[Retired] The LCD Thread

[ericinho]

Difficult indeed to choose the right screen, despite this very informative thread.

I would use the 24" screen mainly for digital design work and the occasional print design. But that doesn't justify forking out the amount of cash that comes with a monitor calibrated for print design work.

Unfortunately, even the NEC as mentioned in this thread, are too pricey, the ViewSonic unavailable here, so I am eyeing the Dell UltraSharp 2408WFP since we have the 2405 at work and we are pretty happy with it.

But i haven't found any decent reviews of it yet and the ghosting and banding story with the 2407 made me somewhat hesitant to blindly choose this one.

Unfortunately, looking under Photo editing/Web design, no other 24"screens are listed, so I would love to hear your experiences and suggestions.

In any case, my videocard (GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb) is dual DVI, so the screen needs to be as well. And if i could tilt, set higher/lower and turn the screen that would be great. For the rest I don't have much other demands, except ofcourse image quality, color reproduction and so on...

 

[SCCA Racer X]

Originally posted by: ericinho
Difficult indeed to choose the right screen, despite this very informative thread.
...
Unfortunately, looking under Photo editing/Web design, no other 24"screens are listed, so I would love to hear your experiences and suggestions.

In any case, my videocard (GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb) is dual DVI, so the screen needs to be as well.
...

Agreed, I went around and around until I felt like I was riding a carousel. The current monitor market forces you to strike a balance between many compromises. Each person may satisfy their most important priority by making an educated choice, but there is no single monitor which would satisfy universally, even if your budget is unlimited. Hence the OP recommendations are categorized by intended primary use.

You mention your card is dual DVI, and you want a monitor to be compatible. It sounds like you have a misconception about what dual DVI is for. Dual DVI is only needed for the largest monitors, which have much higher resolutions than the 1920x1200 of the 24" monitors you are looking at. Dual DVI could also be used to support a dual monitor setup, if you wanted to do that. Essentially, dual DVI is just two regular DVI ports which, when needed, can be configured to work together to drive a single very hi res monitor. So any monitor with a DVI port is compatible with your card, and it would be challenging to find a current model which does not have a DVI port.

As for suggestions, I'm a fan of the $300 24" Soyo sold by OfficeMax. It can be ordered online or over the phone if there isn't a store nearby. The $700 DoubleSight IPS monitor which is getting buzz here right now is where I would look if I were to upgrade. And when you think that you can put 2 Soyos on your desk for that price, you're going to start hearing the carousel music!

 

[TitusTroy]

sorry if this question has been asked but this thread is too long to go through every post...I'm in the market for a good LCD gaming monitor--my first LCD in fact after years of CRT's...my CRT has started to exhibit ghosting burn in so I'm in the market for an excellent 21-24' gaming monitor which has excellent color reproduction and is perfect for gaming...any recommendations for something in the $400-$500 range?...Thanks

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Tonish
Ok I first want to thank everyone that contributed to this thread, especially xtknight. I have found it helpful and very informative. Now that I have that out of the way I must say I hate you all for completely confusing me So far I have gone from just looking for a good 22" to 24" and only wanting to spend around $ 300-500 to looking at spending $900 on a Planar PX2611. I read the OP and started at around page 150ish which was the start of January and I have read it to the end. In that time I have gone from getting the BenQ T241W, to the NEC 2470WNXBK, to thinking maybe i would just go with the BenQ G2400, to debating maybe i should just settle for average and get the VX2435WM. Then Buck Armstrong over there had to go and start the whole Planar PX2611 thing. That leads us to the brand new confusing option of the Double Sight DS-263N.

So here I sit completely confused and baffled at the options that lay before me. So maybe you guys could help me make up my mind. A little background info to help you out, I am running a Dual Core System OC to 3.18 GHZ and I have a newly purchased 8800 GT arriving tomorrow. I have been fighting the LCD wave for quite some time, I have always disliked all the negatives to the LCD but my Viewsonic 21" G810 series CRT is showing signs of its age and another CRT is just too hard to find. Coming into this thread my number one concern was image blur/lag as that as far as I knew was the biggest fault of lcd's. Now I have to rethink that and have a new list which is from greatest to least: Input Lag, Color Distortion, Image blur/lag, Screen Distractions, Color Accuracy, Cost, size. I am a gamer, I always have been. My system is nothing more then a glorified X-Box. I used to have a Sony Trinitron monitor because they had the best clarity and with text not much beat it back in the day. I ended up with the viewsonic when I was setting up someone else's computer and saw the vivid colors of the viewsonic blow the trinitron out of the water. Needless to say I switched monitors with him.

