[Retired] The LCD Thread

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: gorobei

Originally posted by: gorobei

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: Exclusive
xtknight,

The Dell 2408WFP (A01 Rev) has majorly decreased the input lag from 60 ~ 70ms to 30 ~ 35ms.

That's good to hear. I will try and find a source for this and fix the input lag measurement in the OP.

I have the A01 2408wfp. a cursory runthru of the lagom tests, shows anywhere from 25-60ms lag on the quick response times(grey tones cycling squares with squares). some are close to -10, most are around -25, and one or two in the -60 range of color shift.

i have some contract work due next week so i haven't gotten around to breaking out my digital camera or crt for the ghosting or input lag test. I'm working through the weekend and should finish up next week. i'll post some pics of the tests then.

OK. results in.
on the lagom input lag test. (the clock one)
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/3357/p1000678xk1.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/8438/p1000676yk9.jpg
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/5373/p1000675za6.jpg
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/7403/p1000673ne2.jpg
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/6605/p1000672em6.jpg
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/4563/p1000668sg3.jpg
http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/3058/p1000667sq1.jpg
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/3162/p1000665ik2.jpg

average is 1 to 2 frames lag for 60hz/fps. so 17 to 34 ms input lag.

Thanks a lot for these measurements. This is uplifting. I will add it to the OP.

Originally posted by: theslug
This is a calibration/color management question. I have the Eyeone LT colorimeter and I'm using both a CRT and LCD on the same system. Should I use the x-rite software to create an ICC profile? Does a profile actually allow the screen to display more accurate colors/grayscale? I guess I'm not sure what the profile actually does since monitors have their own built-in adjustments as well.

A 'profile' in the strict sense is a notebook of your monitor's physical properties. It records the gamut triangle (the part of the visual spectrum your screen can reproduce) by using the three CIE X, Y, Z ordinates. This range of the visual spectrum is completely irrelevant to the number of colors within that specified spectrum that it can display; that is specified instead by bit depth. (Clearly, bit depth can be up to infinity within any given spectrum, or something like that.) Most monitors have 8 bit depth through one way or another.

Profiles also usually include calibration, which is a list of three columns of 256 values to calibrate each gray level in the display. This is uploaded to your video card to further calibrate the panel even though the monitor does have some R/G/B adjustment.

So yes, calibrate your display and make an ICC profile.

 

[zod96]

Was wondering how good or bad is the HP LP1965 http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc...70-444767-3296839.html

Based on the view angles I would say its a MVA panel? And I'd assume its not glossy either the screen that is. I'm think about downgrading my 22 inch LG to a standard 19 inch non wide screen LCD. I'm having trouble seeing the 22 inch while surfing the internet with my eye sight. I would love to get the NEC 90GX2, but can't find them anywhere. Would the HP LP1965 be a good choice for games and for clear text while surfing the internet?

 

[zod96]

I can get the HP one from B&H for $279 out the door. But I'd really like to hear from people about this LCD before I get it. I'm typing on my Dad's L90D+ now. Its soo much easier to read then my LG lcd.

 

[BassBomb]

Originally posted by: zod96
I can get the HP one from B&H for $279 out the door. But I'd really like to hear from people about this LCD before I get it. I'm typing on my Dad's L90D+ now. Its soo much easier to read then my LG lcd.

22" widescreen is about the same pitch as 19" non widescreen

I would not drop 280 on a 19" in this day and age

What are you having trouble seeing? Move the monitor closer?

 

[JETninja]

Originally posted by: xtknight

I have always had good luck with my old white T-shirt. I am not obsessive about the screen being shining and gleaming but it works to get off the occasional stain when you need to. If you really want to clean it beyond just "getting off the stains" then I'd recommend better materials clearly.

Just look at the Tag and make sure no man made fibers like Rayon or Nylon (has to be 100% cotton) and then you know your safe, those other fibers can leave micro scratches.

It would have to be some serious oily goop to to require Alcohol....Warm water should suffice.

I'm very anal about clean glass and LCD's. I clean my car's windows ('95 modded M3) every single day. (drive 70m per day) I use Armor All or Rain-X spray cleaner, with low lint paper towels two times on each outside window. (first pass cleans the crude, 2nd with another paper towel bundle gets rid of streaks) MF to get any missed streaks. Interior windows (Tinted) only get warm water and 100% cotton towels or MF towels. Just like all the home electronic panels....Only the kids old "glass" tube TV gets spray, cause of the "Gunk" they get on it. (KIDS!)

