Discussion RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

[DisEnchantment]

With the GFX940 patches in full swing since first week of March, it is looking like MI300 is not far in the distant future!
Usually AMD takes around 3Qs to get the support in LLVM and amdgpu. Lately, since RDNA2 the window they push to add support for new devices is much reduced to prevent leaks.
But looking at the flurry of code in LLVM, it is a lot of commits. Maybe because US Govt is starting to prepare the SW environment for El Capitan (Maybe to avoid slow bring up situation like Frontier for example)

See here for the GFX940 specific commits

History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

The LLVM Project is a collection of modular and reusable compiler and toolchain technologies. - History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

github.com

Or Phoronix

More AMD "GFX940" Enablement Work Landing In LLVM - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

There is a lot more if you know whom to follow in LLVM review chains (before getting merged to github), but I am not going to link AMD employees.

I am starting to think MI300 will launch around the same time like Hopper probably only a couple of months later!
Although I believe Hopper had problems not having a host CPU capable of doing PCIe 5 in the very near future therefore it might have gotten pushed back a bit until SPR and Genoa arrives later in 2022.
If PVC slips again I believe MI300 could launch before it

This is nuts, MI100/200/300 cadence is impressive.



Previous thread on CDNA2 and RDNA3 here

Question - Speculation: RDNA3 + CDNA2 Architectures Thread

Man I have been dying to make this one for a while now. First rumours for RDNA3 are here so new thread time! Just going to start off with this one for now: kopite7kimi on Twitter: "@VideoCardz Ah, I mean a simple mcm design with 10240 cores is not enough. Because the lift from RDNA2 to RDNA3...

forums.anandtech.com

 

[soresu]

I think they expected the 50 Series to be a lot better so they were unsure about pricing.

AMD have jebaited so much in the last 3-4 years.

It wouldn't be complately out of the realms of possibility for nVidia to finally clap back and pull a fast one by changing up the specs at the last minute before actual availability.

 

[Keller_TT]

For the initial launch, a customer turning from NV to AMD will be one wanting to go from 3070 to 5070. Will get 2x the RT + raster ~ 4070 Ti level (1.53x), and DLSS 4, and going from 8 to 12 Gigs (just about okay for green sticker fans?).
With FSR 4 looking good, if AMD have indeed learned valuable lessons from RDNA 3, should repeat the pricing of 7800 XT (thankfully not the naming), with true generational value this time.

 

[SolidQ]

AMD have jebaited so much in the last 3-4 years.

Mr.Jebait leave the company, but his legacy lives on.

 

[lucasworais]

If AMD prices the 9070 XT at 499-549, considering that it can achieve 4080 performance, Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

 

[SolidQ]

Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

NV will heavy marketing x4 FG

 

[Keller_TT]

If AMD prices the 9070 XT at 499-549, considering that it can achieve 4080 performance, Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

I guess AIBs wouldn't be up for it and NV wouldn't reduce margins further. It seems they were already surprised by the $549 pricing but with what all Jensen claimed, they would expect it to be a cash cow, and if anything, might prepare a 16GB version to come soon.

 

[deasd]

Another RV770 moment from AMD?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1877307323837812957

 

[marees]

Another RV770 moment from AMD?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1877307323837812957

If they are pricing lesser than 5070 than RT is worse than that

 

[SolidQ]

If they are pricing lesser than 5070 than RT is worse than that

guy from chiphell who leak to us about 4080perf, said RT is about 4080 perf

 

[Win2012R2]

So the plan was:

1. Cancel top SKU and leak about it
2. Use same "proven" leakers to provide false info about size of the other parts
3. ???
4. Profit!

 

[Sunaiac]

"Performance is gonna be much higher than expected 3 days ago"
"Price is gonna be much lower than we thought"
"nVidia will have to lower their prices" (c) guy who just wants to buy nVidia for less while shitting on AMD for not bringing enough competition while AMD's offer would have given him more for less money all along, insert mandatory "had a driver error on my rage 128 pro 30 years ago"

I have a déjà vu. Well a recursive déjà vu, like, each generation.

 

[poke01]

Same, curious about the video encoding perf/quality gains over RDNA3's VCN though.