So to summarize I do not want to experience input lag , but at the same time I want a good picture. The part I am confused about is everyone seems to hate TN panels due to their viewing angles, but as I read the reviews on VA panels I hear those have color distortion. I know I do not want one side of my monitor a different color then the other. Then of course all the IPS panels are expensive and I read they do not do black as well. I do not have much of a reference to go from as the only panels I have seen are TN's. I do plan on going to the store to try to get a grasp on the short comings of all of them. In relation to each other what does one type of panel have over the other? I know TN's have less lag, VA's do black better, and IPS has the best viewing angles but in comparison to one another how are they? Are IPS panels better at black then TN's?

Well the OP contains a comprehensive list of the strong/weak points of each panel type.

At the stores you'll be lucky to find VA and extremely lucky to find IPS.

So what would you guys recommend? I see my current options in no particular order are the BenQ FP241W, BenQ G2400W, Viewsonic VX2435, Planar PX2611W, & the Double Sight DS-263N. Last question do you think it is worth trying the Double Sight DS-263N? I really do not want to spend $900 on the PX2611W & $700 does seem more reasonable. If I spend $500 + dollars on a monitor I expect it to last and not be obsolete in a year.

Thanks for any help give and thanks again for all the great information.

Anyway, the DoubleSight DS-263N seems to satisfy each one of your needs just fine. Seems to be the easiest choice for many people looking for a big LCD these days. And this won't be obsolete, definitely. It's basically the same panel as the pro LCD2690WUXi with less input lag. I wouldn't even bother looking at the other options as long as the DoubleSight is in stock at $700.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: DoctorM
Hey.
ATI's latest drivers finally allowed me to update my drivers (for the last year they haven't worked with my video card).

Now unfortunately anytime the catalyst control center loads it overrides the color profiles I have set for my monitor.

Anyone know a way to prevent ATI's color controls from reactivating themselves?

Sorry, I don't really know.

Originally posted by: Tasiin
The 2007s are 6-bit? I thought nearly all S-IPS displays were 8-bit.

I'm pretty sure I heard reports of dithering/FRC in the Dells, at the very least in the VA panels. But S-IPS panels can certainly be 6-bit also when a cheap DAC is used.

I looked at the 2090UXi a bit ago, but the price is just too high for such a small screen. I'm not really willing to go significantly over $400. And as you said, the amount of input lag is unknown. The 2070NX is definitely just too old. If it used the same panel as the LP2065/2007FP though, that would've been my first choice.

It seems like most new S-IPS displays are going to be 26" or larger, but I just don't have the room for that on my desk, and again it's too expensive. I'd still like to be able to use my CRT occasionally, and it's already a tight squeeze with just a 20" LCD on my desk as well.

Most people seem to agree that if you're not happy with S-IPS you won't be happy with much else, so I think you're probably right about me being nearly out of options. From what I've read about VA, I think I'd actually prefer a TN.

Oddly enough, I still find my 15" Sony TN to be more comfortable than any IPS display or my CRT for simple tasks like web browsing, though that could easily be due to the high pixel pitch or the much nicer anti-glare on it. I'm sure that the viewing angles and poor color reproduction on a larger TN would be bothersome however, and if I wanted to avoid getting a widescreen I'd have to settle for another non-standard aspect ratio (19" 5:4). Probably not even worth considering.

I think I'll take another day to consider it, then order the 2007FP if nothing looks better. It seems to almost be a given that it'll be better than the LP2065, if it doesn't have any issues like the flickering. I think I may actually have a good chance of getting S-IPS with the latest revision too, and I'd have a chance to compare it directly with the LP2065 if I order soon.

Well, the DoubleSight may be something to consider. Possibly.

But I don't see how else the LCD market is going to please you. Maybe you're best off with a 22" TN to hold you over?

Originally posted by: jae
what about the hannsg hg-216? newegg

most of the reviews ive come across have been great but no pro reviews found yet

Usually when I see any Hanns LCDs I immediately look in the other direction but I don't have any more idea than you do on how the HG-216 is.

Originally posted by: Mski0032
my school offers the VideoSeven D22W12-N6 for 250$... anyone know the panel type on this model???? or have a decent review? I have found little to nothing.

because I won't have to wait/pay for delivery I'll probably just get this, but I'd at least like to know the panel type prior... nothing like spending $250 & being disappointed.


[ed.] I went & checked it out. Its definitely the TN panel and its a shitty monitor... so looks like i'll be ordering online

Consider the Acer AL2216wbd available for same $.

Originally posted by: afuturestrader
Very informative thread. I am replacing some 19 inch CRT's (Viewsonic GS790). Being new to LCS's a few questions come to mind.

My monitor use is mostly standard office - web browsing, email, IM, documents etc. Because I use multiple monitors to increase productivity my hope is to keep the per monitor price to around $400 or less.

Therefore after review my thinking is to buy a few 20 inch standard aspect S-IPS monitors with an anti-glare screen - (and hope to win the panel lottery).

1. Any better suggestions? Would the HP L0265 be a or the top choice?

The LP2065 does seem like the best choice in this case. Most have been S-IPS lately.

