[Rumor (Various)] AMD R7/9 3xx / Fiji / Fury

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bystander36

Diamond Member
Apr 1, 2013
5,154
132
106
I'd be curious to know how well they OC. If these are true, they clearly set the clocks to match the Titan X and 980ti. Did they leave performance on the table, or did they stretch it to reach those scores.
 

Alatar

Member
Aug 3, 2013
167
1
81
Given that Fiji is watercooled chances are that the GM200 cards have more performance left on the table.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
28,520
1,575
126
I'd be curious to know how well they OC. If these are true, they clearly set the clocks to match the Titan X and 980ti. Did they leave performance on the table, or did they stretch it to reach those scores.

It was speculated that they upped the clocks after the Ti was released.
 

bfun_x1

Senior member
May 29, 2015
475
155
116
All that HBM hype and it's basically a tie with 980ti and Titan X?

I hope not.

That's gotta' be wrong.

The results might be less than exciting but it's still a 4GB card going toe to toe with a 6GB and 12Gb card and wining at 4k. I think that's impressive. Unfortunately if these numbers are real any factory OC 980Ti will eat the Fury for dinner unless this thing OCs like a beast. I'm hoping these numbers are wrong.
 

utahraptor

Golden Member
Apr 26, 2004
1,053
199
106
The results might be less than exciting but it's still a 4GB card going toe to toe with a 6GB and 12Gb card and wining at 4k. I think that's impressive. Unfortunately if these numbers are real any factory OC 980Ti will eat the Fury for dinner unless this thing OCs like a beast. I'm hoping these numbers are wrong.

The leak indicated these were not overclocked results. It is possible when the 980 ti goes head to head to the overclocked fury they may still be neck and neck. It will matter which side left more in the tank.
 

bystander36

Diamond Member
Apr 1, 2013
5,154
132
106
The results might be less than exciting but it's still a 4GB card going toe to toe with a 6GB and 12Gb card and wining at 4k. I think that's impressive. Unfortunately if these numbers are real any factory OC 980Ti will eat the Fury for dinner unless this thing OCs like a beast. I'm hoping these numbers are wrong.

Higher VRAM does not help performance unless the game requires more VRAM.
 

dzoni2k2

Member
Sep 30, 2009
153
198
116
The results are actually exactly what most of us expected. Its more than 50% faster than 290x if those benchmarks are real of course. We don't even know which Fury they tested water or air cooled edition. If that also translates to games we are looking at around 6% faster than TX.
 

Head1985

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2014
1,866
699
136

Azix

Golden Member
Apr 18, 2014
1,438
67
91
Are we not giving AMD enough credit for these cards? They are going up against nvidias cards with smaller chips. While still not cutting out DP like nvidia has.
 

csbin

Senior member
Feb 4, 2013
858
412
136
http://videocardz.com/56225/amd-radeon-fury-x-3dmark-performance

◾Percentage is calculated as an average from both 3DMark presets.
◾We do not know if the Fury X sample(s) were water-cooled.
◾I did my best to include only results with i7-5960X CPU.
◾My chart is awesome.

FSU 4K

TITAN X 3862
FIJI XT 3960



Infraction issued for not following posting rules.
-- stahlhart
 
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ozzy702

Golden Member
Nov 1, 2011
1,151
530
136
I agree. If it isn't 2x 290x then AMD can go to sleep.

Really? If Fury X is less expensive, 10-15% faster than Titan AND they haven't nuetered DP it's still not fast enough? AMD just can't win with you people. :roll eyes:

I've had the following cards in the past 5 years:

8800gt
4850
4870
4890
6870
GTX570 SLI
7970 GHZ
GTX780 SLI

All of which have been great cards that worked well. I just don't get fanboyism. I'm really looking forward to the Fury cards. I don't have much time to game these days between work and family (3rd kid was born yesterday) so I may hold off for the next node but come on, Fury looks like it will be a great card.
 
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parvadomus

Senior member
Dec 11, 2012
685
14
81
Are we not giving AMD enough credit for these cards? They are going up against nvidias cards with smaller chips. While still not cutting out DP like nvidia has.

