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BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
64,178
12,491
136
why would you tie the cost of an unnecessary luxury item like gasoline to that of minimum wage? it's stupid economics. Sure, the minimum wage is criminally low (this is what Reagan and the fascists keep giving us), but that's a different topic.

MAYBE, if you live in a large city, gasoline (and personal vehicles) could be considered an "unnecessaty luxury item," but here in the west, mass transit, outside the cities is sporadic at best...and hauling a week's worth of groceries on the bus or light rail would be difficult, especially for the elderly and/or handicapped...and in some areas, would set you up as an easy mark for the criminal element. For us, gasoline is a necessity, not a luxury item. Pegging the price of gasoline to minimum wage isn't a perfect comparison, but it does show the gap.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,131
30,082
146
Fuel is not an unnecessary luxury item unless you live in a cabin in the woods and your self-sustaining quality of life is quite low, and your lifespan near 1/3rd shorter than we have achieved today.

If you don't have a motorized vehicle, you still depend on the services of others who have one, and the more fuel (or energy in the case of electric) costs, the more those services and price of durable goods go up as well.

This hurts those making a (low) minimum wage the most, but if you want to do without all the infrastructure in your life that depends on fuel, have fun with that.

Nah, I don't want to do without it, I just want to use the tools of economics that we've always used, only for some reason, we have unreasonable subsidies on certain things simply to protect the unimaginable wealth of very few people.

Fuck up fuel prices and we'll very quickly be incentivized to push out the alternative means that, frankly, we should have made standard decades ago, and we could have.

I don't really tolerate the constant "It's too hard to stop criminally wealthy people from being wealthy!" attitude of large swaths of people that hate themselves enough to endlessly defend these ancient and absurd resources. Obviously, the point is not to end the use of oil as clearly it is needed for most things; just the hilariously ruinous burning of it at a scale that has literally killed us all, and we know that. We just pretend to not care.

I find this attitude to be inhuman.

Fuel is very much a luxury item within the current paradigm that we use it. Every person shitting on scaled, efficient public transportation, deploring inefficient cities and praising suburbs (which only exist from pure racist desegregation responses from perpetually racist people...but that's another story that does cleverly dovetail into this one! ), single use vehicles, etc...is a threat to humanity. It's honestly quite intolerable to hear the same bitching and moaning from the very same clowns that only a few decades ago were screaming that removing lead from their precious fuel was going to destroy all of the jobs and the US with it. Yes, it happened, and yes all of these people are still alive, making the same fucking arguments about the same shit. They pretend they weren't those people then, but of course they were. You are old enough to remember.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,131
30,082
146
MAYBE, if you live in a large city, gasoline (and personal vehicles) could be considered an "unnecessaty luxury item," but here in the west, mass transit, outside the cities is sporadic at best...and hauling a week's worth of groceries on the bus or light rail would be difficult, especially for the elderly and/or handicapped...and in some areas, would set you up as an easy mark for the criminal element. For us, gasoline is a necessity, not a luxury item. Pegging the price of gasoline to minimum wage isn't a perfect comparison, but it does show the gap.

Oh I get that. The point is that you don't need fuel for any of this. Saying that it will never work to replace it now! means that no one will ever replace it.

It's a terrible attitude and simply perpetuates our obvious suicide.
 

mindless1

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2001
8,359
1,555
126
There's no logical way to interpret "why would you tie minimum wage to an unnecessary luxury item" to mean "we should immediately abolish all fuels".
I appreciate your point, but abolish and do without (for those at low/minimum wage) are essentially the same thing subjectively to the person earning low/minimum wage, to decide for them what they shouldn't have.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
38,384
8,686
136
Remember when everyone wasn't staring at a smart device in their hands half the time?
It's my biggest pet peeve at the gym. So many will camp out on a piece of equipment and fiddle with their smart phones. Mine sits in my pocket with a headphone cord going to my ears with sound isolating earbuds while I proceed with my routine in earnest, either working it or hunting for a piece of equipment my routine requires that doesn't have somebody occupying it.

