Racketeering in the indie dev scene

[jruchko]

Please delete this thread.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Call me lazy, how is this racketeering? Sounds more like a twitter war.

 

[jruchko]

Read the link?

 

[imaheadcase]

Do people know know that game conferences = oscars for games? They only exist to show off games, nothing suspicious at all with what I read. its just standard stuff. Nothing worth of note in that article says any wrongdoing.

 

[jruchko]

Do people know know that game conferences = oscars for games? They only exist to show off games, nothing suspicious at all with what I read. its just standard stuff. Nothing worth of note in that article says any wrongdoing.

You have to be joking. Winning awards at these events gives a TON of publicity for them.

You have a group of people that are financially invested in the success of a game, and they are judges at events that will give a lot of publicity if said game wins. Clearly nothing wrong with that, not at all.:whiste:

EDIT: Most of the games up for awards in these events are not even released at that time. These events are there to promote indy games. It is nothing at all like the Oscars.

 

[cmdrdredd]

It's a problem yes, but what really can be done about it? Even through the legal process. I doubt there is anything illegal about it.

I will say that I think indie games get extra hype and praise for what amounts to a gimmick inside what is otherwise an average game that wouldn't stand out without help.

 

[jruchko]

Their lawyers think it is okay for them to make a public announcement that they have uncovered racketeering and name names. No one knows yet (obviously) if they will actually be prosecuted, but the fact that their lawyers said the announcment was okay speaks volumes imo.

If their lawyer didn't think they had enough evidence I highly doubt they would okay them going public because that just opens them up to a defamation lawsuit.

Admittedly I am not a lawyer myself so I could be wrong, but if I am wrong please let me know.

 

[norseamd]

This is very interesting.

 

[JumBie]

And why should any of us care? This is all stupid.

 

[jruchko]

 

[master_shake_]

i think it's more disgusting that she used the dmca to takedown videos that were not favourable to her.

 

[jruchko]

i think it's more disgusting that she used the dmca to takedown videos that were not favourable to her.

That along with all the other censorship is what made the whole thing blow up and allowed this to get revealed. She was the catalyst for the questioning of the gaming press, and beyond that she is, and has been, completely irrelevant.

 

[cmdrdredd]

The main thing is that Activision-Blizzard, Bethesda, EA, Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft Studios, 2K, Rockstar, and Ubisoft aren't going to stop making games over this and neither are any of the studios these companies may own. It just seems that many indie devs feared being too obscure to get noticed and had to do whatever they could to push their name out there. Some of it may have been shady but I dunno about it being illegal. It's not going to stop the industry though. The weeds will be removed and we'll keep going.

 

[darkswordsman17]

That along with all the other censorship is what made the whole thing blow up and allowed this to get revealed. She was the catalyst for the questioning of the gaming press, and beyond that she is, and has been, completely irrelevant.

No it isn't.

Did it really take hacked documents and claims from who knows who for you people to understand that gatherings/"awards" that are entirely about promoting indie games, created and managed by indie game developers, are about promoting indie games? But bias, you scream! Um...again, this is so pointedly obvious I honestly can't fathom why it took the rest of the BS you claim it did to make you realize this. But, but, you mean bias towards specific people. Again, this is pointedly obvious. Why do you think those people are participating and helped set the thing up? How is that different from the multitude of similar promotion that large publishers do? How is that different from people promoting Kickstarters? How is that different from how many industries promote products? Lots of industries have gatherings to promote products and many even hand out awards, and *gasp* plenty of times those products aren't even actually released yet! Ever heard of CES?

Next up, they sue Penny Arcade because their reality TV show Strip Search was found to be about promoting Penny Arcade and people to go to work for Penny Arcade to benefit Penny Arcade, and wasn't really about promoting webcomics in general. Hell Penny Arcade does about as much indie game promotion as anyone and they openly state they're friends with many of those people, and also benefit from their tie-in with PAX.

I really don't see what their legal argument is, and I have serious doubts that it will hold up in court. I'd say it's more likely this blows up in their face (hope their lawyers made sure none of the people they're representing have any connection whatsoever to the attacks or hacking on any of the people they're obviously going after).

