[Retired] The LCD Thread

[blaaarg]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: blaaarg
After all this I'm still undecided... I'm looking for 24" suitable for gaming and photo editing. Being a game dev 3D artist, photo editing is somewhat important as well, for texturing etc. Extensive use of photoshop / Max / Zbrush / Mudbox. I'm also watching movies... So a great all round 24" would be neat.
Cheers!

Take a look at the 24"s recommended under Multimedia. If you can't spend that much, the Samsung 245BW is the best economical option. The ViewSonic VX2435wm seems the best for you since it has a tight gamma curve by default (accurate colors).

cheers! samsung 245BW ok. I didnt look yet for the multimedia ones yet but will see if there is some stuff in my price range (which I don't have yet =D) As for viewsonic, i'll look into it.
Thanks a lot!

 

[zod96]

When playing BF2 last night with both the nec 20wmgx2 and the hp w2207 running dual display, on the hp it looked normal but on the nec it had a nice yellow tinge to it and I couldn't get it to go away...

 

[Mike888]

hey! GREAT thread!


I however, came a little too late it seems. I was on the very verge of buying the samsung 226cw, (i heard that the panel lottery was fixed in this version AND it has 97% color gamut)(even if this isn't correct, i can 100% sure get an S-panel because i will be buying it at the store.). However, i play games such as ut3 quite competitively. I am currently using a 17" crt (quite old), and i wanted to buy a new monitor.


I wanted to see quite a difference, but nothing too big to the point where i'd need to turn my head to see different parts of the monitor, so i decided 22" was perfect.

226 had won many awards and was catching my attention.

What turned me off is the input lag! Someone told me it had 50 ms....that's unbelievable. This completely destroyed my spirits...and have even considered sticking with my old and crappy crt.


I was wondering if you could help me out...in any way at all. There is no 22" in your list. 24" is too big i think, and 19" is too small for me to really be happy about my purchase.

Any ideas o mighty lcd person?

 

[zod96]

How about the HP W2207

 

[TVisitor]

Hey all...

I'm interested in the Planar, but also concerned about the stuck/dead pixel policy. It's been noted here that CDW has a 30 day exchange policy. I know some other retailers are VERY draconian about the dead/stuck pixels - newegg, for instance, says it has to be 8 or greater.

Where on CDW's site does it note about the return policy? I took a look, but I didn't see anything specific to LCD's and stuck pixels (which a lot of places take exception to their standard rules for).

Thanks.

 

[muppet22]

i just called cdw and asked them about it, and they said you pay shipping for a return. and you dont pay shipping for exchanges. and you can exchange for any reason

 

[Buck Armstrong]

Originally posted by: TVisitor
Hey all...

I'm interested in the Planar, but also concerned about the stuck/dead pixel policy. It's been noted here that CDW has a 30 day exchange policy. I know some other retailers are VERY draconian about the dead/stuck pixels - newegg, for instance, says it has to be 8 or greater.

Where on CDW's site does it note about the return policy? I took a look, but I didn't see anything specific to LCD's and stuck pixels (which a lot of places take exception to their standard rules for).

Thanks.

I bought the Planar from CDW, and its perfect except for 3 stuck pixels. When I called to exchange it, they didn't even ask why, they just shipped the new one and sent me a return shipping label for the old one.

No worries with them.

 

[TVisitor]

Thanks guys!

 

[muppet22]

ok..i just placed an order for the samsung 275t+ from cdw..it's on backorder and wont be shipped til march 19

 

[Mike888]

any help? =[

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: kentsfield
Hi!

I just bought samsung 245B, so far im happy with it. No dead pixels, pretty good picture for TN, except vertical angle sucks and the front power button is very wobbly. Overall good monitor (so far) for the price.

I was reading some reviews and forums that samsung 245 model has samsung (S) panel (made in china) and its not a lottery like 226bw model. Mine doesn`t have any S in the back. Model is ls24hubcbq/edc (made in slovakia). Many stores here in europe sell this panel model (ls24hubcbq/edc).

