Redskins to become Bravehearts

[Crono]

Cut the internet ethug bullshit. It scares no one and makes you look like alkemyst jr.

The team name has been around 80+ years and now we have people who get sand in their vaginas and are "offended" and want it changed. Guess what? They can be offended all they want. If they want it changed, come up with the $1 billion+ to buy the team and change it.

I love how you're portraying (or is it advocating?) violence for name calling. Seriously? Is that how YOUR parents raised you? To be an over-sensitive sissy who cries a river and threatens to "beat people up" if they say something you don't like? My parents raised me to turn the other cheek and walk away from name calling and insults -- which is the right way to behave instead of trying to be an ethug and threaten people.

Agreed, and I don't understand the opinion that racial hate is somehow worse than any other kind of hate or violence. Does hurtful remarks of any kind ever necessitate violence? I don't think so.

I'm not white. If some neo-Nazi ever wanted to say something to me regarding my race I would shrug it off and walk away. Taking offense is a symptom of pride - I don't care if you want to insult me or "my people", there's nothing that special about me... or anyone else in fact. We're all human, which is exactly the point. Who cares if some idiot spouting "Aryan" ideals says something. I know enough to know that we have the same ancestors going back several thousand years. If someone wants to identify me as having brown skin, well, congratulations. You have the ability to see and discern colors. Good for you.

People take this stuff too much to heart. They are football team names. So long as we aren't attaching hate to the names today (aside from the usual crappy teams, ha ha), it really doesn't matter what the letters spell.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Agreed, and I don't understand the opinion that racial hate is somehow worse than any other kind of hate or violence. Does hurtful remarks of any kind ever necessitate violence? I don't think so.

I'm not white. If some neo-Nazi ever wanted to say something to me regarding my race I would shrug it off and walk away. Taking offense is a symptom of pride - I don't care if you want to insult me or "my people", there's nothing that special about me... or anyone else in fact. We're all human, which is exactly the point. Who cares if some idiot spouting "Aryan" ideals says something. I know enough to know that we have the same ancestors going back several thousand years. If someone wants to identify me as having brown skin, well, congratulations. You have the ability to see and discern colors. Good for you.

My name is very ethnic -- very, very German. If Jim Irsay came out tomorrow and decided that the Indianapolis Colts were now the Indianapolis Krauts or some other derogatory term against Germans, I may not like it but I'd just stop following the team and that would be the end of it.

Political correctness has gotten completely out of hand in this country and is a form of censorship. I may not like things certain people say but they have the right to say them, no matter how dumb it makes them look. But hey, this is America and if they want the name changed, there is an avenue for that -- buy the team from Dan Snyder and change it.

In addition to his ethuginess, I also loved SP33Demon's insinuation that I'm some sort of hate-filled racist. What an ignorant, clueless, and completely unsubstantiated thing to say.

 

[SP33Demon]

Cut the internet ethug bullshit. It scares no one and makes you look like alkemyst jr.

The team name has been around 80+ years and now we have people who get sand in their vaginas and are "offended" and want it changed. Guess what? They can be offended all they want. If they want it changed, come up with the $1 billion+ to buy the team and change it.

I love how you're portraying (or is it advocating?) violence for name calling. Seriously? Is that how YOUR parents raised you? To be an over-sensitive sissy who cries a river and threatens to "beat people up" if they say something you don't like? My parents raised me to turn the other cheek and walk away from name calling and insults -- which is the right way to behave instead of trying to be an ethug and threaten people.

It's possible that you're just a wimp who wasn't willing to stand up for friends in the face of complete and utter racist bigotry. I had no problem beating people down who tried to bully my friends. Nobody ever messed with them again, I can tell you that. I also have enough empathy to see how much the N word hurt my friends, it's ok if you do not. I wouldn't expect people who grew up privileged with white skin to understand what it's like to be bullied with racial bigotry. As a result, I can empathize with the Native Americans who were bullied and denigrated via racist vitriol which included using the term beloved patriot. Others on this forum have used another racist term that was offensive to me and the mods put the kibosh on that (shout out to Perknose). You don't know what people have been through and what is/isn't hurtful to them, that is the bottom line.

 

[waggy]

It's possible that you're just a wimp who wasn't willing to stand up for friends in the face of complete and utter racist bigotry. I had no problem beating people down who tried to bully my friends. Nobody ever messed with them again, I can tell you that. I also have enough empathy to see how much the N word hurt my friends, it's ok if you do not. I wouldn't expect people who grew up privileged with white skin to understand what it's like to be bullied with racial bigotry. As a result, I can empathize with the Native Americans who were bullied and denigrated via racist vitriol which included using the term beloved patriot. Others on this forum have used another racist term that was offensive to me and the mods put the kibosh on that (shout out to Perknose). You don't know what people have been through and what is/isn't hurtful to them, that is the bottom line.

ok alkyjr.
you need to go outside. go for a walk. get some fresh air. really you need to back out of the thread.

actually never mind. continue on i find it amusing. lol e-thug go go ethug go!


actualy. you notice ICF's avator is a white colt? i think he is a closet racist over that.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

It's possible that you're just a wimp who wasn't willing to stand up for friends in the face of complete and utter racist bigotry.

