Recommended VRAM for Surround

[tommyknocker212]

2gb or 4gb of VRAM for 2D Surround?

Hello Anandtech forums,

I'm reaching the end of my two year video card upgrade cycle and am in a bit of a pickle. I currently have a 560ti and would like to get into 2D Surround gaming at a resolution of 5760x1080.

When the GTX 760s were announced, I felt like those would be the price-performance sweetspot. I figured that a pair of those in SLI would be just the ticket for my first foray into Surround gaming. However, in my research, I found that VRAM across the two cards does not stack and could be a limiting factor insofar as playable FPS. At least, that's the hypothetical case with the 2gb versions of the card. Should I wait for the 4gb version?

How serious of a concern would this be? With these two cards in SLI, I was hoping to be able to extend this next upgrade cycle out to 3-4 years. I would like to be able to play games at a mix of High and Ultra, skewing towards Ultra.

I tend to play games like BF3 (will be playing BF4), Skyrim (without texture mods), Tomb Raider, XCOM, SC2, Arkham Asylum/ City/ Origins, ARMA III, AC III, WARGAME AirLand Battle, etc.

Current build:
i5 2500k - stock clocked and cooled
MSI 560ti Twin Frozr II
8gb RAM
AsRock Z68 Pro Gen3 Fatal1ty
Corsair 850W PSU
Corsair Graphite 600t White Edition

GPU options:
MSI N760 TF 2GD5/OC (preferred option, love Twin Frozr)
Gigabyte GV-N760OC-2GD
EVGA GTX 760 w/ ACX 4gb (when released)

No reference coolers if at all possible.

 

[3DVagabond]

Wait for the 4gig versions.

 

[chernobog]

You should rather choose Radeon HD 7950 3gb than GTX 760 4gb.

Why?
Eyefinity > Surround (better scaling and support)
384bit > 256bit (important for higher resolution and multi monitor set up)

Because GTX 760 will have 4gb, that does not mean its better because its 256bit thus it has a bottleneck versus Radeon HD 7950 that has 3gb RAM and its 384bit thus it will perform better, while GTX 760 is slighly bumped up GTX 670 then why not rather buy 670 and overclock it a bit and save some cash?

I am just saying, if you ever decide to game above 1080p then it will crash down like asteroid compared to Radeon HD 7950 that will have have less impact on resolutions above 1080p.

 

[3DVagabond]

Why do we need to make this AMD vs. nVidia? The OP's question was very specific, For SLI surround is 2gig enough? Or, wait for 4 gig?

You conveniently neglected comparing SLI to Crossfire in your list of 7950 positives.

 

[chernobog]

Why do we need to make this AMD vs. nVidia? The OP's question was very specific, For SLI surround is 2gig enough? Or, wait for 4 gig?

You conveniently neglected comparing SLI to Crossfire in your list of 7950 positives.

Crossfire fix will be out by end of July, if GTX 760 4gb don't get out by end of July then he can go straight away to nVIdia. But buying 2 weak GPU's rather than just one strong GPU is kinda akward.

More VRAM does not always mean better results.

For 500-600$ he is close to a 780.

GTX 760 costs 250-270$ while GTX 780 costs 650$ so its a safer bet to choose GTX 780 rather than two 760 and risk SLI frame time problems in some games that badly support SLI and Crossfire.

780 has a 384bit and 3gb ram and that is enough for surround and 780 is more than enough alone for just that.

He can fix Crossfire issues by getting Radeon Pro.

 

[toyota]

You should rather choose Radeon HD 7950 3gb than GTX 760 4gb.

Why?
Eyefinity > Surround (better scaling and support)
384bit > 256bit (important for higher resolution and multi monitor set up)

Because GTX 760 will have 4gb, that does not mean its better because its 256bit thus it has a bottleneck versus Radeon HD 7950 that has 3gb RAM and its 384bit thus it will perform better, while GTX 760 is slighly bumped up GTX 670 then why not rather buy 670 and overclock it a bit and save some cash?

I am just saying, if you ever decide to game above 1080p then it will crash down like asteroid compared to Radeon HD 7950 that will have have less impact on resolutions above 1080p.

lol no. the 760 does not drop off much and in some cases not at all.

plus SLI is smoother and that is a fact. that crossfire fix is not out yet and may not even fix all the issues anyway. Nvidia addresses their SLI issues in hardware.

 

[chernobog]

GTX 760 is a bumped rebranded GTX 670, anyway for 500$ he could find and buy a brand new Radeon HD 7970 6gb and overclock it to actually match a 780.

Crossfire fix will be out by end of July, 31st July and he can already try to fix Crossfire issue with Radeon Pro. Recent nVIdia drivers turned GTX 6xx and 7xx into Fermi's.

 

[toyota]

GTX 760 is a bumped rebranded GTX 670, anyway for 500$ he could find and buy a brand new Radeon HD 7970 6gb and overclock it to actually match a 780.

