[Retired] The LCD Thread

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xtknight

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Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: goten903
was wondering if anyone could comment on the dell 2408wfp compared to the double sight ds-263n ?

The DS-263N is a better choice due to the H-IPS panel: wider viewing angle, faster response time, less input lag.

Originally posted by: leftheaded
i just came across a deal for the dell 3008WFP for $1500, but honestly, the only thing holding me back from it is because i don't see it on the first post here! LOL I was wanting the LCD3090, but not for more than $1600. so, here i am. should i just get the dell?

edit - i'll be using it for photo/video editing, internet browsing & general office work, some high res gaming, & watching HDTV via satellite (in that order)

The 3008WFP is good if you need connectivity. I may recommend it here. The 3007WFP-HC is a much better deal if you don't need the myriad of inputs. See if your tuner can output VGA or DVI/HDMI w/ or w/o HDCP.

Originally posted by: goten903
okay hopefuly someone can help me, went to the store tonight, they had the 24 inch 2408h hp , didnt have the gateway fhd2400.

i personaly really love the glossy screen and want a 24 inch. i see the gateway listed in the gaming section but dont see the hp 2408h listed any place.

is the 2408h just a poor monitor or not as good as the gateway?

also noticed the hp has a vga and hdmi hook up no dvi. so guess id have to get a dvi to hdmi adapter, was wondering if this causes any issues?

any help would be greatly appreciated

The 2408 is not too bad. I saw the Gateway FHD24 in person the other day and actually I was quite impressed. I am not sure how the HP stacks up to it, but PRAD gave it a favorable review.

Originally posted by: Black Sheep
There is so much good info here my brain hurts... but being who I am I threw caution to the wind and bought an Acer AL2416Wbsd... I really wanted a 24" Widescreen LCD, but $500+ was over my budget. So, I picked this one up for $350 at my local TigerDirect but only after I looked over their demo unit for 3 days. Now that I have it home I can see that I have been deceived... I knew going in that this was a TN panel, but my limited experience didn't send up any flags when I did not notice any color shift when tilting or viewing the demo model at different angles... their demo must be an older version when they used PVA panels. This one color shifts as soon as I move off center in the least... live and learn...

I mostly use my PC for web browsing, Word, Excel, and home office type stuff. But I do dabble in photo and graphics editing for the web. Should I decide to return this monitor, what would be a better choice for under $400? I'd love to have the 26" DoubleSight monitor, but that is about double my budget...

For [around] $400 you'll want to look at the Westinghouse L2410NM. Otherwise, you've basically got no choice but TNs. The Soyo 24" PVA is an (albeit unreliable) option for around $300 if that's still available, and I believe Hyundai has a W240 PVA model.

Originally posted by: Tradewell
**** How big of a difference is there between the 2490 and the 2690. I'm a daytrader and want the easiest on the eyes monitor. I do a lot of research and great text is very important.

Color is also important but I am not a pro photo user. The 2690 in the review states there are some horizontal lines. Are those lines present on the 2490?

I think the 2490 is free of the lines.

Which monitor is clearer? If I go with the 2490 is it worth giving up the larger text and wide gamut of the 2690 for a clearer no horizontial lines monitor???

Honestly the horizontal lines are very faint. I would go for the 2690 and get bigger text. The wide gamut will make things nice and bright, although not always accurate (for sRGB photos) w/o a profile. It doesn't sound like you'll be doing 'sRGB work'.

I sit about 20inches away from the monitors. I have a 2405 dell and an older Sony 20.1 as well as an older 23inch Apple. The NEC will replace one of the monitors.

THanks.

Then you will want to make sure the font is big enough as the different in text/image size between the 2690 and 2490 is not that great.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: iamap
Originally posted by: billingsgate
In my aging eyes text looked clearer on the 2490 monitor, especially smaller fonts, mainly because the slightly larger pixels on the 2690 did give them more of a jagged appearance.

Actually, I think that might help me decide which monitor I'll be buying too. I've been stuck trying to decide on different monitors but I think my eyes might like the 24 better now.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...82E16824155056&bop=And

I think I'll get the BenQ 24" now. Thanks for the input, even if it was regarding other monitors.

The BenQ is the good choice between those.

Originally posted by: billingsgate
Question about color calibrators!

First, thanks to xtknight and others for steering me through the confusing task of choosing my first LCD monitor for graphics and animation work. I got the NEC LCD2490WUXi and so far am delighted with it.

Now I wonder whether anyone can steer me to some trustworthy professional reviews of color calibrators. I need to set up some accurate-as-possible profiles for photo, graphics and TV (NTSC and PAL) output. Looking at the common calibration hardware - Huey, EyeOne and Sypder 2 and 3 - all the reviews on Amazon and elsewhere tend to vary from praising each one to the skies down to blaming it for all the evils upon this earth. Most reviews focus way too much on customer service. I just want some recommendations as to which one actually works best.