I dont know what they expect, really. They are on the boundaries of 28nm, competing with a 100% DP castrated GPUs from Nvidia and are still faster..
 

ocre

Golden Member
Dec 26, 2008
1,594
7
81
I dont know what they expect, really. They are on the boundaries of 28nm, competing with a 100% DP castrated GPUs from Nvidia and are still faster..

So you know this how?

Are you posting speculation from an unverified rumor as fact?

Thought it was against the rules?
 

Gikaseixas

Platinum Member
Jul 1, 2004
2,836
218
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So you know this how?

Are you posting speculation from an unverified rumor as fact?

Thought it was against the rules?

Never seen you quoting pro-Nvidia posters who do exactly the same. Challenge on technical terms, not on bias cuz that's also against the rules
 

stahlhart

Super Moderator Graphics Cards
Dec 21, 2010
4,273
77
91
Nvidia hardware is not on topic for this thread. Start another one for your daily hatefest, and keep it out of here.
-- stahlhart
 

Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,505
2,249
136
New metric....Performance vs board size should be implemented.

Benchmark only good for comparing same teams cards. Scores always favor NVIDIA.

Infraction issued for thread crapping.
-- stahlhart
 
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The Alias

Senior member
Aug 22, 2012
647
58
91
New metric....Performance vs board size should be implemented.

Benchmark only good for comparing same teams cards. Scores always favor NVIDIA.

Infraction issued for thread crapping.
-- stahlhart
So true time and time again amd would lose in firestrike or heaven but still outperform competing Nvidia cards or at least be more competitive than the benchmarks would indicate.
 

Headfoot

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2008
4,444
641
126
The takeaway is its a calculated value, based on "leaks" for 3dmark. Its basically one step above useless when it comes to how Fiji is going to perform real-world, in games, max overclock.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
28,520
1,575
126
So true time and time again amd would lose in firestrike or heaven but still outperform competing Nvidia cards or at least be more competitive than the benchmarks would indicate.

Then tell the AMD leakers to post other benches... :biggrin:

We can only go with what we are shown.

If you want to help AMD out with a leak, why would you post FS or Heaven numbers if they are not representative of actual performance?

Are the leakers stupid?

If you are able to run a Fiji card, then run something else and leak that.

Until then, we will argue, fuss, and debate about what we have been given to work with. :whiste:
 

RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
I'd be curious to know how well they OC. If these are true, they clearly set the clocks to match the Titan X and 980ti. Did they leave performance on the table, or did they stretch it to reach those scores.

Good point. NV's 980Ti easily overclocks 20% and it does so with minimal increase in GPU voltages. As a result in overclocked states it doesn't use a lot of power vs. the reference model. This could be different for after-market 980Tis and unfortunately I haven't seen the power usage at peak on an overclocked after-market card. It's a no-win situation comparing a reference 980TI's overclocking vs. power usage since it sounds like a jet engine, nullifying it for overclocking to begin with. We'd need Fiji XT vs. 980Ti after-market OCing comparisons.

I agree. If it isn't 2x 290x then AMD can go to sleep.

That's not realistic at all. Neither AMD nor NV have doubled the specs of their previous gen flagships cards in 1.5 years. Titan X is not equal to 2x 780Ti in specs. It took NV 3 years to double the performance of a 580 with a 780Ti and right now it took NV 3.5 years to double the performance of a 7970. 290X came out November 2013 and right now is June 2015. How do you expect a card with 5832 shaders, 128 ROPs and 352 TMUs on the same 28nm node? Even 50% improvement over the 290X is impressive. For a true leap, wait for 14nm/16nm HBM2 GPUs then.


This chart can be misleading for 3 reasons:

1) Were launch drivers used for testing of the new cards?
2) Was the flagship WCE card used or was it an air cooled Fiji card?
3) Arguably most important - 3DMark is NOT a reflection of gaming performance and that chart shows that issue.

