn from it an make sure it wont happen to them either.

intel dropped the bat with prescott, that was all, northwood was pretty good IMO. Nvidia fumbled with NV30, and ATi picked it up for a slam dunk with the Artx guys and R300.

 

[rmed64]

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: lifeguard1999
Who cares whether it has 16 pipes or 32? As long as it is competitive, that is all that matters.

How can it be competitive when the R520 (at 700Mhz) is making use of an inefficient design?

high MHz = high heat = dual slot cooling = high power consumption

In terms of power consumption, the R520 consumes more power than the X850XT PE due to its extremely high clock speed. The X850XT PE has already broken new records for single card power consumption. In contrast, the 7800GTX consumes LESS power than previous generation.

You are mistaking competitive with efficient. This site has already confirmed the specs of the midrange RV530, which has 12 pipes, so its all but certain R520 will have 16

 

[g3pro]

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: g3pro

Originally posted by: Munkies123
what, ati is gettin pwned now

QFT.

Have you finished your R520 testing?

Is it still faster than your GTX?

:laugh:

QFT.

You still don't understand that my original quote was to mock you.

LOL. :laugh:

 

[TomKazansky]

Originally posted by: McArra

DESPITE ALL that has been glittering like gold or pyrites before, it transpires that ATI flagship R520 cunningly nicknamed "Fudo" will feature only sixteen pipelines. The sources close to the company earlier indicated that the R520 might have even more pipes but this won't be the case. The R580 will end up with more pipes but R520 has its higher clock to fight Nvidia's counterpart.

Some of the chips will work at 700MHz or even 800MHz but yields at those speeds won't be satisfactory. Nevertheless, there is a good indication that overclockers will like this tech as will get them to run at sky high speeds.

The cards are floating around and ATI could paper launch them even now but would not be able to ship it until the first days of October. That is the rough launch date for this product launch and availability. I don?t think that you will be able to buy R520 master cards at this time but those will follow in a few weeks time after the normal ones.

The performance will be very close to existing 7800 GTX but we don?t know weather will R520 end up faster or slower than this Nvidia flagship card. However it turns out it will be close, very close.

I will be really disappointed if this is true.

all speculations.

 

[ddogg]

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: ddogg

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: DidlySquat

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: AmberClad

So the R520 is the GPU world's version of the Prescott?

Yep, think "inefficient design"

Well there goes my plans of foregoing the 7800s and waiting around for a 32 pipe R520 . 7800 here I come. I'll still wait a bit until the R520 are actually released. You never know...

Why ? I just bought the XFX 7800 GTX PC (490/1300) for less then $500. Based on price history of the 6800U and GT, I don't think the 7800GTX is going to become much cheaper, especially that it is not threatened by R520 any more. Also I have the SLI upgrade path, just as an option if it ever makes sense to use it.

your name seems fitting for you

ATi is being tighter than a nun's chuff with R520 details yet you somehow know that 7800GTX will quash it with ease? keep dreaming. ATI arent stupid. theyre not gonna pull a NV30

geez do you think NV wanted to release the "NV30" like we all knew it?? NO!! do you thing Intel was stupid to let AMD have the performance crown?? NO once again! No company is stupid in releasing underperforming stuff. Problems/circumstances arise that cause such unfortunate releases.

how about a nice warm cup of STFU!

i aint silly man, i know companies dont willingly produce crap (maybe lexmark) i know comapies make a hash of things every now an then and they have to live with it, but once its been done they'll learn from it and it wont happen. their competitors will also learn from it an make sure it wont happen to them either.

intel dropped the bat with prescott, that was all, northwood was pretty good IMO. Nvidia fumbled with NV30, and ATi picked it up for a slam dunk with the Artx guys and R300.

why dont you drink it!?...i just pointed out your mistake!

 

[KeepItRed]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: KeepItRed

Originally posted by: lein
I got a quick question - What is an "extreme pipe"?

lol that's a good question. Maybe a pipeline inside a pipeline , or their just saying "EXTREME!!!!!" to make it sound addicting and powerful.

Extreme Pipe


:laugh:

Hahahha that gave me a laugh. Good one :thumbsup:

 

[fstime]

Originally posted by: g3pro

Originally posted by: Creig

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: g3pro

Originally posted by: Munkies123
what, ati is gettin pwned now

QFT.

Have you finished your R520 testing?

