Originally posted by: dreydin
ive taken a small break from my 2 month LCD buying/returning spree... but right now, im looking at resuming the hunt with either the 245BW, w2207 or the VX2255wmb. before i do though, do any of these have panel lotteries? i heard from redlinez33's brief review, that the w2207 reveals the panel identity on the outside of the box (ty for your recent reviews, btw) is this true? just look for the REV? and the good one begins with S, the bad, A?
Originally posted by: newschool
I was always putting away the wide LCDs because the resolution is too high to play games with a high FPS. But for the 19", the wide 1440x900 (1.296MP) is actually comparable with the non-wide 19" 1280x1024 (1.31MP).
I originally was going for the non-wide 19" LGs, they are great and look good. But now that I want a wide one for film viewing, pixel pitch and general look, LG wasnt delivering (check xbits labs).
Samsung was my other option but they are having problem with panels, your never sure wich one you get, it is a known issue.
But now LG has just released the L197WH, I will be the first to buy. 2msGTG, 16.7M colors, 5000:1 contrast (F-Engine) and HDMI.
xtknight you should check it out and add it to the recommanded gaming and multimedia monitors.
http://www.lge.com/products/model/detail/l197wh.jhtml
peace all good 2008 year
Originally posted by: DoctorM
Many monitors support scaling (internally). Read the reviews on prad.de to see how well a particular one does, but you should be able to play at lower than native resolution pretty well.
And you all correct me if I'm wrong, but even without scaling on a panel you should be able to run at multiples of the native resolution with minimal loss of quality (i.e. a 24" 1920x1200 panel should work without an internal scalar under 1440x900, 1280x800, 1120x700, 960x600, or whatever your videocard supports.)
Finally, contrary to the "loss of detail" argument against scaling, some tweaking sites call it free antialiasing (it's done in your monitor's hardware not on your videocard).
Originally posted by: Trean
doesn't wm simply mean widescreen monitor?
Originally posted by: jns
Hi.
I'm looking for a new monitor, and my major concern are photoediting in PS3.
(priceworthy, non-proffesional and not too expensive
"xtknight", when I red your recommendations in the beginning of this thread I couldn't find my first choice monitor - NEC LCD2070NX - and then I red at "X-bit Labs" that it was reputed(!?)
I've understood that it's an old monitor but is it really not a good one???
I would really like to hear your words about it, or anyone elses for that matter!
I'm also interested in the HP LP2065 but I've heard about the 'lottery' with the panels... whether its S-IPS or MVA... - any news/experiences/oppinions about that???
all answers are appreciated, thank you!
/jns
Originally posted by: yacoub
Well except that my 2007WFP does not have noticeable input lag where as my friends' 2405 and 2407 had enough input lag that it bothered me and I would hate to use them in FPS gaming. (I could even sense it in Windows moving the cursor around the screen.)
So that's why I'm looking for S-IPS.
What's going on in the industry then if S-IPS is hard to find even though it's superior? Is there another new standard that's going to come out that's better than -VA panels that will offer low input lag, fast refresh rate, and the same excellent color accuracy and viewing angle of my S-IPS?
ok, just read up on the w2207 and i think im gonna give it a shot, but im starting to notice that the 22 department is vastly inferior to the 24/20s who are above and below it.. can you suggest a few LCDs in the 20s and 24s for casual gaming and internet browsing? specifically speaking, ones of high quality!Originally posted by: xtknight
Originally posted by: dreydin
ive taken a small break from my 2 month LCD buying/returning spree... but right now, im looking at resuming the hunt with either the 245BW, w2207 or the VX2255wmb. before i do though, do any of these have panel lotteries? i heard from redlinez33's brief review, that the w2207 reveals the panel identity on the outside of the box (ty for your recent reviews, btw) is this true? just look for the REV? and the good one begins with S, the bad, A?
I'm not sure exactly, but there's more info here:
http://www.hardforum.com/showt....php?t=1179531&page=34
But many people are fine with the LPL/Innolux panels.
Originally posted by: xtknight
Originally posted by: Trean
doesn't wm simply mean widescreen monitor?
Widescreen and multimedia, I thought.
