Replacing an 8800GT

[Breegle]

My 8800GT was amongst what seems to be the many G92 cards that failed. I RMA'd it and was provided with a full refund, which was odd because I was expecting it to be replaced or repaired. The problem with that is I actually need the money more than a graphics card at the moment so I can't justify spending the same amount on a new card.

I'd consider the 9800GT since it came down a lot in price, but I really don't want to buy nVidia this time as the 8800GT is the 3rd card to fail on me (6800GS, 7600GT, then this one), so I'm looking to ATi. The choices I'm looking at are the 4670, 4850, OR waiting for the 4830 to come in at eBuyer. I'd love the 4850 but it'll use up all my refund money since I think I want the Sapphire dual-slot solution with the better cooling as those cards run crazy hot. Here's some questions:

- What sort of mileage do you reckon I'll get out of the 4670 before it's upgrade time again? Think I should give it a miss?
- The 4830 hasn't been completely introduced yet, what effect do you reckon it'll have on the price of the 4670 and 4850? Reckon I should wait?
- Are there other options I should be considering?

EDIT:

I run at 1680x1050.

 

[zod96]

If you run at 1680x1050 but don't want to spend most of your refund I'd wait for the 4830 to come into stock where you are. Its slower than the 4850 but not by alot and it does have some nice future proof features and it should play most games at that resolution with easy on medium to high settings and some AA/AF....

 

[Breegle]

Actually after looking around I found Xpertvision 4850s at around the same price as the 4830s are getting released. Should I worry about the temperatures those 4850s run at or just get the cheapest one available with the fairly rubbish fan?

 

[error8]

1) In my opinion the 4670 is a weak card for 1680X1050. I would take that out of your equation. You have to pay more to play at that resolution.

2) I don't see the 4830 reducing the price of 4850, since it's weaker and it makes no sense for ATi to drop its price. It might affect 4670 price somehow, but not by much or maybe not at all.

3) Since you don't have a lot of money to throw away on videocards, your choices are still 9800GT/4830, or the higher priced 4850 or 9800GTX+ . If I was in your situation, I would pay more for 4850/9800GTX+, if you are gaming a lot.

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: Breegle
Actually after looking around I found Xpertvision 4850s at around the same price as the 4830s are getting released. Should I worry about the temperatures those 4850s run at or just get the cheapest one available with the fairly rubbish fan?

You have to understand that, even though that card runs hot, it's not going to burn inside your case. If it's a well ventilated case and you increase the fan speed a bit, your temps will be just fine.

 

[Breegle]

Originally posted by: error8
You have to understand that, even though that card runs hot, it's not going to burn inside your case. If it's a well ventilated case and you increase the fan speed a bit, your temps will be just fine.

I guess, though I don't know that the case I've got is especially well ventilated. It's just a cheap old Antec case with a single fan at the back under the PSU. Gets dusty in there fairly often. Could probably do with a new one really but I'd rather spend the extra money on a graphics card! If temperature would be an issue because of this then the Sapphire 4850 reportedly runs at around 70 under load which I gather is very good for these cards, and the 4830 has the same cooling as the 4850. But maybe this doesn't matter if I can screw with the fan speed like you suggest?

I expect that a price of the 4850 will be static whilst the 4830 will fall when people don't buy it because they can get a 4830 for the same price, but that's just an uneducated guess and I figured the board members here will be able to predict the market better than I having paid closer attention to the market. I've borrowed an old X800XL which'll do for now if waiting's the best thing to do.

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: Breegle

Originally posted by: error8
You have to understand that, even though that card runs hot, it's not going to burn inside your case. If it's a well ventilated case and you increase the fan speed a bit, your temps will be just fine.

I guess, though I don't know that the case I've got is especially well ventilated. It's just a cheap old Antec case with a single fan at the back under the PSU. Gets dusty in there fairly often. Could probably do with a new one really but I'd rather spend the extra money on a graphics card! If temperature would be an issue because of this then the Sapphire 4850 reportedly runs at around 70 under load which I gather is very good for these cards, and the 4830 has the same cooling as the 4850. But maybe this doesn't matter if I can screw with the fan speed like you suggest?