Crossfire fix will be out by end of July, 31st July and he can already try to fix Crossfire issue with Radeon Pro. Recent nVIdia drivers turned GTX 6xx and 7xx into Fermi's.

the 760 is not a rebranded 670. and the 780 has tons of overclocking headroom so guess what happens when you oc it? you sure make a lot of ridiculous and inaccurate comments. now if someone turned that around you would call them fanboy though.

 

[3DVagabond]

All of this 7950 vs. 760 is OT. The question was about 2gig being enough for surround or if he should wait for 4gig.

 

[tommyknocker212]

I'm rather leery of ATI/ AMD GPUs -- I've been burned in the past with terrible driver issues/ support. Irrational as it may be, I've never really gotten over the phobia.

I posted a similar topic on WSGF and the single reply so far has said that, at the moment, 2gb is currently enough and that very few games can even approach that limit. He then went on further to say that that may change in the next few years with consoles now seeing 8gb of unified memory.

Vagabond and Toyota - Would you care to comment on those remarks?

Just some background on my current setup: I've a 560ti and can play BF3 with the following settings at 1080p:
Ambient Occlusion - HBAO
Anisotropic Filtering - 16x
AA Deferred - 2x MSAA
AA Post - High
Effect Quality - Ultra
Fullscreen - On
Graphics Quality - Custom
Mesh Quality - Ultra
Shadow Quality - High
Terrain Decoration - Ultra
Terrain Quality - Ultra
Texture Quality - Ultra

My card is now about two years old and has aged rather well at the 1080p resolution. At least with BF3, my rig defaulted to High when the game initially released and settled on the above.

Would it be safe to assume that that won't be the case in the next two years with two 760 2gb in SLI at 5760x1080?

Edit: I'm not trying to discount what anyone has said so far, I'm just trying to understand the reasoning

 

[3DVagabond]

2gig is enough for 1920*1080, but not for 5760*1080 surround. Also, 2x760 are going to be able to run higher settings than your 560ti and will use more vram. I think it's a foregone conclusion that as time goes on games will use more VRAM.

As far as AMD vs. nVidia, it's to each his own, IMO. If you are anxious about AMD, you will be more likely to find fault. Nothing against you, it's just the way people are wired. If you read the driver threads you'll find that there are issues with both brands. I also tend to believe it's more times than not, the individuals setup. Either corrupted Windows files or faulty driver install, or issues with 3rd party apps. that interact with the card. I pay zero attention to the people who aren't even using the drivers and say how sucky brand X is. They are just the worse kind of fanbois/shills.

 

[guskline]

I have run 3 24" 1920 x 1080 monitors in both AMD Eyefinity and Nvidia Surround. My Eyefinity setup used a Radeon 6970 and was OK but needed more horsepower. I jumped to a Nvidia GTX 680 and ultimately 2 GTX 670 FTWs in SLI for surround. I preferred surround. In the long run I sold the 3 monitors and went with a single 27" 2560 x 1440 monitor. The color and resolution are much nicer. I have no doubt a GTX 760 with 4 Gigs Vram would make a nice setup for Surround. Newegg has one in stock for $279.

What monitor/monitors do you have?

 

[GprophetB]

Very few games the VRAM scale north of 2gb... HOWEVER as soon as you turn on FXAA (or really any flavor of AA since there are several) you WILL see games go over 2gb. I game at 5760x1080 and I love it. I have an EVGA GTX 680 FTW+ 4gb and i just bought another to really push it. I fully believe that the next big wave of games will be more efficient but also require more than 2gb of VRAM for detailed and wide open areas. Think of games like the Witcher 3

What is your budget? If you can swing it I would recommend 2 x EVGA GTX 770 ACX 4gb.

http://www.evga.com/Products/Product.aspx?pn=04G-P4-3778-KR

And obviously if you can really swing it get the 780 ACX. In certain situations, these GPUS perform very closely to the GTX TITAN. The performance in SLI is jaw dropping.

Review of the 780 ACX SLI and bench sources http://www.legitreviews.com/article/2206/6/ and http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_780_sli_review,23.html more here http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/evga_geforce_gtx_780_sc_acx_review,1.html

 

[tommyknocker212]

Guskline - Currently I've got three Asus PB238Qs. They're my first IPS monitors and are just eye-popping for someone coming from TN monitors. Right now I have two hooked up to the GPU and one hooked up to the integrated graphics on the i5. Annoyingly, I have to disable the second monitor when I game

I saw that Newegg has one of EVGA's 4gb 760s but using the reference coolers. Do you think they are a significant detriment when compared to non-reference coolers like ACX/ Twin Frozr/ Windforce?

GprophetB - I've got a budget of around $500-550. At that price range I don't think any single GPU can really handle BF3/ BF4 adequately. Especially considering that I would like the cards to last me at least 3 years. Would I be wrong in thinking that?

 

[GprophetB]

Tommy if your budget is 550~$ you should probably get a pair of EVGA 760 4gb. Just an idea to consider on Nvidia's side! (I only have experience with Nvidia surround so i can't make any recommendations on that side.)

