[Retired] The LCD Thread

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: palladium

Originally posted by: KevinC
here
To install an ICC profile the directions for XP or Vista are down the page a little.

Thanks, managed to get some of the black ones show up ( after tweaking the nvidia CP) but not the white ones. I do notice some banding though...

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: palladium
Hey xtknight ( and anyone else who tried the monitor adjustment link in the OP) did you manage to get the features on the bottom sides of the test image ( the ones marked with numbers 1-3 and 252-255) working? I'm using a HP LP2475w and no matter how hard I try, I can't get them to show up without changing the gamma too much. I suppose the LP2475w should be capable of producing the subtle shades of grey, no?

TIA

Even on my LCD2690 it's hard to get these tones well distinguishable. But these high ends of the spectrum are overrated. I would not worry about them. Getting these three tones to show may sacrifice ALL the midtones greatly.

Ahh I see.. is there a way to know if I've sacrificed my midtones? ( now that I've managed to get some of the black to show up)

Thanks again for the replies.

You could check a gradient I guess to see the difference with and without the correction. It's fairly easy to tell if anything has gone seriously awry. I have the gradlin tool on my site to help you with that, but it's a bit hard to find because I'm way too lazy to organize my site properly. Sorry.

http://lcdresource.com/mambo/i...k=view&id=28&Itemid=39

You can use any of them. They will all give you the same indication if anything has gone wrong.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: xSauronx
ok, in exchange for doing some work for someone, i got a new E207wfp from dell. linky

its new in the box, and they are going for about $150 or so on ebay. Should I just sell this and find another lcd on sale somewhere? Im *planning* on building a quad rig soon, and if i do eventually(primarily itll be a VM box) ill probably want to watch HD stuff and do some moderate gaming. i figure if i sell this i can spend maybe $200 or so tops on an LCD, i should definitely be able to get something better for that much, right?

I would sell it. I cannot say I am much of a fan of this LCD.

But getting something better for $200? Hmm I don't know. Why not $250-300? Reach for the Dell 2209WA...

 

[Sir Phobos]

Hey everyone, new member here. I recently purchased a BenQ E2400HD, and I love it so far. I plan on using it with a PS3 when it arrives in the mail, and I have some questions.

My main concern is input lag, and I read that the BenQ LCDs perform exceptionally well when it comes to that. For my purposes, I'm aiming for 8ms or below with this display. I'm not sure how it works since my PS3 isn't here yet, but I've read that the PS3 doesn't display true 1080p even when the checkbox is marked in the XMB. Now, I understand that input lag comes from a few sources:

1) When the image has to be scaled.

2) From postprocessing on HDTVs.

Since the native resolution of my display is 1920x1080, is there is a way to force the PS3 to output a game in 1080p (maybe uncheck all the boxes except for that?), and would it significantly decrease the input lag as opposed to playing on 720p?

My second question is about postprocessing. Is there any postprocessing on this (or any) LCD monitor when viewing a device connected to the HDMI input port that could increase input lag? If so, there is a 3rd party VGA cable for the PS3, which might eliminate the postprocessing and decrease input lag. I could also get an HDMI to DVI converter if that would avoid the postprocessing (if it exists) as well.

I apologize for the tentative questions, I plan on testing this display thoroughly when I get all the things I need in order to do so. But I would appreciate any responses from anyone who has had some experience with this or a similar LCD display. Thanks!

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Well, my two Dell 2209WA monitors arrived over lunch.

I only had time to hook them up quickly, so no real testing done yet, but I'm very impressed. The stands are very solid, and my first impression is that the picture quality is stellar.
Not the setup I'll use, but for comparison...

At this point, my main regret is that I didn't order three of them!

I'll post some more impressions and pictures later tonight if I have time.

 

[cogent]

Hi guys!

A few pages back I asked a question about the BenQ G2400WD and brightness. Thanks for answering, since then I have ordered it and it came in the mail today. Hopefully this isn't an idiotic question, but what mode should I put it in? Out of the box it displays what it calls "standard" mode and looks pretty good. Looking through the menus I see there's a "dynamics" mode. I assume that's something with dynamic contrast. Is that the mode that takes advantage of the displays full capabilities?

