Roseanne cancelled after racist tweet

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Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
What? You think it shouldnt be talked about? Why? Because some people will be offended? That doesnt matter. What matters is not repeating the horrible mistakes of the boomer generation.
I didn't say that. I don't think placing all blame on one generation is a good idea. I also think the older generation has a lot to teach us even if it's what not to do. That's valuable. Don't you think? You seem clear on what they did wrong. Are you as clear on how to fix it? That seems more worthwhile than berating the older set. You're being told that the next younger generation will have plenty to blame you for. You get that that is true correct? Each generation contributes good and bad. I believe you know that is true as well. Plus you're coming off rather hostile. Is that you're intent?

End of the day if you prefer berating them and fixing nothing, that's your choice. I was just suggesting it's not something you absolutely have to do. You are after all talking to people who can't or don't want to fix the messes they've made. I at least hope that when it's your turn to answer for your generation that you'll do so with an open mind and a willingness to work on the problems.

Any way, I'm not choosing sides.
 
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Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,554
16,394
146
What? You think it shouldnt be talked about? Why? Because some people will be offended? That doesnt matter. What matters is not repeating the horrible mistakes of the boomer generation.

You mean the horrible mistakes of the past?
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Weirdly, James Gunn had this to say about the Roseanne tweet:
I wish some of these so-called defenders of liberty would start to understand what freedom of speech is AND isn’t. Roseanne is allowed to say whatever she wants. It doesn’t mean @ABCNetwork needs to continue funding her TV show if her words are considered abhorrent.

Just a few months later, he loses his job (at the same corporation) over pedophilia jokes. Bask in the wonderfulness of outrage culture.
 
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Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,944
5,569
136
Weirdly, James Gunn had this to say about the Roseanne tweet:


Just a few months later, he loses his job (at the same corporation) over pedophilia jokes. Bask in the wonderfulness of outrage culture.
Outrage is a good thing. With outrage, we don't have to communicate, we don't have to understand, we don't have to think at all. We don't risk the possibility of being mistaken, because once the outrage kicks in it doesn't matter. Outrage gives us the feeling that we can control others, it lets us (in large groups) bend them to our will. That makes us feel powerful. The system is wonderful, until you're on the wrong end of it.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
70,229
28,937
136
Weirdly, James Gunn had this to say about the Roseanne tweet:


Just a few months later, he loses his job (at the same corporation) over pedophilia jokes. Bask in the wonderfulness of outrage culture.
Were the jokes any good? It matters here.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,143
30,099
146
You are literally using whataboutism when someone talks about boomers.
Yes, but you are ignoring the young and proud nazis of our generation, just to shit on his. Keep ignoring them, I guess? That worked out really well before...

Look, shitting on every other generation is stupidly cliche. It makes for terrible literature. No one cares. Deal with your problems as they are, or you are just what you hate.

except for the millennials. we can all agree that they are shit.
 
Feb 4, 2009
35,254
16,729
136
She still apologizing (I think).

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/26/entertainment/roseanne-hannity/index.html

"I've apologized a lot," Barr told Sean Hannity on his Fox News Channel program, before -- at the host's prodding -- directly saying she was "sorry that you thought I was racist" to former Obama adviser Valerie Jarrett, the target of the tweet that prompted ABC to cancel "Roseanne.


Money does weird things to some people. Above is hardly what a normal person would call an apology. Anytime it contains a “sorry you thought I’m a racist” it’s basically saying “I’m sorry you are stupid”
The phrase she used is very similar to the “but” drop the “sorry” and the real meaning becomes clear.
 
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
11,718
136
She still apologizing (I think).

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/26/entertainment/roseanne-hannity/index.html




Money does weird things to some people. Above is hardly what a normal person would call an apology. Anytime it contains a “sorry you thought I’m a racist” it’s basically saying “I’m sorry you are stupid”
The phrase she used is very similar to the “but” drop the “sorry” and the real meaning becomes clear.

She's not apologizing, she's simply feeling sorry for herself and it's been pretty much that since the situation blew up in the first pace.
 
Reactions: Younigue
Feb 4, 2009
35,254
16,729
136
When the spin off (which is bound to fail) premiers Rosanne plans on being in Isreal

Roseanne Barr says she plans to be abroad when "The Conners" premieres without her this fall.

