Question Raptor Lake - Official Thread

[Hulk]

Since we already have the first Raptor Lake leak I'm thinking it should have it's own thread.
What do we know so far?
From Anandtech's Intel Process Roadmap articles from July:

Built on Intel 7 with upgraded FinFET
10-15% PPW (performance-per-watt)
Last non-tiled consumer CPU as Meteor Lake will be tiled

I'm guessing this will be a minor update to ADL with just a few microarchitecture changes to the cores. The larger change will be the new process refinement allowing 8+16 at the top of the stack.

Will it work with current z690 motherboards? If yes then that could be a major selling point for people to move to ADL rather than wait.

 

[A///]

There's a good hoover brand back home called Henry. It sucks dirt and debris very well. I see some similarities here.

 

[H433x0n]

Unless the frequency of each CPU during the benchmark is known it is impossible to make IPC comparisons.

Also, even if this information is known this would only detail the "real" IPC, or more correctly "throughput" of each CPU in this specific game.

FWIW, TLOU specifically is extremely multi threaded. For my personal rig, it will use all 8 p cores and 4-8 e cores. It’s one of those games that uses e-cores for non performant tasks (queueing up textures for example).

 

[Henry swagger]

Guys, knock it off. The kind of contortions he's going to need for the mental gymnastics to square that circle will probably cause a brain aneurysm.

😯 how clever of you

 

[Henry swagger]

There's a good hoover brand back home called Henry. It sucks dirt and debris very well. I see some similarities here.

Clown.. stop with the insults amd aint paying you lol

 

[DrMrLordX]

Clown.. stop with the insults amd aint paying you lol

Is Intel paying you?

 

[FangBLade]

So a 7950x3d has way higher real IPC than a 13900k?

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X3D Review: AMD Retakes Gaming Crown with 3D V-Cache

AMD takes a bite out of Raptor Lake.

www.tomshardware.com

You've destroyed his attempt to troll, haha, easy win. But let's get back to the topic, AMD has a clean sweep in all fields: CPUs for servers and desktops (both mobile and desktop computers), GPUs for servers and desktops(both mobile and desktop computers). And this isn't just a victory in terms of performance, their processors are also much more efficient, consuming significantly less power, so much so that this factor is again becoming a key feature. What answer does Intel have to that? With their refresh, they can only raise the clock speed and increase their already enormous power consumption.

edit: I forgot to add one more thing, Meteor Lake is a mobile design, so it won't have an answer until Arrow Lake is released, and when that Arrow Lake comes out, AMD will have Zen 5.

 

[A///]

For the record, neither Intel nor AMD pay me. I wish they did as a spokesperson. Working at either company? No thank you.


Pat...Lisa... if you need a spokesperson I'm happy to chat up a deal, ciao.

Lisa, I know you lot can afford my fees. You laid off some people in your security division these past two weeks.

 

[Henry swagger]

For the record, neither Intel nor AMD pay me. I wish they did as a spokesperson. Working at either company? No thank you.


Pat...Lisa... if you need a spokesperson I'm happy to chat up a deal, ciao.

Lisa, I know you lot can afford my fees. You laid off some people in your security division these past two weeks.

Stop riding amd so hard.. they d'not know you

 

[Henry swagger]

Is Intel paying you?

They d'not need too.. majority of people own intel anyway lol

 

[A///]

Stop riding amd so hard.. they d'not know you

1.You're right. AMD doesn't know me. Why would they?

2. Learn what humor is.

They d'not need too.. majority of people own intel anyway lol

Including me.

 

[FangBLade]

1.You're right. AMD doesn't know me. Why would they?

2. Learn what humor is.


Including me.

I have both, Intel and AMD, but I use AMD as my primary, better performance with much lower power consumption, an absolute win, my Intel computer serves as a guest computer, for example when my nephews come over.

 

[A///]

I have both, Intel and AMD, but I use AMD as my primary, better performance with much lower power consumption, an absolute win, my Intel computer serves as a guest computer, for example when my nephews come over.

I haven't had an AMD cpu in donkeys years. Everytime I wanted to buy AMD it would sell out, history repeated itself with zen 3 for me. The few AMD systems I owned were in the 90s and they were middle of the road, not bleeding edge hardware. I dunno, I got good dual use out of my hot p4s. They worked well enough to a point and they kept me warm, especially my legs with my case unsheathed. In those days I still used those ugly cases where you had to remove a cover that wrapped around the computers sides and top. Zen 4 is probably going to be the easiest for me to acquire.