Looks like I was right -- shame on your parents for not teaching you that violence is not the answer. Too bad you and your friends aren't strong enough people to turn the other cheek and walk away. Your "solution" is one that will likely eventually get one or more of you killed when you try to "beat down" the wrong person.

I had no problem beating people down who tried to bully my friends. Nobody ever messed with them again, I can tell you that. I also have enough empathy to see how much the N word hurt my friends, it's ok if you do not. I wouldn't expect people who grew up privileged with white skin to understand what it's like to be bullied with racial bigotry. As a result, I can empathize with the Native Americans who were bullied and denigrated via racist vitriol which included using the term beloved patriot. Others on this forum have used another racist term that was offensive to me and the mods put the kibosh on that (shout out to Perknose). You don't know what people have been through and what is/isn't hurtful to them, that is the bottom line.

Oh boy, here we go with more idiocy and ignorance.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

actualy. you notice ICF's avator is a white colt? i think he is a closet racist over that.

It is a blue colt. What do you have against blue colts waggy? Why are you racist against small blue horses?

 

[SP33Demon]

Your bringing up the real problem here: ignorance of history. I don't think simply changing everything because people are offended is the right way to go. There's even a opportunity presented to learn here if everyone can just realize that just taking offense to something doesn't benefit us as a society, not when such offense is needless in the light of historical context.

We cannot expect everyone to have the time and interest to become a historian. The average Joe doesn't give a dam about history. Why are boy bands so popular? You have to account for the lowest common denominator, which may include a million Native Americans who could not give two shits about the history of what a beloved patriot is, in the same vein that blacks don't give a dam about why it was named Negro Mountain, only that negro is literally derogatory. This is same reason why libertarianism is flawed, i.e. expectations of how people should behave aren't applicable to the masses even if it sounds good on paper.

 

[SP33Demon]

My name is very ethnic -- very, very German. If Jim Irsay came out tomorrow and decided that the Indianapolis Colts were now the Indianapolis Krauts or some other derogatory term against Germans, I may not like it but I'd just stop following the team and that would be the end of it.

Political correctness has gotten completely out of hand in this country and is a form of censorship. I may not like things certain people say but they have the right to say them, no matter how dumb it makes them look. But hey, this is America and if they want the name changed, there is an avenue for that -- buy the team from Dan Snyder and change it.

In addition to his ethuginess, I also loved SP33Demon's insinuation that I'm some sort of hate-filled racist. What an ignorant, clueless, and completely unsubstantiated thing to say.

The fact that you would stop watching football if the Colts were "The Krauts" punctuates my point (esp after the hundreds of football threads and posts you have contributed to on this forum alone). You just proved my point in one sentence.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

The fact that you would stop watching football if the Colts were "The Krauts" punctuates my point (esp after the hundreds of football threads and posts you have contributed to on this forum alone). You just proved my point in one sentence.

I proved what I said all along -- if you don't like something, don't patronize it. My point has been consistent THE ENTIRE TIME.

(and actually, I'd probably still watch the Indianapolis Krauts because I love football )

 

[waggy]

It is a blue colt. What do you have against blue colts waggy? Why are you racist against small blue horses?

pfft. small horses? fine. blue small horses? screw you they suck.


anything blue is bad. From blue horses, blue-cheese, blue man group to blue balls.

they all suck. only idiots like them.

blue things? just not on the same level as other colors.

 

[SP33Demon]

Looks like I was right -- shame on your parents for not teaching you that violence is not the answer. Too bad you and your friends aren't strong enough people to turn the other cheek and walk away. Your "solution" is one that will likely eventually get one or more of you killed when you try to "beat down" the wrong person.

Oh boy, here we go with more idiocy and ignorance.

Nice counterargument, maybe you can have a discussion with the mods about why certain terms aren't allowed on this forum. Additionally, if a Native American was offended by the term beloved patriot and went to the mods, you can bet it won't be used on this forum. Let that sink in for awhile.

Let me ask you, if your family was threatened and denigrated, would you stand up for them or cower in a corner? You would hopefully man up and defend them, whether verbally or physically if it came to it. If blatant hate is shoved in my face, I'm going to give it right back to them. A shame you would just ignore it, that is part of the problem today and why racist vitriol is perpetuated. I'm glad the mods on this forum don't subscribe to the same laissez faire attitude toward racism that you exhibit. However, I'm comforted by the fact that such attitudes are in the minority.

