RIP Gamers, not even the 1080 Ti will save you now.

[Headfoot]

Regulation is not a political topic.

lol, no.

 

[Headfoot]

In this thread: a TON of sour grapes because certain individuals didn't have the foresight early enough in the crypto bubble to get their piece. I get it - I didn't take it seriously early enough either. This has immediately turned into a political thread. I refuse to engage. This is a forum about video cards. Not about mortgage backed securities and how great regulation is (eyeroll)

 

[Headfoot]

Here's the challenge - "show me"

You do understand how start up investment / venture investment / risk investment works, right? If you want a lower risk investment, then wait 5 years and see which ones come out on top. It will be less risky with less potential for reward. This is the beginning of a new market in venture capital mode. Every market in the history of commerce has had whacky proposals and huge failure rates for new start ups. Why is everyone acting like this is anything new? Are we forgetting the Pet Rock so soon?

 

[UsandThem]

In this thread: a TON of sour grapes because certain individuals didn't have the foresight early enough in the crypto bubble to get their piece. I get it - I didn't take it seriously early enough either. This has immediately turned into a political thread. I refuse to engage. This is a forum about video cards. Not about mortgage backed securities and how great regulation is (eyeroll)

Then don't participate. There is no need to say people are "sour grapes" because they want to discuss everything that is affected by crypto-currencies.

Crypto-currency mining is a huge issue not only an issue for gamers wanting to buy cards, but for energy usage, and government oversight or regulation. This is really the first time mining and alternative "currencies" have been at this level.

 

[Headfoot]

Except the same individuals post the same comments in every crypto thread, go look at the Ethereum Mining thread for example. I would very much like to not have to participate in this political conversation and just talk about crypto as crypto.

 

[UsandThem]

Except the same individuals post the same comments in every crypto thread, go look at the Ethereum Mining thread for example. I would very much like to not have to participate in this political conversation and just talk about crypto as crypto.

You just have to learn that with any discussion, there are going to be people who who really don't agree with. As long as their comments are at least semi relevant to the discussion, it is allowed. In my opinion, right now crypto mining is in its gold rush stage, with individuals, investors, companies, and governments trying to figure it all out, so I don't think you can really separate the political elements of it from everything else. If you follow the crypto/mining discussions quite a bit, it might seem like they are beating a dead horse. But for people like myself who are more or less just curious how long it will last, and how it be viewed as history when we look back on this period.

Just put them on your ignore list. I know I had a good sized ignore list before becoming a moderator.

 

[Markfw]

Well, I hope this is taken as all on-topic..... I have been waiting for weeks to buy a could of EVGA 1080TI FTW3 cards for $800 (what I paid 2 months ago) and they are either $1400 or unavailable, this angers me. So anyway, bitcoin is down to 10,500 about at the moment, and that is about early Dec levels, so MAYBE I can actually buy a card soon. I got 2 1080TI cards early Dec, so lets hope that this current bitcoin trend continues so we can buy video cards.

 

[PeterScott]

So anyway, bitcoin is down to 10,500 about at the moment, and that is about early Dec levels, so MAYBE I can actually buy a card soon. I got 2 1080TI cards early Dec, so lets hope that this current bitcoin trend continues so we can buy video cards.

Bitcoin isn't mined with GPUs anymore, so Bitcoin pricing has little affect on mining.

GPU mining is centered around the Altcoins.

 

[Markfw]

Bitcoin isn't mined with GPUs anymore, so Bitcoin pricing has little affect on mining.

GPU mining is centered around the Altcoins.

Well, crap, thanks, I did not know that. Having a hard time finding the pricing/trend on that coin. If you have a link, that would be great.

 

[alexruiz]

Bitcoin isn't mined with GPUs anymore, so Bitcoin pricing has little affect on mining.

GPU mining is centered around the Altcoins.

Mark's comment is valid
Like it or not, even though GPUs are not used to mine it, bitcon is still the barometer for the cryptomarket.
Bitcoin goes down, the rest go down.

 

[Despoiler]

Bullcrap. You are not doing anything positive by using renewables and mining. Mining is a waste of resources, renewable or not.

Clearly whatever you say is important to everyone. /s This basic supply and demand and economies of scale that result from it. If you can't reason basic economics you probably shouldn't have an opinion on currency, crypto or not. BTW are you sourcing your energy from renewables or is your entire modern existence dependent on fossil?

 

[NomanA]

Bitcoin isn't mined with GPUs anymore, so Bitcoin pricing has little affect on mining.

GPU mining is centered around the Altcoins.

