Run our new house off of wifi?

[ncage]

Hi guys, in my previous house i had the luxury of having an extremely easy way to run cables. It was a single story house with an unfinished basement.

We must purchased a new home and running cabling is going to be extremely complicated i think. Its a two story house with a finished basement. I'm used to having gigabit network in my old house and being able to copy large files around quite easily.

My first concern was we stream a lot of HD video around the house to our entertainment systems (VUDU mainly).

Second is i'm a developer and i do a lot of work with sql server. I'm not used to having to put wireless adapters in desktop PCs

i had a guy come out to the house today to give me an estimate. He said he is going to have to charge me by the hour because they have no idea what the are going to run into when they start to get in the walls but he was guessing it would be in the neighborhood of $1,500.

I do have a high end wireless router. Netgear R7000 nighthawk with dd-wrt (AC wireless) that i get excellent signal so far on the 2nd floor (cable modem & router is in the basement).

What would you guys do? Would you just use wireless and see what happens and install wireless cards in the PCs? What would you for the few devices that require to be hard wired (Vonage Phone Adapter)?

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[VirtualLarry]

If the house is already finished, and you don't have a deadline for getting the walls wired, and you get good signal throughout the house with AC wireless, then I would go with wireless for now, and then re-evaluate your needs in a month or two, and see how well the wireless works for you.

I'm using AC wireless with an ESR1200 Engenius router, and some PremierTek PT-8812AU USB3.0 wifi adapters. (Both are AC1200)

I get 14-17MB/sec from my wired gigabit NAS to my AC wifi clients. My 30Mbit internet connection is full-speed from any of my PCs.

Edit: Those wireless adapters can be purchased from "PremierTek_com" on ebay for $20 ea.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/802-11abgn-...SB_Wi_Fi_Adapters_Dongles&hash=item25898dcad7

 

[IndyColtsFan]

I'd stick with wireless and see how well that works. Another option you can try is powerline networking. FWIW, my entertainment center downstairs is wirelessly bridged to my network upstairs and I'm able to stream ripped blu rays, Netflix, Amazon, etc. with zero issues.

How many drops did that $1500 rough estimate give you?

 

[JackMDS]

If you think that you can get away by laying few cables (using Molding and other architectural tricks) then go with Wireless.

The few cables would be needed to extend the Wireless with APs to dead/too slow spots).

Otherwise $1500 is the right investment to insure highly functional Network.

 

[ncage]

Hi Guys. Ya i think i'm just going to go wireless for now. If that doesn't work out then i guess i will have to get it wired. I really didn't want to spend that kind of money now considering we have to house payments until we get our other house sold and have to replace the aging furance in the AM.

 

[ncage]

I'd stick with wireless and see how well that works. Another option you can try is powerline networking. FWIW, my entertainment center downstairs is wirelessly bridged to my network upstairs and I'm able to stream ripped blu rays, Netflix, Amazon, etc. with zero issues.

How many drops did that $1500 rough estimate give you?

It was for 5. His issue was one place where i wanted a cable ran. It was right above a finished garage. He said material would probably be about $300 and then he would charge me $80 an hour for two people. He said its very possible that it could take him less just doesn't know what he is going to run into when he start trying to fish the wires through the walls.

He actually was a pretty good guy. He end up calling me about 20 minutes later and telling me he couldn't stop thinking about the job after he left and he recommended i NOT wire my house until i was 100% sure i needed it. He said he wants to be known for honesty and didn't want to try to force me into something that he didn't think i needed.

We did talk about one option that would save me money. Run 1 cat 6 cable to the attic and then have a switch in the upstairs closest. Then drop cat cable from the Attic where you needed it.

I found out he also installs flat screen TVs on walls and that includes opening the wall for the cables for $250 which i though to be a very fair price.

 

[kevnich2]

That price for wiring is reasonable actually. My wiring contractor charges $80 an hr as well, some runs end up cheap and others take more time. If this is a new house, wiring like this is easy before drywall goes up. Pain after its up sometimes.