 

[shortylickens]

Hey speedemon:

We've been discussing over at "the other place" and we've reached a conclusion.

You need to be quiet.


Thats all, thank you and good night.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Nice counterargument, maybe you can have a discussion with the mods about why certain terms aren't allowed on this forum. Additionally, if a Native American was offended by the term beloved patriot and went to the mods, you can bet it won't be used on this forum. Let that sink in for awhile.

The rules of Anandtech are not the rules of the world.

I'm offended with your veiled threats of violence. Maybe I should speak to a mod about that?

Let me ask you, if your family was threatened and denigrated, would you stand up for them or cower in a corner? You would hopefully man up and defend them, whether verbally or physically if it came to it. If blatant hate is shoved in my face, I'm going to give it right back to them. A shame you would just ignore it, that is part of the problem today and why racist vitriol is perpetuated. I'm glad the mods on this forum don't subscribe to the same laissez faire attitude toward racism that you exhibit. However, I'm comforted by the fact that such attitudes are in the minority.

Calling someone a name is not an action where violence is justified as a response. Only children or very, very small people respond that way to being called a name. Me? I'd just laugh it off and walk away, especially these days when you have no idea who might be carrying a concealed weapon.

 

[SP33Demon]

I proved what I said all along -- if you don't like something, don't patronize it. My point has been consistent THE ENTIRE TIME.

(and actually, I'd probably still watch the Indianapolis Krauts because I love football )

Here comes the backpedaling. You don't like it when the tables are turned, it's ok.

Like I said, the fact that you would stop watching your football team, which you've spent countless hours in the past watching, if the name were changed speaks volumes. Would you sign a petition on change.org to change the name from The Krauts to something less offensive? Would you join a lawsuit with other Germans? Redskins was offensive enough for half the tribes in the US to file a lawsuit, and they probably don't watch football either as a result. Maybe now they will if the NFL steps in, it's win win from not only a moral standpoint, but a business one.

 

[sixone]

Hey speedemon:

We've been discussing over at "the other place" and we've reached a conclusion.

You need to be quiet.


Thats all, thank you and good night.

The last bastion of political correctness.

 

[waggy]

The fact that you would stop watching football if the Colts were "The Krauts" punctuates my point (esp after the hundreds of football threads and posts you have contributed to on this forum alone). You just proved my point in one sentence.

I been thinking of this. As a person of German descent i think a team called "the Krauts" would be great.

We could have a big sausage as a mascot. We could host the Sausage race! finish line a big plate of Kraut.

it could be the parks main dish! hmmm German beer on tap! Served by hot women with big tits and low cut top! HELLL YEAH.


fuck yeah i'm behind it now!


edit: in honor of the thread i have decided To have sausage and krout for dinner. hmm yummm

 

[SP33Demon]

Hey speedemon:

We've been discussing over at "the other place" and we've reached a conclusion.

You need to be quiet.


Thats all, thank you and good night.

Alright man. I will gracefully bow out, pretty sure I've made my point.

 

[beachchica]

It's possible that you're just a wimp who wasn't willing to stand up for friends in the face of complete and utter racist bigotry. I had no problem beating people down who tried to bully my friends. Nobody ever messed with them again, I can tell you that. I also have enough empathy to see how much the N word hurt my friends, it's ok if you do not. I wouldn't expect people who grew up privileged with white skin to understand what it's like to be bullied with racial bigotry. As a result, I can empathize with the Native Americans who were bullied and denigrated via racist vitriol which included using the term beloved patriot. Others on this forum have used another racist term that was offensive to me and the mods put the kibosh on that (shout out to Perknose). You don't know what people have been through and what is/isn't hurtful to them, that is the bottom line.

So... exactly how long has the name 'Redskins' offended you? I would suspect you're a bandwagon hater who didn't give one flip about the name until very recently when it became popular to rag on the name.

Otherwise I'd probably be able to search the forum for references you've made on this issue in the past.

 

[Phoenix86]

Holy shit, you cannot read or write. The total population of Indians is not "1.2 million", it's 5.2~ million as evidenced in the article.

<<But the thoughts and beliefs of native people are the basis of the debate over changing the team name. And looking across the breadth of Native America — with 2 million Indians enrolled in 566 federally recognized tribes, plus another 3.2 million who tell the Census they are Indian — it’s difficult to tell how many are opposed to the name.>>

Let's look at the logic path that you have decided to take so far:

1) A lawsuit was filed in 2013 by Native Americans representing 1.2 million people/50%~ of all tribes in the US because they found "Redskins" to be derogatory.
2) You quote a survey from 2004, or 9 years ago, that surveyed 768 people who don't mind "Redskins" and voluntarily claimed to be Indian.
3) With the evidence presented, you still preposterously feel the need to speak for all Native Americans and tell us that they think "Redskins" is still ok with them.