 

[zod96]

The HP uses a MVA panel that's why I think its more than a regular 19 inch. And I've tried moving the LCD closer that didn't help to much. I'm always squinting to see text and such. And if I increase the font size then web pages tend to get somewhat distorted...

 

[BassBomb]

Originally posted by: zod96
The HP uses a MVA panel that's why I think its more than a regular 19 inch. And I've tried moving the LCD closer that didn't help to much. I'm always squinting to see text and such. And if I increase the font size then web pages tend to get somewhat distorted...

Do you need glasses lol?

The size of the text will not change on the MVA.
Also are you using DVI or VGA? And are you using the native resolution of your panel?

 

[zod96]

I'm using DVI. And I do wear glasses I'm blind in one eye actually. Well not totally but its like 2/400 with glasses, and my good eye is 20/80. I know the size of the text will not change, but going from 1680x1050 to 1280x1024 will be huge. When I sit at my dad's desk with his L90D+ I can sit back in the chair and read websites no problem. With my LG I have to lean fore ward and squint to see websites. I'm getting a little tired of that...

 

[zod96]

LOL forget it I just fired up BF2 on my Dad's 1280x1024 LCD, and while text is easier to read on that, games look like crap compared to my LG. They look all squished and games are more important to me then text so the LG stays..

 

[BassBomb]

Originally posted by: zod96
LOL forget it I just fired up BF2 on my Dad's 1280x1024 LCD, and while text is easier to read on that, games look like crap compared to my LG. They look all squished and games are more important to me then text so the LG stays..

LOL

there is a whole lot of tweaking you can do on your lcd to figure out what will look the best to your eyes

for example, xp cleartype.. sharpness on monitor, dv modes

 

[paperfist]

My Dell SP2309W finally came in and after a week + of using it for gaming and web surfing I couldn't be happier.

The screen has a gloss finish on it, not real glossy but just enough to give it a shine. The frame of the LCD is very glossy, but since I don't tend to touch it finger prints aren't an issue. It has a pretty cool 'touch' power button and not your typical press in to turn on button.

I know some people here wanted to know about it, but I'm not sure what the best way to show it off is. I could run some benchmark software (3DMark?) and record it with my camera's video mode and post it here if anyone wants me to. Or if there's a better way I'm all ears

 

[TempletonPeck]

I have an LG L227WTG monitor. I've had it for close to a year now.

It emits a buzzing/whining/some sort of high pitched sound, but only when I visit this one particular web page. If I switch tabs within the web browser it disappears. Any idea why?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Ingenuitor

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: Ingenuitor

Originally posted by: ZealPath
Well I have to say, it was great to finally be pointed to this thread as it seems like quite a fountain of knowledge, hopefully someone has some suggestions for me.

I have had some pretty notorious difficulties making the adjustment from CRT to LCD. I'm not one of those "oh I'll just wait until the next technology" type people, I really want to like LCDs, so far it just seems like they don't like me. One thing that has always been an issue for me is readability, I do play a lot of games, but games have never been the issue, quite the opposite. I would say that I've always thought that the LCDs I have tried have enhanced my gaming experiences, the only problem is, they have all but destroyed my browing/reading experiences, and for someone who likes to kill time at places like Wikipedia, that just doesn't work for me.

So I would say that text is the priority here, size wise, I still use a 17" CRT at 1024x768, so I'm hoping to upgrade a little, 22" seems to be the best size for me at this point for the better dot pitch at 1680x1050, compared to how it would be smaller on a 20"er. I guess by the same token, a 26" at 1900x1200 could work, though I have never used a monitor at that resolution before. Honestly I wish I could use a solution as simple as lowering the resolution but going below the native resolution completely kills the crispness on an LCD in my experiences so far.

I guess I'm wondering if anyone out there has had similar problems with reading and has found an LCD that they like, I believe the vast majority of the LCDs I have tried in the past have been TN panels, and the bad viewing angles are another thing that drove me nuts. This is one thing I know I can work around now by using one of the other panel types, so I would certainly like to hear suggestions for VA or IPS panels. The last LCD that I tried was a 22" Dell (don't remember the exact model name), seemed very cheap and for just a little while, it didn't bug the hell out of me, but it wasn't long before the bad viewing angles and difficulty reading text got the better of me and it got packaged up and returned.

I wish I could try out the LCD2690WUXi just to see what it is like, not exactly the kind of monitor I'm going to find on display at a place like Best Buy huh. :laugh:

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Hello I have two of the LCD2690WUXi's in my small home studio, whereas I just got these units, they seem good. However they are super bright, I turned the brightness all the way down and I would like to turn it down some more if I could. I will say NEC is an amazing company though and very easy to deal with when it comes to support.