Does anyone have any information about this panel? Is it any worse than "S" and who is the manufacturer?

Monitor was made january 2008 (Slovakia).

The 245BW only contains an S panel, made by Samsung.

Originally posted by: toslat
Suggestion: Xtknight, have u considered ordering each sub category of the recommendation list in the OP by size (or any other criteria like manufacturer). For me it would make it easier to find a monitor that meets my needs than a list with absolute rankings. Particularly in sub categories with long lists. U cld still add an index of the rankings or 'top 5 list'.

Hmm I'm not sure what good a manufacturer-based sorting would be, but I have considered the size one. The problem is, quality comes only in bigger sized panels a lot of the time. I want to drive that point home and I think the best way to do it is to have all the LCDs in one big list for each category. Otherwise I'd be impyling you can just pick your size and get the same kind of quality; sadly that's not the case. And I know only a fifth of the people here that visit really read the OP so they'd be making a $300+ mistake. True it is their fault but my goal is to make sure people are making the most informed decision possible and I believe the way it's setup now is the best.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: zod96
Is their a photo or test I can do to show this? I have my nec 20wmgx2 and my hp w2207 running together using the same wallpaper and they look identical I can't tell the slightest differrence between them.

If you think they're equal then I wouldn't bother deliberately looking for flaws.

Use them for a couple weeks and see how it goes. The best way is just real world material. Try some darker movie trailers or something.

Originally posted by: JASTECH
I am still looking and reading these threads and money is hard to come by when your disables I tell you what! xtknight you are still awesome from the first time you answered my questions. I am now reading on the Planar PX2611W and reads like what I need. Does anybody have one or can shed some light on it for me please? It will be a while before I can do anything but I like to keep thinking in the right direction. TIA, JAS

Glad to hear I can help. The PX2611W is a good LCD although it has had some quality control concerns, like backlight bleeding and dead pixels. I hear Planar's policy on pixels is decent (just a few pages back there was a post on this). I can't remember the exact minimum # of dead pixels but it was pretty low. Anyway, backlight bleeding won't be too distracting unless you watch a lot of dark movies. For general use it shouldn't be that big of a deal.

Originally posted by: Eroteme
First of all I'd like to thank xtknight for such a comprehensive resource on lcd monitors, I've recently become interested in buying a wide-screen lcd for gaming and multimedia, for running both my pc and xbox360 through, and this is the best information I've found so-far.

I'm aware that the xbox360 doesn't properly support 16:10 resolutions, something I hope microsoft looks at asap, and that most lcd monitors don't suppport 1:1 or interpollation, but I'm willing to put up with the small amount image stretching atm.

The problem I'm having is a majority of the monitors you recommend either aren't available here, or only available from general electronics stores, rather than computer stores and therefore costing way more than others.

I'm looking at getting a 22" 2ms LCD and the following models seem to be readily available, I'm wondering if you could help me out a little here as to weather they're any good.

22" Asus LCD Monitor VW222U $369
22" LG LCD Monitor - L226WTP $368
22" Samsung LCD Monitor - 226BW $409
22" ViewSonic LCD Monitor - VX2235wm $329

Prices are in Australian Dollars, I'm not sure what panel is in the samsung, but it's more than likely a 'C' panel I'm lead to believe. Out of the monitors listed above the Samsung and LG seem to be the big sellers around here.

Go to

http://www.austin.net.au

If you want to see what else is available around here and the prices, they're pretty much the cheapest/most convienient for me.

Thanks in advance. Also if any other forum members want to comment or help out, feel free.


Regards,
Brendan.

Out of the ones you listed, the 226BW is probably the best overall no matter which panel you get. I don't know about the LG L226WTP in particular but the L226WT is a great 22" choice. The other ones, no idea.

But the VX2255wm listed on the Austin site is your best bet overall. http://www.austin.net.au/Price.../PageNo/2/Default.aspx

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Mike888
hey! GREAT thread!