AMD has a lot of ground to make up on its competitors there, and the RDNA4 slide I have seen specifically highlights this improvement.

Blackwell introduced new media engines too and improved H.265 and AV1 encoding. Also 4:2:2 support.

Hoping for something similar with RDNA4

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-50-series-adds-support-for-422-color-format-video-decoding-and-encoding

 

[SolidQ]

it's GPu Z not updated? Because PX fillrate is too low, also i think can't be 64 rops

7800XT

7900XT

 

[coercitiv]

If they are pricing lesser than 5070 than RT is worse than that

The one thing I was actually pleasantly surprised with from the meeting with the press was the admission that competitive pricing leads to a warmer welcome with the press and the consumers:

I asked about the big positive response to Intel’s $250 Battlemage offering. David had positive things to say - highlighting that when you provide the market with a cost effective option that resonates, it will do well. He then reiterated that Ryzen went on a similar journey, which has helped the brand get to where it is today. Frank stated that when it comes to the Radeon side, AMD has had similar success with specific cards in certain price bands, and it’s a case of replicating those for the new generation.

Tim from HUB also mentioned this talk in one of his videos, and said that AMD folks acknowledged that cards like 7800XT and 7900GRE were much better received considering price/perf ratio. I should say I was not surprised they knew this, I was surpised they admitted this in front of the press. This shows they are much more serious about nailing the price/perf ratio from day one, as opposed to months later when reality sinks in.

I'll stay far away from the hype train, but I am moderately optimist about RDNA4 being decent value overall.

 

[SolidQ]

like 7800XT

Only big question what is 9600XT 12gb is 7800xt perf for 300$?

 

[Meteor Late]

Blackwell introduced new media engines too and improved H.265 and AV1 encoding. Also 4:2:2 support.

Hoping for something similar with RDNA4

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-50-series-adds-support-for-422-color-format-video-decoding-and-encoding

Similar? for AMD to support 4:2:2, first they should start by offering 4:4:4 support, right now you can't even hardware decode 4:4:4 with AMD.

 

[gaav87]

Please don't ban me im, a good boy.

 

[beginner99]

If AMD prices the 9070 XT at 499-549, considering that it can achieve 4080 performance, Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

Wishful thinking. What will happen is AMD will adjust their price upwards with the XT having the Ti pricing, maybe a bit lower. Assuming these performance rumors are true.

 

[gaav87]

it's GPu Z not updated? Because PX fillrate is too low, also i think can't be 64 rops

7800XT

7900XT

This performance must be, a cache thing like adroc said.

 

[soresu]

Also 4:2:2 support

IMHO while important for DCC video/cinematography pros (DaVinci Resolve, Adobe Premiere, Apple Final Cut), it has little use beyond them, and the vast majority of amateur video editors probably won't even know what it means.

I've seen 4:2:0, 4:2:2 and 4:4:4 encoded video side by side and it's pretty difficult to tell the differences at first glance.

Probably 99.999% of video the average person sees is 4:2:0 sampled (even UHD bluray), and most OSS software encoders I know of are tuned to it first and most attentively.

Most pros would probably have a fairly recent, high spec PC that could handle 8K60 with dav1d, which is extremely well optimised for a decoder library.

 

[Heartbreaker]

If AMD prices the 9070 XT at 499-549, considering that it can achieve 4080 performance, Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

If they force NVidia to reprice they have gone too far.

That might be an unpopular opinion, but it isn't AMDs job to create a price war for our benefit, since they still need a healthy profit/part.

And a price war won't necessarily gain them market share. It they goad NVidia into lower prices, they end up back in the same situation, with the same price gap, but now with less profit.

But they must stop doing things like the clueless initial 7900XT pricing, that made no sense at all, which just made people angry, and then they ended up lowering it soon after, anyway once it didn't sell. Price was so bad it was a meme generator.

Then they essentially did it again with 7800XT/7700XT pricing.... With pricing exactly proportional to 7900XTX/7900XT.

How they could make these clueless pricing blunders back to back is just baffling. Forget pricing against the competition properly, they can't price against their own products properly.

 

[eek2121]

IMO, there is no way we are getting an uncut ~380mm^2 RDNA4 GPU for only $500.