2. A second thought I had - Put two 20 inch monitors side by side in portrait mode for a 2400x1600 resolution. Would this not be very close to the functional equivalent of a 30 inch monitor (2560 x 1600) for less money? Any fault in this logic?

Thanks in advance.

Well the only faults I can see are drivers and compatibility with dual monitors vs a single monitor. Plus I just prefer a bigger single monitor but that's just me. The bezel is a bit annoying.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: SCCA Racer X

Originally posted by: xtknight
Another 26" S-IPS. I actually laughed when the actual panel was shown in the specs. How ridiculous. AND LG Philips 8-bit is actually advertised. Maybe they are really catching on.

Not a bad deal at $700 also! Just haven't seen any reviews yet. Wide gamut, I believe. Unlisted on their site as of now.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...=DoubleSight%2bDS-263N
...

You don't sound completely enthusiastic about developments which I consider a huge step in the right direction. I assume I'm just unable to interperet sarcasm over the net, and you're in shock from actually seeing what discerning buyers have been wishing for.

Declaring the panel type, and even naming the panel model, while lowering the price point by $200, is nothing short of a hat trick. I can only hope for this to become a full-on trend.

FYI, I got another Soyo 24" P-MVA monitor for $300 from OfficeMax. I really wanted to hold out for a nice >=24" IPS panel, but after being in the market for about a year, I decided that I just wasn't going to come up with ~$900 for the "low budget" Planar, or settle for a relatively pricey 20" HP. I even played the lottery (not the panel lottery, the real one), and bid on ebay, but no luck. So, I made my move. I own two now (two for less than the price of one IPS monitor!), and I still recommend it as the best bang-for-buck at the moment.

I am relieved to not have to move my 21" CRT every weekend between the two cities I live in, it can stay in one place now. No more funky magnetic special effects from my speakers, and my desk is usable for a change.

So I am out of the market for now. I hope that when I re-enter, there will be substantial changes for the better. But one thing I hope remains the same is this awesome forum! This is where I'll come to learn about the state of the art. Maybe by that time it won't even be called the LCD thread, but named for something which transcends the limitations of the LCD. No matter, xtknight, you've got the winning formula.

Thanks to everyone for making this a first-class thread. I plan to drop by from time to time to see what's new.

Thanks for the good words and I really hope I can continue it as well. But no I'm not too hopeful about more IPSes coming into the market.

Originally posted by: Buck Armstrong
The Doublesight 26" is finally on their website. I just read the product description, and there are a few differences between the Planar and the Doublesight:

- The Planar has a better warranty: 3 years, 2-day replacement, paid shipping both ways, with a 3 dead/stuck pixels policy vs. Doublesight's 3 years limited with 6 dead/stuck pixels.

- The Planar is height, tilt, and swivel adjustable. The Doublesight only tilts. From photos its clear they have a different stand.

- The Doublesight apparently has built-in speakers. The Planar does not.

- The Doublesight is $150-200 cheaper.

Like I said, I'd rather have the Planar because I like the 2-day replacement and prepaid shipping, adjustable height is important to me, and I don't need the speakers. Regardless, $699 is a steal for a 26" IPS, and anyone considering a 24"-27" VA and/or not wanting to spend the money for the Planar should probably take a hard look at one of these...

I don't think the 27" VAs should even be looked at when there's a deal like this. It's amazing what happens when somebody finally fills the <$700 IPS niche.

Originally posted by: ericinho
Difficult indeed to choose the right screen, despite this very informative thread.

I would use the 24" screen mainly for digital design work and the occasional print design. But that doesn't justify forking out the amount of cash that comes with a monitor calibrated for print design work.

Unfortunately, even the NEC as mentioned in this thread, are too pricey, the ViewSonic unavailable here, so I am eyeing the Dell UltraSharp 2408WFP since we have the 2405 at work and we are pretty happy with it.

But i haven't found any decent reviews of it yet and the ghosting and banding story with the 2407 made me somewhat hesitant to blindly choose this one.

Unfortunately, looking under Photo editing/Web design, no other 24"screens are listed, so I would love to hear your experiences and suggestions.

In any case, my videocard (GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb) is dual DVI, so the screen needs to be as well. And if i could tilt, set higher/lower and turn the screen that would be great. For the rest I don't have much other demands, except ofcourse image quality, color reproduction and so on...

I'm not sure what you mean by the screen needing to be dual DVI. Dual-link DVI? I think most 23"+ panels are. But you only hook up one DVI dual-link cable to one dual-link DVI port on your card. Even 1920x1200@60 Hz however may benefit from dual-link depending on your card. Dual-link DVI is NOT the same as dual DVI and you never hook two DVI cables to one monitor (at least not for many practical purposes).

What about the HP LP2465 or NEC LCD2470WNX? They're not as good, but alright for design as well. Although the LCD2470WNX is more expensive than the DoubleSight IPS at least in the US.