Here are some SLI reviews of the 760 4gb but the highest res they test at is 2560x1600. http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_sli_review,8.html I think for your budget and with turning some of the settings to "High / Medium" would get you a pretty decent 5760x1080 experience. If anyone finds a review of them in SLI @ 5760x1080 please post.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130937

EDIT: Personally I'd rather spend your entire budget on a single EVGA GTX 780 ACX now that I've thought about it for a while. You could then start planning / budgeting / saving for a 2nd card in 6~ months? 8 months? Whatever works for you. Just my 2c. Good luck and have fun.

 

[3DVagabond]

Tommy if your budget is 550~$ you should probably get a pair of EVGA 760 4gb. Just an idea to consider on Nvidia's side! (I only have experience with Nvidia surround so i can't make any recommendations on that side.)

Here are some SLI reviews of the 760 4gb but the highest res they test at is 2560x1600. http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_sli_review,8.html I think for your budget and with turning some of the settings to "High / Medium" would get you a pretty decent 5760x1080 experience. If anyone finds a review of them in SLI @ 5760x1080 please post.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130937

EDIT: Personally I'd rather spend your entire budget on a single EVGA GTX 780 ACX now that I've thought about it for a while. You could then start planning / budgeting / saving for a 2nd card in 6~ months? 8 months? Whatever works for you. Just my 2c. Good luck and have fun.

While I'm not arguing against the performance of 2x780, ~$1300 for GPU's to play video games is a lot of money. Especially if less than 1/2 of that will give a real good gaming experience.

 

[tommyknocker212]

Personally I'd rather spend your entire budget on a single EVGA GTX 780 ACX now that I've thought about it for a while. You could then start planning / budgeting / saving for a 2nd card in 6~ months? 8 months? Whatever works for you. Just my 2c. Good luck and have fun.

I don't think this would be feasible as it would require my upgrading my PSU (Corsair TX850) to something in the 1000-1200w range and definitely drive the cost of an SLI setup to way beyond $1300.

Does anyone think that the reference coolers are a detriment? How (in)significant?

 

[GprophetB]

3DVagabond, I'd personally want the long term solution even if it is 1300~$ but that's just my opinion, not my suggestion to Tommy.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Um, FXAA/SMAA have basically zero vram overhead.

 

[3DVagabond]

3DVagabond, I'd personally want the long term solution even if it is 1300~$ but that's just my opinion, not my suggestion to Tommy.

Sorry. Even though you did say it was what you would do personally, I took it as a recommendation.

 

[tommyknocker212]

3DVagabond, I'd personally want the long term solution even if it is 1300~$ but that's just my opinion, not my suggestion to Tommy.

Sorry. Even though you did say it was what you would do personally, I took it as a recommendation.

I appreciate your thoughts and suggestions GprophetB, but the 780(s) would be way beyond my current budget. I'd really rather have smaller upgrades more often than monster upgrades at longer periods of time.

If any members could give their thoughts on reference coolers vs. non-reference coolers eg ACX, Windforce, and Twin Frozr, it would be much appreciated. Please list their advantages/ disadvantages.

 

[3DVagabond]

I appreciate your thoughts and suggestions GprophetB, but the 780(s) would be way beyond my current budget. I'd really rather have smaller upgrades more often than monster upgrades at longer periods of time.

If any members could give their thoughts on reference coolers vs. non-reference coolers eg ACX, Windforce, and Twin Frozr, it would be much appreciated. Please list their advantages/ disadvantages.

No 760 to give you a 1st hand report, but looking at TechPowerUp's 760 review the stock cooler, while pretty quiet, lacks a bit on overall effectiveness. The custom cooled versions are appreciably cooler. Ref is 82°C while the better custom coolers are 68°C. 82°C is a bit high for 28nm.

 

[tommyknocker212]

Awesome! Thanks, Vagabond.

I think I'll be getting a pair of EVGA GTX 760 FTW 4gb w/ ACX...unless MSI releases a 4gb version w/ Twin Frozr

If anyone has further thoughts, I'd really appreciate reading them!

 

[guskline]

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_sli_review,19.html

Above is a link to the performance of GTX760 in SLI. With your budget, PSU etc 2 GTX760s with 4 Gigs Vram for those 3 monitors makes sense. AND you'll be able to run all three monitors in Surround from the video cards. I liked Surround. My 2 GTX670 FTWs in SLI work fine with the reference cooler. I know the 700 series has Boost 2 and runs hotter but with appropriate cooling you should be fine. WHOOPS link already posted sorry.

 

[notty22]

I wouldn't be afraid of the stock blower coolers. They move the heat out of the case. If you want to get two of the same card for sli. Blowers are a better choice, IMO. I ran two open air coolers in sli, but they were 160 watt cards(gtx 460). Case cooling is needed to move out the hot air, especially if gaming for a couple hour sessions. For aesthetics builders like to get , 2 of the same card often.