Barr told her longtime friend, Rabbi Shmuley Boteach, during the latest installment of his podcast, that she won't be tuning into the "Roseanne" spinoff. Instead, she'll be halfway around the world.
"I have an opportunity to go to Israel for a few months and study with my favorite teachers over there," Barr said. "And that's where I'm going to go and probably move somewhere there and study with my favorite teachers. I have saved a few pennies and I'm so lucky I can go. It's my great joy and privilege to be a Jewish woman."

https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/03/entertainment/roseanne-barr-moving-israel-conners/index.html
 

Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
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outriding

Diamond Member
Feb 20, 2002
3,415
2,584
136
gahh

did she forget this gem... I bet the people of Israel will welcome her with open arms.

 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
17,079
136
gahh

did she forget this gem... I bet the people of Israel will welcome her with open arms.



OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.
You just cited two Jewish people. Do you not expect them to have thoughts on something that likely affected their direct relatives?

So when you say "its [sic] OK cuz [sic] some of them are Jews [sic]", what are you saying?
 

Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.
Well there tends to be an abundance of proof that there is a significant amount of separatism and ugly belief behind "jokes" on the conservative side. If racism and supremacy weren't so prevalent from the conservative point of view their "jokes" might land in a palatable, easily digestible way don'tcha think? I do.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,816
1,126
126
OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.

I don't think it is uncommon for folks belonging to a certain group to be given a free pass when joking about "their people" even if the jokes are off-color...
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,280
5,722
146
OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.

Uh, what? Not sure what rock you've been living under, but comedians are seemingly the 2nd most persecuted group of people in America. They can't even do shows at colleges any more because fucking snowflake kids make it so these comedians can't handle being heckled over some of their more fucked up off color jokes!!! Poor babies like Louis CK can't even joke about himself and Woody Allen being incredibly fucked up (at the expense of the people they're that way to) without being called out for it now. And a comedian can't even joke about the woman heckling him over his rape joke getting raped anymore. What has the world come to?

I'd wonder where Vince Vaughn is, but I assume he's on a fucking crucifix somewhere for being a conservative comedian.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,629
11,348
136
OK, first off, I hate modern American conservatives.

Having said that, its annoying that conservatives get loads of shit for making pretty much the exact same jokes that liberals do.

Pretty sure lots of comedians have done holocaust Jew material but I guess its OK cuz some of them are Jews.
Larry David on his latest saturday night live appearance pops to mind. Pretty sure Sarah Silverman did it too.

Comedy is largely about playing with audiences' expectations of what they're about to hear as well as their expectations of the comedian.

For example, a Jew making a Holocaust joke is certainly playing against the expectation that a Jewish person would consider the Holocaust to be absolutely unsuitable as a comedic topic, let alone making the victims to be the butt of the joke. Such a person is unlikely to truly believe in the punch-line of the joke, it's just an amusing alternate perspective. In a way it's likely to be self-depreciating rather than punching down.

The problem is if you've got say a Nazi making a Holocaust joke, chances are they're just telling you what they already believe. Conservatives have a rep for seriously buying into problematic beliefs, so if they make jokes about them, there's definitely room for interpretation (do they really buy into what they're making a joke about, are they also punching down, neither of which are remotely funny things). As opposed to when say Dave Chapelle makes a joke about a black guy getting stopped by the police for smoking weed; there's no question over whether Dave Chapelle believes that say all black people are into drugs.

If Donald Trump makes a joke about Jewish people, is he just trying to be funny without being nasty about it or does he really believe in the basis of what he's making a joke about? It completely alters the perspective of the joke from respecting a minority yet considering them fair game for humour to mocking those you think deserve it and a means of elevating your status by regarding others as inferior.

Generally speaking, I'm of the opinion that anything should be an acceptable target for comedy, but a sensible person makes sure that their intended audience know from which perspective to interpret the humour.

A really basic example would be Steve Martin's trousers dropping as part of the script in a comedy sketch versus some old guy in a supermarket whose just had the misfortune of their trousers dropping. Only a "not nice person"* will start laughing out loud at the latter and then when being told to hush will start complaining and calling for equality because it was funny when it happened to Steve Martin.

* - The forum threw an error when I wanted to use a word that sufficiently describes how I'd feel about that kind of person!
 