Originally posted by: Jephph
Hi. I've been looking at some monitors trying to find a really nice one for my wife. She does retouching at a photo studio. I noticed in your "Photo" section, you list first a monitor with 72% (or somewhere around there) color gamut.
Wouldn't the NEC MultiSync LCD2180WG-LED with over 100% color gamut be a better choice for the number 1 spot? I know it's pretty pricey... Is that why it's not on the list, or is there a different reason? Thanks.
Originally posted by: DoctorM
I apologize ahead of time for my lack of knowledge, I can only tell you what I see.
I received my Viewsonic vx2435wm today. For those keeping track I ordered it Sunday evening from TechOnWeb and received it this today (Friday) even with New Years in between.
My only complaint with them was that it was shipped in the original box. Which means not even a piece of tape to hold the lid closed.
If someone wanted to steal the cables off the top of the box in transit, they were fair game.
The monitor:
You know 24" looks so much smaller at the store.
I looked long and hard, and I can't find one bad pixel on this immense piece of real estate. That's a relief.
Cables: Power, 1/8" stereo audio cable, VGA-VGA and a DVI-HDMI.
Make sure you have the install disk since there doesn't seem to be drivers for this panel in Viewsonic's driver bundles online.
I started out on the default settings and soon felt like I was sitting in a spotlight. I used some of the OptiColor profiles and found the last few seemed the nicest.
One review I read said that after calibrating the monitor they found the Game Mode to be almost the same as what they tweaked up themselves. I believe this was a mistake.
Although you can only adjust things like Brightness and Contrast with Opticolor on standard, the other Opticolor modes are extrapolated from that.
Meaning I turned my Brightness from 100 to 50% and all the OptiColor modes are softer, not just Standard.
It also means that if you don't like how bright a preferred mode is you have to switch back to Standard, adjust, and then set it back to the profile you want.
I will admit to a mild color blindness, and have no equipment to adjust the colors.
Still I found the colors to be very nice. The Vivid setting, while probably inaccurate is very pleasing.
The Portrait and Scenery settings are probably more accurate, but the colors seem a bit duller. For now I have it set to Scenery (and 30% brightness).
Backlight Bleeding: Um... I just don't see it. About a year ago I returned 3 NEC panels 90gx2 (I think) and an LG. The bleeding made me crazy.
If this panel has any I just can't tell. The panels seems nicely uniform.
Viewing angles are so much better than the TN's I had been looking at and I can't believe I was considering them.
Gaming: My system is a bit old. An Athlon 3200+ (32-bit) and a x850 XT PE video card.
Still I cranked up Half-Life 2 and Tomb Raider Anniversary to their full graphic settings at 1920x1200 and was in heaven.
There is some mild ghosting which frankly looks almost like motion blur... which more modern games are trying desperately to add anyway. It was not intrusive or annoying to me in the least.
One review complained of a noisy backlight. If I put my ear near the back I can hear it, but soon as I move a foot or two off my system fans (set on low speed) are louder so it's pointless to even discuss it.
My only complaint is that it's huge, and conspicuously indulgent.
I don't know what else to say. Any questions?+
Edit: I forgot to mention that it's a concern to some that there is no ability to raise/lower this display. The level it's at is fine for me, and it's so large that angling it up or down seems to adjust for most heights relatively well.
Edit2: I'm sure it's common for LCDs but I am surprised that when scrolling white text on black that there is odd grey flicker to the text. I'm sure this is the same effect that causes ghosting in games, but I wasn't expecting it.
I guess I'll get use to it.
Originally posted by: DoctorM
I'm not sure what you see about the vx2435wm that makes the 'speakers extend its profile'. You can hardly see the things.
As far as the piano black... it's a matter of taste, but almost all Viewsonic panels are going that way.
Originally posted by: C Zoui
Thank you for your efforts, xtknight. This is the best LCD resource I have encountered on the internet.
I'm trying to find a suitable monitor for my multimedia needs, including photo processing, gaming, HD movie viewing, and spreadsheet use. My ideal specs are:
24" (given my viewing environment, the ideal size for movies in particular), PVA/MVA/IPS (for better color reproduction and viewing angles), HDCP (for the HD-DVD/BD drive that will eventually be purchased, and possibly HD cable tv content), 1:1 (for 1080p with black bars and games at less than 1920x1200 with black bars instead 4:3 or fill scaling), medium image delay or lower, and under $600 AR.