Just because their lawyers say it's ok for them to publicly talk about doesn't mean they have some irrefutable legal proof, or frankly anything at all. All that tells me is they're trying to drum up publicity.

 

[jruchko]

I updated the OP, and I am going to bed.

@darkswordsman17 - I guess you missed the part where judges are directly financially invested in the outcome of the awards. I also don't get the whole comparison with PA promoting one of their own creations on their own site. These award shows are not ran by a game development company.

You can be right, and there is nothing illegal going on, I simply thought this whole thing might be interesting to some.

 

[cmdrdredd]

I think the only outcome we can be sure of is that the indie devs involved in this have hurt their own cause a bit. Probably a good number of people out there who will scrutinize indie games a bit more than before.

 

[thedosbox]

If you don't know about the whole #gamergate thing here is a very quick breakdown:
-An indie dev had a blog post from an ex describing their breakup and her cheating on him.
-Some of the guys she cheated are indy devs or gaming press.

You do know this has been debunked by the ex right? Go read his updated post.

Oh wait, who cares about integrity if you get to smear someone for your own purposes.

Do people know know that game conferences = oscars for games? They only exist to show off games, nothing suspicious at all with what I read. its just standard stuff. Nothing worth of note in that article says any wrongdoing.

Exactly. Actors and Directors get to vote for films they created! Politicians are allowed to vote for themselves! SCANDAL

 

[norseamd]

Go read his updated post.

Link?

 

[norseamd]

Not debunked. Only certain speculations were in fact possibly not true. Not implying that it is true anymore than not true.

There was a typo up for a while that made it seem like Zoe and I were on break between March and June. This has apparently led some people to infer that her infidelity with Nathan Grayson began in early March. I want to clarify that I have no reason to believe or evidence to imply she was sleeping with him prior to late March or early April (though I believe they’d been friends for a while before that). This typo has since been corrected to make it clear we were on break between May and June. To be clear, if there was any conflict of interest between Zoe and Nathan regarding coverage of Depression Quest prior to April, I have no reason to believe that it was sexual in nature.

 

[thedosbox]

Not debunked. Only certain speculations were in fact possibly not true. Not implying that it is true anymore than not true.

That's some truly impressive selective reading:

To be clear, if there was any conflict of interest between Zoe and Nathan regarding coverage of Depression Quest prior to April, I have no reason to believe that it was sexual in nature.

His mention of the game was in January

 

[norseamd]

You are very obnoxious and contemptible despite your image as some moral crusader.

You actually think that your trick of disclaiming the whole story just because one small element of the conjectured possibilities was considered possibly false by the ex-boyfriend is actually going to work?

 

[master_shake_]

You are very obnoxious and contemptible despite your image as some moral crusader.

You actually think that your trick of disclaiming the whole story just because one small element of the conjectured possibilities was considered possibly false by the ex-boyfriend is actually going to work?

and you are on his ignore list.

i tell ya that thing must be huuuuuuuuuge

 

[thedosbox]

You are very obnoxious and contemptible despite your image as some moral crusader.

Weren't you the one who started throwing Hitler analogies around?

You actually think that your trick of disclaiming the whole story just because one small element of the conjectured possibilities was considered possibly false by the ex-boyfriend is actually going to work?

The "small element", that resulted in the title of a video that's now had 842,000 views? And has formed the basis of numerous slut shaming attacks?

 

[norseamd]

When did I ever say that I knew that any of the supposed element of the conjecture was true? To me it all seems like just one more possible incident in a culture of cronyism and corruption. Not suggesting that these developers and journalists are anything unique in the industry but they still are just as corrupt and vile as the more established celebrities and companies of the video game industry. What is especially vile is the label-shaming, coverup, and oppression that these developers and journalists are creating on the internet.

 

[norseamd]

Weren't you the one who started throwing Hitler analogies around?

Do you think it was actually about connecting Zoe Quinn and Hitler in this scandal? No it was basically the first thing that came to mind which is the weakness of Godwins Law. The other guy that came to mind was that US citizen who was taken out while preaching hate against the US in Yemen some years ago. Would you like to use some religious preacher who calls for hate and violence against citizens of a different faith or who act in ways that are considered immoral by that religious preacher? But this preacher would also never act physically against the supposed enemies of his rhetoric?