I wonder if there is better at this size, seems medical grade are the best, but very costly. Also I hear good things about the HP Dream Color. 1 billion colors in a 30-bit, LED-backlit display, designed for Dream Works Animation SKG Inc. I'm going to be testing these next, before making a final purchase.

Good luck with you search, this forum has definitely helped me narrow my choices.

Some of the medical grade are grayscale only for radiology. Otherwise they are probably just IPS panels with a high price and certifications slapped on them. Although, you may prefer HP's upcoming LED backlight monitor to the LCD2690.

The HP Dream Color? I'm thinking about testing it, pricey, but maybe fair for the technology it represents at this time, plus it dropped by $1200, just in one year. Yet I read it's not really is good as HP markets it to be. Or are you looking at another model and if so what model, I would liove to research it? Thanks

I was speaking of the HP you were referencing. I don't know about their other models.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: zod96
Was wondering how good or bad is the HP LP1965 http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc...70-444767-3296839.html

Based on the view angles I would say its a MVA panel? And I'd assume its not glossy either the screen that is. I'm think about downgrading my 22 inch LG to a standard 19 inch non wide screen LCD. I'm having trouble seeing the 22 inch while surfing the internet with my eye sight. I would love to get the NEC 90GX2, but can't find them anywhere. Would the HP LP1965 be a good choice for games and for clear text while surfing the internet?

Yes it is a matte MVA panel that I recommend in the OP. It would be OK for games but great I think for general use. It does have quite a fast response time. Check the X-Bit Labs review I link in the OP for the LP1965.

 

[natty1]

Originally posted by: shiznit

Originally posted by: Triplehammer
The Samsung 2233rz is now available from Tigerdirect and CompUSA as part of a $600 bundle that includes the new nVidia 3D Vision goggles. Early reports from the hardforum thread, here:

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1387713

is that it is a true 120Hz LCD display. This single fact would put it at the top of the Hardcore Gaming list. Being 120Hz may even make it the ONLY Hardcore Gaming choice.

Agreed. This monitor is for real and the 120hz alone (so long vsync, burn in hell) is good enough for the top of the list, way up there miles above the rest.

Until the 120hz Viewsonic comes out this is the ONLY gaming worthy LCD on the market.

this is correct

xtknight, this monitor needs to go to the top of the hardcore gaming list

 

[WaxHaX0rS]

I just purchased and received the BenQ 2400WD. One thing I notice (and I noticed it with my old TN monitor) is that that contrast within dark colors is not very good. If you have a dark area and a light area, you really have to jack up the contrast/brightness to be able to distinguish between the colors in the dark area. This makes the lighter areas excessively bright imo. Basically my question is, does anyone have a good way of increasing contrast in dark areas without maxing out the brightness and burning my eyes out from the bright areas? Obv I know this is mostly a problem with the technology but I was wondering if someone could give some idea of things to tweak to minimize this problem.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: WaxHaX0rS
I just purchased and received the BenQ 2400WD. One thing I notice (and I noticed it with my old TN monitor) is that that contrast within dark colors is not very good. If you have a dark area and a light area, you really have to jack up the contrast/brightness to be able to distinguish between the colors in the dark area. This makes the lighter areas excessively bright imo. Basically my question is, does anyone have a good way of increasing contrast in dark areas without maxing out the brightness and burning my eyes out from the bright areas? Obv I know this is mostly a problem with the technology but I was wondering if someone could give some idea of things to tweak to minimize this problem.

Gamma can be increased to raise brightness with the bias towards the midtones rather than at one side or the other only.

Edit: I should say, 'gamma correction', because 'gamma' is actually a function of your display itself. However, it is labeled simply as 'gamma' in most programs and usually raising this will increase the brightness, but sometimes lowering it due to the ambiguous terminology.

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Originally posted by: paperfist
My Dell SP2309W finally came in and after a week + of using it for gaming and web surfing I couldn't be happier.

The screen has a gloss finish on it, not real glossy but just enough to give it a shine. The frame of the LCD is very glossy, but since I don't tend to touch it finger prints aren't an issue. It has a pretty cool 'touch' power button and not your typical press in to turn on button.

I know some people here wanted to know about it, but I'm not sure what the best way to show it off is. I could run some benchmark software (3DMark?) and record it with my camera's video mode and post it here if anyone wants me to. Or if there's a better way I'm all ears

Honestly, I'd just be interested in hearing your objective impressions of it; viewing angles, overall picture quality, input lag test if you have a CRT to compare, etc.