The Dell 2408 has bad uniformity issues last I heard.

Originally posted by: TitusTroy
sorry if this question has been asked but this thread is too long to go through every post...I'm in the market for a good LCD gaming monitor--my first LCD in fact after years of CRT's...my CRT has started to exhibit ghosting burn in so I'm in the market for an excellent 21-24' gaming monitor which has excellent color reproduction and is perfect for gaming...any recommendations for something in the $400-$500 range?...Thanks

The ViewSonic VX2435wm pretty much fits the bill but it's $60 over after rebate: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...824116079&Tpk=vx2435wm

Other than that I'm not sure what to tell you. But you could always go for a TN if you don't mind semi-poor viewing angle. BenQ G2400W has nice response time and good default colors, available for $400 (best 24" TN): http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16824014158&Tpk=g2400w

You might like the BenQ better for gaming anyway than the ViewSonic.

 

[TitusTroy]

Originally posted by: xtknight
The ViewSonic VX2435wm pretty much fits the bill but it's $60 over after rebate: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...824116079&Tpk=vx2435wm

Other than that I'm not sure what to tell you. But you could always go for a TN if you don't mind semi-poor viewing angle. BenQ G2400W has nice response time and good default colors, available for $400 (best 24" TN): http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16824014158&Tpk=g2400w

You might like the BenQ better for gaming anyway than the ViewSonic.

the Viewsonic you linked to has an 8ms response time though...I thought 2ms response time was best for gaming, or at most 5ms?...or does it not really matter?

also when they say that 'native resolution' is 1680 x 1050 does that mean that the max resolution I can use with that monitor is 1680 x 1050?...I can't game at 1920 x 1200 (which is my preferred gaming resolution)?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TitusTroy

Originally posted by: xtknight
The ViewSonic VX2435wm pretty much fits the bill but it's $60 over after rebate: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...824116079&Tpk=vx2435wm

Other than that I'm not sure what to tell you. But you could always go for a TN if you don't mind semi-poor viewing angle. BenQ G2400W has nice response time and good default colors, available for $400 (best 24" TN): http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16824014158&Tpk=g2400w

You might like the BenQ better for gaming anyway than the ViewSonic.

the Viewsonic you linked to has an 8ms response time though...I thought 2ms response time was best for gaming, or at most 5ms?...or does it not really matter?

also when they say that 'native resolution' is 1680 x 1050 does that mean that the max resolution I can use with that monitor is 1680 x 1050?...I can't game at 1920 x 1200 (which is my preferred gaming resolution)?

I'm guessing you should read thru the OP (just for your own benefit).

The G2400W (TN, overdriven) is faster than the ViewSonic (VA, slightly slower panel).

But no you can't go higher than native (doing so would result in only marginally higher quality, actually).

 

[TitusTroy]

Originally posted by: xtknightI'm guessing you should read thru the OP (just for your own benefit).

The G2400W (TN, overdriven) is faster than the ViewSonic (VA, slightly slower panel).

But no you can't go higher than native (doing so would result in only marginally higher quality, actually).

so what happens in a few years when gaming is possible at 2400 x 1900 or some crazy resolution like that and I'm stuck with a monitor with a native resolution of only 1900 x 1200 or 1680 x 1050?...I have to then buy a new monitor??...I thought monitors were meant to last for a long time...my CRT has been with me for over 7 years now...so with LCD's I have to change them out every few years to be able to game at high resolutions??

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TitusTroy

Originally posted by: xtknightI'm guessing you should read thru the OP (just for your own benefit).

The G2400W (TN, overdriven) is faster than the ViewSonic (VA, slightly slower panel).

But no you can't go higher than native (doing so would result in only marginally higher quality, actually).

so what happens in a few years when gaming is possible at 2400 x 1900 or some crazy resolution like that and I'm stuck with a monitor with a native resolution of only 1900 x 1200 or 1680 x 1050?...I have to then buy a new monitor??...I thought monitors were meant to last for a long time...my CRT has been with me for over 7 years now...so with LCD's I have to change them out every few years to be able to game at high resolutions??

Gaming is already possible at resolutions like that, it just depends on what games you play and how fast you care to have your graphics. But I can play UT2004 w/ highest settings just fine at a dual monitor config of 3600x1200 (even with 16xAA) on my 7800GT, 60 FPS or higher. I'm not able to confirm 16xAA was enabled but that's what it said in my control panel, anyway.

When you can game at a higher res than your monitor supports, you should enable higher supersampling/antialiasing. That would accomplish the same thing, but usually higher quality, than having the monitor downscale. Still, squeezing a high res on a low res monitor only gains you slightly smoother lines and nothing more.

 

[redlinez33]

Pondering if I should send my planar back and get doublesight.

xtknight do u know if doublesight is a good company in terms of returns etc? Better warranty is nice (with planar) but the $200 savings could be even nicer.

