[Retired] The LCD Thread

[Trean]

DoctorM:

Another odd question - How long is the included DVI->HDMI cable with the VX2435wm?

 

[cboath]

Without unplugging it and putting a ruler on it 3' i think.

 

[cboath]

Originally posted by: Trean
DoctorM, xtknight, or someone in the know:

about to finally plop down for the vx2435wm just trying to verify one last thing...

I was wondering about the monitors aspect modes or scaling options. Since I want to watch television via the monitor its kind of important and it just occurred to me. Maybe someone knows where these are listed or DoctorM could you list them or someone else with the monitor OSD at their disposal.

oh and one more thing:

the review on 'trustedreviews.com' states:

This is a fairly comprehensive list of options and as an added bonus there's support for 1:1 pixel mapping. However, testing revealed that the monitor only did this accurately over D-Sub and not over Component or HDMI. When outputting 1080p over HDMI or Component with 1:1 pixel mapping enabled, the display added black bars all round the image. Considering 1080p (1,920 x 1,080) shares the same horizontal resolution as the native resolution of this display, there should only be bars at the top and bottom of the display.

just wondering if anyone that owns the monitor has any way of testing this. um possibly a full 1080p trailer or something like that and use the osd menu to change to 1:1 mode

Thanks for all the help.

Doc answered the aspect questions pretty well, but for the record, i'm using the HDMI connection and i've watched a few 1080p video's on it. They fit full width with black bars on the top and bottom only. Scales great for me.

 

[xtknight]

Scaling on the 20WMGX2 is possible but there are some caveats:

- You must be in DVI-HD mode under the options (I'm not sure what difference it makes)
- Expansion only works for 1280x720 (720p) from the desktop. I don't know if 480i/p or 1080i is supported from another device. 640x480 from the desktop didn't work.
- Options are FULL (fill), ASPECT (aspect ratio scaling), OFF (1:1 pixel mapping, centered mode)
- No custom expansion is available (a la NEC 90s series) for DVI
- There don't appear to be any DDC/CI control codes to control expansion or expansion mode. Hacking in expansion modes for other resolutions or scripting something to control the expansion mode probably isn't possible. Not that I expect that, anyways.
- The mode is remembered the next time you use 1280x720

I never thought it worked at all before so I thought I'd share that discovery.

I haven't bothered to try VGA.

 

[DoctorM]

Where are you planning on ordering Trean?
ToW has been mostly ok... not the best all the time though and they certainly don't seem to take instruction for taping a box closed, but their return policy seems pretty liberal.

cboath: Is that from an external 1080 source or from your PC?

 

[krilonx]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: krilonx
I think it's just the color (BF black, WF white), but I still don't understand if the contrast is 2000 or 3000:1
It's about one of your recommended 19" LCDs: LG L1970HR (L1970HR-BF, L1970HR-WF)
Thank for your great guide!

Don't worry about it. Both are lies. But it's a good gaming LCD. Contrast in reality..hmm..probably 500:1.

Thank you very much for your advices! I don't need it especialy for gaming , but for its colors accuracy and lower price. And its fast image delay I think its very welcome for me
I need an 19" 5:4 TN panel LCD with good colors. Of course, I'm not expected it to be better than an IPS or VA, the more expensive ones
I checked your 19" LCD recommendations and this was good for Office work and Multimedia, too. I need it a lot for web surfing at this moment.
This is my first LCD monitor and I'm making a transition from an old, heavy Dell Trinitron of 17", with superb colors of course, but not in its best condition for clear text. Maybe I'll use them both if I have enough space

Now I'm searching something about LG's pixel warranty, but, again, it's hard(er) to find
I would also consider of buying Philips, Samsung or another producer's 19" TN LCD, if they have better colors than this LG L1970HR-BF, at a similar price, but I think not Of course good text and images or diagrams legibility is also very important.

Thank you again for you support!

 

[Timeetyo]

xt:

I had thought I had figured out what monitor I wanted, but now I'm considering possibly going a bit bigger...so time to ask some more questions again.

