Question Raptor Lake - Official Thread

[Hulk]

Since we already have the first Raptor Lake leak I'm thinking it should have it's own thread.
What do we know so far?
From Anandtech's Intel Process Roadmap articles from July:

Built on Intel 7 with upgraded FinFET
10-15% PPW (performance-per-watt)
Last non-tiled consumer CPU as Meteor Lake will be tiled

I'm guessing this will be a minor update to ADL with just a few microarchitecture changes to the cores. The larger change will be the new process refinement allowing 8+16 at the top of the stack.

Will it work with current z690 motherboards? If yes then that could be a major selling point for people to move to ADL rather than wait.

 

[A///]

Hypocrisy much?

1 comment whereas you went pages on about it.

 

[Hulk]

Raptor Refresh is the last hurrah for Intel 7.
Not a bad thing but debatable if it deserves to be a new generation.
Either way here it comes.
This will be the first time I've ever had three generations of Intel cpu's in the same motherboard. 12700k, then 13900k to 13600k (warranty return on 13900k), and now probably to a 14700k.
Golden Cove/Raptor/Gracemont cores definitely hung around a while.

 

[jpiniero]

Raptor Refresh is the last hurrah for Intel 7.

Temping fate, I see.

 

[A///]

Temping fate, I see.

intel hasn't yet reached the depths of the titan sub no.

 

[Hulk]

Temping fate, I see.

Yes, good point!
Never say never.

 

[dullard]

Never say never.

In terms of a CPU, probably the end of the line. But in terms of foundry customers, I imagine Intel 7 will live on for many years. Heck Intel Foundry Services just launched their 16 nm node. When all you need is a cheap chip and can deal with a slightly older node, Intel 7 will live on in some (albeit slightly altered) format.

 

[DrMrLordX]

1 comment whereas you went pages on about it.

And it was deserved. Also you're pretty far off-topic. Nyeh.

 

[Timur Born]

Try reaching out to the person in charge of windows 11 that does the interval updates for beta testers?

Where do I find the contact?

 

[deasd]

Price hike, 14900K charges 95$ more than 13900k

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695780428022796670

 

[H433x0n]

Pretty sure that's the typical launch pricing. First few weeks for the 13900K had it selling for $650.00+ as well.

 

[eek2121]

Raptor Refresh is the last hurrah for Intel 7.
Not a bad thing but debatable if it deserves to be a new generation.
Either way here it comes.
This will be the first time I've ever had three generations of Intel cpu's in the same motherboard. 12700k, then 13900k to 13600k (warranty return on 13900k), and now probably to a 14700k.
Golden Cove/Raptor/Gracemont cores definitely hung around a while.

I mean, the stack as a whole is > 10% faster, and there are other changes , which definitely warrants a new generation in my mind.

That being said, good riddance to Intel 7.

 

[coercitiv]

Price hike, 14900K charges 95$ more than 13900k

The usual pricing scarecrow, the current market conditions and the nature of the 14th gen refresh don't allow for a significant price hike. The new gen will cost a bit more for the first few weeks, then 13th gen will slowly dip in price while 14th gen takes it's place.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Just a quick heads up: They added Denuvo to Assassins Creed Mirage in the day one patch. Right after reviews were done. Serious dirtbag move.

Good news: Seems it doesn't impact performance the way it did with previous AC games.
Bad News: It has nerfed e-cores like it did back when Alder Lake launched.

Until it is fixed you need to disable e-cores or the stuttering makes the game unplayable.

It's my supposition that DRM is the issue. Haven't seen it verified. It tracks though. What really grinds my gears is this was an Intel sponsored title and Ubisoft managed to scuff it up.

EDIT: Okay this got weird. Pedro had to redo his video on the A770 because the stuttering with so bad with e-cores enabled.

Meanwhile W1z tested the public release with Denuvo and a 13900K and had no issues.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/assassin-s-creed-mirage-benchmark-test-performance-analysis/

I will note that he is getting 5-10% less performance from an A750 using TAA and Native than I am using XeSS and Native. Despite my only using a 5600 with 4.65GHz boost. He must have went near water? I haven't done that yet.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Just a quick heads up: They added Denuvo to Assassins Creed Mirage in the day one patch. Right after reviews were done. Serious dirtbag move.