If someone can point me to reliable professional reviews, or has advice to offer, I would appreciate it.

You have an NEC, which means you can get the SpectraView hardware calibration kit, including colorimeter and software for about $300. That is the best option for the NEC 2490 and 2690.

If you are looking for something more economical, you can't go wrong with the Eye One Display 2 from Gretag-Macbeth or Pantone. And you can get the NEC SpectraView software alone for $100. You can combine that with the i1 Display 2, which is what I did. I don't think the colorimeter included in the $300 package is any different, maybe slightly, than the i1 Display 2.

The Spyder (Pro) and Eye One are at roughly the same level. I would say the Eye One has better software support and also I believe the Spyder has some issues with SpectraView or the wide gamut monitors and also glossy ones.

I don't know about PAL but I did see NTSC support in SpectraView. You will be able to cover roughly 72% of NTSC with the 2490.

Originally posted by: Tradewell
Billingsgate..

Are you using clear Type or just standard. Is it just the text or is the overall monitor sharper (2490 vs 2690) because of the larger pixels. Thanks.

The 2490 gives you sharpness, but[/i] only largeness when you increase the font size in the software. If you can do that and still have enough desktop real estate, then the 2490 is better. If not, then get the 2690.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: goten903
im going tonight to look at the hp 2408h compared to the fhd gateway 2400. really leaning towards one of those since i like the glossy screen.

Ill probly take a look at the lg 22 inch l227wtg-pf but was really leaning to one of the first 2 since i wanted a 24 inch.


any opinions would be great really. mostly use it for gaming

Your best bet is to see them in person but if you have any observations that would be great. I have not heard much about how these models compare.

Originally posted by: DukeFan21
Anyone have any experience or things to say about a Samsung T220HD? I just got a PS3 and want to be able to take advantage of it's HD capabilities; my old 17" Dell and 20" Trinitron tube TV cannot do this (this is in my bedroom, mind you). My original intention was to simply replace my PC monitor with a 22 or 24" LCD with an HDMI input so I could connect my PS3 to it.

However, I came across the T220HD and was intrigued by the fact that it had a built in HDTV tuner and was just within my budget at $400. It also had 2 HDMI inputs, DVI, VGA, and component inputs along with other audio input and outputs. With this I could instead replace my TV and and hook my PS3 up to it. Frankly my PC gaming has dropped off and don't mind my current 17", so the idea of upgrading my TV seems more attractive to me.

I haven't been able to find many reviews on it, aside from the 8 user reviews on Newegg. Is this monitor essentially the same as the T220 with added inputs and a HDTV tuner? I haven't seen it in the stores around here so I can't get a look at it for myself.

The T220 monitors have TN panels. That is something to keep in mind if you are coming from a CRT and expect wide angles. However, the T220HD is one of very few monitors that also have tuners. (There are a few TV models around this size that can also be hooked up to the PC, unfortunately I don't know much about these.)

If I were you I would go to the store and check out the 22" models they have on display. They will all be TNs, which you can tell by ducking and looking at the lower angle and seeing the LCD get very dark/inverted. If you think the lateral and vertical angles are fine for you, then pull the trigger on the T220HD.

Keep in mind this HD tuner does not support CableCard or encryption. As far as I know it will tune Clear QAM (unencrypted US cable channels) or 8VSB (terrestrial, over-the-air US). If you have digital cable or satellite and expect to be able to directly tune into it, you're probably out of luck. You may be able to get local channels through the cable but that's it. With that in mind see if that's still a model you want to get.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: kreidel
What are some of the better 20" LCD's on the market now that are S-IPS?

The Apple Cinema 20" is an option (sure S-IPS).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16824176053&Tpk=lp2065 (mostly S-IPS, known to have some AMVAs)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...4002138&Tpk=lcd2090uxi (sure S-IPS)

Other than that, there is very little except even more expensive LCDs (from LaCie?)

Originally posted by: iamap
Originally posted by: xtknight
I don't go off of specifications, only reviews, so unfortunately I wouldn't be able to tell you the differences. In my mind there is not a single specification you can trust, except viewing angle, which indicates whether it is a TN, VA, or IPS panel (if you pay attention to what contrast ratio the viewing angle was measured at, 5:1 or 10:1). The brightness rating is usually reliable too, but that's about it.
I can only go by specs and reviews. It's not like I can try them all out either.


The HP LP2465 and ViewSonic VX2435wm are good VA panel choices.

And if you don't edit photos (sRGB) for a living, the Dell 2408 is probably the best choice due to the wide gamut backlight.
I don't do photo editing but, unfortunately, those are all 20-50% more expensive than the BenQ 24" or the KDS 26" that I was looking at and, again, I don't see much difference in the specs that can't be trusted anyway.