I'm sure the real answer to this is "do whatever looks better". But I guess my real question is what's the difference between "standard" and "dynamics" modes.

Thanks guys! You're awesome.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: icered

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: icered
I was planning on getting a Benq E2200 HD Flat panel this weekend(My first transition from a CRT to a flat panel)
Specs are as below:
21.5" viewable
16:9 Aspect Ratio
1920x1080 Native resolution
5ms Response time
DVI-D with hdcp
HDMI port

Benq E2200HD

While I was at the store I found out there was a cheaper version of the same monitor - the Benq T2200 HD. Its the same as its slightly more expensive brethren minus the HDMI port, the crappy speakers, the Senseye+Photo image tech and possibly the overdrive mechanism(Benq calls its AMA I guess)

Benq T2200HD

Now the price difference between the two is about $30. My question is whether it is better to go for the cheaper version(the T2200HD which doesn't have the HDMI port)? Reading through forum posts I gather its easy to get an DVI-HDMI adapter if I need to, say connect a PS3/XBOX-360. (I don't own a console right now, but I might after, say 5-6 months)

Yeah a DVI-HDMI adapter should work. I think it's worth paying the extra for AMA (overdrive). Otherwise it might feel like you're using 5-years-old LCD response technology.

My second question is supposing I do get the DVI-HDMI adapter for the T2200 HD, what about audio? I have a logitech x-540 5.1 setup. How do I route multi-channel audio to the speaker set then?

That depends on the outputs of your console. If it has Dolby output that hook this up to a receiver. Otherwise you might be stuck with stereo. I'm not sure there's anything to "grab" audio from the HDMI and even then it seems you'd need a receiver (Dolby decoder) to get 5.1.

My third question is if indeed I get the E2200 HD (which has the HDMI port), how do I route the audio to my speaker system?(This monitor comes with a set of crappy speakers built-in).

What do you guys think?

Thanks,
-IceRed

The E2200HD doesn't have audio output (at least not 5.1), so you'd have to come up with some other solution.

Check this out: http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hard.../x/xbox360hdmiavcable/

Thanks... Short, crisp and to the point!

One more twist to this though. While I was at the retail shop to get this monitor, unfortunately for me they had run of stock but offered me an enticing Samsung 2233SW (22" Full HD monitor without HDMI) at a lower price($20 less) instead. Am not sure what to make of this one though.

The new batch of Benq E2200HDs arrive in 3 days. Which one do I choose? Are the samsung ones inherently better than Benq and so blindly go for the Samsung? (However the Samsung has a slower response time of 5ms compared to 2ms for Benq)

Go for the E2200HDs. Some Samsungs have blue color tint issues. BenQs haven't had these issues.

 

[GripS]

After much research and stumbling across this thread I finally had decided on the LG 227WT..... It's not listed as a WTG and I live in the US so not sure what is up there. Cheapest place I could find and it was free shipping(280 bucks). Too bad I only read the recommendations in the beginning otherwise I would have spotted the Dell 2209WA.

After searching for that I found out that last week they were selling them for a little over $200.00 + tax and shipping(seen a couple posts of invoices proving this). Tried calling Dell up today and low and behold they were on sale last week and that ended on the 31st(this is what i was told anyway). Just thought I would let everyone know that the too good to be true actually was true and now its over. Bummer....

Looks like a sweet panel. I saw a video showing all the diff positions you can put the monitor in..... pretty much unheard of to have those kind of positioning options. I'd like to see a decent 'real' review on this by someone who actually bought the monitor as i'm really torn on what I should do..... return the LG and go for the Dell??? Or will the Dell not be as good at gaming? (main purpose for monitor)

Thanks xtknight for sharing your knowledge on LCD monitors...... marketing is so misleading and I don't trust high profile review sites. I prefer first hand knowledge from people that use it for more then a few hours. Thanks much!

 

[ungco]

Originally posted by: ZetaEpyon
Well, my two Dell 2209WA monitors arrived over lunch.