Your case is not that well ventilated. Anyway, messing with the fan really improves thermals with the 4850. But an even better "tweak" for this card, is to replace the poo that ATi puts between the GPU and the heatsink. They're using a tone of that stuff, that acts more like an isolator, then as a real thermal conductor. I've seen this problem on two 4850 and on my 4870, so I guess it's wildly spread. Replacing the thermal paste and making some fan profiles, can give you less then 70 C under load. But now, not everyone is willing to dismantle a videocard to do that.

 

[SolMiester]

Well, after reading X-bit's review on after market GPU coolers here, I'd stay away from 4850's, there coolers are just pants and no-one has a decent cooler to that cools VRM's. The 4870 is a better cooler, but needs to be adjusted over 50% to keep the ah heck cool, and it doesnt sound like your case is conducive to these little heaters....

Its a shame really, as ATI has the bang for buck, but dropped the ball on the finishing line....

 

[dajo]

I'm seeing a lot of good results from overclocking the HD4830 cards, if you're into that. Performance near HD4850 look possible for most cards.

 

[imported_clockerspiel]

Originally posted by: Breegle

Originally posted by: error8
You have to understand that, even though that card runs hot, it's not going to burn inside your case. If it's a well ventilated case and you increase the fan speed a bit, your temps will be just fine.

I guess, though I don't know that the case I've got is especially well ventilated. It's just a cheap old Antec case with a single fan at the back under the PSU. Gets dusty in there fairly often. Could probably do with a new one really but I'd rather spend the extra money on a graphics card! If temperature would be an issue because of this then the Sapphire 4850 reportedly runs at around 70 under load which I gather is very good for these cards, and the 4830 has the same cooling as the 4850. But maybe this doesn't matter if I can screw with the fan speed like you suggest?

I expect that a price of the 4850 will be static whilst the 4830 will fall when people don't buy it because they can get a 4830 for the same price, but that's just an uneducated guess and I figured the board members here will be able to predict the market better than I having paid closer attention to the market. I've borrowed an old X800XL which'll do for now if waiting's the best thing to do.

You are caught between a rock and a hard place. The 8800GT failed because your case can't expel the system heat adequately causing the card to overheat (as well as other components as well). I suspect you'll have a shortened lifespan from the ATI cards as well, if you keep the same case. You seek a video card that is inexpensive, relatively fast, and helps to exhaust heat outside of the box. A B-stock from eVga may fit your needs for the least expenditure, i.e, the 512-P3-N808-RX, which is their 8800 GT Akimbo model which is designed to run cooler and exhaust the video card heat.

see: http://www.evga.com/products/bstock.asp

For $104.00, not a bad deal (considering your case and in the interest of keeping expenses down).

Between the 4850 and 4870, I'd recommend the 4870, if you have a good solid, name brand, tier III (or better) PS of 500 watts or greater, a case with better ventilation, and the financial resources to have all three.

Good Luck!

 

[cusideabelincoln]

At eBuyer I see the HD4830 will be 99.99 while an HD4850 is 116.99. In USD that's a difference of $28. I'd say the HD4830 is a better deal so wait!

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: SolMiester
Well, after reading X-bit's review on after market GPU coolers here, I'd stay away from 4850's, there coolers are just pants and no-one has a decent cooler to that cools VRM's.

Uhm..you got it all wrong. Only 4870 has VRM overheating issues, when people are using aftermarket coolers on them. 4850 cards do not have this issue from what I know. I've installed an S1 on a 4850 and used two little heatsinks for the VRM area and it's working like a champ inside a bad ass gamer.

Originally posted by: SolMiester

The 4870 is a better cooler, but needs to be adjusted over 50% to keep the ah heck cool, and it doesnt sound like your case is conducive to these little heaters....

Its a shame really, as ATI has the bang for buck, but dropped the ball on the finishing line....

Wow, you are such an Nvidia fanboy here, even if you don't realize it. Do you have a 4870 and noticed that you need 50% fanspeed to cool the gpu? If you haven't , then I'd suggest to keep your wrong opinions to yourself. Even at 30% fanspeed, the gpu stays bellow 70C and the fan is not audible.