The cryptocurrencies all rise and fall with the same trends. If Bitcoin is down 7% today, then most of alt-coins will be down 5-10% as well. Just for your reference, Ethereum is down 6%, Ripple 11%, and Litecoin 7%. That's just today. This has been the pattern for weeks, with swings of 10 to -10% in a day, based on low volumes, and generally trending lower (mostly due to the fear of incoming bans in various countries). The spikes and dips in valuations make these coins useless for most of the functions that you'd want a normal currency to perform.

Anyway, the October 2017 prices are now within reach, and once we get there, at least the Mom-and-Pop miners will give up, and the graphic cards availability will improve.

[Fixed a typo, meant to say Oct 2017, but wrote 2016 instead]

 

[PeterScott]

The cryptocurrencies all rise and fall with the same trends. If Bitcoin is down 7% today, then most of alt-coins will be down 5-10% as well. Just for your reference, Ethereum is down 6%, Ripple 11%, and Litecoin 7%. That's just today. This has been the pattern for weeks, with swings of 10 to -10% in a day, based on low volumes, and generally trending lower (mostly due to the fear of incoming bans in various countries). The spikes and dips in valuations make these coins useless for most of the functions that you'd want a normal currency to perform.

Anyway, the October 2016 prices are now within reach, and once we get there, at least the Mom-and-Pop miners will give up, and the graphic cards availability will improve.

The stock market stocks, often rise and falls on news affecting the general market.

But Ethereum, the most popular and most mined Altcoin, is not really linked directly to Bitcoin. Here is a ratio chart. It's hardly a straight line.

 

[DrMrLordX]

For me it's simply an unforgivable waste of energy. In these times of climate change when we're apparently doing what we can to limit our energy usage in order to keep carbon emissions down the cryptocurrency network is adding to a global problem and delivering no benefit to society.

They could at least do something useful with the energy they're currently wasting, fold proteins or something.

Maybe you would be interested in GridCoin:

https://www.gridcoin.us/

Sadly, it is not a major player in the crypto world.

That being said, much ado has been made of the wastefulness of PoW algorithms, and I generally agree with that (never mind that existing currency exchange/payment networks can also chew up a lot of power, but I digress). PoS promises to significantly reduce power usage for crypto blockchain transaction verification.

It also obviates the need for specialized hardware - such as GPUs - to verify transactions. Which means shifting to PoS = no more mining with hardware.

Well, crap, thanks, I did not know that. Having a hard time finding the pricing/trend on that coin. If you have a link, that would be great.

The main coins you want to look at are probably Ethereum (ETH) and Monero (XMR). You want to look at their difficulty curves and price levels. Though Monero CPU mining is becoming "a thing" thanks to Zen being so fast mining it. Also watch ZCash (ZEC)

Some links:

https://www.coinwarz.com/difficulty-charts/ethereum-difficulty-chart

https://www.coinwarz.com/difficulty-charts/monero-difficulty-chart

https://www.coinwarz.com/difficulty-charts/zcash-difficulty-chart

For clarification:

ETH = mostly AMD cards + some Nvidia

XMR =- mostly AMD cards + some CPUs

ZEC = mostly Nvidia cards + some AMD cards

Obviously there are some "stupid" miners trying sub-optimal mining combinations, such as mining XMR with an Nvidia card. And some people wind up mining dozens of different cryptos which they exchange for BTC automatically using a service like NiceHash. So tracking card demand via difficulty is not always easy.

But Ethereum, the most popular and most mined Altcoin, is not really linked directly to Bitcoin.

I wish that were more true. Sometimes ETH goes out on its own, and sometimes not . . .

 

[NomanA]

The stock market stocks, often rise and falls on news affecting the general market.

But Ethereum, the most popular and most mined Altcoin, is not really linked directly to Bitcoin. Here is a ratio chart. It's hardly a straight line.

I didn't say there's a fixed relation between BTC and Ethereum market cap. But all cryptocurrencies follow the same trend. Look at the chart you posted. Ethereum valuation on a daily basis are 3-6% of Bitcoin valuation, in the last three months. In those same months, BTC valuation has gone up and down an insane amount, and on many occasions. If even during this volatile period for BTC, Ethereum to BTC ratio isn't changing much, doesn't it tell you that Ethereum must have followed similarly insane peaks and troughs of its own?

Cryptocurrency pricing trends are similar, since their valuations are all based on the same hypes and fears.

 

[Headfoot]

For me it's simply an unforgivable waste of energy. In these times of climate change when we're apparently doing what we can to limit our energy usage in order to keep carbon emissions down the cryptocurrency network is adding to a global problem and delivering no benefit to society.

They could at least do something useful with the energy they're currently wasting, fold proteins or something.