 

[TitusTroy]

so you're saying that I can game at a higher resolution then what my LCD's native resolution is?...that's what I'm confused about...if my LCD's native resolution is 1680 x 1024 can I still game at a resolution such as 1920 x 1200 on it?...or will it look stretched and not very good quality?

 

[Buck Armstrong]

Originally posted by: redlinez33
Pondering if I should send my planar back and get doublesight.

xtknight do u know if doublesight is a good company in terms of returns etc? Better warranty is nice (with planar) but the $200 savings could be even nicer.

I'm curious about this too, because I've never heard of them and their website is pretty basic; not only does the online product description not match the manual, but the site only shows 3 consumer monitors, including the 26" that just appeared there yesterday, at least a week AFTER the product was being sold. Meanwhile, the monitor has the same head and OSD, but a worse warranty and stand (which is why its not height or swivel adjustable).

Also, I found out why the manual seems to be describing another monitor: because it is! Its the Planar manual down to the font! Thats why it shows the wrong base and so on: the drawings are of the PX2611W, not the Doublesight. It even calls the joystick thingie a "4D+1 Key", which is Planar's version of the NEC NaviKey.

Its starting to look like this thing is $699 for a good reason. I'd keep the Planar if I were you...

 

[Gatss]

I have a question for those of you who are the color guru's here.

I used the reviews on this site to purchase a Viewsonic VX2435. I really love it so far. Upon recommendation of xtNight I downloaded the calibration profile from digital versus for my monitor.

I also used the settings for RGB and Brightness that Digital Versus used when calibrating their VX2435.

I didn't see much of a difference when I applied the profile but adjusting the RGB and Brightness made it look better.

Now I am working on a website and I am realizing something, I figure at least 75% of the LCD using population has a TN panel. The person I am designing the site for tells me the graphics are all way too dark when I show him the prototype. I check it on a TN panel I have in my house on another computer and sure enough it is much darker. On my Viewsonic however it looks great.

Are my calibration settings wrong or am I just designing on a better monitor than the majority of people's monitors who will be viewing it? Is my brightness still set too high? I don't have a color calibration device but I am willing to follow any instructions or advice you may have.

Thank you

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TitusTroy
so you're saying that I can game at a higher resolution then what my LCD's native resolution is?...that's what I'm confused about...if my LCD's native resolution is 1680 x 1024 can I still game at a resolution such as 1920 x 1200 on it?...or will it look stretched and not very good quality?

No, you can't have Windows set a higher mode than native...at least not that I'm aware of. I did say raising SSAA would accomplish the same thing, if such a thing as using a higher mode was practically possible. Downscaling yields high quality, not that many artifacts (assuming similar aspect ratio between the two resolutions). It's like watching 1080p on a 1366x768 LCD/plasma.

Originally posted by: Buck Armstrong
I'm curious about this too, because I've never heard of them and their website is pretty basic; not only does the online product description not match the manual, but the site only shows 3 consumer monitors, including the 26" that just appeared there yesterday, at least a week AFTER the product was being sold. Meanwhile, the monitor has the same head and OSD, but a worse warranty and stand (which is why its not height or swivel adjustable).

I don't really know this company's reputation but I don't think it's bad. I've seen many of their monitors get favorable reviews and they tend to use higher quality panel types (VA/IPS).

They originally only sold dual-LCD configs, I believe.

Also, I found out why the manual seems to be describing another monitor: because it is! Its the Planar manual down to the font! Thats why it shows the wrong base and so on: the drawings are of the PX2611W, not the Doublesight. It even calls the joystick thingie a "4D+1 Key", which is Planar's version of the NEC NaviKey.

Its starting to look like this thing is $699 for a good reason. I'd keep the Planar if I were you...

If this is the worst that happened in the LCD world I'd feel privileged.

Height adjustment and swivel can be somewhat substituted for by using a stand, if needed.

They just posted it on the site a couple days ago so maybe they will make a revision to the manual. It still looks like a good deal, to me, even without height and swivel adjusting. I personally rarely use such features.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Gatss
I have a question for those of you who are the color guru's here.

I used the reviews on this site to purchase a Viewsonic VX2435. I really love it so far. Upon recommendation of xtNight I downloaded the calibration profile from digital versus for my monitor.

I also used the settings for RGB and Brightness that Digital Versus used when calibrating their VX2435.

I didn't see much of a difference when I applied the profile but adjusting the RGB and Brightness made it look better.

Now I am working on a website and I am realizing something, I figure at least 75% of the LCD using population has a TN panel. The person I am designing the site for tells me the graphics are all way too dark when I show him the prototype. I check it on a TN panel I have in my house on another computer and sure enough it is much darker. On my Viewsonic however it looks great.