I primarily game, although I do watch some movies (either way, but parked in chair right in front), and I was thinking of getting the vx2255. When looking through the gaming selections the Samsung SyncMaster 245BW stands out as well. It's not *that* much more, so I could probably swing it...but I'm not sure if its worth the upgrade. So, a few questions:

1. How much difference would there be in image quality/accuracy...mostly it just needs to look good and be fairly accurate...not doing any photo editing or the like.

2. Which will be better in terms of game quality (fps and mmo). Things like ghosting, etc.

3. I know they are both TN's, but is there a difference on viewing angles? The user reviews on newegg were pretty harsh regarding the 245's viewing angles. Are they worse than other TN's, or is it just that the pricier/larger monitor people expected something different?

4. Any differences in terms of overall quality, craftsmanship, durability...or RMA policies if I do have an issue?


Thanks again.

Tim

 

[cboath]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
Where are you planning on ordering Trean?
ToW has been mostly ok... not the best all the time though and they certainly don't seem to take instruction for taping a box closed, but their return policy seems pretty liberal.

cboath: Is that from an external 1080 source or from your PC?

The PC. It's the only thing in my house capable of 1080p

 

[Cheex]

Are laptop screens TNs??
Dell Inspiron specifically...

 

[Trean]

I ordered from TechOnWeb. It seems that both of you have had good experiences with them in general so I don't really wish to venture in a separate direction. Besides they are still in the leading price pack on the monitor its just around $560 (after tax or s&h) now like the rest of the other sites with a rebate offer instead of $520-540 like before.

Why do you suggest going from elsewhere?

 

[BassBomb]

hey xt, how is your nec treating you after all this time

Mines going a year strong and still perfect. Image retention always happens when in general windows but not in anything else

I noticed on one of the LCD databases there are IPS 24" with high contrast ratios and 8 bit panels, any word as to what monitors use this panel?

Same thing i saw for 30" with a very high contrast ratio, these are dynamic of course

 

[redlinez33]

I know people talk about the ghosting problems of the 2407WFP-HC. Have reviewers picked up on this and agree??? behardware (i think) said they didnt notice this.... For $600 for a high quality panel otherwise, sounds like a good deal.......... But I am scared of bad ghosting.....

BTW I am liking my samsung 245BW, but I miss the quality of a VA panel.

 

[najames]

Bahh, I've been following this thread forever, even posted a few times. I've been waiting patiently for a dual widescreen monitor setup somewhat like I use at work (2 x 19" non-widescreen Dells). I kept thinking that they come out with a good smaller monitor with HDCP, but it never seemed to happen. I don't want BIG 24"+ monitors or I'll need bigger tables for my equipment. Even though they are bigger that I wanted, I picked up 2 HP W2207 monitors at Staples yesterday for $245 each. They look like they should both be Samsung panels because they are labeled Rev STM001. They do have height adjustment, which is nice since I'm tall, wife's short.

We don't do gaming, usually surfing, videos, audio, and loading pics. I do a LOT of system work, testing Linux stuff, or connected up to work, and crunching data.

Are these a good deal or do you have other suggestions? I'm about ready to unbox them unless someone has other ideas.

 

[redlinez33]

good deals. STM001 = samsung panels

As long as glossy screen doesnt bother you. You just picked up a good quality 22" for the price of a 20" (TN).

 

[najames]

That does it, time to check them out. As long as they work OK (not a lot of dead or stuck pixels), I'm sure we'll be happy with them.

I only have a million other things I should be doing instead, DOH.

 

[redlinez33]

Ya just pray if you do have a dead pixel, that its not right in the center

 

[hi tek]

this may be a dumb questions but is there any way to fix a dead pixel?

 

[redlinez33]

Well theres really 2 different types of bad pixels. One is a stuck pixel other is a dead one. The likeliness of fixing either is slim, but there have been rumors of fixing stuck ones by using different methods (search for it). I have never been able to fix a stuck one.

Dead ones are just that dead......... No way to fix.

 

[DoctorM]

There are a few methods, usually pressure or a program that rapidly switches the pixel on and off.
I think there's a link on the first post to a Wiki on how to do it.

Mind you, I've had 3 LCD panels with stuck and/or dead pixels... and I've never gotten one to work.
My most recent panel has one stuck on and I wish I could fix it, but no luck.