How often do you complain about the power use all of the combined networks of Visa, MasterCard and American Express (as well as all of the PoS cardreaders, servers, etc)? Transaction focus cryptocurrencies (XRP, XLM, XRB) aim to provide an identical benefit. Or do you think that credit cards and electronic payment add "no benefit to society"? Competition is good. My LED bulbs work a lot better than whale oil lamps.

 

[AdamK47]

I thought about mining Ethereum with my two Titan Xp cards when I'm not using them.

In a month I would make the equivalent of me working less than 3 hours at my day job. Very much not worth having my computer on all day eating electricity and producing heat.

 

[preslove]

How often do you complain about the power use all of the combined networks of Visa, MasterCard and American Express (as well as all of the PoS cardreaders, servers, etc)? Transaction focus cryptocurrencies (XRP, XLM, XRB) aim to provide an identical benefit. Or do you think that credit cards and electronic payment add "no benefit to society"? Competition is good. My LED bulbs work a lot better than whale oil lamps.

On a per transaction scale, Visa is vastly cheaper and several orders of magnitude more efficient than cryptofakecurrencies. If you really want an led metaphor with Visa vs Ethereum, visa is the led bulm and ethereum is a gasoline fire

 

[PeterScott]

The stock market stocks, often rise and falls on news affecting the general market.

But Ethereum, the most popular and most mined Altcoin, is not really linked directly to Bitcoin. Here is a ratio chart. It's hardly a straight line.

I didn't say there's a fixed relation between BTC and Ethereum market cap. But all cryptocurrencies follow the same trend. Look at the chart you posted. Ethereum valuation on a daily basis are 3-6% of Bitcoin valuation, in the last three months. In those same months, BTC valuation has gone up and down an insane amount, and on many occasions. If even during this volatile period for BTC, Ethereum to BTC ratio isn't changing much, doesn't it tell you that Ethereum must have followed similarly insane peaks and troughs of its own?

It tells me that you aren't interpreting the graph properly. He is what actually happened in the last month, and the post I was replying to was talking about the big drop in Bitcoin in the last month (down 30%). Well in the same month the Bitcoin was down 30%, Ether was UP 30%, and Ether is one that is mined on GPUs.

 

[NomanA]

Once again I am talking about general trends over a period of time. Even in my last post I mentioned a three month period (Oct 2017 to present). In the last graph that you attached, the pricing chart over last ten days are almost exactly the same, and it's true for all alt-coins. As for the price increase in Ethereum in the last month, that's because the run-up in BTC prices happened first and Ethereum and other alt-coins were a bit delayed. For a three month period, BTC is still up 230%, and Ethereum around 290%.

By the way, you can see this effect in the first graph you posted, where between Oct and Dec 2017, Ethereum was going down in BTC value, because BTC was running up at an insane pace. Ethereum then got its own wave and its BTC valuation came back to Oct level.

Also keep in mind that for new crypto-currencies, there's always a time where their BTC valuation goes up significantly as more and more people jump on the hype train.

Hopefully the prices continue this downward trend.

 

[PeterScott]

Once again I am talking about general trends over a period of time..

And as I said in an earlier post, there are forces that affect most stocks in the stock market as well. That is even more in line when it is narrowed to a segment like Petroleum stocks. Naturally bad news for Crypto coins in general will tank them all, but bitcoin failing at this point would probably just clear the way for Ethereum, unless it fails by something universal like it being outlawed in the biggest economies.

 

[Red Squirrel]

This is a great time to sell off old video cards you arn't using. Just sold two GTX 560 TIs on Ebay for $90. Recently sold a 750 TI for $100 as well.

 

[Ken g6]

It tells me that you aren't interpreting the graph properly. He is what actually happened in the last month, and the post I was replying to was talking about the big drop in Bitcoin in the last month (down 30%). Well in the same month the Bitcoin was down 30%, Ether was UP 30%, and Ether is one that is mined on GPUs.

Now, those are some interesting charts. Here's a chart (Warning! Pop-ups!) I saw today of the 2008 stock market crash. Looks pretty similar. That suggests to me that coins could crash soon.

 

[Markfw]

Now, those are some interesting charts. Here's a chart (Warning! Pop-ups!) I saw today of the 2008 stock market crash. Looks pretty similar. That suggests to me that coins could crash soon.

I hope they do !

 

[tamz_msc]

I don't think that miners are flocking to online stores to lap up 1000$+ cards by the dozens. They simply sidestep the supply channels and get them directly from AIB warehouses. It isn't far-fetched to think that they have the connections(read $$$) to pull it off.

The 1000$+ listings you see are third-party resellers taking advantage of the limited supply and jacking prices up.