I only had time to hook them up quickly, so no real testing done yet, but I'm very impressed. The stands are very solid, and my first impression is that the picture quality is stellar.
Not the setup I'll use, but for comparison...

At this point, my main regret is that I didn't order three of them!

I'll post some more impressions and pictures later tonight if I have time.

It would be great to hear your thoughts on the monitor and, if you so please, post up calibration settings. I took the plunge and received it yesterday (only three business days!). I haven't had much experience with IPS screens, save for the Cinema Displays at uni, but the colours seem to be pretty true on this Dell screen, although sharpness was a bit high out of the box. Definitely beats out my laptop's screen.

 

[herbals]

are 16:9 monitors are bad choice for gaming? I play some older games too, like quake1
I want a very good gaming monitor

Im thinking about the Benq G2400WD and thats 16:10 #2 on gaming list OR the BenQ M2400HD which is 16:9

how does the Benq M2400HD stack up against it? To me it seems to be a better monitor, how does it compare for gaming? is 16:9 crap for gaming?

my store has: Benq E2200HD Full HD / Benq G2400WD / Benq M2400HD

ive never owned a LCD, and want a very good gaming one

thanks, very informative thread

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: spiral529

Originally posted by: zod96
When is the Dell 2209WA due out? I know its only going to be like less than $300 22 inch using an IPS panel. Just can't seem to find anywhere that has them. Also is it going to have a glossy screen?

This monitor has been available for the past week or so from Dell:

http://accessories.us.dell.com...=en&cs=04&sku=320-7825

I am very tempted to get one. The only thing holding me back is the possible upcoming release of additional low-cost eIPS panels at higher resolutions, such as the 1920x1080 panel described here:

http://www.displayblog.com/200...80p-lcd-monitor-panel/

Wow. This is awesome.

Originally posted by: zod96
Is the Dell 2209WA a glossy screen?

Nope, matte.

Here's the million dollar question then, and I hoping you know the answer xtknight. What did they do to make IPS panels cheap all of a sudden? Same angles, same 8-bit color, great response time, etc. It leaves me wondering what the trick was to make this things so much cheaper, and what the downsides may be.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: ViRGE

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: spiral529

Originally posted by: zod96
When is the Dell 2209WA due out? I know its only going to be like less than $300 22 inch using an IPS panel. Just can't seem to find anywhere that has them. Also is it going to have a glossy screen?

This monitor has been available for the past week or so from Dell:

http://accessories.us.dell.com...=en&cs=04&sku=320-7825

I am very tempted to get one. The only thing holding me back is the possible upcoming release of additional low-cost eIPS panels at higher resolutions, such as the 1920x1080 panel described here:

http://www.displayblog.com/200...80p-lcd-monitor-panel/

Wow. This is awesome.

Originally posted by: zod96
Is the Dell 2209WA a glossy screen?

Nope, matte.

Here's the million dollar question then, and I hoping you know the answer xtknight. What did they do to make IPS panels cheap all of a sudden? Same angles, same 8-bit color, great response time, etc. It leaves me wondering what the trick was to make this things so much cheaper, and what the downsides may be.

I don't think IPS panels have ever been that expensive. They just seemed that way.

Remember when HP sold the 20.1" LP2065 for $300? Many of them had an IPS panel.

Lower class IPS panels (not grade A) combined with dithering and some uniformity problems probably yield you an eIPS panel.

I doubt the cell structure is any different. Most modern S-IPS panels have a dual-domain alignment of liquid crystals as far as I know. Maybe eIPS is single-domain. I'm not sure.

You can expect the same viewing angle performance and decent response time. Maybe you can expect poor default gamma correction (in the 2209WA's case). eIPS has nothing to do with whether the panel is wide gamut or not, either. These seem like a better choice for a lot of people than TN or PVA. I think better than TN for everyone. But, better than PVA may depend on whether you want high contrast or not.