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compuwiz1

Admin Emeritus Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
27,111
926
126
Part of me sees that people are getting way too sensitive these days. The days of water off the duck's back are over. My sister and nephew, who are uber liberal are even calling it out. Society is never going to be perfect, no matter how much revolt there is. Back in my day, we rolled with the punches and, sure things were said that we found distasteful, but nobody got up in arms at every turn, unlike today.
 

Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
Comedy is largely about playing with audiences' expectations of what they're about to hear as well as their expectations of the comedian.

For example, a Jew making a Holocaust joke is certainly playing against the expectation that a Jewish person would consider the Holocaust to be absolutely unsuitable as a comedic topic, let alone making the victims to be the butt of the joke. Such a person is unlikely to truly believe in the punch-line of the joke, it's just an amusing alternate perspective. In a way it's likely to be self-depreciating rather than punching down.

The problem is if you've got say a Nazi making a Holocaust joke, chances are they're just telling you what they already believe. Conservatives have a rep for seriously buying into problematic beliefs, so if they make jokes about them, there's definitely room for interpretation (do they really buy into what they're making a joke about, are they also punching down, neither of which are remotely funny things). As opposed to when say Dave Chapelle makes a joke about a black guy getting stopped by the police for smoking weed; there's no question over whether Dave Chapelle believes that say all black people are into drugs.

If Donald Trump makes a joke about Jewish people, is he just trying to be funny without being nasty about it or does he really believe in the basis of what he's making a joke about? It completely alters the perspective of the joke from respecting a minority yet considering them fair game for humour to mocking those you think deserve it and a means of elevating your status by regarding others as inferior.

Generally speaking, I'm of the opinion that anything should be an acceptable target for comedy, but a sensible person makes sure that their intended audience know from which perspective to interpret the humour.

A really basic example would be Steve Martin's trousers as part of the script in a comedy sketch versus some old guy in a supermarket whose just had the misfortune of their trousers dropping. Only a "not nice person"* will start laughing out loud at the latter and then when being told to hush will start complaining and calling for equality because it was funny when it happened to Steve Martin.

* - The forum threw an error when I wanted to use a word that sufficiently describes how I'd feel about that kind of person!
Well said.
 

crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
10,582
2,150
146
I sure hope we won't totally lose the ability to laugh at and with each other. Not to minimize ongoing injustices, but being too easily offended is hard on the self and others.
Maybe there's just not a lot of interest in people just being nice to each other, it certainly doesn't make for an exciting news story.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
Part of me sees that people are getting way too sensitive these days. The days of water off the duck's back are over. My sister and nephew, who are uber liberal are even calling it out. Society is never going to be perfect, no matter how much revolt there is. Back in my day, we rolled with the punches and, sure things were said that we found distasteful, but nobody got up in arms at every turn, unlike today.
The goal is to work towards perfection, knowing you will never achieve it.

The value is in the work towards having a better union and to get there we need to be inclusive, not bigoted and ignorant.

More people lack the privilege required to "just let it go."
 
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Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,818
136
Part of me sees that people are getting way too sensitive these days. The days of water off the duck's back are over. My sister and nephew, who are uber liberal are even calling it out. Society is never going to be perfect, no matter how much revolt there is. Back in my day, we rolled with the punches and, sure things were said that we found distasteful, but nobody got up in arms at every turn, unlike today.

There is such a thing as too sensitive, but we also have to get away from that notion that we can just let bigoted language slide. Let's be honest, there are a lot of people who use genuinely hateful language that both reflects their thinking and colors the thinking of others. Just look at how many homophobic and transphobic slurs (among others) you'll see teens and twenty-something dudebros use... if I were LGBT, that'd be pretty depressing.
 

crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
10,582
2,150
146
The goal is to work towards perfection, knowing you will never achieve it.

The value is in the work towards having a better union and to get there we need to be inclusive, not bigoted and ignorant.

More people lack the privilege required to "just let it go."
I've heard it said that dignity can't be taken away. Nothing external such as social status need necessarily affect one's internal thought processes, these belong to the individual regardless of circumstance.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
I've heard it said that dignity can't be taken away. Nothing external such as social status need necessarily affect one's internal thought processes, these belong to the individual regardless of circumstance.
Well it sounds like what you heard were the words of a moron.
 
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