I thought I had decided on the BenQ 24" but now I'm looking at 4 monitors, instead of 2, and now I'm even more confused. What's the difference between DC 4000:1(1000:1) and 1000:1?

DC means Dynamic Contrast. That means it can do this at 4000:1 and then it has a static contrast ratio of 1000:1. The other does not support dynamic contrast, which most people do not like or use anyway. It can conserve power but often results in too drastic of brightness changes while watching different things. The brightness is changed depending on the scene to maximize contrast.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...2359%2CN82E16824116123

1) The BenQ 24 has the smallest pixel DPI but also the smallest brightness spec and free shipping. (not many reviews (5 total) on newegg but most are excellent)

2) The NEC 24 has the wider "advertised" viewing angles and is brighter but it has midrange refresh rates and it has a larger pixel DPI than the other 24" panel. (Many reviews say it's a tn with poor viewing angles but mostly excellent reviews (51 total) on newegg)

The difference in DPI doesn't look right to me with the same diagonal rating and resolution. It should be 0.270mm. for 24" at 1920x1200. These angles are measured at just 5:1, so they are the same as the BenQ (TN-ish).

3) The KDS 26 has midrange brightness, slightly better H-viewing angles but lower refresh rates. (A few complaints about back lighting issues but many excellent reviews (28 total) too)

4) The ViewSonic 26 is bright but more expensive and it has midrange refresh rates than the rest but I can only assume it uses a larger pixel DPI like the other 26" monitors. (Not many (5 total) but fair to good reviews on newegg)

The 26" monitors are tempting due to their size vs cost compared to the 24's but I'm completely confused now. I'm glad I didn't order yet.

The refresh rates will all be 60 Hz on these models (and 99% of LCDs). I have not seen an LCD over 22" with a higher refresh rate than 60 Hz.

EDIT:
After re-reading the OP it seems refresh rates aren't that important and aging eyes might like the larger DPI so now I'm leaning towards the KDS 26" and the NEC 24" (in that order) due to the number of positive reviews and comparable specs.

2nd Edit:
After doing more searching I found a KDS review at hardforum and another forum and it's looking better and better. I was considering the Samsung 2493hm until I read that it doesn't scale to 16:9 well (the BenQ G2400WD does) and I don't think the KDS has that problem. Does anyone know of scaling issues with the NEC ASLCD24WMCX-BK, ViewSonic VX2640w or the HP w2408h? If it's just down to the BenQ24 and the KDS26, I'll most likely go for the KDS.

Maybe you should just try the KDS because the DPI of the 24" NEC will probably be the same as other 24"s.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: Lightning983
Okay, i've posted a couple questions on a couple of other forums, but the best answer i get is that i should never buy a 24" TN monitor

Which is exactly what i want to do

So out of these what do you this is the best one?

Dell E248WFP
Samsung SM 245B
BENQ G2400W

Or from the next price range:

Dell 2407WFP-HC
Dell 2408WF
HP LP2465
ViewSonic VX2435wm
BENQ FP 241WZ


The use of the screen will mostly be gaming/watching movies... and occasional CAD/CAM work. I'll probably be the sole user, so viewing angles aren't really that important to me (also from what i see, a friend has a 22" Samsung TN, and i don't mind the viewing angles at all)

A 24" doesn't sound bad for gaming/some movies and CAD. So, I would recommend the G2400W. Easy choice there. The E248..yuck..not that. The 245B is OK, not as good as the G2400W.

In the next range, the 2408 is the best IMO. (But if you can actually find the FP241WZ that's my next choice.) Not the 2407...too much ghosting.

Originally posted by: thestain
xtknight,

In regards to my original post and your reply:

Originally posted by: thestain

Hi xtknight,

I bought a couple NEC Multisync 20WMGX2's a while back and on my dad's I get this video input blue box that pops up and stays on for a while unless you wait long enough or hit the menu key on the remote. This occurs if you log off and want to log back on and the box actually blocks the log in area.. and it just doesn't like to go away.. it is very annoying.

I know you have owned the monitor. Did you ever have this problem? Any idea on how to get this blue 2 3/4 inches wide by 1 1/4 inch high video input box from displaying in the just below center middle part of the Monitor or to at least make it go away faster???


I have this problem with unsupported resolutions or modes. I would point at the problem being your video card or driver, first.

I did not notice any way to get around it, but many monitors also limit menu options in unsupported modes, or show an annoying message, etc. I'm not really sure why.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I forgot to mention that this is not the resolution notifier, but simply one that tells you what you are looking at.. video input then 1 PC-1 or 2 PC-2 with drawing of dvi-d for example or if you turn to tv, then it tells you the channel you are on and that you are watching tv, like 3 TV CH 3.

I have tried swapping out cards and updating drivers, but nothing has helped.