There have been a lot of versions of IPS.

http://www.ips-alpha.co.jp/en/technology/ips.html

eIPS may be the same as S-TFT along with some improvements in yield? If anything, it's the lowest class IPS available, which still has decent performance but probably lower contrast than other IPS modes like AS-IPS or H-IPS. H-IPS is said to improve contrast ratio to 750:1 from 700:1. This proved true in my testing. So eIPS will be 700:1 or lower, very likely. My guess is 500:1 for most eIPS panels which is not bad at all. It is lower contrast than TN, but the overall performance is so much better it's worth the contrast sacrifice. Photo editing favors good color rendering and viewing angle stability over contrast.

eIPS will use 6-bit drivers. As certain as I am about most or all TNs using 6-bit drivers, the same goes for low-cost eIPS. Hopefully they'll use good FRC+dithering methods so it's not too noticeable. This will be most noticeable in the dark tones simply because our eyes are most sensitive to them. It's going to be harder to see dithering in midtones and hopefully lighter tones.

And if they use less domains you might expect possibly slightly sloppier viewing angles, but better than TN and PVA still probably. I'm speculating. I'm not an LCD developer. I'm just going off of what I've read and the 5% part of the academic papers that I actually understand.

Whether or not to use overdrive is up to the implementer. Response time is very likely the same. Input lag should be low.

Given the history of S-IPS panels from Grade A to lower grades, I'd expect eIPS to have more QC problems than any of the other panel types right now.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Sir Phobos
Hey everyone, new member here. I recently purchased a BenQ E2400HD, and I love it so far. I plan on using it with a PS3 when it arrives in the mail, and I have some questions.

My main concern is input lag, and I read that the BenQ LCDs perform exceptionally well when it comes to that. For my purposes, I'm aiming for 8ms or below with this display. I'm not sure how it works since my PS3 isn't here yet, but I've read that the PS3 doesn't display true 1080p even when the checkbox is marked in the XMB. Now, I understand that input lag comes from a few sources:

1) When the image has to be scaled.

2) From postprocessing on HDTVs.

Since the native resolution of my display is 1920x1080, is there is a way to force the PS3 to output a game in 1080p (maybe uncheck all the boxes except for that?), and would it significantly decrease the input lag as opposed to playing on 720p?

Sorry, no clue about PS3s. Shouldn't it be outputting a geometry of 1080p already, even if the image isn't truly 1080p? (i.e., yes the PS3's 1080p might be 720p upscaled, but the geometric output is 1920x1080 still.)

My second question is about postprocessing. Is there any postprocessing on this (or any) LCD monitor when viewing a device connected to the HDMI input port that could increase input lag?

On the E2400HD? I doubt it, since it's not a TV. Processing is generally connection independent if it occurs. Meaning, it happens on all connections. But, you can probably expect the least amount of processing (whether that be the same or less) on digital connections such as DVI, HDMI, and DisplayPort.

If so, there is a 3rd party VGA cable for the PS3, which might eliminate the postprocessing and decrease input lag. I could also get an HDMI to DVI converter if that would avoid the postprocessing (if it exists) as well.

Cables do not affect input lag. And if you are using this cable as a detour to use an input of lesser lag, I don't think that will work because there is no input with lesser lag than a digital, typically. I mean it's possible that VGA will have less lag since it may be able to be fed directly to the TFT, but as long as VGA is still 'postprocessed' (i.e., perhaps buffered for overdrive or adaptive contrast), I doubt it.

I apologize for the tentative questions, I plan on testing this display thoroughly when I get all the things I need in order to do so. But I would appreciate any responses from anyone who has had some experience with this or a similar LCD display. Thanks!

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: xtknight
eIPS will use 6-bit drivers. As certain as I am about most or all TNs using 6-bit drivers, the same goes for low-cost eIPS. Hopefully they'll use good FRC+dithering methods so it's not too noticeable. This will be most noticeable in the dark tones simply because our eyes are most sensitive to them. It's going to be harder to see dithering in midtones and hopefully lighter tones.

Everything before that was reasonable, and then you mentioned 6-bit color.:| What a waste of the IPS name.:frown:

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: ZetaEpyon
Well, my two Dell 2209WA monitors arrived over lunch.

I only had time to hook them up quickly, so no real testing done yet, but I'm very impressed. The stands are very solid, and my first impression is that the picture quality is stellar.
Not the setup I'll use, but for comparison...