 

[FangBLade]

I haven't had an AMD cpu in donkeys years. Everytime I wanted to buy AMD it would sell out, history repeated itself with zen 3 for me. The few AMD systems I owned were in the 90s and they were middle of the road, not bleeding edge hardware. I dunno, I got good dual use out of my hot p4s. They worked well enough to a point and they kept me warm, especially my legs with my case unsheathed. In those days I still used those ugly cases where you had to remove a cover that wrapped around the computers sides and top. Zen 4 is probably going to be the easiest for me to acquire.

Yes, Zen 2 and Zen 3 were selling like hotcakes, while on the other hand, Intel was sitting on the shelves. I spoke with several retailers and they all said that few people were interested in Intel, which is why Intel had to officially cut prices for ADL and RPL from the first day. There was a weak hype for Intel, while Zen 3 sold very well despite the initially high price. Intel cannot replicate that.

 

[A///]

Yes, Zen 2 and Zen 3 were selling like hotcakes, while on the other hand, Intel was sitting on the shelves. I spoke with several retailers and they all said that few people were interested in Intel, which is why Intel had to officially cut prices for ADL and RPL from the first day. There was a weak hype for Intel, while Zen 3 sold very well despite the initially high price. Intel cannot replicate that.

Zen 2 and 3 were the only versions where I had to have it, but you get tired of going to the shops, looking online, calling into far away stores only to be told by the person on the line I was the 300reth caller that day asking about it. Even with raptor's cheap pricing it looks like zen 4 is outselling it. some issues that feed into it is the mild bugs gen 12 has, the high cost of ddr5 at launch compared to now and knowing zen 3d would come out in a few months. Pat talking up meteor a year ago didn't help intel either. people are waiting on meteor and now arrowlake.

the issue with zen 4 is there was an echo chamber of "such a high price" and it did for people who don't have a lot of expendable income. For those who do the price isn't an issue but the availablility of the parts you want.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I posted here, so I cannot moderate the thread. Let me jump in as a member that is familiar with the rules in an attempt to reason with youz guyz before management starts trout smacking people.

Stop insulting each other. It is argumentum ad hominem, the weakest of all debating fallacies. The guidelines state to attack the argument, not the person making it.

I don't know why some of you feel it is necessary to defend AMD's honor in the Raptor Lake thread? Who cares if someone thinks it is the best for gaming, in CPU demanding situations? Particularly when you are familiar with the person making the statement. The whole thing becomes a study in futility. Chillax, no one is going to be gaslit by spurious claims based on spurious sources.

FWIW, TLOU specifically is extremely multi threaded. For my personal rig, it will use all 8 p cores and 4-8 e cores. It’s one of those games that uses e-cores for non performant tasks (queueing up textures for example).

Thanks for sharing that. I have seen reports that are all over the place about whether or not this latest patch is even helping with the CPU demands. I saw an older Xeon owner saying it did nothing for their setup. I have seen it hitting almost 90% usage on a 5800X3D. Seems like as with other games that use Kraken on PS5, on PC, the CPU gets hammered.

 

[A///]

Thanks for sharing that. I have seen reports that are all over the place about whether or not this latest patch is even helping with the CPU demands. I saw an older Xeon owner saying it did nothing for their setup. I have seen it hitting almost 90% usage on a 5800X3D. Seems like as with other games that use Kraken on PS5, on PC, the CPU gets hammered.

from what I'm getting through reading naughty dog were not even the source of this port but a third party company that may specialize in such matters. That could be total bs because naughty dog comes to mind of being one of the worst porters in history because every game they've ever ported to pc runs like rubbish. To clarify I'm not defending any brand here. I couldn't care less. Though I am open to taking bribes to shill harder than anyone else in this industry. Aides to Pat and Lisa, take note. I'll take monthly or lump sum payoffs. Poppop needs to order 5 tons of soil and would love a cash gift.

Getting back to reality while tlou is not a game I'd find myself playing because I am so over the zombie stuff now that nowadays and maybe for the past 10 years I don't bother with a game until it's several months to a year or two old because invariably it always sucks.

 

[esquared]

Seconding Dapunisher's post.
Stop with the trolling and stop with the AMD trash talking in the Intel thread.

Get back on topic.

Members that that continue down this road will be infracted.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director

 

[Henry swagger]

Intel Raptor Lake Refresh CPUs Reportedly Part of 14th Gen Desktop Family

Intel is reportedly going to use the 14th Gen Core branding for its upcoming desktop CPU family, the Raptor Lake Refresh.

wccftech.com

Wonder what enhanced intel 7 node they gonna use to push clocker higher ?🤔

 

[FangBLade]

The only thing Intel can do is increase its already very high power consumption and make it very inefficient, and this trend of rising electricity prices is not helping them either.