Good news: Seems it doesn't impact performance the way it did with previous AC games.
Bad News: It has nerfed e-cores like it did back when Alder Lake launched.

Until it is fixed you need to disable e-cores or the stuttering makes the game unplayable.

It's my supposition that DRM is the issue. Haven't seen it verified. It tracks though. What really grinds my gears is this was an Intel sponsored title and Ubisoft managed to scuff it up.

EDIT: Okay this got weird. Pedro had to redo his video on the A770 because the stuttering with so bad with e-cores enabled.

Meanwhile W1z tested the public release with Denuvo and a 13900K and had no issues.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/assassin-s-creed-mirage-benchmark-test-performance-analysis/

I will note that he is getting 5-10% less performance from an A750 using TAA and Native than I am using XeSS and Native. Despite my only using a 5600 with 4.65GHz boost. He must have went near water? I haven't done that yet.

That is why the hybrid arch is not something I am fond of. And its not just DRM. Lots of apps with no DRM have lots of issues as well.

Its not good for anything but tablets and phones and other mobile devices.

7800X3D is the best chip and puts so much less heat into case for an RTX 4090 gaming system.

I moved to it and happy with it and have not looked back.

 

[Markfw]

Just a quick heads up: They added Denuvo to Assassins Creed Mirage in the day one patch. Right after reviews were done. Serious dirtbag move.

Good news: Seems it doesn't impact performance the way it did with previous AC games.
Bad News: It has nerfed e-cores like it did back when Alder Lake launched.

Until it is fixed you need to disable e-cores or the stuttering makes the game unplayable.

It's my supposition that DRM is the issue. Haven't seen it verified. It tracks though. What really grinds my gears is this was an Intel sponsored title and Ubisoft managed to scuff it up.

EDIT: Okay this got weird. Pedro had to redo his video on the A770 because the stuttering with so bad with e-cores enabled.

Meanwhile W1z tested the public release with Denuvo and a 13900K and had no issues.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/assassin-s-creed-mirage-benchmark-test-performance-analysis/

I will note that he is getting 5-10% less performance from an A750 using TAA and Native than I am using XeSS and Native. Despite my only using a 5600 with 4.65GHz boost. He must have went near water? I haven't done that yet.

Exactly why I hate hybrid cpu setups. And I am sure a lot of other software has similar issues.

 

[Hulk]

That is why the hybrid arch is not something I am fond of. And its not just DRM. AP\pps have lots of issues.

Its not good for anything but tablets and phones and other mobile devices.

I've been using Alder Lake and Raptor since they were released. Best systems I've ever had and I've been building rigs since the late '90's. Besides being performant they are the most STABLE computers I've ever had.

 

[controlflow]

I've been using Alder Lake and Raptor since they were released. Best systems I've ever had and I've been building rigs since the late '90's. Besides being performant they are the most STABLE computers I've ever had.

Agree, I have a few RPL and ADL rigs too and they have been absolutely rock solid and performant. I really don't get the complaints about the hybrid architecture. There were some early issues but they are very very few and far in between now. I would expect that to only get better in the future.
Garbage software like Denuvo isn't a good argument for why hybrid architecture isn't viable.

 

[Shmee]

Agree, I have a few RPL and ADL rigs too and they have been absolutely rock solid and performant. I really don't get the complaints about the hybrid architecture. There were some early issues but they are very very few and far in between now. I would expect that to only get better in the future.
Garbage software like Denuvo isn't a good argument for why hybrid architecture isn't viable.

A fair point I suppose. Windows 11 is another hurdle though to consider, also garbage software hehe. Does APL and RPL still not do as well on Windows 10? Or was that fixed?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Does APL and RPL still not do as well on Windows 10? Or was that fixed?

MS won't pour any resources into fixing that problem, and I doubt that Intel will either.

 

[H433x0n]

I've been using Alder Lake and Raptor since they were released. Best systems I've ever had and I've been building rigs since the late '90's. Besides being performant they are the most STABLE computers I've ever had.

This mirrors my experience as well. It’s been remarkably stable. There has been no WHEA errors, no BSOD, zero random restarts and no usb disconnects.