Are my calibration settings wrong or am I just designing on a better monitor than the majority of people's monitors who will be viewing it? Is my brightness still set too high? I don't have a color calibration device but I am willing to follow any instructions or advice you may have.

Thank you

If it's OK I can take a look at the site if you want and tell you how it should look on an sRGB monitor (reference/calibrated IPS). Then we can determine if it's the TN panel's problem or the calibration settings not matching.

You probably need to set the OptiColor mode to something more standard, by the way, when you use those calibration profiles.

That profile does make things look quite dark and contrasty on my LCDs, so it's very possible that calibration doesn't match your monitor.

 

[TVisitor]

So, I got my Planar PX2611W yesterday. I bought it from CDW becuase of their very liberal return/exchange policy. No dead pixels, thankfully. I'm running this off of an 8800GTX, and it looks absolutely stunning. The one thing I have a tough time getting used to is that LCD's can be VERY bright. I have the brightness turned down somewhat, so it's better now. I think I may have to futz with it a bit more (I really haven't run any calibration stuff, not even nVidia's cheapo monitor setup stuff). Yesterday I had noticed that when I had big areas of even color (like backgrounds on web pages) I saw a bit of a ... shimmer, almost like it was waves when you threw a pebble in the water. It was very subtle. Today, I don't see that at all. I've played Portal & Quake III on it so far, and I really like it! The 4D+1 joystick isn't *that* bad. After I get my monitor tweaked, don't bother with setup again. It's not like you're using it constantly.

 

[TempletonPeck]

I'm looking for some advice/help in selecting an LCD monitor.

The main problem I have, is that I can only fit a certain sized LCD with my current desk setup. It's enclosed on the sides, where the monitor needs to go, so it limits the width, height is not an issue. The back is open, so depth is not an issue.

I'm looking at a 20" LCD, as that is what will fit, a 22" LCD is too big.

I've ruled out a IPS or VA panel at this point due to both price and availability.

I'm in Canada (specifically BC) and I'd prefer to get a monitor locally, so I can exchange, get repairs (if necessary) and try out different models with ease. Also, not having to pay shipping is helpful and no restocking fees at the stores I'm looking at purchasing from is also a bonus.

Also, the only reason I'd want to order online, is to try and get a IPS or VA panel which don't seem to be in stores anywhere locally. The ones I've are usually out of my price range at the moment and are often not available to order, like with the Dell LCD, which will take 3+ weeks to just ship. Not something I want to have to deal with if I need an exchange for any reason.

NCIX doesn't seem to have any and although tigerdirect, has some, the prices are all high, plus I have to pay $50 shipping from them, then add in tax and the $12 EHF for BC and you get the point. There are other online stores probably, but I can't find any at the moment and I want to deal with a trusted dealer, also like I mentioned before there are benefits to dealing locally (including time saved and no restocking fees). Not to mention you can return a monitor for ANY reason within 14 days.

Now to discount some models I've tried and returned already.

From the recommended list, I had the:

HP w2007.

Issues: 1 year warranty only. Also, what I'd describe as dithering issues maybe? Darker colours (especially grey) would show a checkerboard like pattern in video and even on the desktop, like in windows explorer, IE, firefox, etc. The bezel/frame on it would also make a strange cracking noise every 20 seconds or so and I couldn't make it stop. I didn't really like the bezel on it, besides the sound it made, it looked easily breakable.

I also tried the Samsung 206bw.

Issues: terrible colours, for example, light blue looked turquoise in Windows and I couldn't get it calibrated no matter how hard I tried. I probably needed a colour wheel and software, but I didn't have the money for that. It also seemed to run hot after only a short period of time, unlike other LCDs I had tested. The software made my computer crash on shutdown ever time as well. The back panel/cable cover didn't fit right and would fall off (not a huge deal), but did show the bad quality control of Samsung.

I also tried two LG monitors. The L222WT-BF (it fit on my desk, although it's a 21.6" screen, only some select LG in that size seem to have the right measurement to fit) and the L20WTQ-BF.

Issues: With the L20WTQ-BF, the 2ms response time came with RTC errors that I could clearly see in any video playback and also during some gaming. Other than that, it seemed like a decent monitor, but I couldn't stand having artifacts in video (lines down peoples face). The Samsung panel also had this, but it let you turn off the overdrive through its software, whereas LG's software won't let you.

With the L222WT-BF (I tried this because it had 5ms response time (no overdrive) and I was hoping it would be same quality as the L20WTQ aside from that. However, the picture was very washed out and the professional reviews I saw on it said the same. It also had the same dithering effect the HP monitor had (I'm wondering if that has anything to do with my video card, or if it's a normal problem because I haven't heard much about it from anyone else).

All of these monitors had the obvious TN viewing angle limitations and some backlight bleed, both of which I can live with. All of the preceding monitors were hooked up via DVI, although I also tried out the VGA on a couple.