Unfortunately, my options appear to be quite limited, if not non-existent.
With the exception of the high image lag, the 24": ViewSonic VX2435WM, 1920x1200 (16:10) fits the above criteria. This is one rare instance, however, when I feel compelled to veto a unit based on aesthetics alone. I find it hideously ugly; the built-in speakers extend its profile unnecessarily, but worse still is the 'high-gloss, piano-black' finish, a reflective eyesore that screams faux-elegance. I know beggars can't be choosers, and there appears to be few reliably-reviewed monitors that meet my criteria, but I just can't bring myself to do it.
I could probably settle for the marginally high (40ms) image delay of the 24": HP LP2465, 1920x1200 (16:10), but it lacks HDCP.
Having exhausted all the 24" choices in the recommended multimedia section of this thread that fit my criteria, perhaps you are thinking, "What about the 24": Dell UltraSharp 2407WFP-HC, 1920x1200 (16:10)? It's only 69 dollars more than your max budget, and it performs reasonably well with movies." It doesn't, however, appear up to snuff for gaming.
The better question for me to ask appears to be what new monitors are coming that will fight my criteria, and when are they coming?
Finally, I'd like to inquire about the DoubleSight DS-245W. It appears to meet all of my requirements except the image lag that I cannot determine.
Edit: I forgot to mention, the 19": LG Flatron L1970HR, 1280x1024 (5:4) link to Circuit City is no longer valid. The 19": LG Flatron L1960TR, 1280x1024 (5:4), meanwhile, has gone down in price from 270 to 230 dollars at CompUSA.
Originally posted by: has33
So here it goes...I m 4m Bombay, India & we are the deprived few, as we hardly ve much choices when it come to PC parts.
Originally posted by: Trean
Besides the widescreengamingforum I could not find a source that stood by their TN stance on the monitor. Apparently when the monitor was released they announced a 5ms response time or something like that and did not note whether it was BWB or GTG. Which lead to a few places assuming that it must be a TN panel and the viewing angles in the spec were just wrong.
Since then the response time has been clarified(now listed at 8ms) and all the reviews I have read have sworn by the great viewing angles; thus in my mind it can't be a TN panel. As for what panel is in the thing; the only consensus is that it is a VA panel. I don't have a reputable source as to what type. xtknight states its a S-MVA where the hardforum states its a P-MVA and a few other sites just list MVA without the prefix letter... so I guess its an MVA I don't know what the prefix letter even means.
Edit: Oh and reasoning on why WSGF.com has TN listed... well the only ones that can update it are admins or something otherwise it has to be suggested on the forums and that means someone has to buy it and be a participant on the forum... and who would buy a TN panel (going off their site) and then go to viewsonic and see 8ms response time!
Originally posted by: AtmosFear
Hey I was wondering if anyone could help me.. I've been using a Sony Trinitron Multiscan G400 (19" CRT display) for the past 8 or so years and it's been great, although within the past year or so, it's started to die slowly and needs to be replaced.
Now that LCD's have become the standard, I've been trying to find a replacement for my CRT, but I was having a really difficult time deciding between all the different vendors and models. I'm glad I finally happened upon this thread, since I really had no idea where to even start. Anyway, I need a monitor mainly for computer programming, with a little bit of photoshop work (if I need to quickly create a logo or button for a website), no gaming whatsoever (well, maybe MAME, but that's rare) and I'd like to be able to watch movies, although it's not a huge deal, just a nice to have. So my main focus is on viewing code, text and documents. I'd like a larger monitor than what I have now, so I've been looking at 22 and 24 inch screens, but I think bigger is better (unless there's a reason that I should choose 22 over 24)
I was looking at the following from the recommendation guide:
24": Dell UltraSharp 2407WFP-HC, 1920x1200 (16:10)
it's within my budget (around $600) which is good, but the note regarding ghosting worried me a little bit. I guess I probably wouldn't be affected since I won't be using this for games, but I was just wondering if maybe Dell has come out with a revision since this guide was put together, or if there might be a better monitor for programming work. Also wanted to know if a 24 inch monitor is too large for computer programming work, or if it'll cause eye strain since the native resolution is pretty high (I take it that it's best to leave an LCD at its native resolution - I'm used to running my CRT at whatever resolution provides the best display of text without killing my eyes. I think at work I run a 21 inch Trinitron CRT at 1600x1200 without an issue)
Dell also has the following 24" monitor which is $369 (verus $599 for the UltraSharp 2407WFP) and as far as I can tell, the main difference is the fact that the 2407WFP has a 6 in 1 card reader and more inputs (RGB, S-Video, composite video, component video)
Dell E248WFP 24'' Widescreen LCD Monitor
I've also heard some good things about Samsung monitors, but I'm not really sure which ones I should be considering.. I know to stay away from the 226BW, but is the 245BW 24" good?