Should I remember you how the 8800GT was such a great bang for buck card then, but the stock cooler was so miserable, causing the card to overheat and crash, sometime? But most of the GTs out there, were running at 85-90C full load, with no problems at all. Upping the fan speed also improved the situation. This is the same thing with the 4850 cards today. Some are used in cases with poor ventilation and/or with high ambient temps and are bound to have instability problems. Up the fanspeed and everything is fine.

 

[badnewcastle]

Replacing my 8800gt with a gtx260 core 216 for the same res... I play too many games, too much... couldn't resist the FC2 bundle.

 

[Breegle]

Originally posted by: cusideabelincoln
At eBuyer I see the HD4830 will be 99.99 while an HD4850 is 116.99. In USD that's a difference of $28. I'd say the HD4830 is a better deal so wait!

The problem is that you can pick up HD 4850s from other UK stores below £105 if you're not bothered about rubbish stock cooling, which I am a bit. Though, you know, if it DOES die in my case I can RMA it fine, my case isn't horrible it's just an average old computer case. If it failed in there it would almost certainly be a fault with the card as far as I'm concerned. It's a bit much for the card manufacturers to silently require their cards to be going into cases with better than average cooling.

Originally posted by: clockerspiel
You are caught between a rock and a hard place. The 8800GT failed because your case can't expel the system heat adequately causing the card to overheat (as well as other components as well).

Although I agree my case wouldn't have helped matters I know that it was the card which was at fault and not my case, as it originally started having problems when it was used in a CoolerMaster C690 which really should've been adequate.


I would be willing to give nVidia one last try, as the second failure was mostly my fault so they've still got one strike left I saw an 8800GTS going for a nice looking price but it only has 320MB memory, reckon I should avoid it? Also what if I see a 3870 going around the same price as a 4670? Would that be a good bet?

 

[MarcVenice]

8800gts 320mb is a pretty slow, like HD3850 speeds. At 1680*1050 you'll run out of vram as well, I know, coz I own one and game at 1680*1050.

I'd grab a HD4850, really, all this talk about them running hot is nothing more but a bunch of fud. They use roughly the same amount of power as a 8800gt or 9800gtx, the fan doesn't run fast enough though, so the heat doesn't disspate very fast, heating the gpu into the 85c area. But if you turn up the fan, it will run 75c or so under load, and that's perectly fine for a gpu.

 

[Breegle]

Originally posted by: MarcVenice
8800gts 320mb is a pretty slow, like HD3850 speeds. At 1680*1050 you'll run out of vram as well, I know, coz I own one and game at 1680*1050.

I'd grab a HD4850, really, all this talk about them running hot is nothing more but a bunch of fud. They use roughly the same amount of power as a 8800gt or 9800gtx, the fan doesn't run fast enough though, so the heat doesn't disspate very fast, heating the gpu into the 85c area. But if you turn up the fan, it will run 75c or so under load, and that's perectly fine for a gpu.

Heh, fair enough. Thanks, I think I will avoid it then. Pretty much it looks like 4850 or bust at the moment for my resolution, although no one's commented on the option of a HD 3870 yet. I did stumble across an 8800GT 1GB version for only £75, and that's only marginally more expensive than a HD 4670. I'm just chewing over whether I'm really going to give the G92 another shot. My gut says no but my wallet loves it. So options remaining gaming at 1680x1050:

HD 3870 £70
8800GT 1GB £75 (very tentatively considering)
HD 4850 £105

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: Breegle


So options remaining gaming at 1680x1050:

HD 3870 £70
8800GT 1GB £75 (very tentatively considering)
HD 4850 £105

3870 is about as fast as a 9600GT. It could have been a good choice some time ago, but seeing that is only £5 cheaper then the 8800GT, there is no sense in getting it, since is slower and sucks at AA.

Now, like MarcVenice said, the 4850 is the way to go for your resolution. If you have the money take it, you surely won't regret. If you don't, then that 8800GT should do it for the time being, but don't let that 1 GB of memory fool you, since it doesn't do anything over the stock 512 mb card, in terms of performance. ( marketing crap )