[Retired] The LCD Thread

[Cometer]

My head got in such a mess with this LCD stuff that I ended up making an order then canceling and ordering another panel.
I started by ordering the HP LP2475W. Now I'm ordering the Benq G2400WD.
Lots of websites, lots of opinions and I end up with this conclusion.
The HP LP2475W though displaying accurate colors has its share of problems in games and other applications that don't use a color profile.
It also suffers from a bit of lag that thought it may be a rather small one, I still must really consider that I'm a very avid gamer. And then the final question is. Does the Benq G2400WD provide good enough image quality when compared to what you're used to? And the answer really seams to be that. YES, although it is a TN-PANEL it has a good picture quality. Most of the time the screen is right in front of me. The screenshots and videos show that it is nice for movie watching and even work.
On the other side the HP LP2475W doesn't come calibrated accurately out of box and games may not look that good.
IT seams to me that probably the Benq G2400WD will be more hassle free. And that is what I want.
Good experience out of box.

Now compared to other good gaming panels it seams to me that competition isn't making a good job. For each panel that I read I see problems. The Benq G2400WD seams to be the only panel that overall people say that it is "overall it is a nice panel".

But it really is something that is getting old. There is still no panel that is capable to deliver at affordable prices a complete replace of the now very old CRT screens.

 

[Winterpool]

Indeed. I'm sure someone has mentioned this already, but... welcome to LCD hell. I wish someone were still making Trinitron / Diamondtron CRTs.

I do think, with every TN panel sold, we confirm the industry's presumption that there's no need to make better LCDs. The BenQ G2400WD makes for a partial exception, since it's apparently as good as TN gets. But that's why I'd be very interested to see how well the Dell 2209WA does in the market... If the industry perceives that affordable IPS can gain market share, then maybe things would improve a little. LED-backlighting and 120 Hz is fine and dandy, but panel qualite should come first.

 

[Haruspex]

Seems like the Iiyama ProLite B2206WS is a really good 22 inch TN monitor for gamers. (at least on paper)

http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6

According to digital versus this monitor has zero input lag, really fast response time for a 22 inch TN monitor, and on top of that it has higher contrast ratio even from the T220.

Also even the colors are very good (for a TN panel)

As i said at least on paper this 22 inch TN monitor looks really promising.

I hope later reviews and/or user impressions doesn't disappoint me.

Also i hope this monitor doesn't have different panels like the 226BW from Samsung.

 

[Cometer]

Yeah. The thing is we switched to a new technology because pretty much everyone was tired of the huge CRT's. It was understandable to have lesser quality when the technology was in its infancy. But right now I really don't get it. LCD's are pretty much everywhere and there is little choice for a person to pick a CRT monitor. The adoption rate for LCD's is high so it makes no sense for this technology to remain stagnant. What I really think has happen is that companies realized it was easier to make money with LCD's. For CRT's we had to worry only about two things. Resolution and Refresh rate. Nowadays we need to worry about resolution (is it full hd?), refresh rates (is it 120Hz capable for 3d monitor?), panel type for image quality(is it TN, IPS, S-PVA), response times (any lag?). Now they can mix this stuff up to get some confusion in the market and make lots of stupid price tiers for each of this stuff. The idea is the client will never ever have the best mix options at an affordable price.

Their sucking the market until this roller coaster gets really old and no one searches for any new monitor since it really doesn't make sense to do that.

The only real reason I'm buying this new LCD is that I really don't have a choice.

 

[thestain]

XtKnight,

Are there any 120mHz Big Screens that would work well as PC Monitors?

Anyway to bring back the recommnded big screen list that used to include the westinghouse and sharp Monitor/TV/s??

Anyone come across a larger TV/Monitor in the 42-57 inch class that you could sit 3 feet away from and use as a computer monitor without killing your eyes?

 

[spacemanspliff1]

You want a decent 30" for the best big screen monitor. I would not bother with anything bigger unless you have $2k+ cash for it.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Cometer
So even for a hardcore gamer that plays lots of FPS but also uses the PC for work, movie watching and web the HP LP2475w would be the better choice right?

If I were that gamer, that's what I would choose, at least.