At this point, my main regret is that I didn't order three of them!

I'll post some more impressions and pictures later tonight if I have time.

Wow. Please be sure to give us your thoughts on these miraculous new pieces of equipment!

Originally posted by: cogent
Hi guys!

A few pages back I asked a question about the BenQ G2400WD and brightness. Thanks for answering, since then I have ordered it and it came in the mail today. Hopefully this isn't an idiotic question, but what mode should I put it in? Out of the box it displays what it calls "standard" mode and looks pretty good. Looking through the menus I see there's a "dynamics" mode. I assume that's something with dynamic contrast. Is that the mode that takes advantage of the displays full capabilities?

I'm sure the real answer to this is "do whatever looks better". But I guess my real question is what's the difference between "standard" and "dynamics" modes.

Thanks guys! You're awesome.

The WD model (standing for Wide, Dynamic) features dynamic contrast.

Dynamic contrast adjusts the backlight of the scene depending on what is being shown. It is to save power and give you a lower black level when you need it. The problem is, you can see the backlight rising and falling (like pulsation) and that can be distracting, particularly for general use but also for other things like contrasty movies.

I recommend most people use standard. I rarely, if ever, use dynamic contrast because it messes up the relative contrast of a whole set of frames when the backlight is different during each frame. That means you get a pretty messed up looking stream of pictures, with some having TONS of dark detail when they shouldn't. Face it: our eyes don't have dynamic contrast [well ok, the iris dilates in dark but not THAT much and certainly not that fast], so why should our monitor? That's like turning the lights off during the day and having everything look exactly the same because your eyes compensated for the lack of light within a second. Weird isn't it? And comparing an 8-bit dynamic contrast algorithm to our rods and cones is pretty insulting. Of course the dynamic contrast performed with 8-bit is going to look a lot worse.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: ViRGE

Originally posted by: xtknight
eIPS will use 6-bit drivers. As certain as I am about most or all TNs using 6-bit drivers, the same goes for low-cost eIPS. Hopefully they'll use good FRC+dithering methods so it's not too noticeable. This will be most noticeable in the dark tones simply because our eyes are most sensitive to them. It's going to be harder to see dithering in midtones and hopefully lighter tones.

Everything before that was reasonable, and then you mentioned 6-bit color.:| What a waste of the IPS name.:frown:

HP LP2065 is 6-bit as well, along with the Dell 2007FP and Dell 2007WFP. These LCDs did not look that bad, and nor will eIPS panels. TN are also 6-bit, and eIPS cannot be worse than TN. It's a fundamental misunderstanding of how FRC works that is perpetuating the myth of 6-bit being "clearly inferior". In a double blind test, most people probably couldn't tell if you showed them a set of average pictures on the monitor. On the last 20 (so maybe even 60) tones of the black scale lined up right next to each other, maybe, as our eyes are quite sensitive to these. It would depend on other factors like gamma as well. Sure you can have an 8-bit driver: but oops, even though there are 256 tones, is the distance between each tone the same (L* curve, or whatever we want it to be), and how can you ensure that?

There is a higher likelihood of dithering and FRC having a more reliable tone response curve, even if the color itself looks a little dirty, which is precisely the reason the LCD2690 does not even do without some dithering as is blatantly visible here in a test case:

http://xtknight.50webs.com/lcd26/page4.htm

( At the time I wrote the review, I wasn't quite sure, but this pretty much eased my doubts: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php )

The LCD2690 probably uses the highest form there, which is an 8-bit driver and some dithering to raise the bit depth a little. Then it became more clear. Since DVI is a digital connection, this noise should not be occuring without some form of dithering.

To say dithering is unacceptable is akin to saying that we would rather use a TN than some of the 6-bit VA and IPS monitors out there, and this is pretty asinine in my opinion!

Dithering and FRC can produce quite a reliable image, and I can tell you that it's not the reason I dislike TNs. It's mainly for the viewing angles. Just the way the viewing angles work will kill the resulting bit depth a little. A 6-bit eIPS will look better than a 6-bit TN. You can quote me on this one any day.