Either present stronger evidence or concede that your stance is based on a flimsy survey.

What part of "I think is safe to assume excludes most 1/16th Indians" was difficult to understand. People in this category often claim Indian status for benefits in things like a census but aren't active tribal members. Others could claim it but don't give a fuck, because we don't identify ourselves as Indians. If you want to include them, sure the number inflates. Derp, derp, derp.

I quoted your link which says this like " it’s difficult to tell how many are opposed to the name" and a bunch of other quotes with are opposed to your point of view yet you ignore them.

I never spoke for anyone, go ahead and find where I did, but it sure makes your point of view look stronger when you say shit like that. I did, however, question how many who do identify as being an American Indian consider it offensive. Multiple times. Just like the link you posted states.

You're not very good at this.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Here comes the backpedaling. You don't like it when the tables are turned, it's ok.

There was no backpedaling. My position has been consistent the entire time -- if you don't like something or are offended, the solution is REALLY simple -- don't patronize it.

Like I said, the fact that you would stop watching your football team, which you've spent countless hours in the past watching, if the name were changed speaks volumes. Would you sign a petition on change.org to change the name from The Krauts to something less offensive? Would you join a lawsuit with other Germans? Redskins was offensive enough for half the tribes in the US to file a lawsuit, and they probably don't watch football either as a result. Maybe now they will if the NFL steps in, it's win win from not only a moral standpoint, but a business one.

Actually, as I said, I probably really wouldn't stop watching them. I was giving an example of how I would behave if somehow I were highly offended by a name change. I'd simply stop watching the team or patronizing it. This isn't rocket science, please keep up.

(And no, I would not sign a petition to have the name changed or join a lawsuit)

 

[SlitheryDee]

We cannot expect everyone to have the time and interest to become a historian. The average Joe doesn't give a dam about history. Why are boy bands so popular? You have to account for the lowest common denominator, which may include a million Native Americans who could not give two shits about the history of what a beloved patriot is, in the same vein that blacks don't give a dam about why it was named Negro Mountain, only that negro is literally derogatory. This is same reason why libertarianism is flawed, i.e. expectations of how people should behave aren't applicable to the masses even if it sounds good on paper.

WTF dude. If you have the time and interest to demand sweeping changes in society, you should apply that interest to making certain those changes are really necessary. If that means studying some history, then fine. Why not take a little of the time that would have been spent doing nothing better than bitching and moaning about perceived offenses and apply it to making sure you really have a case?

I think all political philosophies suffer from that last bit.

 

[Greenman]

Nice counterargument, maybe you can have a discussion with the mods about why certain terms aren't allowed on this forum. Additionally, if a Native American was offended by the term beloved patriot and went to the mods, you can bet it won't be used on this forum. Let that sink in for awhile.

Let me ask you, if your family was threatened and denigrated, would you stand up for them or cower in a corner? You would hopefully man up and defend them, whether verbally or physically if it came to it. If blatant hate is shoved in my face, I'm going to give it right back to them. A shame you would just ignore it, that is part of the problem today and why racist vitriol is perpetuated. I'm glad the mods on this forum don't subscribe to the same laissez faire attitude toward racism that you exhibit. However, I'm comforted by the fact that such attitudes are in the minority.

So out in the real world you have to ask yourself "what would the AT mods do?". This is your standard for judging whats right or wrong? You could mix this up with a touch of Catholicism and really make it work. Confession could start with "forgive me Perknose for I have sinned", you could pray to saint Pizza for better grades in school, and of course evil people would incite the prince of darkness, Oldsmoboat, and be cursed to spend eternity in his basement.

You might really be on to something here.

 

[QuietDad]

The Constitution of the US GUARENTEES the right of freedom of speech. The bill of rights has this as the FIRST amendment in it. of the 27 Amendments in the Constitution NOT ONE gives you the right not to be offended. Suck it up cupcakes. It's just words.

 

[waggy]

The Constitution of the US GUARENTEES the right of freedom of speech. The bill of rights has this as the FIRST amendment in it. of the 27 Amendments in the Constitution NOT ONE gives you the right not to be offended. Suck it up cupcakes. It's just words.

True.

So who is with me on buying a pro-team and naming it "the krouts"?

 

[BUTCH1]

do you think that would happen?

If not, why?

I got that from a discussion a few years ago when a group of Indians were complaining about the Cleveland Indians, the leader of the group replied, "why don't you call them the Cleveland Jews" instead. Kind of funny, what I don't understand is weather it's Cleveland, Washington, KC, naming the team to an native American is not derogatory in any fashion, it should be considered an honor as Indians put up a fierce battle with little weapons or numbers before they were raped and stripped of their land..