So onto monitors I'm looking at now to try now maybe. Basically a list of monitors available to purchase that haven't been discounted (due to size limitations) or tried already.


Acer 20": X203WBD

Samsung 20": 2032GW

LG 22": L226WTQ (is 22", but has dimensions that will fit over any other 22" I've seen) I'm not sure about this monitor because I've been told by others who have had it that there are 3 different panel types and 4-5 different firmware revisions and it's basically a crap shoot to get the right one. If you get the wrong firmware version, you get RTC errors. I'm not sure on the colour quality of the panels themselves.

BenQ 20": G2000W

Dell 20": SP2008WP (probably discounted because xtknight says these are a cheap series of monitors).

Viewsonic 20": VA2026w (value series, not too keen on the sound of that)


I'd prefer a 20", but a couple 19" monitors:

ASUS 19": VW192T

VIEWSONIC 19": NX1932W (has a TV-tuner, supports 1440x900, but is more of a TV I believe with a computer connection available).

Any of these monitors even worth a look?

based on reviews or just opinion is fine.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TempletonPeck
I'm looking for some advice/help in selecting an LCD monitor.

The main problem I have, is that I can only fit a certain sized LCD with my current desk setup. It's enclosed on the sides, where the monitor needs to go, so it limits the width, height is not an issue. The back is open, so depth is not an issue.

I'm looking at a 20" LCD, as that is what will fit, a 22" LCD is too big.

I've ruled out a IPS or VA panel at this point due to both price and availability.

I'm in Canada (specifically BC) and I'd prefer to get a monitor locally, so I can exchange, get repairs (if necessary) and try out different models with ease. Also, not having to pay shipping is helpful and no restocking fees at the stores I'm looking at purchasing from is also a bonus.

Also, the only reason I'd want to order online, is to try and get a IPS or VA panel which don't seem to be in stores anywhere locally. The ones I've are usually out of my price range at the moment and are often not available to order, like with the Dell LCD, which will take 3+ weeks to just ship. Not something I want to have to deal with if I need an exchange for any reason.

NCIX doesn't seem to have any and although tigerdirect, has some, the prices are all high, plus I have to pay $50 shipping from them, then add in tax and the $12 EHF for BC and you get the point. There are other online stores probably, but I can't find any at the moment and I want to deal with a trusted dealer, also like I mentioned before there are benefits to dealing locally (including time saved and no restocking fees). Not to mention you can return a monitor for ANY reason within 14 days.

Now to discount some models I've tried and returned already.

From the recommended list, I had the:

HP w2007.

Issues: 1 year warranty only. Also, what I'd describe as dithering issues maybe? Darker colours (especially grey) would show a checkerboard like pattern in video and even on the desktop, like in windows explorer, IE, firefox, etc. The bezel/frame on it would also make a strange cracking noise every 20 seconds or so and I couldn't make it stop. I didn't really like the bezel on it, besides the sound it made, it looked easily breakable.

I also tried the Samsung 206bw.

Issues: terrible colours, for example, light blue looked turquoise in Windows and I couldn't get it calibrated no matter how hard I tried. I probably needed a colour wheel and software, but I didn't have the money for that. It also seemed to run hot after only a short period of time, unlike other LCDs I had tested. The software made my computer crash on shutdown ever time as well. The back panel/cable cover didn't fit right and would fall off (not a huge deal), but did show the bad quality control of Samsung.

I also tried two LG monitors. The L222WT-BF (it fit on my desk, although it's a 21.6" screen, only some select LG in that size seem to have the right measurement to fit) and the L20WTQ-BF.

Issues: With the L20WTQ-BF, the 2ms response time came with RTC errors that I could clearly see in any video playback and also during some gaming. Other than that, it seemed like a decent monitor, but I couldn't stand having artifacts in video (lines down peoples face). The Samsung panel also had this, but it let you turn off the overdrive through its software, whereas LG's software won't let you.

With the L222WT-BF (I tried this because it had 5ms response time (no overdrive) and I was hoping it would be same quality as the L20WTQ aside from that. However, the picture was very washed out and the professional reviews I saw on it said the same. It also had the same dithering effect the HP monitor had (I'm wondering if that has anything to do with my video card, or if it's a normal problem because I haven't heard much about it from anyone else).

All of these monitors had the obvious TN viewing angle limitations and some backlight bleed, both of which I can live with. All of the preceding monitors were hooked up via DVI, although I also tried out the VGA on a couple.

So onto monitors I'm looking at now to try now maybe. Basically a list of monitors available to purchase that haven't been discounted (due to size limitations) or tried already.


Acer 20": X203WBD

Samsung 20": 2032GW

LG 22": L226WTQ (is 22", but has dimensions that will fit over any other 22" I've seen) I'm not sure about this monitor because I've been told by others who have had it that there are 3 different panel types and 4-5 different firmware revisions and it's basically a crap shoot to get the right one. If you get the wrong firmware version, you get RTC errors. I'm not sure on the colour quality of the panels themselves.