Originally posted by: Winterpool
Cometer, I thought you'd decided TN, specifically the G2400WD, was for you (I was under the impression even minor input lag would be problematic for your gaming). I do realise it's tough to settle on a choice. Even now, a month after ordering my Dell 2209WA, I'm tempted to pull the trigger on an HP LP2475w.

XTKnight, may I ask where you've to sit Finals so soon as April? Or you're one of those early and well-prepared types I envied so much at uni?

Well I have a couple weeks till finals but still kinda stressed about my last exams and all too. A lot to remember.

Originally posted by: goodCat
xtknight, I was hoping to help me out in choosing a 24" display. After tons of reading reviews and comments I ended up with the following 3:
Benq FP241W, HP LP2465 and LG L245WP-BN. There's no doubt that thsese are all great multi-purpose monitors, but I am really puzzeled about which one to choose.
I like the connectivity and positive feedback for the benq, but I am very concerned about the blackout problem that some users expirienced and apparently nobody knows what causes it. Also I heard something about buzzing and overheating.

I don't think these are common problems any more.

The LG uses the same panel, but it lacks de dvi port. In some reviews there seems to be some problems with the gamma curve and some users reported that the colors look washed out.

Yeah, the LG isn't quite as vibrant but it is at least a VA panel.

Finally, the hp - which seems great, but it is an old model with basic connectivity.

Can you please advice me in this regard? I will be using it mostly foe webdesign (photoshop graphics for the web), coding, office use, movies and so on. No games.

thanks in advance!

I would go with the FP241W. It is the most solid model that you list. The HP isn't as good for photo editing due to its gamma curve (see prad review). I am pretty sure the BenQ is better in this regard.

Originally posted by: Cometer
My head got in such a mess with this LCD stuff that I ended up making an order then canceling and ordering another panel.
I started by ordering the HP LP2475W. Now I'm ordering the Benq G2400WD.
Lots of websites, lots of opinions and I end up with this conclusion.
The HP LP2475W though displaying accurate colors has its share of problems in games and other applications that don't use a color profile.
It also suffers from a bit of lag that thought it may be a rather small one, I still must really consider that I'm a very avid gamer. And then the final question is. Does the Benq G2400WD provide good enough image quality when compared to what you're used to? And the answer really seams to be that. YES, although it is a TN-PANEL it has a good picture quality. Most of the time the screen is right in front of me. The screenshots and videos show that it is nice for movie watching and even work.
On the other side the HP LP2475W doesn't come calibrated accurately out of box and games may not look that good.
IT seams to me that probably the Benq G2400WD will be more hassle free. And that is what I want.
Good experience out of box.

Now compared to other good gaming panels it seams to me that competition isn't making a good job. For each panel that I read I see problems. The Benq G2400WD seams to be the only panel that overall people say that it is "overall it is a nice panel".

But it really is something that is getting old. There is still no panel that is capable to deliver at affordable prices a complete replace of the now very old CRT screens.

Well I think you would have a good experience with the HP out of the box unless you were one of the unfortunate ones to get the uniformity problem.

But you do have a point. A lot of the IPS panels come with their idiosyncrasies and sometimes TN panels come in a better overall package.

 

[zod96]

I am getting a little tired of my 22 inch display. I'd like to move up to 24 inch. Looking for a all black 24 inch that is good for games and surfing the internet. I'd like to get a 1920x1080 resolution if possible. Was thinking about the DELL S2409W I can get it for about $250. Are their better ones out their then the DELL? I don't want to spend more than say $350 max.

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: zod96
I am getting a little tired of my 22 inch display. I'd like to move up to 24 inch. Looking for a all black 24 inch that is good for games and surfing the internet. I'd like to get a 1920x1080 resolution if possible. Was thinking about the DELL S2409W I can get it for about $250. Are their better ones out their then the DELL? I don't want to spend more than say $350 max.

I have just ordered Asus VW 246H for my gaming needs and general use,specs are 1920x1080,2ms,16:9(HDMI,DVI,VGA ).
I can live with TN panel since I only seat in one position for my LCD computer usage ie straight on,anyway I'll keep you posted with my feedback once it arrives.

I was lucky that the UK supplier has a pixel check service for a small fee(which I paid for) for my LCD.