Well I do know the TV one stays up for awhile while it tries to acquire and sync into an analog signal. But once it's there it should switch quickly. If you can't get it to go away with pressing SELECT constantly for five seconds then I'd say something is wrong. And if you mean it's staying there while you're watching the channel for over 5 secs, it's probably defective. Make sure your signal is strong enough, else it will just keep staying there. But, as long as the TV isn't flashing in and on and staticy, your signal should be fine.

So it is most likely defective if it's staying there for over 5 seconds. See if you can get any more details on this.
 

iamap

Junior Member
Jun 21, 2008
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Originally posted by: xtknight
Maybe you should just try the KDS because the DPI of the 24" NEC will probably be the same as other 24"s.

After talking blix into more testing, I've finally decided on the KDS K-2626mdhwb - 26" monitor. After bugging him for days to get scaling tests, the results show it's scales 1080p, 1:1 with zero overscan.

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1304046

This means that it'll be good for PC, gaming consoles and/or external blu-ray players with excellent picture quality and no stretching nor cropping. Being a tn it doesn't have the best viewing angles but it has good gaming performance. All in all, $400.00 for the KDS 26" seems like a no-brainer to me.

Thanks, everyone, for all of the input...



 

albovin

Member
Jan 15, 2008
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Originally posted by: iamap
Originally posted by: xtknight
Maybe you should just try the KDS because the DPI of the 24" NEC will probably be the same as other 24"s.

After talking blix into more testing, I've finally decided on the KDS K-2626mdhwb - 26" monitor. After bugging him for days to get scaling tests, the results show it's scales 1080p, 1:1 with zero overscan.

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1304046

This means that it'll be good for PC, gaming consoles and/or external blu-ray players with excellent picture quality and no stretching nor cropping. Being a tn it doesn't have the best viewing angles but it has good gaming performance. All in all, $400.00 for the KDS 26" seems like a no-brainer to me.

Thanks, everyone, for all of the input...

This means that it'll be good for PC, gaming consoles and/or external blu-ray players with excellent picture quality and no stretching nor cropping.

It means nothing related to 1080p support or overscan.
This is a simple exercise to see how PC videocard works.
Testing for hardware video support/blu-ray/PS3 is totally different.
 

iamap

Junior Member
Jun 21, 2008
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OK, if you say so. I have neither a gaming console nor a blu-ray player (yet) but I feel better after seeing the test so that's still the monitor I'm getting.
 

Teslacoiled

Member
May 1, 2001
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Hi,
I read every single post containing the word G2400W in this thread. About 11 very informative pages. Thank you xtknight, 10e and others, you really helped! I only have one question:

-I've already decided to buy the G2400W, and I want to know if I will be sitting 2-3 feet away from the monitor, will I be bothered by the TN's viewing angle? I can't find any 24'' LCD (TN or not) on display in any store. so I can't try them.

I live in Ukraine, if it helps. I will mostly use this LCD for work (mostly writing content for my websites and a little bit of designing), some movie watching, occasional gaming (I hope to play once a week, but I haven't had the time to do that for months now ).

I have a Sony F520 in another room for "serious stuff" like photo editing, so a TN is more than enough for me right now. As for the budget, not more than the G2400W! I just need the high resolution for multiple windows.

Thanks!
 

goten903

Junior Member
Jun 23, 2008
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well after trying the lg 227wtg, 2408h and the gatewayfhd2400, i absolutly love the hp 2408h. one feature i found pretty neat on it so far, it has an ambient light sensor that changes how bright the monitor is based on the lighting around you, pretty neat feature and if you dont like it you can turn it off. Also been testing it in some games so far no issues there. id say prads review about it is right on. thanks everyone
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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Originally posted by: iamap
Blix at hardforums tested 16:9 scaling and the KDS 26" has 0% overscan. That's the one it looks like I'm ordering.

Cool. That makes me not as hesitant to recommend a brand I'm not quite as comfortable with. (Assuming you get that 1:1 thing cleared up.)