Keep in mind, there's a lot of things I don't know either. This is all just speculation until I have one in my hands. You can pretty much infer that since lower S-IPS panels are 6-bit, that eIPS will also be, especially since they are targeting the same low-cost area that TNs are. My point is, dithering is hardly even visible except in large blocks of the exact same color. For every fourth tone, you won't need dithering.

Just for clarification: (2^8)-(2^6) = 2^2=4.

Edit: sorry for editing this post a lot.

The point of dithering is to ensure you're getting something, not to rob you of something. The tone may be noisier, but it may also be more visible than most true 8-bit monitors because most true 8-bit monitors don't have the response curve necessary to make it actually look decent. And when we're talking about a couple pixels of noise, that might even be more reliable for photo editing than an uncalibrated 8-bit LCD since at least it's visible at ALL. And this is irrelevant to panel type.

I'll take some slightly visible dithering grids on darker pages (as I experience now with my L227WT) over a TN panel's viewing angles.

When I said "eIPS will be 6-bit" I was about 90% sure, but I did not get any underground info when I made that post so just keep that in mind. Besides, if this is simply a simple manufacturing or yield breakthough rather than downgrading components then maybe we can expect 8-bit eIPS panels. I just doubt it. At least from manufacturers like Dell and HP. Don't count your chickens, and assume the worst. I don't believe panel type really has any relevance to what DAC is used, but there will definitely be a trend of 6-bitness in eIPS as there was in affordable S-IPS and VA panels.

 

[Sir Phobos]

xtknight: Thanks for the response! I'll post up again if I'm able to do some input lag tests with my display.

 

[dguy6789]

Anyone know a good place to buy a DVI-D cable for my LG LCD? Newegg wants $15 for their cheapest one and $10 shipping for it.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: dguy6789
Anyone know a good place to buy a DVI-D cable for my LG LCD? Newegg wants $15 for their cheapest one and $10 shipping for it.

monoprice.com ?

 

[herbals]

What are the best GAMING screens right now, im looking tobuy a screen very soon.
I posted on this page a few posts up but noanswers yet. Please help

are the Benq E2400HD and the M2400HD essentially the same screen with the M having USB ports and a camera?

I want a fast gaming screen preferably 24' , i still play alot ofolder games too

please some advice, thanks.

 

[GripS]

Originally posted by: herbals
What are the best GAMING screens right now, im looking tobuy a screen very soon.
I posted on this page a few posts up but noanswers yet. Please help

are the Benq E2400HD and the M2400HD essentially the same screen with the M having USB ports and a camera?

I want a fast gaming screen preferably 24' , i still play alot ofolder games too

please some advice, thanks.

See the first page of the thread and scroll down. Recommendations are right there. Looks like the BenQ G2400WD is the one your after.

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Originally posted by: ungco
It would be great to hear your thoughts on the monitor and, if you so please, post up calibration settings. I took the plunge and received it yesterday (only three business days!). I haven't had much experience with IPS screens, save for the Cinema Displays at uni, but the colours seem to be pretty true on this Dell screen, although sharpness was a bit high out of the box. Definitely beats out my laptop's screen.

Originally posted by: xtknight
Wow. Please be sure to give us your thoughts on these miraculous new pieces of equipment!

Sorry about the delay, been a busy couple of days.

I have a few new photos, but I'm not sure how useful they'll be in terms of demonstrating the image quality of the monitors. Getting meaningful photos of monitors in action is notoriously diffucult.

Image samples
Contrast on 4:3 image
Ignoring the slight blurriness due to shaky hands )), you can see there's not really any noticeable backlight bleeding on these LCDs. Definitely a massive upgrade from the old 17" I had been using.

Matte finish, nice viewing angles
As you move more and more off-axis, the image does get a little bit lighter, but there's definitely no serious color shift like you would see in a TN panel. In this particular image, the glare on the center monitor is actually from a window off to the left, not any issue with off-angle viewing. There is also no purple or green tint when viewing off-axis.