As we all know its all subjective which monitor is best ,especially when you compare TN against TN and things like backlight bleed, dead pixels, eveness can vary from monitor to monitor.I'll be using my Spyder monitor calibration to set it up right.

Asus VW 246H Homepage.


Newegg had the Asus for $269.99.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: thestain
XtKnight,

Are there any 120mHz Big Screens that would work well as PC Monitors?

Anyway to bring back the recommnded big screen list that used to include the westinghouse and sharp Monitor/TV/s??

Anyone come across a larger TV/Monitor in the 42-57 inch class that you could sit 3 feet away from and use as a computer monitor without killing your eyes?

Sorry, I do not keep up with the TVs.

But a lot of the 120 Hz LCDs are annoying because you can notice flicker. I'd use them for movies or games only but not general use.

Originally posted by: zod96
I am getting a little tired of my 22 inch display. I'd like to move up to 24 inch. Looking for a all black 24 inch that is good for games and surfing the internet. I'd like to get a 1920x1080 resolution if possible. Was thinking about the DELL S2409W I can get it for about $250. Are their better ones out their then the DELL? I don't want to spend more than say $350 max.

The BenQ E2400HD is a better choice at that point:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16824014181

 

[zod96]

Are their any 24 inch LCD's that are non-TN panels for less than $400?

 

[Winterpool]

Sometimes you might be able to play panel lottery at that size and price and win a VA display (Soyo, for instance). Realistically, however, for a good marque, warranty, support, etc, you need to bump up a hundred dollars. At the $450-550 range, you can get the Dell 2408WFP (S-PVA) and HP LP2475w (H-IPS). The HP is down to $508 at Provantage.

If you believe the rumours, we may see 23 to 24-inch e-IPS panels in your price range soon. I feel somewhat sceptical myself, which is partly why I bought the Dell 2209WA for $212.

 

[zod96]

Yeah the 2209WA seems impossible to get now, its been backordered for a long time at Dell..

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Haruspex
Seems like the Iiyama ProLite B2206WS is a really good 22 inch TN monitor for gamers. (at least on paper)

http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6

According to digital versus this monitor has zero input lag, really fast response time for a 22 inch TN monitor, and on top of that it has higher contrast ratio even from the T220.

Also even the colors are very good (for a TN panel)

As i said at least on paper this 22 inch TN monitor looks really promising.

I hope later reviews and/or user impressions doesn't disappoint me.

Also i hope this monitor doesn't have different panels like the 226BW from Samsung.

Yea unfortunately this monitor isn't available in the US. Otherwise I would add it.

 

[dfedders]

Originally posted by: zod96
Yeah the 2209WA seems impossible to get now, its been backordered for a long time at Dell..

The Dell Outlet has some refurbs on sale for $179. You may be able to find a 10% off coupon somewhere as well. I got one for $161 + tax with free overnight shipping. Should have it on Monday.

 

[zod96]

That is the exact deal I just got as well dfedders $161 + tax and free overnight shipping. I should have mine tuesday. I will compare it to the other dell I just bought the s2409w. I'll look at the 2 side by side and pick which one I keep and which one goes back. I hope the ones from the dell outlet carry the same warranty as new ones. I mean if it has any dead or stuck pixels I'd like to return it for another one until I got one with zero...

 

[zod96]

I got my friend to buy one as well He found the 10% off coupon too. When I first looked at the dell outlet site they had llike 34 2209WA in stock that was about 2 hours ago, not its like 12 in stock they went fast..

 

[pspLite]

I am looking for a monitor (~$500) specifically for pc gaming. Can we talk about what are good options? I have looked into a lot of monitors, but I could not find a clear winner. And it doesn't help that all public reviews talk about video quality, whereas I want something optimized for gaming. I was originally looking at 24" monitors (ideally, that is what I want), but from what I read it seems that smaller monitors make games look better as the playable resolution is native to the monitor. What do you guys suggest? This is for a brand new core i7 rig (~$2k).