I however, came a little too late it seems. I was on the very verge of buying the samsung 226cw, (i heard that the panel lottery was fixed in this version AND it has 97% color gamut)(even if this isn't correct, i can 100% sure get an S-panel because i will be buying it at the store.). However, i play games such as ut3 quite competitively. I am currently using a 17" crt (quite old), and i wanted to buy a new monitor.


I wanted to see quite a difference, but nothing too big to the point where i'd need to turn my head to see different parts of the monitor, so i decided 22" was perfect.

226 had won many awards and was catching my attention.

What turned me off is the input lag! Someone told me it had 50 ms....that's unbelievable. This completely destroyed my spirits...and have even considered sticking with my old and crappy crt.


I was wondering if you could help me out...in any way at all. There is no 22" in your list. 24" is too big i think, and 19" is too small for me to really be happy about my purchase.

Any ideas o mighty lcd person?

The best 22" overall for gaming I'd say is the ViewSonic VX2255wm. Still has a tad bit of input lag but that's just the way it goes. 2 frames of it doesn't bother most people but I try to keep my Gaming section to 1 frame or less or sometimes based on real good subjective descriptions.

 

[zod96]

I'll try that thanks xtknight

 

[redlinez33]

Well i have the 2408WFP right here, took some input lag pictures compared to my 245BW (which should have almost 0 input lag) and come up with anywhere between 25ms to 50ms (varies) of input lag. I could actually notice the input lag when i first turned the monitor on, but after about 5 minutes of use I dont notice it during desktop usage.

It is slightly noticeable when you have another monitor right next to it...... Will post more when I get done messing with it.

I tried to replicate the ghosting that I saw in the video of the 2407WFP, I cant. Its about the same as the 245BW as that goes, maybe slightly worse (this is desktop use, havent tried games yet).


Went to prad and did the ghosting test (gray block with red block inside) it did about as well as my TN. Not quiet a TN, but good from what I saw.



(will be updating this through the night with my findings.)

 

[redlinez33]

Great, this monitor is defective. The left part of the screen (as you are looking at it) is much brighter than the rest of the screen. Its not backlight bleeding either, because a blank screen doesnt show this. What shows it is a dark scene in a game, or a dark gray desktop..

 

[ClockHound]

Originally posted by: Mike888
I was wondering if you could help me out...in any way at all. There is no 22" in your list. 24" is too big i think, and 19" is too small for me to really be happy about my purchase.

This is a helpful side by side comparo site, Digitalversus.com.
Here's the Viewsonic 2235, 9 -22 ms lag and the Acer P223W with 0 ms lag. Digital Versus

 

[redlinez33]

OK more impressions. As i said before the left side of my monitor is brighter than the rest of the monitor, but I just assume its defective and rate the rest of the monitor.

The picture quality is leaps and bounds better than the 245BW. Its just amazing how much better everything looks. Response time seems good, not as fast as the 245BW, but for me is fine.

The problem is input lag, I actually notice it....... In fast paced games like UT its obvious. Something I might be able to get used to, but I am still deciding on that. If the picture quality wasnt so darn good for gaming it would be going back, but it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside when I see how these games are really suppose to look.

 

[redlinez33]

Went to you tube and watched the input lag videos of the Samsung 215TW and did the same tests. The Dells input lag is almost non existent COMPARED to the 215TW. Its there, but not nearly as bad. As I said before, I have taken pictures using the online monitor test counter program and compared to the Samsung 245BW, the DELL 2408WFP has anywhere between 22-50 ms of input lag. It never went over 50ms in any of my pictures.

There is also some black crush (think thats what its called) where black detail is lost viewing straight on compared to the 245BW. The thing is, the picture quality of the 245BW sucks so much compared to the Dell, the black crush is really nothing in comparison to the horrible black levels, lifeless colors, and overall washed out image of the 245BW compared to the DELL....

 

[xtknight]

Well speaking of input lag the only thing I could get out of NEC USA is the following (paraphrased):

The 2690 is not designed for fast frame rate response. It is primarily targeted to customers who are interested in accurate color reproduction, not gaming.