It isn’t 380mm2. Much smaller.

Seriously find me the person that stopped RDNA4 halo. This is looking like AMD cooked. Very optimistic now

Wouldn’t have even taken Halo. A 96CU part would be walking all over the 5080 unless clocks dropped too much.

Her name is dr. Lisa Su.
But can you truly fight a divine being?

Absolute marvelous comment. 😍

Yeah, I think this is the crux of the matter. They expected 5090 and 80 to be much more powerfull and not reliant on AI trickery and probably in the last hours lound out about real performance of Nvidia lineup and had chose to wait it out even though the board makers were already with them on display.

I'm actually marginally optimistic they have a good product on their hands by fooling aveeryone with their small die strategy, whici is not small anymore and has to have higher than expected perf to back it up

Next gen NV cards are faster than you think. There is a reason this is a 9070XT and not a 9080.

Just a mere glimpse of promising performance, and folks loose perception of reality and purpose. I still think the reference XT will be ~7900 XT, like 7800 XT vs 6800 XT and offering optimum PPW at 260W, and should be priced at $500 max for any gen on gen value and upgrade. AIBs will likely go up to $600.
If you're stagnant in value for 2 gens when the real 7900XT was a $700-750 launch card overpriced to upsell the XTX, NV will take the cake with 5070. AMD have done enough to drive down costs for RDNA 4, and should transfer that value to the customer.

If AMD prices the 9070 XT at 499-549, considering that it can achieve 4080 performance, Nvidia will for sure cut prices or rename the lineup even

The price is even cheaper.

If they are pricing lesser than 5070 than RT is worse than that

The 5070 might be a bit ahead, but probably not by that much

Wishful thinking. What will happen is AMD will adjust their price upwards with the XT having the Ti pricing, maybe a bit lower. Assuming these performance rumors are true.

No, they aren’t.

 

[insertcarehere]

I guess AIBs wouldn't be up for it and NV wouldn't reduce margins further. It seems they were already surprised by the $549 pricing but with what all Jensen claimed, they would expect it to be a cash cow, and if anything, might prepare a 16GB version to come soon.

I'd be very surprised that the AIBs would tolerate $549 with AMD in the first place. Looking at the furmark leak:

The GPU can max at 330w TBP with GPU temps in the mid-50s while the fan is at 1100rpm or so.. Correct me if I am wrong but any cooler that can do this are gonna involve very substantial metal heatsinks, and good quality fans (read: $$$), not to mention power delivery that can handle 3x 8-pin. These costs are all borne by the AIB who would not be happy if AMD's guidance price is that low (ballpark to similar designs for 4080S/7900XTX?).

Having said that, with these performance indications even $599/$649 should get good market response..

 

[gaav87]

I'd be very surprised that the AIBs would tolerate $549 with AMD in the first place. Looking at the furmark leak:
View attachment 114572
The GPU can max at 330w TBP with GPU temps in the mid-50s while the fan is at 1100rpm or so.. Correct me if I am wrong but any cooler that can do this are gonna involve very substantial metal heatsinks, and good quality fans (read: $$$), not to mention power delivery that can handle 3x 8-pin. These costs are all borne by the AIB who would not be happy if AMD's guidance price is that low (ballpark to similar designs for 4080S/7900XTX?).

Having said that, with these performance indications even $599/$649 should get good market response..

u are arguing about 1 pizza price for next 2years of use...

 

[Keller_TT]

I'd be very surprised that the AIBs would tolerate $549 with AMD in the first place. Looking at the furmark leak:
View attachment 114572
The GPU can max at 330w TBP with GPU temps in the mid-50s while the fan is at 1100rpm or so.. Correct me if I am wrong but any cooler that can do this are gonna involve very substantial metal heatsinks, and good quality fans (read: $$$), not to mention power delivery that can handle 3x 8-pin. These costs are all borne by the AIB who would not be happy if AMD's guidance price is that low (ballpark to similar designs for 4080S/7900XTX?).

Having said that, with these performance indications even $599/$649 should get good market response..

I think AIB cards for the 9070 XT would be up to $600. They can reuse the designs from overclocked 7900 GRE with updated materials and thermals in line for 2025 .