Discussion RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

[DisEnchantment]

With the GFX940 patches in full swing since first week of March, it is looking like MI300 is not far in the distant future!
Usually AMD takes around 3Qs to get the support in LLVM and amdgpu. Lately, since RDNA2 the window they push to add support for new devices is much reduced to prevent leaks.
But looking at the flurry of code in LLVM, it is a lot of commits. Maybe because US Govt is starting to prepare the SW environment for El Capitan (Maybe to avoid slow bring up situation like Frontier for example)

See here for the GFX940 specific commits

History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

The LLVM Project is a collection of modular and reusable compiler and toolchain technologies. - History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

github.com

Or Phoronix

More AMD "GFX940" Enablement Work Landing In LLVM - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

There is a lot more if you know whom to follow in LLVM review chains (before getting merged to github), but I am not going to link AMD employees.

I am starting to think MI300 will launch around the same time like Hopper probably only a couple of months later!
Although I believe Hopper had problems not having a host CPU capable of doing PCIe 5 in the very near future therefore it might have gotten pushed back a bit until SPR and Genoa arrives later in 2022.
If PVC slips again I believe MI300 could launch before it

This is nuts, MI100/200/300 cadence is impressive.



Previous thread on CDNA2 and RDNA3 here

Question - Speculation: RDNA3 + CDNA2 Architectures Thread

Man I have been dying to make this one for a while now. First rumours for RDNA3 are here so new thread time! Just going to start off with this one for now: kopite7kimi on Twitter: "@VideoCardz Ah, I mean a simple mcm design with 10240 cores is not enough. Because the lift from RDNA2 to RDNA3...

forums.anandtech.com

 

[blckgrffn]

I didn't think they'd really make me question my 7900XTX but here we are.

I think it really comes down to availability. I think like the B580 if they have them, the first wave will sell especially with blackwell setting the "buy at launch or cry later" precedent, even if it doesn't actually hold.

Those who want to buy nvidia should also rejoice, as it will take pressure off of the limited stock available of those cards.

Regarding market share I don't think they'll gain much without laptop parts and without a complete line up. N44 will be a tough sell in desktop at any price if the rumors about missing media engines are true.

I don't think AMD will ever care about discrete laptop GPU again. Since they gained enough CPU market share there, its APU or bust. They'll own the small but mindshare large portable handheld PC market for the foreseeable future.

N44 getting slapped into a lot of OEM systems again is my guess. It will be irrelevant if it can't compete with the 4060/5060 on actual game performance. Given the modest uplift on other SKUs I guess I am not expecting much or any uplift on the base 5060 so it might be interesting.

 

[HuesToo4]

AMD finally majorly improves stream encoding quality when it's no longer the main shill point

 

[Joe NYC]

Just not the same without Lisa Su... she must be getting ready to retire from her AMD CEO role...

Lisa Su is apparently 55. 12 years before she can start collecting Social Security.

 

[Heartbreaker]

So will the 9070 non-XT outperform RTX 5070 comfortably???
[Taking in account of the first party results of 9070 XT vs 5070Ti and the reduced CU and clocks of 9070 it looks like the performance will be neck and neck to the 5070]

TIM from HWUB calculates it should be about 10% faster at Raster, and 20% slower at RT, for the exact same price... I'm sure that will work out well.

9070 should have been $500, it's kind of DOA if NVidia actually ships MSRP cards. XT seems fine even against MSRP cards, but 9070 is not.

 

[marees]

More ROPs ???

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895483738437636284

 

[Keller_TT]

9070 looks DOA though, given the price. Similar to the 7900XT vs 7900XTX. Weird choice by AMD, I get the common reasons - but I still disagree.

Nah. It'll settle down at $499 not long from now, because AMD would need both the models to counter the 5070, if Nvidia can ensure supply and stabilize pricing.

NV has price pressure from AIBs who were supposedly a bit stumped by the last minute price change (600 to 549), and other models like 4070S, 5060Ti (8, 16GB) that all slot in a close stack. And Jensen won't dilute NV premium further.

 

[linkgoron]

I didn't think they'd really make me question my 7900XTX but here we are.

I think it really comes down to availability. I think like the B580 if they have them, the first wave will sell especially with blackwell setting the "buy at launch or cry later" precedent, even if it doesn't actually hold.

Those who want to buy nvidia should also rejoice, as it will take pressure off of the limited stock available of those cards.

It's still worse than the 7900xtx in both raster and RT and has less memory.

AMD finally majorly improves stream encoding quality when it's no longer the main shill point

The main shill point is always what Nvidia has and AMD hasn't. You'll see whatever esoteric encoding/decoding that Nvidia supports and AMD doesn't will be exactly the differentiator. For years it was Performance per watt - however now that Nvidia freely releases 600W monsters, it's now RT or something else. You could always count on something - encoding, physx, hairworks, tessellation, stereoscopic 3d, gsync or whatever.

Nah. It'll settle down at $499 not long from now, because AMD would need both the models to counter the 5070, if Nvidia can ensure supply and stabilize pricing.

Then they should just release it at $499.

 

[SolidQ]

Some FPS numbers from AMD

https://www.amd.com/en/products/graphics/desktops/radeon/9000-series/amd-radeon-rx-9070xt.html

Interesting where they test it

 

[Keller_TT]

Then they should just release it at $499.

