[Retired] The LCD Thread

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Raptor051
Thx for the response, it seems that 1st post was in the right place? sorry about 2nd post

So if I understand right, if some old program/ game have fixed or lower resolution, I will be able to make picture in a black box (bars) with actually ?acceptable? quality of the picture ? not distorted only smaller (like a wide screen movie on classic 4:3 television ) within the monitor (option in the LCD menu not in graphic card software)?

1 step closer to 20WGX2

Any advice to really good non wide monitor within +/- 20% range price ? size is not important 17?, 19?, 20??

Thx again

No, the LCD20WGX2 does not have scaling options in the OSD. The only thing that will happen is a "fill" but I believe this has aspect ratio correction, anyway.

If you have an NVIDIA card then you will have options of 1:1, etc but please read the short section in the OP because this really does get asked a lot.

The HP LP2065 (20.1" S-IPS/AMVA) is a nice 4:3 option, and the Acer AL2051W is a glossy 20.1" P-MVA. The ViewSonic VP2030b is also a good choice. I don't recommend the LP2065 because I hate panel lotteries but Bob Howell in here just ended up with an S-IPS. I'm on the edge of recommending/not recommending it because of the lottery but I don't know how the AMVA panel in the LP2065 compares to the VP2030b's P-MVA.

Edit: actually there is stretching in all of the modes except Centered and Aspect Ratio. So the monitor stretches and the video card stretches in Fill mode.

 

[xtknight]

Web design is now in sRGB recommendations. Apparently the standard for web is "sRGB" (which is not exactly = 2.2 gamma BTW). Rather a gray area since "web" targets a huge audience, and most people don't calibrate their displays anyway. But, that's no excuse to make the situation worse.

Originally posted by: Crash0
The Planar's been tested to have less than 1 frame of lag http://www.hardforum.com/showt...1259394#post1031259394

Nice. The OP has been updated with the information. The Planar has also raised in ranks to right below the 3007WFP, mainly because it's smaller. It's above the 305T since it's an S-IPS with less lag. The 3007WFP and Planar are neck-and-neck but the 3007WFP is a better deal for the price.

 

[goldpete]

Just a FYI:

Best Buy is selling the LG L226WTQ for 309.99 through Saturday August 11, 2007.

Didn't see any rebate requirements either.

Definitely going to get one this Friday. Glad I waited.

 

[fillalph]

I read that quite a few people were getting S-IPS panels in the Dell 2007wfp lately. I am going to through the dice and see if I get the panel. If not, back to the drawing board

 

[Skott]

Originally posted by: goldpete
Just a FYI:

Best Buy is selling the LG L226WTQ for 309.99 through Saturday August 11, 2007.

Didn't see any rebate requirements either.

Definitely going to get one this Friday. Glad I waited.

$40 bucks cheaper than Circuit City was selling them for a week ago. Not a bad price.

Edit: No ghosting in CoD2 with my L226WTQ(BF). Just picked up FEAR and STALKER today. I'll report back in a few days how they look on my L226.

Edit2: No ghosting in FEAR. I'm on Interval (episode?) 4 and the graphics is just blowing my mind! I ran the FEAR test twice and lowest min fps is 55fps and everything set to highest settings. This LCD with a stock 8800GTS 640 rocks! :thumbsup:

 

[frythecpuofbender]

Hi there, been reading all 40 pages of this great thread and now it's my turn to shell out the bucks on a new LCD, 22''

I'm really interested in the L226 variants and the HPs...dunno which one


It seems there is a new L226W variant? Or is this just for Germany /Europe?

22" LG Electronics L226WA 1680x1050 HDMI/ana/dig
http://www.kmelektronik.de/mai...ail&ArtNr=15109&Shop=0
or
22" LG Electronics L226WTQ 1680x1050 ana/dig
or
22" HP Pavilion W2207 1680x1050 ana/dig/aud
or full HD:
24" HP Pavilion W2408 1920x1200 ana/dig/aud

Or should I wait for the L227?

I'm doing compositing, 3d modeling and gaming a lot so I know I would be better served with a real high quality monitor, but I just can't bring myself to spend 600+ Euros for a monitor.

 

[Skott]

If you want an LG 22" your best bet is either a WT or WTQ version. I was just looking at a ghosting problem someone was showing on their WA model so I'd avoid that particular LG model.