Anyone else have any success with these things?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Cheex
This monitor has now become even more attractive...

The second best 1920x1200 rating on Newegg and now at $500...

Tell me again, your thoughts...

...**drum roll please**...

Note: I'm totally monitor confused right now, all I know is that I want 1920x1200 for gaming and movies.

Originally posted by: Cheex
Also....

I saw some nice reviews on this cheapo Acer...
What you guys think...its glossy...:thumbsup:....
Acer P243WAid

ExtremeTech didn't like the 28" Hanns much: http://www.extremetech.com/art.../0,1697,2205464,00.asp

I'd try the Acer myself though since it's glossy and actually very cheap. Haven't seen reviews though.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: czajunia
Another colorimeter question.

After reading some colorimeters reviews and user opinions it looks like Eye One calibration device sold under different names (Lacie, GretagMacbeth, X-Rite) with different software packages is the best affordable calibration solution. Especially when compared with slightly cheaper Spyder2 and Pantone Huey Pro.

As I couldn't find too much information on that does anyone know how EyeOne Display2 compares with the new Spyder3 device? Has anyone actually tried Spyder3?

It's very new and I haven't seen any comparisons. But I'm not better than Google. Personally I wouldn't be concerned with the Sypder3...the Eye One Display 2 is probably better. For wide gamut displays I'm not quite sure, actually. Spyder3 might possibly have an advantage there since it actually mentions WG support, but Eye One Display 2 might be better at it in reality. Eye One works brilliantly with my WG monitor so i1 Display 2 is the safest option.

Also, I read somewhere (I think it was one of the digital photgraphy forums) that Spyder2 is very capable device if used with a proper 3rd party software. Is this correct and is it possible to get good (read: comparable to EyeOne Display2) results using this device or is it in a completely different league hardware wise?

Thank's a lot for all the answers!

The i1 Display 2 is still likely better with third party software like basICColor.

 

[Cheex]

I just need to round up some funds now.
I'm kinda sold on the Acer because of the low price, fast panel, glossy, good user reviews and the 3 inputs including HDMI..

I would be good if I could find a review though...even on a vanilla P243W...don't know what the Aid on the end is for....

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Tasiin
My mistake then. Still not sure I want to bother with the lottery, but if I did, which do you think is the better monitor overall, the FP or WFP? What are the differences exactly?

I really don't know, but I'd try the WFP since it has the best likelihood of being more similar to the 20WMGX2, and I hear it's a great panel.

I only really prefer 4:3 because my desktop usage includes programming -- the extra height is more useful than extra width there -- and I occasionally play a few older games that don't support widescreen resolutions. I can always run them with fixed aspect scaling, though back when I had a 20WMGX2 I found the IPS panel's tendency to turn purple or orange at the corners of the black borders and bleed a little into the rest of the image pretty annoying for that.

Yes, this is an S-IPS problem (mostly alleviated by newer H-IPS panels like LCD2490WUXi or LCD2690WUXi).

Originally posted by: xtknight
Oh, why not make it the primary and designate the CRT as the secondary for corner cases where the LCD isn't suitable (response time)?

...
...
...

Well, I tried...

Heh, so have I.

Though I'd probably be happier with a monitor without gloss than I was with the NEC. In the addition to the other things that bothered me about it that would apply to pretty much any other LCD, I think that was the real deal breaker. That, and I was just expecting too much from it really. I wanted it to be able to be as good or nearly as good as my CRT for everything I commonly do, and those were pretty unrealistic expectations I have to admit.

It had fantastic image quality when the reflections weren't an issue though, far better than any other monitor I've used (including CRTs). I hope I haven't been spoiled in advance for anything else.

It never had better static contrast than a CRT but the glossy screen and Advanced DVM sure made it seem like it.

Color accuracy was better than CRTs. Black levels weren't quite there but still impressive. Watch out with matte S-IPS panels though. The black isn't going to be nearly as dark with some ambient light. That said, I'm still thrilled with my LCD2690WUXi (matte H-IPS). Black actually looks just as good when the lights are out (but not when lights are on).