980 has a 19% lead over 290X at 1440P in 3DMark, but real world gaming scores show an 11-12% lead. 980 has a 13% lead at 4K but bench scores for games only show a 6-8% lead. Therefore, using the same logic, if Fiji XT matches Titan X in 3DMark scores, we would need to add 5-7% increase in performance in games which theoretically means if a Fiji card matches Titan X in 3DMark, logic would dictate that it's actually faster in the real world gaming scores, at least when comparing Maxwell vs. GCN products this gen. Honestly though, I don't like 3DMark scores all that much since for the last 5 years, they have been hit and miss - often failing to predict accurate standing of GPU cards between brands. For example, 3DMark never predicted how Fermi and Kepler would perform much worse than GCN in future titles but that's exactly what happened. Sometimes 3D mark can be used as a very rough gauge to compare NV vs. NV or AMD vs. AMD but they usually fail to depict an accurate representation of NV vs. AMD for DX11 games. This of course makes sense since naturally no DX11 game uses a 3DMark game engine, which is why sites like TPU, AnandTech and so on stopped using 3DMark as it's just a synthetic bench.

I would much rather see a professional review site running real world gaming benchmarks on final release date drivers.

So true time and time again amd would lose in firestrike or heaven but still outperform competing Nvidia cards or at least be more competitive than the benchmarks would indicate.

That's exactly it. It's ironic that so many people online keep using Unigine Valley and 3DMark for comparing GPU performance. Those benchmarks can be good for gauging your card's noise levels, temperatures, getting a good starting base for testing your GPU stability since you can loop them. For predicting how AMD and NV fair against each other in games though, these 2 synthetic benchmarks are not very accurate at all, especially Unigine Valley. Also, one can make the argument that a firm with more resources could specifically optimize better for those synthetic benches but it doesn't mean Star Wars Battlefront will run faster on those products, etc. If we go back to 3DMark03 and those days, NV/ATI are known to optimize and even using IQ reducing/cheating drivers to increase scores in those synthetic benches.

If you want to help AMD out with a leak, why would you post FS or Heaven numbers if they are not representative of actual performance?

Are the leakers stupid?

Are you seriously trying to present this argument? Most people on these boards who used synthetic GPU benchmarks like Unigine and 3DMark know they are worthless for predicting gaming performance. Just because someone ran the card in 3DMark it doesn't at all mean it's representative of actual gaming scores. What part of "No game in the world uses a 3DMark game engine" do some gamers not understand? I can't believe synthetic GPU benches and synthetic power viruses are still relevant in 2015. It's just insane how stubborn some PC gamers are that they cling to outdated 15+ year old methods where these tests used to be relevant. One must understand what these tests and designed to do - they are just trying to simulate things, key word -- simulate.

3DMark score tells me absolutely nothing about how my card will perform in The Witcher 3, Star Wars Battlefront, Batman AK, GTA V, Shadow of Mordor. Can you tell me how a 980Ti performs in those games against a Fiji card based on a 3DMark score? No, you cannot. Using 3DMark to gauge where GCN sits against another GCN card is borderline as is and even those are often not correct because if game is geometry limited (280X suffers more than a 285/290), a 3DMark bench score won't predict that scenario and it also can't predict performance in GameWorks titles.

Gamers don't want DP.

That's not the point. It's more impressive from an engineering perspective to design a dual-purpose compute card that's still top of class in gaming, whether gamers want DP or not is not what some of the members here alluded to. It's about the idea that a firm with less resources could potentially beat a company that's more or less focused on graphics (NV). Their point was that if AMD's chip is only 550mm2 but is as fast as the Titan X in games butstill has DP performance, that means AMD's engineers have outperformed NV's because they would have managed to make a dual-purpose product that succeeds in more than 1 area in a smaller die size. The penalty for this is likely that 300W TDP though, still NV's engineers needed a 601mm2 die just for gaming. You also may have forgotten how double precision was used to justify the brand/premiums for the OG Titan, but now the same posters no longer care for it.

Considering for months all we heard how Fiji is either a re-badge of a 290X with HBM or it's a dual Tonga XT card (2x2048 shaders on 2 die) or that it has no chance of catching up the Titan X (coming from Titan X owners), if AMD's card is even 1% faster than the Titan X at 4K, a lot of people on these forums will have been proven wrong.
 
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Headfoot

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2008
4,444
641
126
If both companies can get another 50% out of the same node, color me impressed. The 980 Ti and Titan X are already very impressive for 28nm. If AMD can reach the same ballpark, id say they both did a marvelous job of working within the constraints of the seemingly unending 28nm node
 
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