I had attached three images showing the delay of the 2690, compared to a CRT and the 20WMGX2.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9138204@N03/2293570267/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9138204@N03/2293570271/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9138204@N03/2293570279/

Turning overdrive ON actually reduced input lag by 4 ms on average. The frame buffering remained with overdrive OFF.

So, the LCD2690 has 2-4 frames of lag (usually 2-3). I'm going to add all the results to my review though.

 

[BassBomb]

How about 20WMGX2's input lag VS crt?

Has LCD Resource been down for awhile?

 

[Mark R]

Does anyone know which monitors support hardware calibration, for accurate colours? Just wondering, because some of the ones we have at work, are just standard monitors from NEC and Eizo (although not ones I'd particularly like at home) - but when calibrating, you upload the calibration to the monitor, instead of configuring it on the video driver. This avoids throwing away 'colours' by having the video card skip over them.

 

[redlinez33]

So it seems the NE 2690 might actually be better than the DELL 2408WFP (or about the same actually) in terms of input lag, hmm. I would say the average was probably close to 30-35 for the 2408WFP so far...

 

[Hardtarget]

hi guys, I'm hoping one of you can help me as I don't know what to do.
I currently have a Dell 2005WFP (I believe that's what it was, they were all the rage when I bought mine a couple years ago)

I want to get a second monitor to match it. I see the 2007WFPs are still out and it doesn't look like the 2008FP is coming out anytime soon, I'm fine with going nondell, but none of the decent looking non-dell LCDs have the hight adjustment and rotation abilities of my current 2005WFP, and I really want that for the new monitor.
should I get a 2007WFP (i've heard there may be problems with them) or is there something else I can get that will be good and has the features I want + good gaming abilities, etc..

(sorry for rambleness of this post)

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: BassBomb
How about 20WMGX2's input lag VS crt?

16-32 ms.

Has LCD Resource been down for awhile?

Yeah, I'm in contact w/ the owner about it.

Originally posted by: Mark R
Does anyone know which monitors support hardware calibration, for accurate colours? Just wondering, because some of the ones we have at work, are just standard monitors from NEC and Eizo (although not ones I'd particularly like at home) - but when calibrating, you upload the calibration to the monitor, instead of configuring it on the video driver. This avoids throwing away 'colours' by having the video card skip over them.

Quite a few do, actually. I don't really have a list of all HW calibration models but most Eizo ColorEdge ones do and the following NECs are supported by the SpectraView II software.

Some LaCies might also support HW calibration.


basICColor 4.0.2 HW-LUT support:

• Eizo CG18
• Eizo CG19
• Eizo CG21
• Eizo CG210
• Eizo CG220

NEC SpectraView II HW-LUT support (README):

• NEC LCD1980SXi
• NEC LCD1980FXi
• NEC LCD1990SX
• NEC LCD1990SXi
• NEC LCD1990SXp
• NEC LCD2090UXi
• NEC LCD2180UX
• NEC LCD2180WG-LED
• NEC LCD2190UXi
• NEC LCD2190UXp
• NEC LCD2490WUXi
• NEC LCD2690WUXi
• NEC LCD4020
• NEC LCD4620
• NEC Multeos M40
• NEC Multeos M46

EIZO ColorNavigator 5.0.1 HW-LUT support (DOWNLOAD):

• ColorEdge CG301W
• CG210-N
• CG221
• CG210
• CG19
• CE240W
• CG241W
• CG211
• CG220
• CG21
• CG18
• CE210W

LaCie blue eye (details): LaCie 300/500 Series monitors for fully automatic performance (10-bit+ LUTs I believe)

I believe Samsung's XL series LCDs support hardware calibration through Samsung's Natural Color Expert software. Their monitors do claim 10-14 bit LUTs, at least. I don't see how this would be used without having upload to upload to it.

http://www.samsung.com/us/pdf/...esBrochure01042008.pdf