Several people had mentioned the "sparkle" in Dell's anti-glare coating. I can see it if I'm looking at a pure white window, but other than that, it doesn't seem noticeable at all. When not pixel-peeping, and actually just doing stuff, I don't notice it at all. Caveat: I do use a pair of Dell monitors at work, which probably have a similar coating, so it may be that I'm already used to it and it doesn't bother me too much because of that.

A (bad) gaming shot
The only game I've really tested so far is Final Fantasy XI, which admittedly is not really the best sample for gaming performance for a whole host of reasons. Still, I don't notice any significant input lag, although if there is any, it would certainly be more noticeable in a shooter, rather than an old MMORPG. I can't really comment on blur or ghosting, FFXI is capped at 30fps due to some lame old PS2 compatibilities, so it would be almost impossible to really make a useful comment based on that.

There were also some questions about dithering. I haven't really noticed it in any cases, even when looking at test patterns. If it does dither, it's really good at it from my perspective.

General settings
At the moment I'm not using an ICC profile, and I adjusted the monitor settings as follows:
[*]Mode: Standard
[*]Brightness: 25
[*]Contrast: 75

I found that even with drastically reduced brightness, looking at it was pretty uncomfortable. I reduced the gamma in the nVidia control panel a bit, and that helped with viewing comfort quite a bit, as well as improving overall contrast a little, I think.

Both copies that I have look identical with the same settings, which is a vast improvement over any other multi-monitor setup that I've used in the past. At work, I have two monitors of the same model, and I cannot get them to look the same, no matter what.

With the settings that I'm using now, I do feel that the image is a little bit too blue, so I may look into adjusting that sometime this weekend.

Overall
Overall, I think these monitors probably would be worth close to $300 each to me. For that price, I think that I would really like to see a little bit higher resolution, perhaps 1920x1080. However, for the $200 price that I got each one for, I feel like I got a real steal, and almost wish that I had ordered a third.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

[you2]

But they currently cost $300

Couple of questions:
How solid are the blacks? One of my 'complaint' with non-ips monitors is that the blacks are pretty weak (esp at night - i.,e, low light in the room) (the hp i tried had solid blacks but lousy backlighting).
How good (even) is the back lighting - esp in the corners which tend to be a weak point ?
How well does the monitor handle 4:3 images (one of the reason I prefer 20inch but can't find anything good right now).

Thanks!

Originally posted by: ZetaEpyon

Originally posted by: ungco
It would be great to hear your thoughts on the monitor and, if you so please, post up calibration settings. I took the plunge and received it yesterday (only three business days!). I haven't had much experience with IPS screens, save for the Cinema Displays at uni, but the colours seem to be pretty true on this Dell screen, although sharpness was a bit high out of the box. Definitely beats out my laptop's screen.

Originally posted by: xtknight
Wow. Please be sure to give us your thoughts on these miraculous new pieces of equipment!

Sorry about the delay, been a busy couple of days.

I have a few new photos, but I'm not sure how useful they'll be in terms of demonstrating the image quality of the monitors. Getting meaningful photos of monitors in action is notoriously diffucult.

Image samples
Contrast on 4:3 image
Ignoring the slight blurriness due to shaky hands )), you can see there's not really any noticeable backlight bleeding on these LCDs. Definitely a massive upgrade from the old 17" I had been using.

Matte finish, nice viewing angles
As you move more and more off-axis, the image does get a little bit lighter, but there's definitely no serious color shift like you would see in a TN panel. In this particular image, the glare on the center monitor is actually from a window off to the left, not any issue with off-angle viewing. There is also no purple or green tint when viewing off-axis.

Several people had mentioned the "sparkle" in Dell's anti-glare coating. I can see it if I'm looking at a pure white window, but other than that, it doesn't seem noticeable at all. When not pixel-peeping, and actually just doing stuff, I don't notice it at all. Caveat: I do use a pair of Dell monitors at work, which probably have a similar coating, so it may be that I'm already used to it and it doesn't bother me too much because of that.

A (bad) gaming shot
The only game I've really tested so far is Final Fantasy XI, which admittedly is not really the best sample for gaming performance for a whole host of reasons. Still, I don't notice any significant input lag, although if there is any, it would certainly be more noticeable in a shooter, rather than an old MMORPG. I can't really comment on blur or ghosting, FFXI is capped at 30fps due to some lame old PS2 compatibilities, so it would be almost impossible to really make a useful comment based on that.