Yes, what most of us have been saying. I think $479 would be even better if they really wanted to sell that card. But AMD are playing a very dirty upsell tactic completely remorseless from what they did with 7900 XT, 7700 XT.
Twice bitten, never shy, because they have 90% market share!

 

[blckgrffn]

Then they should just release it at $499.

I think this gives them also some flexibility. They could say "oh you're right, we should do that" on the 5070 launch day to take one more opportunity to step on that launch. Or only do it if they need to - short of the 5070Ti I think each launch has been a little underwhelming, so why undercut themselves when maybe they don't need too?

And if the 5070 launch is super thin on the ground, it won't even matter. They'll all sell anyway.

Yes, what most of us have been saying. I think $479 would be even better if they really wanted to sell that card.

They don't.

 

[SolidQ]

1440P RT numbers from AMD

 

[exquisitechar]

It's still worse than the 7900xtx in both raster and RT and has less memory.

How will it be slower in RT?

TIM from HWUB calculates it should be about 10% faster at Raster, and 20% slower at RT, for the exact same price... I'm sure that will work out well.

9070 should have been $500, it's kind of DOA if NVidia actually ships MSRP cards. XT seems fine even against MSRP cards, but 9070 is not.

20% slower in RT? Yes, and more in Nvidia PT tech demos. In most hybrid rendered games with lighter RT, probably not if AMD is to be believed.

 

[maddie]

Volume & price control will have to be there for this to happen.

Per TPU.

"AMD told us in our post-CES roundtable that it is gunning for one thing and one thing only—market-share."

 

[Philste]

So what is bottlenecking the XT so hard? Memory?

Compared to non XT: 14% more CUs, 16% higher Clocks, 37% more power draw

Gaming Performance according to AMD: +15%

 

[MrTeal]

Lisa Su is apparently 55. 12 years before she can start collecting Social Security.

And 24 years before we can start Su for President after the successful launch of RDNA 15.

 

[MrTeal]

TIM from HWUB calculates it should be about 10% faster at Raster, and 20% slower at RT, for the exact same price... I'm sure that will work out well.

9070 should have been $500, it's kind of DOA if NVidia actually ships MSRP cards. XT seems fine even against MSRP cards, but 9070 is not.

9070 is such a weird product. Hopefully it's not so terribly power locked that a lot of the deficit to the XT can at least be clawed back.

If there is stock of the 9070 XT available whatever they put out for vanilla 9070 will just sit on shelves or get shoved into SI units for people who don't know better.

 

[gdansk]

So what is bottlenecking the XT so hard? Memory?

Compared to non XT: 14% more CUs, 16% higher Clocks, 37% more power draw

Gaming Performance according to AMD: +15%

Memory is the most likely culprit. Or perhaps independent frontend clocks aren't scaling as well with power limit?

 

[adroc_thurston]

and shader execution reordering

Oh no that's not that, it's a real partial OoO like some of the in-order Cortex A cores.

 

[GTracing]

So what is bottlenecking the XT so hard? Memory?

Compared to non XT: 14% more CUs, 16% higher Clocks, 37% more power draw

Gaming Performance according to AMD: +15%

I left a comment about this a few days ago. This is a common thing.

Cut down SKUs often perform better than the core count would suggest. The 5080 has 20% more cores and higher clock speeds than the 5070 ti , but it's only 12-14% higher fps in games.

In TPU's testing, the 5070ti can get up to 12% more performance from overclocking.That puts it only 3% behind a stock 5080.

 

[gdansk]

Hopefully it's not so terribly power locked

Oh I bet it is! But maybe you can flash some AIB BIOS onto the 9070 for a higher power limit.

 

[Abwx]

So what is bottlenecking the XT so hard? Memory?

Compared to non XT: 14% more CUs, 16% higher Clocks, 37% more power draw

Gaming Performance according to AMD: +15%

I see an average of 20% here :

Page 357 - Discussion - RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

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Volume & price control will have to be there for this to happen.

Per TPU.

"AMD told us in our post-CES roundtable that it is gunning for one thing and one thing only—market-share."

Price should be within expected numbers, AIBs are already eagerly lining to sell their cards, that s the ten ones received by Computerbase for reviews :

Alle Details zur Radeon RX 9070 XT und RX 9070

AMD hat Radeon RX 9070 XT und RX 9070 mit RDNA 4 offiziell vorgestellt. Ein Überblick über Leistung, Specs und Preise.

www.computerbase.de

 

[blckgrffn]

I am sure AIB's are ready to get this show started, they probably have a lot of money tied up in the existing inventory that they would like to have ASAP for their cash flows. Should be a great launch for them though, demand seems pent up & high.

For any GPU, especially ones closer to MSRP. I think that there will be a solid amount of value seeking here, and people waiting for the 5070 and who don't get one might just buy what is available instead, which is a proven consumer behavior.

 

[BurnItDwn]

I dont like paying over $500 for a gpu, but the 9070 xt might just tempt me as it seems quite a bit better than the 7900xt in general, and its a good $40 less than the $640 we saw the 7900xt for back in Nov and Dec.

 

[stayfrosty]

Huh? Are they going to revive big navi?

 

[adroc_thurston]

View attachment 118380

Huh? Are they going to revive big navi?

If they wanted they would've announced the roadmap.