 

[imported_Cicero]

Originally posted by: xtknight
I think you'd like the Dell 2407WFP-HC best. I haven't seen enough data on the 275T to recommend it (no input lag measurements), although it would probably also be fine. If you're doing imaging work you'll most likely like the smaller dot pitch of the 2407WFP-HC.

I ended up buying a 275T, I've only had it less than 24 hours so I'm still getting a fix on what it's like. My early impressions are positive, the wide gamut color is fine with very good rich colors. It's an excellent monitor for watching movies. I had a look at the first hour of the HD version of 'The Searchers' and it looked superb.

The dot pitch of .303 isn't an issue for me as the viewing distance is never closer than 80cm (2 feet 8 inches), the dot pitch is only an issue if you eyeball the LCD from very close up. For my eyesight (I wear glasses with graduated lenses) I prefer this monitor at 1920 x 1200 to a 24" LCD at the same resolution.

As a gaming monitor I have not tried it as I'm not a gamer. Some other comments in passing, the monitor is bit of a plain jane looking thing (not trendy like the new Dells). The menu system is like that used on the 215TW. I haven't tried the other inputs yet (component, s-video etc) nor the USB connections. No problems with blacklight bleeding nor dead pixels either. One negative is the position of the DVI input, it is right behind the leg of the stand so it is a bit fiddly to connect.

 

[pelleanka]

Has anyone seen or heard of the LG L226WTG (yes, g not q)?

Pretty much all the google results seem to be swedish/scandinavian stores, I can't even find it on LG's own site.

So of course I had to order one. As far as I can tell it's a normal WTQ but with a glossy coating, which is just what I was looking for (the HP is ugly). Unfortunately I'm in the process of moving and had the screen delivered to my future residence, so I won't be able to try it out until tuesday at the earliest even though it was delivered yesterday. Oh the suspense!

Will be interesting to see how it compares to the WTQ..

 

[Heinrich]

I swear Vista's driving me nuts. I am trying Ecksor's 2407 Profile. I bring up color management, when i try to open the file from the desktop it says "access denied." When I double click on it, the screen flashes and it seems to work. If I right click, there is an "install profile" option that works, then Color Management does say Dell2407WFP-HC (default) with the file name. Is that the one on my desktop? Where should I move it? And what is that "use my settings for this device" box doing!? I have Vista 64

 

[frythecpuofbender]

I just ordered a L226WA which is 30 Euros more than the L226WQT and seems to be newer. It has AV ports and HDMI, I really hope it's the same quality. I could still change the order to the L226WQT. Any other opinions on the WA? Any reviews? I really hope this model doesn't have some unfixable ghosting issues?

 

[BernardP]

Originally posted by: frythecpuofbender
I just ordered a L226WA which is 30 Euros more than the L226WQT and seems to be newer. It has AV ports and HDMI, I really hope it's the same quality. I could still change the order to the L226WQT. Any other opinions on the WA? Any reviews? I really hope this model doesn't have some unfixable ghosting issues?

The WA has been available here in Canada for many months. It is an excellent choice. It is identical to the WTQ, with the 2ms response time and presumably the true LG-Philips panel, but you also get AV ports and HDMI. I have seen it in action at Futureshop, playing DVD's and the picture was great, with no visible twinkling.

Here are some reviews of the L226WA on the Futureshop web site Click on Customer Reviews

No reason at all to change your mind for a WTQ. :thumbsup:

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: frythecpuofbender
Hi there, been reading all 40 pages of this great thread and now it's my turn to shell out the bucks on a new LCD, 22''

I'm really interested in the L226 variants and the HPs...dunno which one


It seems there is a new L226W variant? Or is this just for Germany /Europe?

The L226WA is also available in Canada. It adds some multimedia features.

22" LG Electronics L226WA 1680x1050 HDMI/ana/dig
http://www.kmelektronik.de/mai...ail&ArtNr=15109&Shop=0
or
22" LG Electronics L226WTQ 1680x1050 ana/dig
or
22" HP Pavilion W2207 1680x1050 ana/dig/aud
or full HD:
24" HP Pavilion W2408 1920x1200 ana/dig/aud

Or should I wait for the L227?

I'm doing compositing, 3d modeling and gaming a lot so I know I would be better served with a real high quality monitor, but I just can't bring myself to spend 600+ Euros for a monitor.

A higher gamut won't affect gaming or modeling as much as movies or proofing, but you can wait for the L227 if you think it's worth it. You should only get it right when it comes out if you're ambitious. Always expect problems with LCDs when they first come out.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: pelleanka
Has anyone seen or heard of the LG L226WTG (yes, g not q)?

