Rocket scientist harassed over shirt

[MrPickins]

I like this part too.

I absolutely agree, and should have included that in my quote. :thumbsup:

 

[HumblePie]

Welcome to the age of "Be yourself and express yourself, except when society doesn't want you being yourself anymore. Then be who we tell you to be."

 

[senseamp]

It's inappropriate attire for work. I am surprised his manager hasn't talked to him about this stuff before.

 

[MrPickins]

Welcome to the age of "Be yourself and express yourself, except when you're at work and also in an extremely visible position/situation.. Then be who we tell you to be."

Fixed that for you.

 

[Exophase]

It's inappropriate attire for work. I am surprised his manager hasn't talked to him about this stuff before.

We don't know if this is the sort of thing he wears to work a lot. He could have thought that this particularly shirt was a good nerdy sci-fi display that would be giving a friendly nod to the audience.

The thing is, it seems like a lot of the criticism is coming from Americans, but this isn't an American agency and they could have different cultural standards. Just look at TV in Europe, people are a lot more comfortable with sex and nudity there. Even England, while probably more reserved than other countries in the region, is less so than America. For example, I saw on the local news streakers in body paint that were displayed uncensored. There's no way you'd see this in America.

 

[senseamp]

We don't know if this is the sort of thing he wears to work a lot. He could have thought that this particularly shirt was a good nerdy sci-fi display that would be giving a friendly nod to the audience.

The thing is, it seems like a lot of the criticism is coming from Americans, but this isn't an American agency and they could have different cultural standards. Just look at TV in Europe, people are a lot more comfortable with sex and nudity there. Even England, while probably more reserved than other countries in the region, is less so than America. For example, I saw on the local news streakers in body paint that were displayed uncensored. There's no way you'd see this in America.

DailyMail.co.uk in the OP is a UK site.
If you think this is approprate attire, go represent your employer while wearing a shirt with half naked women on it, and then report back to us.

 

[Cozarkian]

We don't know if this is the sort of thing he wears to work a lot. He could have thought that this particularly shirt was a good nerdy sci-fi display that would be giving a friendly nod to the audience.

Moreover, since it was a custom shirt made for him by a friend, he could have been thanking said friend by displaying her art in a public setting.

 

[BoberFett]

Welcome to the age of "Be yourself and express yourself, except when society doesn't want you being yourself anymore. Then be who we tell you to be."

It's the authoritarian left becoming exactly what they hate.

 

[Exophase]

DailyMail.co.uk in the OP is a UK site.

Yeah, and if you go read the article again you'll find that the author doesn't actually make a judgement on the shirt at all, except perhaps by putting "sexist" in quotes. All it's really doing is reporting on a controversy stirred up by other people. So what's your point?

If you think this is approprate attire, go represent your employer while wearing a shirt with half naked women on it, and then report back to us.

Show me where I said "this is appropriate attire." Show me. Maybe the post earlier in the thread where I said the opposite?

I doubt it's really appropriate work attire for any space agency. What I'm saying is that while it might be inappropriate, the reaction in other places could be milder (or more extreme) because of different cultural norms. And because of that one should be careful to criticize it under the lens of American culture.

 

[Guurn]

The truth is you don't know what appropriate attire was in that office. He had probably worn it before. Offices vary widely. Suits and ties are frowned on in mine, yours may be different.

 

[OverVolt]

Scientist personality types do this kind of shit all the time. Science isn't really valued as much as superficial bullshit is part of whats going on. I mean you can be project lead on landing on a comet and thats great and all but if you wear the wrong shirt to the celebration your career could be done.

...aaaaand thats where our priorities are right now as as country WRT to science. That about sums it up.

 

[dainthomas]

Perhaps his employer believes his ability to fly a spaceship to a comet outweighs his fashion sense.

 

[moonbogg]

Welcome to the age of "Be yourself and express yourself, except when society doesn't want you being yourself anymore. Then be who we tell you to be."

Yes exactly. Lets encourage gay people to act gay in the work place since that's who they are, but when this brilliant rocket scientist wears a shirt with sexy cartoon women on it, lets FUCKING FIRE HIM?
They brought this man to tears for wearing a shirt after he took charge in furthering mankind's chances of leaving earth someday. Ungrateful bastards.

 

[Nebor]

Scientist personality types do this kind of shit all the time. Science isn't really valued as much as superficial bullshit is part of whats going on. I mean you can be project lead on landing on a comet and thats great and all but if you wear the wrong shirt to the celebration your career could be done.

...aaaaand thats where our priorities are right now as as country WRT to science. That about sums it up.

Don't worry, when all the scientists are gone the women's studies PhDs will explain to us why violating a comet in such a way would just perpetuate rape culture anyway.

 

[Exophase]

I really hope someone is televised wearing a shirt with scantily clad men as a response to this. I have a feeling that it too will somehow be construed as sexist towards women.

