Rumor has it that 3dfx has a new trick up their sleeve, and it has something to do with this:

[ElFenix]

here i thought we were arguing over whether nvidia's choices were absolutely right or not, implication being that if nvidia was absolutely right, then 3dfx was absolutely wrong. since, of course, that isn't the case, 3dfx was not absolutely wrong, they simply had some unforeseen difficulties executing on the vsa-100. our esteemed collegue seems to believe that there are absolute rights and wrongs in the video chip/card industry.

 

[Hardware]

well if we look at the past
3dfx was complete wrong about 0.25
nvidia was complete right with 0.18
I dont see a reason why this system should fail in the future!

 

[Methodical]

I didnt read the entire topic because its huge but i will chip in what i know about HSR,
There is a hardware solution in the works and its name is the kyro. It runs at like 120 mhz and the HSR architecture is refered to as tile rendering, something powerVR has done before i think. (maybe not, but someone)

Hardware - go to school, take some english courses. they will seriously help.

 

[DaveB3D]

Hardware? Haven't you got anything smarter to say than that same thing over and over? It is wrong,, obviously, and you just look really stupid.

 

[Hardware]

dave u are working for 3dfx so you have to say 3dfx is right
but we all know that isnt true

 

[ATRAF]

I heard that Hardware was [rude idiocy deleted]

---

And the winner of a one way ticket away from AnandTech is...

ATRAF

AnandTech Moderator

 

[DaveB3D]

I don't have to say anything I don't want to say, and I say what I want to say.

 

[BigToque]

<< 3dfx was complete wrong about 0.25
nvidia was complete right with 0.18 >>



Did you not read my post above? Even with a chip made at .25, the V6000 stomps the GF2U around.

You keep saying that short term .25 is alright, but long term is horrible. Thats correct, but do you think 3dfx is gonna use .25 for each and every card they make? If you do thats pretty dumb. They change with the technology. Just because nVidia jumps on the bandwagon earlier than 3dfx does not give them a more powerful card.

RE:

.25 V6000: 1600x1200x32 2xFSAA = 65.1 FPS (BTW, with NO FSAA is that like 120 FPS??)

.18 GF2U: 1600x1200x32 NO FSAA = 58 FPS

Your amazing company that moved to .18 first is getting smoked by the lowly company that sucks because they are using .25.

 

[Hardware]

dave:
I gave facts that 0.18 is better (for a long time) as 0.25
can you give me facts why 0.25 is reliable and good enough for a long time?

 

[Hardware]

stefan your numbers are wrong!

even 65fps are unproofed (how much tweaking the settings)

 

[BigToque]

Hardware, your 'advantages' in .18 are ridiculous. The only thing that matters is how well the card can display the graphics, and how fast it can display them.



<< cooler
less power
more mhz
more functions possible (max die size)
cheaper (more dies from waver)
smaller >>



Wait, those advantages are all fine and dandy. Heres 3dfx's .25 advantage.

.25 V6000: 1600x1200x32 2xFSAA = 65.1 FPS

.18 GF2U: 1600x1200x32 NO FSAA = 58 FPS

 

[BigToque]

I apologize. I was taking the results from here

There is no FSAA when running at 1600x1200x32 NO FSAA and getting 65.1 FPS. while I've been stating it was using 2x FSAA.

Hardware, still with no FSAA, the V6000 whips the GF2U.

 

[Hardware]

We all know q3 can be tweaked in different ways so as we dont have the exact settings I do not know how to evaluate the 65FPS!
How much FPS has the V5500?

 

[Ahriman6]

Hardware:

Are you naturally this much of a tool or are you just trying to be a total horse's ass?

1600x1200x32 is a totally bandwidth-limited setting. The GTS Ultra has what, 7.3GB? The V5 6000 has 10.6GB, roughly 50% more. What do you expect to happen at 16x12x32??

 

[ndee]

Hardware: Why do you belive 0.18 is _FASTER_ than 0.25????????? Why???? Tell me why??????????? A VW Beetle isn't faster than a Ferrari Maranello!!!! SIZE DOESN'T MATTER!!!!!!

 

[rahvin]

Hardware, by your own admission you don't play games because you don't have time. So why the heck do you waste your time in here bashing 3dfx over gaming that you don't do.

 

[ElFenix]

how do you get that 3dfx was completely wrong about .25u?
conversely, how do you get that nvidia was completely right about .18u?
and thirdly, do you not recognize that past performance is no indicator of future performance? lets see, S3 was king of the world, then rendition, then matrox/3dfx, then nvidia, then matrox, then nvidia, then ati gave nvidia a run for its money, likelihood is that nvidia doesn't have much more luck sitting around, so they might just get knocked off the top spot like everyone else has.

 

[Hardware]

The V5500 pushed out 26FPS in Q3 (anand)
With the V6000 65 means a 125% speedup!

I just can see how its possible with the same settings!
Maybe different drivers?

 

[Hardware]

<< how do you get that 3dfx was completely wrong about .25u? >>




<< conversely, how do you get that nvidia was completely right about .18u? >>



It was not me it was the market!
I can just speak for the past
Maybe in the future we will see more ATi Radeon stuff

3dfx is out of question while the VSA-100 is getting older each day and rampage isnt near!
Matrox is silent (Maybe there is a G800 maybe not) but I assume they are fighting for the business market
Kyro is a fine design (HSR) but there a drivers problems and it lacks some speed to go to the top (in my opinoon HSR is the way to go)

 

[Ahriman6]

Hardware:

Referring to the Kyro chip as a &quot;HSR&quot; isn't complete or accurate. You might want to speak less and read more in the future. Just a suggestion, but you really sound like you have more bias than fact going for you, and you're sadly confusing the two in your arguments.

 

[DaveB3D]

5500 gets 35 fps at 1600x1200x32, FYI.

And if you like deferred rendering Hardware, you better like 3dfx. 3dfx bought Gigapixel. Gigapixel uses deferred rendering.

Hardware.. you call KYRO HSR. No NOBODY else answer this. Let us see if Hardware really has the slightest idea of what he is talking about.

How does KYRO do HSR? I want at least the basic steps of it. What happens, etc? I'll even give you a little help. Some time back I made a few posts explaining it.

 

[ICyourNipple]

A few notes to people in this thread:

Why doesn't everyone just stop responding to Hardware?

Ndee: You might want to stop using a million &quot;?&quot; and &quot;!&quot; marks in your posts. I instantly skip anything like that just as much as I would skip an ALL CAPS post.

All this Voodoo 6k talk is alot considering it is basically never going to be a factor. But good luck to 3dfx, I hope they can take over the lead with Gigapixel technology in the future.

 

[Hardware]

Dave: There is no need to prove me
If you want read something about infinite planes ask some other!

 

[ndee]

ICyourNipple: I'm just soooooooooooo upset when somebody wants to talk with the big guys(I'm not saying I'm a big guy, but the Elite Members etc.), and he has NO fact......

 

[DaveB3D]

Yeah there is.. I want to prove that you don't have a clue about this stuff. You proved it about farication and unless you answer me on this, you'll again be proving it on deferred rendering. So shoot it out or shut up.