Pretty much all the google results seem to be swedish/scandinavian stores, I can't even find it on LG's own site.

So of course I had to order one. As far as I can tell it's a normal WTQ but with a glossy coating, which is just what I was looking for (the HP is ugly). Unfortunately I'm in the process of moving and had the screen delivered to my future residence, so I won't be able to try it out until tuesday at the earliest even though it was delivered yesterday. Oh the suspense!

Will be interesting to see how it compares to the WTQ..

Yea, the G in WTG stands for glossy. I'm pretty sure I came across it earlier also. Nice find.

Originally posted by: Cicero
I ended up buying a 275T, I've only had it less than 24 hours so I'm still getting a fix on what it's like. My early impressions are positive, the wide gamut color is fine with very good rich colors. It's an excellent monitor for watching movies. I had a look at the first hour of the HD version of 'The Searchers' and it looked superb.

The dot pitch of .303 isn't an issue for me as the viewing distance is never closer than 80cm (2 feet 8 inches), the dot pitch is only an issue if you eyeball the LCD from very close up. For my eyesight (I wear glasses with graduated lenses) I prefer this monitor at 1920 x 1200 to a 24" LCD at the same resolution.

As a gaming monitor I have not tried it as I'm not a gamer. Some other comments in passing, the monitor is bit of a plain jane looking thing (not trendy like the new Dells). The menu system is like that used on the 215TW. I haven't tried the other inputs yet (component, s-video etc) nor the USB connections. No problems with blacklight bleeding nor dead pixels either. One negative is the position of the DVI input, it is right behind the leg of the stand so it is a bit fiddly to connect.

Seeing as 27" is the largest LCD for 1920x1200 I would be a bit worried about dot pitch also, but good to hear it's not a problem.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Heinrich
I swear Vista's driving me nuts. I am trying Ecksor's 2407 Profile. I bring up color management, when i try to open the file from the desktop it says "access denied." When I double click on it, the screen flashes and it seems to work. If I right click, there is an "install profile" option that works, then Color Management does say Dell2407WFP-HC (default) with the file name. Is that the one on my desktop? Where should I move it? And what is that "use my settings for this device" box doing!? I have Vista 64

Sorry, no idea, I don't use Vista. Probably something to do with UAC/permissions.

 

[jrichrds]

I have an Acer AL2223W 22" LCD. Acer's Euro site offers an .icm color profile for this monitor. I loaded the .inf/.icm and don't see any difference from the generic PnP monitor driver and no color profile. When would one expect to see a difference?

 

[Cerb]

Got the HP w2207 from BB, and am typing on it now. Glossy will be an issue, but no more than my old CRT's screen was (it's been on for 10-15 minutes and already has dust and cat hair--arg!), but otherwise it quite nice. The apparent brightness fade is difficult to see except with a flat color BG in landscape. It's easier to tell in portrait, but I'll have it that way for long periods of reading and typing, so it's less of a concern. A touch of lag is apparent, but it's not major (if I weren't a veteran of FPS games, I problably wouldn't notice at all), and I'm already getting used to it. It's not enough to make videos appear out of sync, just not as good as some 1280x1024 gaming-centric displays or CRTs.

I really like how it's made to rotate (the base has centered a grippy pad that can pivot, with felt pads around the base), and actually does a decent job of keeping to a similar viewing angle when making height adjustments. The cable guides hold pretty tightly, too, which is cool.

My only complaints so far are that the pivot adjustment requires a change in viewing angle (the display can't physically rotate without being tilted upwards first), and that the default settings are clearly for on-the-floor "wow" factor (too bright and overly vibrant).

So, thanks for pointing this one out over the 2405.

 

[KenI]

Originally posted by: BernardP

Originally posted by: fillalph
Another one of the suggestion posts.
Size wise: 19 - 24
Price: 399 or so (MAYBE a bit more if it was worth it)
Usage: I have a dSLR and want to get into some post processing (I am a hobbyist only though). Spend time doing "office" work such as surfing the net, word processing, MATLAB, I use AutoCAD a bit too. As for gaming, I don't really.Location: Vancouver, Canada (not sure if it would help)

The Samsung 215T looked alright, but the input lag was a turn off.
I gave the 226WT/WTX a good look but this thread really turned me off from it: http://forums.dpreview.com/for...=22694763&q=226wt&qf=m
I thought about the Samsung 226BW. I didn't see it listed anywhere in xtknight's recommendation list though.
(Is it worth waiting for the Samsung 226CW or the high gamut from LG?)