 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
38,384
8,686
136
It should be about $7 per gallon right now, but we are a very stupid people.
Yeah, I don't complain about the cost of gasoline. If they boost it it will get some of the damn cars off the road (I bicycle and skate further than I drive my car), there's still less than 35k on my '97 sedan.
 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
38,384
8,686
136
Remember when you need greenbacks in your wallet or a checkbook to buy stuff and had coins jiggling in your pocket and you counted your change? Nowadays I don't usually have currency on my person.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,940
16,201
126
Remember when you need greenbacks in your wallet or a checkbook to buy stuff and had coins jiggling in your pocket and you counted your change? Nowadays I don't usually have currency on my person.
I still carry cash. Including coins
 

GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
7,148
7,644
136
It's my biggest pet peeve at the gym. So many will camp out on a piece of equipment and fiddle with their smart phones. Mine sits in my pocket with a headphone cord going to my ears with sound isolating earbuds while I proceed with my routine in earnest, either working it or hunting for a piece of equipment my routine requires that doesn't have somebody occupying it.


-To bring the "Getting old sucks" and this thread together, one of my favorite things about getting old is the shyness is gone. Just walk up, tap someone on the shoulder and ask to work in a set while I do my rotation.

99% of the time they're fine with it.
 
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GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
7,148
7,644
136
Remember when you need greenbacks in your wallet or a checkbook to buy stuff and had coins jiggling in your pocket and you counted your change? Nowadays I don't usually have currency on my person.

-My Google Pay wasn't working so I had to pay bus fare with some actual paper money and two hobos immediately started hitting me up for money

"No one carries money nowadays, can I have some?"

"No"

"Why not?"

"Because its mine and I don't want to give it to you"

*disgruntled mumbling and probably some swears directed at me*
 
Jul 27, 2020
19,805
13,573
146
Remember waiting for an important download to finish on your modem and praying no one picked up the phone? Especially in cases where the ISP had a bug that wouldn't disconnect you even if your scratch card time was used up and you could keep using the internet as long as it wasn't disconnected?
 
Reactions: pete6032
Jul 27, 2020
19,805
13,573
146
Remember when almost any DOS/Windows 98 game ran on your 386/486/Pentium and you didn't have to worry about upgrading your computer in a panic just to enjoy a newly released game? I would fantasize more about owning a Gravis Ultrasound or a Creative SB AWE32 than some powerful video card.
 

Stiff Clamp

Senior member
Feb 3, 2021
869
323
106
Remember when Creative Labs made mp3 players and Apple iPod wasn't around yet? I remember the first Nomad was the size of a CD player and had a laptop HDD in it.


Yeah, those days I had an Archos Jukebox "Recorder" with a real hard drive inside. 4 AAs. It was just my car jukebox so the buttons never got much wear. Think I have it sitting around somewhere here. I once took it to a session with a lawyer and recorded the conversion. It was when we were wrapping up the discussion that she found out it was recording the whole time, even though I'd set it conspicuously on the table between us, she suspected nothing. She was not pleased . . .



Never touched a Nomad. Though I did move on to Creative's Zen Vision:M
 
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pete6032

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2010
7,668
3,210
136
Remember waiting for an important download to finish on your modem and praying no one picked up the phone? Especially in cases where the ISP had a bug that wouldn't disconnect you even if your scratch card time was used up and you could keep using the internet as long as it wasn't disconnected?
I would sign on late at night when everyone was asleep and leave it on overnight to download demos.
 
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nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
59,219
13,811
136
Remember when almost any DOS/Windows 98 game ran on your 386/486/Pentium and you didn't have to worry about upgrading your computer in a panic just to enjoy a newly released game? I would fantasize more about owning a Gravis Ultrasound or a Creative SB AWE32 than some powerful video card.
I badgered my parents into buying a CD-ROM drive too early, we ended up with a single speed unit... wasn't long before games required a 2X drive
 
Reactions: igor_kavinski
Jul 27, 2020
19,805
13,573
146
I badgered my parents into buying a CD-ROM drive too early, we ended up with a single speed unit... wasn't long before games required a 2X drive
Yeah, they were too expensive at the start. When I finally got one, it was a used 24X reader-only unit. If it had trouble reading some CD, I would wipe the lens with a soft painting brush and it would read the CD perfectly. Then one sad day, my little sister poked inside my drawer and promptly wasted the painting brush. I was furious and threw a tantrum. No one understood the reason for my rage. I went out and got another brush. Apparently, it was a tad too hard coz it probably scratched the lens. That CD drive was never the same again. It would be a while before I could afford a brand new one.
 
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