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: krilonx
Thank you very much for your advices! I don't need it especialy for gaming , but for its colors accuracy and lower price. And its fast image delay I think its very welcome for me
I need an 19" 5:4 TN panel LCD with good colors. Of course, I'm not expected it to be better than an IPS or VA, the more expensive ones
I checked your 19" LCD recommendations and this was good for Office work and Multimedia, too. I need it a lot for web surfing at this moment.
This is my first LCD monitor and I'm making a transition from an old, heavy Dell Trinitron of 17", with superb colors of course, but not in its best condition for clear text. Maybe I'll use them both if I have enough space

Now I'm searching something about LG's pixel warranty, but, again, it's hard(er) to find
I would also consider of buying Philips, Samsung or another producer's 19" TN LCD, if they have better colors than this LG L1970HR-BF, at a similar price, but I think not Of course good text and images or diagrams legibility is also very important.

Thank you again for you support!

I'm really sorry if you mentioned this earlier but were the Samsung 971P or ViewSonic VP930b 19" VA panels unsuitable for some reason? The HP LP1965 is another possibility. I'd like to say all these VA panels would be superior, especially the 971P.

Pixel policies often vary per country. Are you in the US? If so it's probably just as bad as all the other policies here (at least 4-6 dead pixels).

I don't think these TN LCDs will come close to your Trinitron.

I think the L1970HR is a good bet but here are other options.

The Samsung 932B Plus looks good (probably better than L1970HR): http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/re.../samsung_932b_plus.htm

The L1960TQ is another decent option: http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/lg_l1960tq.htm

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Timeetyo
xt:

I had thought I had figured out what monitor I wanted, but now I'm considering possibly going a bit bigger...so time to ask some more questions again.

That's good, I like returning customers.

I primarily game, although I do watch some movies (either way, but parked in chair right in front), and I was thinking of getting the vx2255. When looking through the gaming selections the Samsung SyncMaster 245BW stands out as well. It's not *that* much more, so I could probably swing it...but I'm not sure if its worth the upgrade. So, a few questions:

1. How much difference would there be in image quality/accuracy...mostly it just needs to look good and be fairly accurate...not doing any photo editing or the like.

The VX2255wmb looks a little more accurate, actually. But both are good after calibration, of course. The 245BW's colors are decent enough and more accurate than average for a TN already.

The VX2255wmb has a higher static contrast according to the prad review. Backlight uniformity is good on both. Possibly a slight edge to the 245BW here but it depends on the unit anyway.

2. Which will be better in terms of game quality (fps and mmo). Things like ghosting, etc.

In ghosting, I doubt there would be much difference. Neither monitor uses overdrive and both are fast TNs.

And you can see that here. They're practically identical down to the last ghost: http://www.digitalversus.com/d...1&mo2=285&p2=2684&ph=1

Here's a full-blown review of the 245B: http://prad.de/en/monitore/rev...view-samsung-245b.html

And VX2255wmb: http://prad.de/en/monitore/rev...ewsonic-vx2255wmb.html

245B is same thing as 245BW in US.

3. I know they are both TN's, but is there a difference on viewing angles? The user reviews on newegg were pretty harsh regarding the 245's viewing angles. Are they worse than other TN's, or is it just that the pricier/larger monitor people expected something different?

Choose the viewing angle option on DigitalVersus. The 22" VX2255wmb may appear to have a wider viewing angle because it's smaller, though. The images indicate the 245BW might actually be better. Let's look at prad's images:

VX: http://prad.de/en/monitore/rev...c-vx2255wmb-part8.html
245B: http://prad.de/en/monitore/rev...amsung-245b-part9.html

Hard to tell because they didn't use the same picture, but the 245B certainly performs decent here except for the underneath pic (as all TNs).

4. Any differences in terms of overall quality, craftsmanship, durability...or RMA policies if I do have an issue?


Thanks again.

Tim

No idea. Read through the PRAD reviews and hopefully you'll have a better idea. Or search for user opinion for this one. If I had to guess, Samsung. ViewSonic has more issues w/ DVI problems. I like Samsungs better overall myself. The ViewSonic does have decent image quality but so does the 245B and I think size matters here. I'd go with the 245B. Although, I believe Samsung has more trouble with vertical/horizontal lines of dead pixels. You can RMA for that, though.

Good luck.