Input lag is a turnoff mostly for hardcore gamers in FPS games. NCIX, in Vancouver has the 215TW for less than $500 now, so it could be an option.

As for the 226CW (Samsung) and L227WT (LG) high-gamut monitors, I think they are worth the wait, if only because initially at least, they should have true Samsung and LG-Philips panels respectively.

The 226CW has been available on BestBuy.ca for some time, and went on sale for $C 399 at some point, but now it is no longer listed. It is becoming available in the US, so I guess it will be widely available before the LG L227, which is not expected before September, possibly later. I read in an LCD industry article that LG-Philips can't produce enough 22-inch wide panels and that additional capacity for this size will only come online sometimes in August.

In my own case, I am waiting to see the LG L227 with my own eyes before I decide anything. In Canada, it is almost certain that it will be priced significantly lower than the Samsung 226CW. For some reason, LG has a very agressive pricing stategy in Canada, while Samsung seems to maintain premium prices like a Korean Sony

I just bought a Samsung 226CW at Best Buy in Portland Oregon. I had found this forum to be very valuable in my decsion making process, and since it appears that very few people have gotten an opportunity to get their hands on a 226CW, I wanted to share my experience.

I have no prior experience with LCD monitors, so I cannot comment on whether the 226CW does anything better than any other 22" TN panel. What I can say is that I can find nothing to complain about with the 226CW. I run it at 1680X1050, with the DVI cable (and, by the way, the DVI-D cable WAS included). It came from the factory at 100% brightness and 75% contrast and RGBs at 50/50/50, and, frankly, we find that we like running it at those settings. In the future we will probably turn the brightness down, but right now we are enjoying how vivid and crisp everything looks at those settings, from jpegs to screen savers to text. I don't know what blacklight bleeding really looks like, but I stare at a mostly black screen (like when running the Mystify screensaver) and I just don't see any edge-of-screen phenomenon to comment on.

Here are the identifiers - sometimes those tell people "in the know" alot about the true nature of the panel...

Backside label (under plastic pop-off cover that hides the input ports)

Model: 226CW
Model Code: L22MEXSFV/XAA
Color Display Unit Type: GH22WS
SA LR50298
Safety Mark 062506-11
N363 CE
SN: ME22H9NP######Z
Made in Dongguan China (XINF)
Manufactured: June 2007
BN68-######-01

Service Panel (accessed the same way as the 226BW)
Auto Auto On
Pixel Shift Off
Country English
HDCPHotPlug Off
HotPlug Time 9
Scaler-MCU MStar
Version: M-ME22X0CAA-1000
Checksum F56F

All of my comments are to try to help us understand whether Samsung has indeed shipped the 226CW as "the best of the 226BWs, with Wide Gamut", which is their intent, as reported in June in their announcements. I am not experienced enough to know. Like I say, I can't find anything to fault with it, and my expectations on clarity and color vividness have been met. I had originally fallen in love with the LG226WTY-BF I saw on the store floor displays, which I thought had a very crisp, clean look to them, but I couldn't find any local store with a floor model with firmware above 1.10, so I wasn't willing to take my chances that a v1.14 or higher was in the stockroom. The HP2207 was mesmerizing, but our home setup has large windows, so glare from the glossy HP was a deal killer. After seeing the HP2007/2207 in action, you can't say that the colors on the Samsung or LG are 'eye-popping", but, honestly, they are probably more 'real'. The unexpected chance to get a "good" Samsung 22" TN panel, with Wide Gamut to boot, led me to take a chance on buying this 226CW sight-unseen (it was on the Best Buy shelves, but not on floor display, so I was buying on faith). I feel that I made a good decision.

 

[tw33ter]

I just got the 205bw for a friend, and she's sayin that no matter what she tries, it's blurry. I had her mess with the sharpness setting, but that didnt make a difference. Could it be because she's using onboard vga? I also made sure she had it set to the native res.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: tw33ter
I just got the 205bw for a friend, and she's sayin that no matter what she tries, it's blurry. I had her mess with the sharpness setting, but that didnt make a difference. Could it be because she's using onboard vga? I also made sure she had it set to the native res.

It's gotta be the onboard VGA. I have the exact same experience with my mom's HP with integrated Intel Extreme graphics (I really need to get her a dedicated card). My HP dv2000 notebook with integrated graphics also has blurry VGA output. The only video outputs I trust anymore are those from high-end GeForce 7/8 cards or comparable ATIs.