 

[rpsgc]

I'm thinking of buying this largely unknown monitor, the Philips 240PW9ES (black version 240PW9EB). Apparently it uses the same panel as the HP LP2475W. Unfortunately it seems to be rare outside of Asia/Europe, thus I can only find good information on Singaporean forums but still it's not enough, no input lag tests, etc :/

 

[africanleopard]

So...I'm not that clued up on LCD monitors - I really like the look of the Dell 2209WA. Would I be able to play my XBOX360 on it? Or do I need monitor that states specifically it can run HD?

 

[cogent]

Hi guys!

I'm sure this has been asked before, in that case please refer me to the page number. As I didn't read through all of the 323 pages in this thread
What's the deal with brightness (cd/m^2)? I read over the 1st post a couple of times, and there doesn't seem to be a good description of how it effects the monitor. When shopping for a monitor should I just ignore it and focus more on contrast? The reason I'm asking is because I'm eyeballing the BenQ 2400WD ($350 on amazon) and it's brightness is 250cd. As opposed to another common value of 300cd. Right now I have a crappy FujiPLUS FP-988D (http://www.newegg.com/product/...?item=N82E16824168005), which also has 250cd. When I watch movies on it, it appears way too dark, I can barely see the anything if the movie is in a dark setting. So my question is, will the 2400WD be dark as well?

Thanks!

 

[Lalakai]

the LG W2241T..............i tried searching through this thread for info on it, but couldn't find it, so i'll break down and ask.

what are the differences between the W2241T the LG L227WTG?? I was just getting ready to buy the 227 when i seen a sale at BB for the 2241 at $209. Primary use will be gaming. Usually i'ld also check Egg's feedback but for some reason i can't access them right now.

and a definite word of thanks to xtknight for this thread. i've watched it grow into a huge success, and i've seen it linked on countless other sites. kudos to you.

 

[brencat]

Originally posted by: cogent
Hi guys!

I'm sure this has been asked before, in that case please refer me to the page number. As I didn't read through all of the 323 pages in this thread
What's the deal with brightness (cd/m^2)? I read over the 1st post a couple of times, and there doesn't seem to be a good description of how it effects the monitor. When shopping for a monitor should I just ignore it and focus more on contrast? The reason I'm asking is because I'm eyeballing the BenQ 2400WD ($350 on amazon) and it's brightness is 250cd. As opposed to another common value of 300cd. Right now I have a crappy FujiPLUS FP-988D (http://www.newegg.com/product/...?item=N82E16824168005), which also has 250cd. When I watch movies on it, it appears way too dark, I can barely see the anything if the movie is in a dark setting. So my question is, will the 2400WD be dark as well?

Thanks!

LCD companies play all kinds of games with statistics -- the most abusive is with the dynamic contrast advert (10000:1, 20000:1, etc). Even 2ms/5ms statistics are unreliable indicators of how the monitor will perform for YOUR purposes. Rather, you need to look at pro and other user reviews to get a sense of the input lag + response time (2 different things) the monitor has, which is largely determined by the panel type (TN, VA, or IPS)

Lastly, I'm sure xtknight will explain this better but brightness over 200 cd/m^2 is more than enough for most users. I'm using a V2400W (same panel as the G2400WD you referenced) and have brightness turned down to 55%. The great thing about this LCD is the fact it's standard gamut so colors are accurate.

 

[10e]

Originally posted by: africanleopard
So...I'm not that clued up on LCD monitors - I really like the look of the Dell 2209WA. Would I be able to play my XBOX360 on it? Or do I need monitor that states specifically it can run HD?

The Xbox 360 now supports 1680x1050 resolution, so it will display correctly on that monitor with a VGA or HDMI to DVI cable. But since it only has one DVI port, you'd need an HDMI or DVI switch to share it between an xbox 360 and PC, but the difference between HDMI and VGA is pretty much none in my opinion, with regards to quality.

 

[eivanov]

hi guys,

I have a problem in choosing 24" monitor for general home usage. For now my options are Eizo S2431W and Eizo HD2442W but which one is better?

My video card is ATI HD4850 with 2 HDMI connectors but I can not find any information if I can connect both of them to Eizo HD2442W (one to its HDMI input for gaming and movies and the other to its DVI input for general purposes). Can anyone help on that? The idea behind this type of connection is to use so called Thrue mode which works only on HDMI. I'm not sure if dynamic contrast option works also on DVI or only on HDMI?

My research shows me that S2431W is the same as HD2442W without HDMI connectors, remote control and dynamic contrast. Is that correct? Thanks in advance for any information on that.

P.S. Sorry for my poor english - it's not my native language