Originally posted by: hotstocks
I really wanted to know if my monitor had a problem or not, so I brought my xbox (easier than PC) to Best Buy and tried it on the Samsung 2493 and Gateway FHD2400. I must say the BenQ V2400W is by far the sharpest picture, but the Gateway had a setting called Saturation, and the Samsung had a setting called Color, and they both actually worked and were not greyed out of the menu! Anyways, I do not believe that any TN monitor will have vibrant colors like on my PVA panel or Sony HDTV. I liked the Gateway's glossy look and complete control of the color saturation, hue, etc., but it had horrible vertical viewing angle problems. So, I guess no TN is going to be perfect for games, BenQ COULD have done it by allowing the user to control the color saturation like Gateway does, but with a far sharper panel. I guess I'll have to hope the future will bring a PVA or IPS panel that is not 2-3 frames behind reality with a 47ms response+lag time (when they advertise it as 6ms, yeah right). Well, I guess as of the present time, you can't have your cake and eat it too with 24" HDMI,DVI monitors. It is a tough choice between fast and dingy or slow and beautifully colored. When shelling out $500, we shouldn't have to compromise (or eat magic mushrooms to make the colors come out), there should just be a color control like on a 50 year old t.v. Why can't any company get it right? I have heard rumors about a Doublesight 24" panel that is a PVA or IPS, does HDMI and DVI, and has been claimed to have low lag, but when I looked at some test sites it showed about a 38ms response/lag, which is what I would have expected. I would return this if I though something better was coming out soon, but I don't think anything will. People playing their XBOX's and PS3s on their new Sony or Samsung 1080p beautiful screens with the "Game" function on and the false 6ms advertising have no clue that they are in reality 3 frames behind me and that puts 3 bullets in them. That is why I don't multiplayer game on my PVS panel or HDTV. I was hoping BenQ would solve all my problems, so close; what I would do for just a color or saturation setting on this thing...

Yup this just goes to show you no LCD is perfect.

Originally posted by: slayer305
This is a kinda ghetto input lag test I did for my Samsung 275T.

Tested against my LG L204WT, a TN panel with about zero input lag.

Used my webcam to take the shots laugh but it still gave recognisable results mainly because one monitor is so much slower than the other.

Results are below, L204WT is on the left and 275T is on the right:

http://img518.imageshack.us/im.../8864/picture80bz8.jpg

http://img515.imageshack.us/im.../1917/picture81dh4.jpg

http://img179.imageshack.us/im.../3232/picture86tu1.jpg

http://img238.imageshack.us/im.../8785/picture84hs2.jpg


So the 275T has roughly 50 ms or 3 frames of input lag.


Additionally, when I used the display's built-in scaler instead of the graphics card scaler, input lag jumped to 70 ms or 4 frames.

There's of course an error of +/- 10ms due to the camera but isn't much compared to the 50 and 70 ms delay measured between the two monitors.

Thank you. I'm sure this will be helpful for prospective 275T buyers.

Originally posted by: hotstocks
Yes, I am going to keep it. The BenQ store will open Monday, they are moving this weekend.
The V2400W has pro's and con's, but I believe it is the best 24" Multimedia Monitor out as of now. It is a problem that all the bright well colored displays that are best for movies and games are NOT TN panels. You don't see Sony or Samsung making their HDTVs out of TN panels since the viewing angles are poor, there is colorshift, and the colors are just not as bright (or as many, so you see lines in gradiation of colors). But since gaming is a secondary priority on a HDTV, the slower more beautifull PVA, MVA, and IPS screens will be used. Until the figure out how to get those panels quicker, there will always be a 2-3 frame lag, despite their advertising of 6 or 8 ms. Now comparing the V2400W to all other 24" TN monitors I have seen, I must say it has the least color shift and best viewing angles. I prefer the glossy look of the Gateway, but it has HORRENDOUS vertical viewing angle problems. The V2400W is also the sharpest text and works great over DVI on the PC with the RGB setting. The screen has accurate colors and doesn't burn your eyes out. Now the problem comes in when you actually want to use a TN monitor for games and to some extent movies. They are all too dark color wise, and if you turn up the brightness/contrast to the max, you just wash out the colors. I have found that using the four different settings and switching between them is mandatory. As I have said, RGB mode works best for the desktop. Dynamic mode (which is supposed to be bright and colorfull for games, isn't) can be tweaked with a little extra brightness/contrast to be usable in some games and movies. Movie and Photo modes are ok for some t.v./movie watching, yet sometimes are too dark/dull, I don't use them much. The big discovery was that STANDARD mode is the only mode that you can actually go in and change the color saturation! So I set it to USER Mode and brightness 100, contrast 80, sharpness 1, red 94, green 90, and blue 88. This works pretty good for the XBOX 360 and PC games, I would still like more color and brightness (neon look) in games like on a CRT, but it is what it is. Your desktop will look all bright and bleached out, so make sure to go back to RGB mode for computer use. Most games now look pretty good, but dark games are still a huge problem. This is the only con I have found for the monitor. Forget about seeing anything in dark games like Doom 3, Prey, etc. Live with the fact that glowing swords and neon signs in games like Devil May Cry and Ninja Gaiden will just not look as good as with a CRT or good 1080p LCD HDTV. I love the response time and see no ghosting or lag. I have tried the 2ms AMA feature and can't see any difference at all, so I leave it off, because it does make a little weird ghosting when you move windows around. I also leave the dynamic contrast off, as it is totally useless once you have your STANDARD and DYNAMIC modes set the way you like them. The thin panel of the V2400W doesn't really matter to me since I don't look at the back of my monitor, and I don't like the fact that there is about a 5 degree tilt to the right on my panel. I think it was dumb to make the monitor stand not "standard" so that you can tilt it. I am hoping that the way the stand is too the right, in due time gravity and weight will lower the left side 5 degrees so I have an even panel height. BenQ, put the damn stand in the middle! So, If it is true that the G2400WD is the same exact panel in a more standard casing, for less money, I would get that one. But I always think newer is better and bought the V2400W just in case. All that being said, I have a perfect panel with no dead or stuck pixels or blemishes, so I am keeping it...........Until something better comes along. Now back to Halo 3.