I was looking at:
Dell G2410 <- This is my top contender at the moment
Dell UltraSharp 2408WFP <- Long time favorite until I read about red tint/input lag issues
Acer G24 <- Very fast, until I read about poor darks/light bleeding from edges
Gateway FHD2400 <- good reviews
Samsung 2493HM <- good reviews

Thanks

 

[PurdueRy]

xtnight...I debating replacing my L227WTG. I like the monitor...its definitely higher quality than some other 22" monitors I've seen. However, I've recently discovered that I'm fairly color concious. I'm looking for a PVA or IPS 22-24" monitor. Right now top running would probably be between the Dell 2209WA or the NEC P221. I don't like that the Dell doesn't have 1:1 scaling. Either monitor I'd be calibrating with CEDpro and spyder2. Have any advice?

 

[spacemanspliff1]

That NEC is pricey. Well, most of the good nec monitors are. Enzio is releasing a new 22 and 24" you might like.

http://www.flatpanelshd.com/ne...showfull&id=1240227647

I am trying an Asus VK266H even though it is a TN. 26" decent speed and color for a multipurpose 360/pc/tv monitor for $335 shipped was too good to pass up. Even though it is 16:10.

 

[Saiyajin]

Good stuff about Dell 2408wfp and HP LP2475w on the previously pages. I am then consider the HP but got a question about the actual dimensions.
I just have a bit tight space around the desktop where I am planning to place it.
Right specifically I?ve got a shelf above which only make a maximum 18.50 inch (47cm) available in height.
According to the specs I could lower the stand a bit and make it fit.
I?ve got too around 23.6 inch (60cm) in length, don?t think it will be problematic.
Not because I don?t trust the specs but they could be larger in real lift.
I would like to ask owners if this monitor will fit my small room without any trouble?
Thank you

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: pspLite
I am looking for a monitor (~$500) specifically for pc gaming. Can we talk about what are good options? I have looked into a lot of monitors, but I could not find a clear winner. And it doesn't help that all public reviews talk about video quality, whereas I want something optimized for gaming. I was originally looking at 24" monitors (ideally, that is what I want), but from what I read it seems that smaller monitors make games look better as the playable resolution is native to the monitor. What do you guys suggest? This is for a brand new core i7 rig (~$2k).

I was looking at:
Dell G2410 <- This is my top contender at the moment
Dell UltraSharp 2408WFP <- Long time favorite until I read about red tint/input lag issues
Acer G24 <- Very fast, until I read about poor darks/light bleeding from edges
Gateway FHD2400 <- good reviews
Samsung 2493HM <- good reviews

Thanks

Have you looked at the BenQ G2400WD? This is probably the best monitor for your purposes. Let me know what you think.

Originally posted by: PurdueRy
xtnight...I debating replacing my L227WTG. I like the monitor...its definitely higher quality than some other 22" monitors I've seen. However, I've recently discovered that I'm fairly color concious. I'm looking for a PVA or IPS 22-24" monitor. Right now top running would probably be between the Dell 2209WA or the NEC P221. I don't like that the Dell doesn't have 1:1 scaling. Either monitor I'd be calibrating with CEDpro and spyder2. Have any advice?

The Dell 2209WA, Lenovo L220X, and Eizo S2231W are decent options. I don't know much about the NEC P221, actually. Any of these PVA/IPS screens should be quite high quality and calibratable to good color performance.

 

[Mem]

I just setup my Asus VW246 24" TN monitor(16:9 with native 1920X1080),WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ..is the first word when I saw how good the screen is,there's no dead pixels lovely colours and very nice blacks only problem was brightness was too high and contrast too,so quick lowering of these settings made it a lot better.


My old monitor was a Belinea 102035w P-MVA 20" WS LCD so the Asus was up against some tough competition especially being a TN panel,however I can say TN panels have improved if this is todays standard.

Monitor package came with audio cable,VGA and DVI cable plus paper manual , both 2 and 3 pin power leads,no drivers since its plug and play monitor , no HDMI cable was included(it does have HDMI input).


I still have to set it up with my Spyder calibration device later ,however I want to warm it up for a few hours first but initial impressions are I'm keeping this for sure,even viewing angles are decent if you sit more or less in same position like I do at my computer desk.

I'm using Vista x64 with Gigabyte 4870 card@1920x1080 res.

Anyway I'll update later with more info and feedback .