Is it still faster than your GTX?

:laugh:

Keep telling your self that.

QFT.

You still don't understand that my original quote was to mock you.

LOL. :laugh:

 

[reever]

Wow, doesn't anybody moderate this forum?

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: ddogg

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: ddogg

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer

Originally posted by: DidlySquat

Originally posted by: AmberClad

Originally posted by: malG

Originally posted by: AmberClad

So the R520 is the GPU world's version of the Prescott?

Yep, think "inefficient design"

Well there goes my plans of foregoing the 7800s and waiting around for a 32 pipe R520 . 7800 here I come. I'll still wait a bit until the R520 are actually released. You never know...

Why ? I just bought the XFX 7800 GTX PC (490/1300) for less then $500. Based on price history of the 6800U and GT, I don't think the 7800GTX is going to become much cheaper, especially that it is not threatened by R520 any more. Also I have the SLI upgrade path, just as an option if it ever makes sense to use it.

your name seems fitting for you

ATi is being tighter than a nun's chuff with R520 details yet you somehow know that 7800GTX will quash it with ease? keep dreaming. ATI arent stupid. theyre not gonna pull a NV30

geez do you think NV wanted to release the "NV30" like we all knew it?? NO!! do you thing Intel was stupid to let AMD have the performance crown?? NO once again! No company is stupid in releasing underperforming stuff. Problems/circumstances arise that cause such unfortunate releases.

how about a nice warm cup of STFU!

i aint silly man, i know companies dont willingly produce crap (maybe lexmark) i know comapies make a hash of things every now an then and they have to live with it, but once its been done they'll learn from it and it wont happen. their competitors will also learn from it an make sure it wont happen to them either.

intel dropped the bat with prescott, that was all, northwood was pretty good IMO. Nvidia fumbled with NV30, and ATi picked it up for a slam dunk with the Artx guys and R300.

why dont you drink it!?...i just pointed out your mistake!

it was the way you did it. i didnt class it as too polite. im not stupid so dont talk to me like i am

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: reever
Wow, doesn't anybody moderate this forum?

heh id buy a beer for the mod that dives into a fanboi fight

 

[DidlySquat]

Bottom line: My 7800GTX OC is DA BOMB

 

[BFG10K]

Since the definition of a "pipe" seems to change on an almost daily basis this doesn't necessary mean bad news. I mean the G70 has 16 pipes depending on which way you look at it yet it still manages amazing performance.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Since the definition of a "pipe" seems to change on an almost daily basis this doesn't necessary mean bad news. I mean the G70 has 16 pipes depending on which way you look at it yet it still manages amazing performance.

According to Anand's initial 7800GTX hits the ground running article, the 16 ROP's are not near being saturated even with 24 pipes. The pixel spends more time in the pipes than the Rendering Output piplines.

Heres a quote:

"If NVIDIA is correct in their guess (and we see no reason they should be wrong), we will see increasing amounts of processing being done per pixel in future titles. This means that each pixel will spend more time in the pixel pipeline. In order to keep the ROPs busy in light of a decreased output flow from a single pixel pipe, the ratio of pixel pipes to ROPs can be increased. This is in accord with the situation we've already described.

ROPs will need to be driven higher as common resolutions increase. This can also be mitigated by increases in frequency. We will also need more ROPs as the number pixel pipelines are able to saturate the fragment crossbar in spite of the increased time a pixel spends being shaded. "

 

[BFG10K]

According to Anand's initial 7800GTX hits the ground running article, the 16 ROP's are not near being saturated even with 24 pipes.

Great. And?

I was debating rumours' definitions of a pipe, just like when the NV40 was rumoured to have 32 but those turned out to only be for zixel operations.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

According to Anand's initial 7800GTX hits the ground running article, the 16 ROP's are not near being saturated even with 24 pipes.

Great. And?

I was debating rumours' definitions of a pipe, just like when the NV40 was rumoured to have 32 but those turned out to only be for zixel operations.

Ah, well then I guess I misunderstood then. My apologies and no need for the 'tude.
However, I can't think of any other reason you would say that the G70 has 16 pipes depending on the way you look at it. The only other way you can look at it and say it has 16 pipes is if you were referring to the 16 ROP's. No? Anyway, I thought I'd link to the article to show that is does not "bottleneck" performance "yet". 32 pipes may do just that however. Depends on the pixel shader instructions or clocks.