There actually is a PVA with 0 ms input lag (the Iolair). I'm not sure how they did it, and I haven't seen any other models like it though. I've never heard of the brand either.

http://www.behardware.com/arti...th-iolair-vs-dell.html
 

Chronoshock

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
4,860
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Right now I'm in the market for a new monitor as my 2001FP had a good run but it's dying. An entire 2 inch band on the left side artifacts in any sort of heat (>80F ambient) I'm guessing due to dead/dying caps. When the temp goes even higher, the entire left half starts blurring, its pretty bad. Even before the artifacting occurred, I had some image persistence at the top and bottom of the monitor (all of these problems occurred slightly 3 years after I bought the monitor, so out of warranty). It's definitely time for something new.

Anyways, my usage will likely be 50% gaming, 30% office work, 20% multimedia. My budget is fairly loose, but looking for under 1000. I'm looking at the 25.5" choices, namely the NEC 2690, the DoubleSight DS-263N, and the Planar PX2611W. I've glanced at a few reviews and skimmed the thread, and, while I would like to spend more time reading professional reviews and user impressions, I'd like to make a quick decision.
I have a 10% cashback coupon for ebay which expires today, and using the 20% cashback promotion (see Hot Deals), I could get a new PX2611W for 600 shipped. No one is selling the DS-263N on ebay. A new LCD2690WUXi would wind up around 860 after coupons. Seeing as this would be a significant savings over retail, I'd like to jump on a chance to get a new monitor while I can.
The seller for both has over 90k ratings so that isn't the issue. Are there any dead pixel/reliability issues I should concern myself with or should I definitely jump at this? I should get the original warranty as the monitors are sold new in box, so if there are any problems I can fall back on that.
Is there any reason not to go this route?
 

qz33

Junior Member
Aug 15, 2007
12
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61
Does anyone know what is going on with lcdresource? Anyone else have a link to the 1920X1200 monitor scaling matrix?
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
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4
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Has the Dell 2408WFP Revision A01 (that is supposed to greatly reduce the input lag from the original revision) been released yet? If not, is the A01 that I have heard of a hardware revision or a firmware update?
 

iamap

Junior Member
Jun 21, 2008
12
0
0
I read, on another forum, that A01 is due out mid-July. There's also speculation that it wont be fixing the lag problem but I don't know if that's true.
 

PeanutButter

Member
Nov 26, 2007
145
0
0
What can someone recommend for me that's at most a 22" and at least 20" for mild gamer and movie watcher? Specs are in my sig and I'm looking for something in the $240-$250 range tops.
 

Chronoshock

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
4,860
1
81
Well I decided to grab a PX2611W, with the increase to 25% cashback (with maximum value of 250), the Planar dropped another 40 bucks relative to the NEC. The fast response time/low input lag is also appealing given my high priority on gaming. Total wound up being 520 + 20 shipping + 6 insurance. Saving over 300 on retail was pretty compelling
 

FlasHBurN

Golden Member
Oct 12, 1999
1,346
0
71
I am looking to replace my NEC FP2141SB 22" CRT since it has been acting kind of flakey when it turns on plus I would like to go for a bigger widescreen setup. What is the best 24" LCD that I can buy for under $500? I need something with zero lag or ghosting issues and it needs to be exceptional at both displaying text and for playing games, since the majority I use my system for is web surfing and game playing. Should I just stop at the HP 2408H or is there better to be had in my price range?

edit: I was reading a review saying that as far as black levels go the best it does is a dull grey, that sounds really bad to me. Is it that bad? Any other TN monitors that handle blacks better?
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: ModemManCJ
So after reading a couple review sites and asking a couple friends, I felt completely lost in the search for a new display. I must admit though, this thread is pretty impressive and informative. I thought I might just read other people's questions and do my research that way (the lurker's way, hehe), but no, I'm going to formally ask for an opinion. Any help would be much appreciated.

So I'm looking at upgrading my display. I'm currently using an HP f1703 17" that came with an old family desktop and would like something bigger. I'm split between getting either a 22" or 24" display. One of my friends told me to avoid the 22" models because of the larger pixels. Is this really a big deal? I haven't seen larger pixels and smaller pixels juxtaposed before.

I don't think that 22" pixels are particularly "large". It's probably not something to be "concerned" about but 22"s will have text/images that appear larger in the same resolution.