BenQ 20": G2000W

Dell 20": SP2008WP (probably discounted because xtknight says these are a cheap series of monitors).

Viewsonic 20": VA2026w (value series, not too keen on the sound of that)


I'd prefer a 20", but a couple 19" monitors:

ASUS 19": VW192T

VIEWSONIC 19": NX1932W (has a TV-tuner, supports 1440x900, but is more of a TV I believe with a computer connection available).

Any of these monitors even worth a look?

based on reviews or just opinion is fine.

I'd give the BenQ G2000W a look, since the G2400W had good default colors. The L226WTQ and then 2032GW should be your next choices, I think. Other than that, I don't really know. Hopefully one of those is suitable for you. The Samsung might be good but I hear if you get a CMO panel you still get a blue tinge (although you might be able to find a profile to correct this).

This is the kind of stuff you have to deal with, with most TN panels.

 

[Buck Armstrong]

Originally posted by: xtknight
I don't really know this company's reputation but I don't think it's bad. I've seen many of their monitors get favorable reviews and they tend to use higher quality panel types (VA/IPS).

They originally only sold dual-LCD configs, I believe.

If this is the worst that happened in the LCD world I'd feel privileged.

Height adjustment and swivel can be somewhat substituted for by using a stand, if needed.

They just posted it on the site a couple days ago so maybe they will make a revision to the manual. It still looks like a good deal, to me, even without height and swivel adjusting. I personally rarely use such features.

Hey don't get me wrong...I'd take a 26" IPS over any other monitor available for $699 or less!

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TVisitor
So, I got my Planar PX2611W yesterday. I bought it from CDW becuase of their very liberal return/exchange policy. No dead pixels, thankfully. I'm running this off of an 8800GTX, and it looks absolutely stunning. The one thing I have a tough time getting used to is that LCD's can be VERY bright. I have the brightness turned down somewhat, so it's better now. I think I may have to futz with it a bit more (I really haven't run any calibration stuff, not even nVidia's cheapo monitor setup stuff). Yesterday I had noticed that when I had big areas of even color (like backgrounds on web pages) I saw a bit of a ... shimmer, almost like it was waves when you threw a pebble in the water. It was very subtle. Today, I don't see that at all. I've played Portal & Quake III on it so far, and I really like it! The 4D+1 joystick isn't *that* bad. After I get my monitor tweaked, don't bother with setup again. It's not like you're using it constantly.

Good to know. I'm not sure what's going on with the shimmer though.

Most 20WMGX2 owners loved the joystick setup. Why, is the PX2611W's worse or something?

 

[Buck Armstrong]

Originally posted by: xtknight

Originally posted by: TVisitor
So, I got my Planar PX2611W yesterday. I bought it from CDW becuase of their very liberal return/exchange policy. No dead pixels, thankfully. I'm running this off of an 8800GTX, and it looks absolutely stunning. The one thing I have a tough time getting used to is that LCD's can be VERY bright. I have the brightness turned down somewhat, so it's better now. I think I may have to futz with it a bit more (I really haven't run any calibration stuff, not even nVidia's cheapo monitor setup stuff). Yesterday I had noticed that when I had big areas of even color (like backgrounds on web pages) I saw a bit of a ... shimmer, almost like it was waves when you threw a pebble in the water. It was very subtle. Today, I don't see that at all. I've played Portal & Quake III on it so far, and I really like it! The 4D+1 joystick isn't *that* bad. After I get my monitor tweaked, don't bother with setup again. It's not like you're using it constantly.

Good to know. I'm not sure what's going on with the shimmer though.

Most 20WMGX2 owners loved the joystick setup. Why, is the PX2611W's worse or something?

It's not exactly "worse", in fact its bigger, sturdier, and easier to access than the NECs. The problem is that it sometimes doesn't seem as responsive and/or precise, so you might have to push it twice, or make sure you're pushing straight up rather than slightly to the side, etc.

 

[TitusTroy]

what about the BenQ FP241VW monitor?...I hear a lot of good things about it...some even compare it to the NEC 2490...it also doesn't use the TN panel correct?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: TitusTroy
what about the BenQ FP241VW monitor?...I hear a lot of good things about it...some even compare it to the NEC 2490...it also doesn't use the TN panel correct?

Yeah although look at the VW's input lag: http://www.digitalversus.com/d...&mo2=149&p2=1606&ph=12

Not a gaming LCD I think, compared to the G2400W. Most VAs have around that amount of input lag so it's up to you. Many people don't think VAs are even worth it over TNs because they possess their own viewing angle problems, not to mention higher price/more lag and not always better color accuracy.

 

[redlinez33]

People must be crazy if they think TNs look better than a good VA panel.....................

Input lag is really the killing factor for VAs.