There were also some questions about dithering. I haven't really noticed it in any cases, even when looking at test patterns. If it does dither, it's really good at it from my perspective.

General settings
At the moment I'm not using an ICC profile, and I adjusted the monitor settings as follows:
[*]Mode: Standard
[*]Brightness: 25
[*]Contrast: 75

I found that even with drastically reduced brightness, looking at it was pretty uncomfortable. I reduced the gamma in the nVidia control panel a bit, and that helped with viewing comfort quite a bit, as well as improving overall contrast a little, I think.

Both copies that I have look identical with the same settings, which is a vast improvement over any other multi-monitor setup that I've used in the past. At work, I have two monitors of the same model, and I cannot get them to look the same, no matter what.

With the settings that I'm using now, I do feel that the image is a little bit too blue, so I may look into adjusting that sometime this weekend.

Overall
Overall, I think these monitors probably would be worth close to $300 each to me. For that price, I think that I would really like to see a little bit higher resolution, perhaps 1920x1080. However, for the $200 price that I got each one for, I feel like I got a real steal, and almost wish that I had ordered a third.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Originally posted by: you2
But they currently cost $300

Couple of questions:
How solid are the blacks? One of my 'complaint' with non-ips monitors is that the blacks are pretty weak (esp at night - i.,e, low light in the room) (the hp i tried had solid blacks but lousy backlighting).
How good (even) is the back lighting - esp in the corners which tend to be a weak point ?
How well does the monitor handle 4:3 images (one of the reason I prefer 20inch but can't find anything good right now).

Thanks!

The blacks are pretty good to my eyes. A far cry better than my old monitor, but it's always going to be a matter of perception. I do think there is a little bit of black crush with the settings I have right now, but might be able to reduce that with an ICC profile or better calibration.

The backlight is really even, I have not yet noticed any significant issues with that. It probably would have been most noticeable in the 2nd image that I posted. Since it's a 4:3 video, backlight issues would have been pretty noticeable on the left and right sides.

I think it handles 4:3 just fine, but I'm not really sure what you mean by that. Obviously, it pillar-boxes, but I think you can also set it to stretch the image if you had, say, a game console or something hooked up to it by DVI.

 

[10e]

I just received my Dell 2209WA from Dell Canada, and I couldn't be happier. I'll be posting a link later on this weekend with full stats/calibration/impressions on this thing.

XTKnight, I would be inclined to agree with you about a 6-bit per channel e-IPS panel for cost cutting purposes, but after having used this display for the past 1.5 hours, I can honestly say that I don't see any dithering or FRC artifacts/noise coming from this screen. If there are, they are so hard to see, that they are effectively not there.

This panel reminds me a fair bit of my older Dell 2005FPW with less of that anti-glare sparkle effect, and seemingly less input lag. Also, viewing angles seem to be as good as most IPS screens out there. When I get it in a darker place than my office cubicle, I'll have photos of it with blacks to show if there is any intense off-angle hazing on dark colors.

Cheers.

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Originally posted by: 10e
I just received my Dell 2209WA from Dell Canada, and I couldn't be happier. I'll be posting a link later on this weekend with full stats/calibration/impressions on this thing.

XTKnight, I would be inclined to agree with you about a 6-bit per channel e-IPS panel for cost cutting purposes, but after having used this display for the past 1.5 hours, I can honestly say that I don't see any dithering or FRC artifacts/noise coming from this screen. If there are, they are so hard to see, that they are effectively not there.

This panel reminds me a fair bit of my older Dell 2005FPW with less of that anti-glare sparkle effect, and seemingly less input lag. Also, viewing angles seem to be as good as most IPS screens out there. When I get it in a darker place than my office cubicle, I'll have photos of it with blacks to show if there is any intense off-angle hazing on dark colors.

Cheers.

Sounds like your initial impressions are similar to my own; I'll definitely be looking forward to your more detailed take.