The GeForce 7600GT is a great mid-range card for occasional gaming and very nice video output (it's DVI). I'm sure something cheaper would suffice, although at the same time I'm not so sure because of all the bad video card experiences I've had. My Radeon 9500 PRO's VGA at 1280x1024, connected to a 17" Samsung 710t, was nothing to write home about either. Yet, my GeForce 7800GT connected to the NEC 20WMGX2's VGA port exhibits no, or very little, quality differences when compared to its DVI hookup.

Originally posted by: jrichrds
I have an Acer AL2223W 22" LCD. Acer's Euro site offers an .icm color profile for this monitor. I loaded the .inf/.icm and don't see any difference from the generic PnP monitor driver and no color profile. When would one expect to see a difference?

I believe the icm profiles provided by LCD manufacturers don't include "gamma tables", the information needed for Windows to make the color corrections. Don't ask me why this is, it really doesn't make any sense to me either. For this reason, ordinary people with colorimeters have started providing model-based profiles online. What the CD-based ones do provide, possibly, is gamut information (at least of the unit they profiled at the factory) for use by Photoshop.

Originally posted by: Cerb
Got the HP w2207 from BB, and am typing on it now. Glossy will be an issue, but no more than my old CRT's screen was (it's been on for 10-15 minutes and already has dust and cat hair--arg!), but otherwise it quite nice. The apparent brightness fade is difficult to see except with a flat color BG in landscape. It's easier to tell in portrait, but I'll have it that way for long periods of reading and typing, so it's less of a concern. A touch of lag is apparent, but it's not major (if I weren't a veteran of FPS games, I problably wouldn't notice at all), and I'm already getting used to it. It's not enough to make videos appear out of sync, just not as good as some 1280x1024 gaming-centric displays or CRTs.

I really like how it's made to rotate (the base has centered a grippy pad that can pivot, with felt pads around the base), and actually does a decent job of keeping to a similar viewing angle when making height adjustments. The cable guides hold pretty tightly, too, which is cool.

My only complaints so far are that the pivot adjustment requires a change in viewing angle (the display can't physically rotate without being tilted upwards first), and that the default settings are clearly for on-the-floor "wow" factor (too bright and overly vibrant).

So, thanks for pointing this one out over the 2405.

Glad to hear it worked out for you.

 

[Heinrich]

My brand new 2407 FPW HC developed two very small very surface scratches somehow after I let a young friend play conquer online for a few hours isgust;

I tried the toothpaste trick by rubbing a bit of toothpase into the tiny scratches, and they disappeared. I'm not even sure where they were anymore.

Should I be concerned about a year from now?

 

[xtknight]

Just FYI: I think the Dell 2407WFP-HC is a better deal than the Planar 26" now. It's about $400 less, and it has more connectivity options. While neither has great uniformity, the Dell probably has the edge here. The S-IPS panel is great for viewing angles but with the Dell you get a higher contrast, at least. The 2407WFP-HC may be my next LCD if the Planar's price doesn't come down by a good margin. The Planar is above the 2407WFP-HC in the recommendations since I do my recommendations by image quality and not by value. It probably has less input lag than the Dell, too. I'm hoping there are more affordable and value-oriented wide gamut S-IPS panels down the road. Maybe by Xmas season the Planar will be affordable. Something tells me it will be no higher than $800 by the time Newegg has it in stock and it's been out for awhile.

 

[Montius]

Still really tempted by the 2407WFP-HC...

Would you say holding out for a price drop on an S-IPS panel (like the Planar) would be a better choice? Or would a 2407 now (still at $569 by the way, good deal) be a wise choice?

 

[ftrippie]

Hi,

did anybody ever test the Eizo's new S2031W? I can't find any tests or reviews on it...

For photoshop work, I am hesitating between:
- Eizo S2031W (around 600 euros)
- NEC 20WMGX2PRO (around 500 euros)
- Samsung 215TW (around 450 euros)
- Apple Cinema Display (20") (around 600 euros)

Of which the Eizo has got the nicest details (on paper) I reckon.

Cheers,
FTrippie

 

[BernardP]

Finally, XBit Labs turn their attention to 22-inch monitors:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articl...er/display/22inch.html

There is a very interesting presentation of RTC artifacts problems on the LG L226WTQ, as well as comparison between the three versions (S, A, C) of the Samsung 226BW.

This is only Part 1. Other reviews in this category are sure to follow