I'm not too nit-picky on all of the technical aspects, to be honest. I primarily use my computer to surf the web, play games, listen to music, and occasionally watch films, so I suppose I fall into the "multimedia" category. I must admit, I'm attracted to the very pretty glossy screens. Other frills, like multiple input options, USB ports, et cetera, are not important; I need a DVI input at minimum. I'm looking to spend around $500 at most. Like anyone would, I want the most bang for my buck, but I don't want to sacrifice too much quality; for instance, a decent stand is important to me.

I hope I've been specific enough so that the more knowledgeable members here can make some helpful suggestions. Let me know if you need any additional information. Thanks much!

- ModemManCJ

The BenQ G2400W would probably be good for you. It is not extremely expensive but it's a good panel for gaming and the rest of what you'll be doing (mostly general use).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16824014158&Tpk=g2400w

I think the stand on the G2400W is better than on other BenQ models. See what you think.

I haven't seen reviews of the DS-245W but it is here for $500 (out of stock): http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16824185005

The LP2465 goes for $520 after rebate: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16824176059

The main advantage of the other panels (other than G2400W) is that they use an S-PVA panel, which may deliver higher contrast. It will have slightly better viewing angles but it won't be quite as fast for gaming. It's up to you whether it's worth it, but you are probably more concerned with the ergonomics. They both have a decent amount of adjustments as well.

If you like glossy panels then the Gateway FHD2400 might be the best deal for you.

I don't think the glossy Acer P243 is too bad, although I'm more confident recommending the FHD2400.

The FHD2400 may have more backlight bleeding than the G2400W, which means slightly lighter corners when viewing a dark image and not as good at rendering dark images. However the glossy panel will give the illusion of higher contrast and vibrance, as will the backlight which is wider gamut than the G2400W's NTSC-grade.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: Teslacoiled
Hi,
I read every single post containing the word G2400W in this thread. About 11 very informative pages. Thank you xtknight, 10e and others, you really helped! I only have one question:

-I've already decided to buy the G2400W, and I want to know if I will be sitting 2-3 feet away from the monitor, will I be bothered by the TN's viewing angle? I can't find any 24'' LCD (TN or not) on display in any store. so I can't try them.

I live in Ukraine, if it helps. I will mostly use this LCD for work (mostly writing content for my websites and a little bit of designing), some movie watching, occasional gaming (I hope to play once a week, but I haven't had the time to do that for months now ).

I have a Sony F520 in another room for "serious stuff" like photo editing, so a TN is more than enough for me right now. As for the budget, not more than the G2400W! I just need the high resolution for multiple windows.

Thanks!

Viewing distance in itself will not affect the viewing angle. If you are not moving that much on the horizontal plane I don't think you will have trouble. In short, don't worry about it, and enjoy the G2400W.

I didn't quite get the gist of whether you actually pulled the trigger on the G2400W yet or not, but if VA panels are not much more expensive in your area you could consider those.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: goten903
well after trying the lg 227wtg, 2408h and the gatewayfhd2400, i absolutly love the hp 2408h. one feature i found pretty neat on it so far, it has an ambient light sensor that changes how bright the monitor is based on the lighting around you, pretty neat feature and if you dont like it you can turn it off. Also been testing it in some games so far no issues there. id say prads review about it is right on. thanks everyone

Yup I think BenQ has some LCDs like this as well (SensEye), as well as NEC (AmbiBright) but I did not know HP had this feature. Glad you like the LCD.

Originally posted by: Chronoshock
Right now I'm in the market for a new monitor as my 2001FP had a good run but it's dying. An entire 2 inch band on the left side artifacts in any sort of heat (>80F ambient) I'm guessing due to dead/dying caps. When the temp goes even higher, the entire left half starts blurring, its pretty bad. Even before the artifacting occurred, I had some image persistence at the top and bottom of the monitor (all of these problems occurred slightly 3 years after I bought the monitor, so out of warranty). It's definitely time for something new.

Anyways, my usage will likely be 50% gaming, 30% office work, 20% multimedia. My budget is fairly loose, but looking for under 1000. I'm looking at the 25.5" choices, namely the NEC 2690, the DoubleSight DS-263N, and the Planar PX2611W. I've glanced at a few reviews and skimmed the thread, and, while I would like to spend more time reading professional reviews and user impressions, I'd like to make a quick decision.
I have a 10% cashback coupon for ebay which expires today, and using the 20% cashback promotion (see Hot Deals), I could get a new PX2611W for 600 shipped. No one is selling the DS-263N on ebay. A new LCD2690WUXi would wind up around 860 after coupons. Seeing as this would be a significant savings over retail, I'd like to jump on a chance to get a new monitor while I can.
The seller for both has over 90k ratings so that isn't the issue. Are there any dead pixel/reliability issues I should concern myself with or should I definitely jump at this? I should get the original warranty as the monitors are sold new in box, so if there are any problems I can fall back on that.
Is there any reason not to go this route?