So if anyone can give me some advice or suggestions, I'd really appreciate it, since I'm really quite lost at the moment. Thanks!
Originally posted by: Amart
I am looking for a monitor for gaming and design work (student level, color accuracy is desired but not critical).
Size: 19" 4:3 or, more likely 20" Widescreen 1600x1050, with the ~0.25 dot pitch. Not willing to go higher due to GPU (8800 GTS 320mb), and sitting distance.
Budget: $200-400 (I am on a budget, but can shift resources if the sacrifice is worth it)
The only store I can buy from is FRYS.com, because they are the only ones that have 100% 30 Day Return guarantee, so I can get a replacement, different model or refund in case I'm not satisfied (according to their sales over the phone, and what's listed in their return policy online).
All the local B&M chains require 15% restocking fee for any open box LCD, and some claim to be Final Sale only. I haven't tried smaller stores yet.
Most other online stores have shameless dead pixel return policy, 7 or more, and don't recognize other issues like image tearing.
I've talked xtknight and he suggested the HP w2007.
I went to see it at J&R (NYC) - took some time to calibrate since someone messed up its settings, but once I reset and tweaked it the image quality was great. The glossy screen was a problem for me, however, as darker images (common in games) resulted in too much of a reflection. I am used to some reflection from CRT, but this was higher.
The exterior design was also an annoyance - its one high-gloss box inside another, with ~1/4" space in between, perfect for collecting dust and being hard to clean.
The Samsung 206BW they had a much better exterior design, but apparently a bad roll in the panel lottery - tearing and color bleeding / jitter / flickering was highly visible on both static and moving images. The colors were acceptable for me on both, as I could calibrate it much like the HP.
Back home I went through the review links and the best so far was XBITLABS.com - xtknight please check out his format, especially things like RTC / Non-RTC specification and RTC-Error percentages.
Conclusion: I'm basically screwed.
Fry's has:
- LG 1960TR, but then I'll have to give up on design (its triangulblargh stand looks disgusting), and my minor preference for 20" W over its 19" 4:3.
- Samsung 206BW - I can live with the lottery and having to calibrate default color settings EXCEPT Image Tearing. If it shows the same tearing I saw at J&R it's going to be returned. It's RTC has some errors 15% average with 50% max, but can be turned off (making it just like a nonRTC 5ms B2B monitor)
- HP w2007 - big issue with glossy screen, no RTC option so some response lag, and minor gripes with exterior design
- LG 206WTQ-BF - according to XBitLabs the bigger 226WTQ has sub par color setup, worse then Samsung, and I have no other reliable in-depth reviews to go by so far. I also remember high RTC errors being mentioned, which is unacceptable, and likely affecting the 20" panel too. The new firmware supposedly reduced the RTC errors, but no new review to indicate to what extent. People report it's not noticeable, so I guess it's good. I can't be sure about color accuracy being good or bad - HP's w2007 is better then w2207, so perhaps the same situation applies here.
_____________
From reading XBitLabs reviews, there's also the ASUS MW201u that has good color accuracy for a TN panel, decent RTC setup, and slick design.
If Fry's had it I would have ordered it without a second thought. Except it's not sold by them or any other merchant I know. I'm trying to find it right now =(
I'll probably go with the LG 206WTQ from Fry's and get a calibration tool to ensure the accuracy is good.
I can also roll the dice with a Samsung and hope for one of the better panels ... or Fry's being honest about their 30 day guarantee.
The 2007 20" LCD monitor market and return policies are making me sad. >_>