I decided to go with warm setting for calibration,anyway Spyder2 did a very nice job and makes any LCD a lot easier to get the colours more balanced and right,the brightness I had to reduce to 35 from the default setting(100 is max) contrast I reduced to 72.The Asus offers a lot of settings even 5 different video enanched settings at a touch of a button ,more info on them here , I went with the standard setting in the end,I can see scenery mode being a favourite for some being it brings out the colours so you get rich colours.

There are options for brightness,contrast,sharpness,focus, sRGB ,saturation ,ASCR ,also colour temps like cool,normal,warm,sRGB and user mode plus skin tone mode too.. however some are not available in DVI or standard setting mode.

I used Eizo test program to get the brightness and contrast roughly right then went with Spyder2 calibration after.

Blacks were not quite up to my Belinea P-MVA panel but then I was not expecting it to be ,however it should be decent enough for most users and was good overall IMHO,colours went from wishy washy to very rich depending how you set the LCD up so for a TN panel it was very good once you adjusted the colours,brightness etc..I have yet to have a LCD where no adjustments were not made.


No lag was seen in two games I tested it with UT2004,Fallout 3.
Backlight bleed was very good only minimal along the top edge centre part ,we are talking a few millimetres thick (very faint only seen on black background and never seen in normal use).Colour and brightness across the panel seemed very good to me, no one spot seems a lot darker or different(bearing the fact you have to take the TN viewing angle limitation into the equation) maybe I got one of the better panels we all know its lottery even for IPS,MVA panels etc when it comes to backlight bleed.

No dead pixels but I was not expecting any since I paid for a pixel check for a small fee.Onscreen menu took good 5 minutes to get use too,however once you know how to navigate was not a problem,the manual does not explain this very well so its more of a trial and error in finding the right buttons you need in the learning navigation stage.

Overal I'm impressed and you do get a lot for your money,would I buy another TN panel down the road?...yep you bet if they keep improving and I'm lucky enough to get one with minimal backlight bleed like this one .No banding was seen in normal use .
I might play around with the user settings over the weekend and more game testing.


Good Points:

Very fast response time(Great for gaming)
Nice colours
Decent blacks
Good tweaking options
VGI,DVI,Audio cable supplied.
Minimal backlight bleed and no dead pixels(at least on mine).
Panel can pivot.


Bad points:

Typical TN viewing angles
No height adjustment
Needs some calibration for best image and colour quality(most LCDs do however).
No HDMI cable supplied.
No optional INF monitor driver(I might be nit picking here).

 

[RickJ5]

I've been reading this thread for a few weeks now trying to decide which monitor to buy since my current monitor is starting to get darker. I just wanted to say thanks. This thread was really helpful in making my decision. I finally decided to go with a Dell 2408WFP. I guess my decision process was as follows. I was originally going to go with the BenQ G2400WD. But, I spend a lot of time on my computer and I wanted a little better monitor. I figure I'll be living with it for probably 5 - 10 years so I was willing to spend a little more. I was also considering the HP LP2475w. If money wasn't an issue at all I might have gone for one of the top of the line NEC IPS monitors, but I just wasn't willing to spend over $1000 on a monitor. A few things put me off on the HP. One was the reports of color uniformity issues. Another was that it didn't have a VGA port. I know it does come with a cable to adapt one of the DVI ports to VGA. But, I considered having a VGA port to be a plus. The last thing was I checked with CDW which I'm within driving distance of about my return options if I didn't like it. My return options were limited. A cash return wasn't an option. I was a little concerned about the input lag on the Dell, but I'm not a heavy gamer and I don't play FPS games at all. I did also notice that the Dell and the HP have the same input lag listed on the second post. The Dell has a premium panel guarantee, which covers bright pixels. I suspect that doesn't include dead pixels, but maybe I could negotiate that with Dell. I also figured I was pretty much guaranteed an A01 revision on the Dell. Pretty much every review of the Dell was positive. I also managed a super deal on the Dell. I had been looking at it and it was $130 off which got it down to $519. Last night when I went to order it the discount had gone up to $150. I also found a 10% off coupon that worked on it and they were offering free shipping. So, I got the Dell for $477 and some change after taxes. I'm supposed to get the Dell on Friday. Hopefully it will be as good as everyone says it is. Maybe my analysis will help someone else decide on a monitor. But, mostly I registered to say thanks for all the help in deciding.

 

[ryedizzel]

i still love this thread! ;P