I'm not familiar with it, but I guess I don't see any problem if you know that the warranty will be transferred over. I'm not so sure about that for monitors so ask around.

The PX2611W does not have the A-TW polarizer, although I'm not sure if it's worth $260 more (to get the LCD26). The LCD26 does have a hardware calibratable LUT though and that price is pretty attractive. It's too bad you couldn't get a good deal on the DS-263N though. I would have to go with the creme de la creme LCD26 in your case. Otherwise I probably would have saved the money and gone with a 'good' DS-263N deal.

Originally posted by: qz33
Does anyone know what is going on with lcdresource? Anyone else have a link to the 1920X1200 monitor scaling matrix?

I don't know what is going on with it. Uptime isn't amazing but until then I have replaced some of the links in the OP and hosted them on google. ( Just another reason to love Google. )

http://xt.knight.googlepages.com/dsp_scale.htm

 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Has the Dell 2408WFP Revision A01 (that is supposed to greatly reduce the input lag from the original revision) been released yet? If not, is the A01 that I have heard of a hardware revision or a firmware update?

As far as I know it has not been released into the wild yet.

Revisions typically embody only firmware updates, but if the problems to be fixed were diagnosed as hardware and were planned to be fixed, then a hardware replacement would surely be in order. They would probably get a newer revision of the panel from Samsung if that was the case.

You can take a look at this thread: http://www.dellcommunity.com/s...thread.id=92507#M92507
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: PeanutButter
What can someone recommend for me that's at most a 22" and at least 20" for mild gamer and movie watcher? Specs are in my sig and I'm looking for something in the $240-$250 range tops.

Try the ASUS VW222u.

If that's too much then the Acer AL2216WBD is an alternative.

Originally posted by: Chronoshock
Well I decided to grab a PX2611W, with the increase to 25% cashback (with maximum value of 250), the Planar dropped another 40 bucks relative to the NEC. The fast response time/low input lag is also appealing given my high priority on gaming. Total wound up being 520 + 20 shipping + 6 insurance. Saving over 300 on retail was pretty compelling

That is good, you got a great hard-to-pass-up deal on it.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: FlasHBurN
I am looking to replace my NEC FP2141SB 22" CRT since it has been acting kind of flakey when it turns on plus I would like to go for a bigger widescreen setup. What is the best 24" LCD that I can buy for under $500? I need something with zero lag or ghosting issues and it needs to be exceptional at both displaying text and for playing games, since the majority I use my system for is web surfing and game playing. Should I just stop at the HP 2408H or is there better to be had in my price range?

edit: I was reading a review saying that as far as black levels go the best it does is a dull grey, that sounds really bad to me. Is it that bad? Any other TN monitors that handle blacks better?

'Dark gray' is a really poor and misguided generalization of LCD black levels. A better analogy would be to compare a pitch black puddle of paint on the floor, against a black jacket. Obviously, the LCD is more like the jacket.

The level of black, as your eyes perceive it, also depends on the brightness surrounding it. (Still, most Trinitron/Diamondtron CRTs achieve higher contrast.)

Trinitrons may reach around 10,000:1, where a good VA LCD will do over 1,500:1. This figure may increase when LED backlights come, as localized dimming (dimming part of the screen) will be available once there is a huge array of LEDs to adjust in the back.

It doesn't sound like you want a VA panel (you want zero lag). So, you might indeed want to look towards glossy panels that deliver a high perceived contrast, like the HP w2408h. The FHD2400 is also decent, although I hear that it is not very good at reproducing darker tones. I may replace the FHD2400 with the w2408h; I will have to read up on that more. In the immediate sense, the FHD2400 looks better because of all the connectivity available, but that appears not to be part of your criteria.

PRAD has a comprehensive review of the w2408h here: http://prad.de/en/monitore/rev.../review-hp-w2408h.html

It doesn't use overdrive (native 5 ms black/white transition panel) so you have less likelihood of getting input lag.

You will get the best perceived black by using a glossy panel. This is widely known to be the easiest route upon which to embark when moving from a Trinitron/DiamondTron. If you have the ambition to find a used/refurb (or somehow new) glossy NEC 20WMGX2 that's the best choice (AS-IPS panel).

Make sure there are no stores around you that have on display the glossy panels so that you could just check them out right there. This is actually quite common at Best Buy and Circuit City.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
I am sorry if I didn't get around to anybody in the previous barrage of posts. I have been busier the past week. If you could repost I could get back to you as soon as I can.

Meanwhile I decided to take upon the task of slightly improving the OP. It's often said that after one reads this thread he's even more confused! So, suggestions (as always) are welcome.

Many of you herald this as one of the best, or the best, LCD resources and I would love to keep the status quo.
 
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