 

[A///]

itll probably cost higher than the ks. I don't see a point in the refresh unless it addresses power and heat. Hope they release it around June and not wait until end of q3 or worse q4. My best guess here is intel is trying to make this refresh into something like the 5775C processor that was a must have for gaming.

in which case i'd be tempted to get one just to say i have the processor.

 

[jpiniero]

itll probably cost higher than the ks. I don't see a point in the refresh unless it addresses power and heat.

OEMs want new products, and new products is what they get. Since the time between Raptor Lake and Arrow Lake is far too long, Intel needs to release something inbetween. And that something is Raptor Lake Refresh. It doesn't have to be majorly better only new.

 

[H433x0n]

itll probably cost higher than the ks. I don't see a point in the refresh unless it addresses power and heat. Hope they release it around June and not wait until end of q3 or worse q4. My best guess here is intel is trying to make this refresh into something like the 5775C processor that was a must have for gaming.

in which case i'd be tempted to get one just to say i have the processor.

I tend to believe the DLVR speculation since it was already a part of RPL silicon and was active / working in engineering samples. They would’ve had some time to optimize this feature to have it ready for a refresh.

They’re not going to reduce power consumption because increased performance makes better marketing material and sells better. If I had to guess, they keep the same 253w PL2 but boost performance by 10-12% via DLVR giving headroom to clock higher (6.0-6.1ghz single core, 5.7-5.8ghz all core). However, I would make a standard option for an Intel 'Eco' mode that performs the same as regular RPL (same clocks) but only uses 200-210 watts.

 

[A///]

I tend to believe the DLVR speculation since it was already a part of RPL silicon and was active / working in engineering samples. They would’ve had some time to optimize this feature to have it ready for a refresh.

They’re not going to reduce power consumption because increased performance makes better marketing material and sells better. If I had to guess, they keep the same 253w PL2 but boost performance by 10-12% via DLVR giving headroom to clock higher (6.0-6.1ghz single core, 5.7-5.8ghz all core). However, I would make a standard option for an Intel 'Eco' mode that performs the same as regular RPL (same clocks) but only uses 200-210 watts.

That would be nice and I'm going to say that if DLVR sticks around it'll be an iterative feature going forward simply due to the nature of being able to work it over and constantly improve it. It's not quite a develop once that's the end type of feature. I would think Intel would want to go all in on that feature. Your figures are conservative but I'm more interested in what they're doing for their cache situation. So far I've only seen more L2 cache being mentioned but it almost seems criminal even for Intel to aim so low for something that will stick around for at least another 6-12 months. You lost me on the "Eco" mode. Do you mean a setting through XTU? I mentioned it a while back but I would prefer if Intel rebuilt XTU to look more like Ryzen Master. RM is more easy to follow visually than reading various settings in XTU. Over the years XTU has not evolved from looking like a trading terminal monitor.

 

[Henry swagger]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1645498015606792192

Intel needs to increase l3 cache by 1mb to outright crush em again

 

[A///]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1645498015606792192

Intel needs to increase l3 cache by 1mb to outright crush em again

Incorrect. L2 cache is getting an increase among other changes Not to take from the Intel thread but AMD's design with the extend cache layer is L3 cache. L2 is faster. My best guess going forward is AMD looked back in how great the 5775c was and expanded on that concept. AMD's approach is placed on top of the chiplet by vias. It's a modified approach vs a ground up approach. Culminating with other changes Raptor's refresh will put it slightly ahead of Zen 4 3d.

The real battle is next gen next year. All of Intel's new tech and core designs plurality included vs whatever Zen 5 is ignoring all the bs mlid or that fat kid with the mop hair post on youtubes.

If Intel is smart they'll come in at a lower price than the 3D with some incentives. June tru August is their launch date, and Zen 5 may very well launch between June and July of next year. Plenty of time for Intel to grab up sales. Both companies current hardware is amazing and competent. Power usage ignored if it doesn't affect you too much financially you can't go wrong with either direction.

My own hesitance with Zen 4 is knowing it may very well be a waste of money based on the claism I've heard of Zen 5, and I know through gut feeling X770 is going to be the board to have. PCIe 6 availability by Intel and AMD is likely. Depending on how the economy is in 1 years to 2, we may see as speedy as a rampup of DDR6 in 2026 as we did with DDR5.

Consumer hardware hasn't been this exciting in nearly 20 years. IDK how to embed a video but someone embed a video of people dancing or pretend it's there.


edit: i should note I expect intel to increase caches in their native ip without relying on the same method amd does. it adds risk and complexity to designs but it will avoid the minimal latency available on v-cache. it will also help with future thermals and be able to push frequencies higher than amd can. just gotta find that one sucker and convince them to buy an arrow lake or panther lake system and watch how good or awful the bugginess is.