 

[alkemyst]

When a person steps before the cameras to represent their employer, they are there to represent the image the employer wants to convey. They aren't on their own time. If the European Space Agency wants babe shirts, that's their business, otherwise Dr. Taylor was out of line. In Dr. Taylor's defense, the agency should have had a professional PR person orchestrating this very public event to head off this kind of silliness.

QFT. If Matt as Matt just Facebooked himself this would not be an issue, he showed up wearing this at a very public event with a mixed audience.

People would have been equally offended had Kim dropped trow at it as well.

 

[Cozarkian]

QFT. If Matt as Matt just Facebooked himself this would not be an issue, he showed up wearing this at a very public event with a mixed audience.

People would have been equally offended had Kim dropped trow at it as well.

You think so? You think the outrage is targeted solely to the fact that it was an inappropriate shirt for a public appearance and that the outraged people aren't stating an opinion that the very existence of the shirt in his wardrobe shows he objectifies women?

 

[Atomic Playboy]

You think so? You think the outrage is targeted solely to the fact that it was an inappropriate shirt for a public appearance and that the outraged people aren't stating an opinion that the very existence of the shirt in his wardrobe shows he objectifies women?

I'm sure there are some people who think that the very fact that he owns such an item reveals some deep misogyny. Those people are idiots. But you can respect his right to wear a shirt like that and also think that it was unprofessional to do it in that specific setting without jumping on the "he must hate women" bandwagon.

 

[Exophase]

I'm sure there are some people who think that the very fact that he owns such an item reveals some deep misogyny. Those people are idiots. But you can respect his right to wear a shirt like that and also think that it was unprofessional to do it in that specific setting without jumping on the "he must hate women" bandwagon.

Yes, and I think this is a stance a lot of people are taking. I also think that if it were limited to that there wouldn't have been any real controversy and the press coverage would have been a lot lower. But we're talking about this now because a vocal group of people have deemed this "casual misogyny" and an example of how women aren't welcome in STEM.

 

[alkemyst]

You think so? You think the outrage is targeted solely to the fact that it was an inappropriate shirt for a public appearance and that the outraged people aren't stating an opinion that the very existence of the shirt in his wardrobe shows he objectifies women?

I am thinking it's mostly because this was a public event, had it been in Matt's free-time I doubt we'd be hearing about it at all.

That said, I am sure many would think the same way regardless; it just wouldn't have gained the traction it did.

 

[HumblePie]

It's inappropriate attire for work. I am surprised his manager hasn't talked to him about this stuff before.

It is inappropriate for many work places that is true. But what is inappropriate for may workplaces isn't inappropriate for them all.

I used to work at a strip club, I'm pretty sure any of the attire the women wore there weren't appropriate in most places. So your blanket statement is dumb.

Here is the problem. He has a workplace that has different attire restrictions than others. He just happened to get in front of a camera for once wearing something that others took offense too. Who cares? It's not like he was on camera to sell you something or solicit a vote. Don't like it? too bad. In his career field this isn't a whole lot of people that can fill in his shoes. So companies that need to hire people like him tend to be a bit more lenient on the eccentricities.

Personally if the people in charge of him had a problem with his attire prior to him being on camera, they should have used a PR person instead at the very least to address the media.

Anyone getting overly pissed at this guy wearing a shirt like that only shows their own small mindedness.

 

[alkemyst]

It is inappropriate for many work places that is true. But what is inappropriate for may workplaces isn't inappropriate for them all.

I used to work at a strip club, I'm pretty sure any of the attire the women wore there weren't appropriate in most places. So your blanket statement is dumb.

Here is the problem. He has a workplace that has different attire restrictions than others. He just happened to get in front of a camera for once wearing something that others took offense too. Who cares? It's not like he was on camera to sell you something or solicit a vote. Don't like it? too bad. In his career field this isn't a whole lot of people that can fill in his shoes. So companies that need to hire people like him tend to be a bit more lenient on the eccentricities.

Personally if the people in charge of him had a problem with his attire prior to him being on camera, they should have used a PR person instead at the very least to address the media.

Anyone getting overly pissed at this guy wearing a shirt like that only shows their own small mindedness.

I am sure we all know no one is talking about off the beaten path workplaces like strip clubs and the like.

 

[MrPickins]

Anyone getting overly pissed at this guy wearing a shirt like that only shows their own small mindedness.

Sure, if they're "overly-pissed", but it's also small minded not to be able to see why there might be some people who found it inappropriate enough to voice their opinions.

 

[justoh]

Sure, if they're "overly-pissed", but it's also small minded not to be able to see why there might be some people who found it inappropriate enough to voice their opinions.

Nah. It's simply idiotic and gives true feminism a bad name.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Nah. It's simply idiotic and gives true feminism a bad name.

It gives rocket science a bad name; it makes them look like a bunch of dorks with the fashion sense of a porn producer.