 

[Wolverine2349]

I've been using Alder Lake and Raptor since they were released. Best systems I've ever had and I've been building rigs since the late '90's. Besides being performant they are the most STABLE computers I've ever had.

The chipset level is very stable.

The P cores rock with performance.. hybrid arch not so much.

Though even P cores I have had trouble with a manual all core static clock on that was seemingly stable as it passed everything with flying colors and then down the road a few weeks later a random CPU related WHEA when CPU under load which means a BSOD is coming. Not consistent with stability

I had several 13900Ks and a 13700K e-cores disabled that did this and all have been sold now.

I wanted a static manual overclock and Intel was way to go.

Except I guess static manual overclocks are not a thing anymore that works well unlike Coffee Lake and prior Intel gens where if you passed stress tests it was fully stable real world usage. Not so with Raptor Lake. With Alder Lake it seemed easier to get stable at only 5GHz as opposed to Raptor at even 5.4GHz as no hidden instabilities down the road with Alder but boom surprise CPU WHEAs down the road with Raptor clocked only 400MHz higher.

13900KF I had that was clocked to 5.4GHz with 4.8GHz ring at 1.225V LLC6. It passed all Yrucnher, Linpack, Prime85 everything, OCCT Large Data Set variable, Linpack XTREME and etc.. including Small FFTs. Even passed The Last of Us Part 1 Shader Compilation to confirm it Passed multiple times and no WHEAs. Temps never got hotter than low 80s under tough normal work loads and never higher than low 90s under the most extreme stress test like Y Cruncher SFT and Prime95 Small FFTs AVX on only 91C.

However a few weeks later go to play Last of Us Part 1 and WHEA during shader compilation which broke my heart and I threw in towel on Intel.

I had several other chips that did the same thing

Intel just too hard to tune and no patience for it and did not want to run it at stock with all auto settings and stupid e-cores on as 7800X3D is better for gamers anyways if you give up on manual static overclock as it is locked.

So I have 7800X3D and never looked back and it is best for gamers if that is what you mostly do.

 

[Thunder 57]

Agree, I have a few RPL and ADL rigs too and they have been absolutely rock solid and performant. I really don't get the complaints about the hybrid architecture. There were some early issues but they are very very few and far in between now. I would expect that to only get better in the future.
Garbage software like Denuvo isn't a good argument for why hybrid architecture isn't viable.

Not so much if you play Counter Strike 2. You have to disable E cores otherwise you get much lower frame times.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Not so much if you play Counter Strike 2. You have to disable E cores otherwise you get much lower frame times.

Another example of a game that was just released that does not like hybrid arch.

All the talk all issues are all sorted out by now is juts not true. If that were the case nothing new should have issues and clearly some new things have them like that and Star Citizen.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Another example of a game that was just released that does not like hybrid arch.

All the talk all issues are all sorted out by now is juts not true. If that were the case nothing new should have issues and clearly some new things have them like that and Star Citizen.

There's the weirdness with Assassins Creed Mirage too. I saw a tester saying it doesn't like Intel HT but SMT is fine. The reports of stuttering are being fixed by disabling e-cores for some but not others. Maybe disabling both e-cores and HT is necessary for those folks? AMD isn't having the issues in either title, and the games need patching for Intel.

 

[coercitiv]

The game may have an issue with very high core counts in general. The 13700K has less trouble than 13900K, though it's still clearly under performing considering the results 13900K gets in 8+0 config. At the same time, performance on 7950X3D exhibits the same drop in 0.1% LOWs. I'd like to see 7950X in the same chart, although I understand why GN stopped the CPU testing considering the frequency of game updates.

There's the weirdness with Assassins Creed Mirage too. I saw a tester saying it doesn't like Intel HT but SMT is fine. The reports of stuttering are being fixed by disabling e-cores for some but not others.

AC Odyssey had issues with E cores on Win 10 - rubber-banding during gameplay and massive performance drops when opening the skill tree (the video previews for skill stuttered like mad) I would not be surprised if the issues carried over to Valhalla / Mirage for people who stayed on Win 10, since part of it is the different scheduler from Intel/MS.