Another option is to do a wireless site survey and have a few runs ran to spots in the ceiling and have few ubiquiti unifi WAP installed. This would give ideal coverage and spread load. I'm not a fan of wireless from a wireless router as it's never as good as dedicated AP

 

[tential]

Depends on the person you get doing the wiring for you really. I had my wiring done when I moved to Verizon FIOS for $100 per "drop"(is that the correct term?).

Seems a high price for $1500 but I guess it's dependent on who you know and what your house looks like as well as the length/difficulty of the runs. I know we had a photographer come here to do baby photos and the quoted price on the phone somehow "quadrupled" when she got to the house.

I'd say wire it though. I've used wireless and powerline adapters constantly and the hassle/headache I've been through as well as the amount of time I have spent trouble shooting issues? That's been in excess of $1500 worth of time throughout the years, as well as replaced devices to attempt to fix "patches" in the network coverage.

 

[azazel1024]

Depends on the person you get doing the wiring for you really. I had my wiring done when I moved to Verizon FIOS for $100 per "drop"(is that the correct term?).

Seems a high price for $1500 but I guess it's dependent on who you know and what your house looks like as well as the length/difficulty of the runs. I know we had a photographer come here to do baby photos and the quoted price on the phone somehow "quadrupled" when she got to the house.

I'd say wire it though. I've used wireless and powerline adapters constantly and the hassle/headache I've been through as well as the amount of time I have spent trouble shooting issues? That's been in excess of $1500 worth of time throughout the years, as well as replaced devices to attempt to fix "patches" in the network coverage.

It seems pretty high to me as well. Yes, difficulties can be encountered. That said I've generally seen $80-100 per drop flat rate or in the range of $60-80 an hour (inclusive of materials).

As for time required, $1500 would indicate nearly 20 hours of work, which seems MASSIVELY high for 5 drops. By comparison (I'll grant, it is an unfinished basement) it took me roughly 4hrs to do the HARDEST LAN drop in my brothers house, running it completely across the house, through the garage and up in to the master bedroom. Most of the other drops did or would take me in the area of 30 minutes to 2hrs. Short of a masnsion, a typical 2 story family home (bonus points for rancher and unfinished basement or partially unfinished basement) would likely be on the order of 1-2hrs per locations and this is NOT something I do as a job or have terribly specialized tools (other than a wire snake).

I'd frankly shop around a little. I'd be kind of surpised, to be honest, if you couldn't find an electrician or security company that couldn't or wouldn't do those 5 drops for less than a grand. Just because someone seems honest, doesn't mean that they aren't either overcharging or just might be slow at what they do (and thus expensive).

 

[DigDog]

i'm just here to give you points for having written "off of" correctly; english lives!

 

[Scarpozzi]

Do a little research on wireless standards. If your house is big enough, you may want a few hotspots. It might make sense to move your cable modem/router/switch somewhere that you can easily branch to WAPs from.

If you look at the N standards, you can get some really good throughput as long as you're close enough to the access points. You may have some opportunities to use plumbing or closets to easily run cable without having to fish the cable too far...just depends on floorplan.

Otherwise, try to get something you can put DD-WRT on with good antennas and max the power out for the max signal near your computers.

Don't forget you can get external USB N Adapters for your desktop. They're fast and you can throw them on a 10 foot cable to move them around for better reception. Some come with stands for desk or bookshelf placement.

 

[nk215]

I have a big house (5000+sf) with half the basement finished. I use wireless (ac) for the most part but also run cables for the hotspots and certain computers. I use hvac return duct to run cat5 from the basement to one of my upper level bed room.

Don't forget that you can also run cables in your attic. Basement to garage to the bed room right above that is also an option.

 

[nk215]

I forgot to recommend commercial wireless hot spot. Then looks like smoke detectors and get power thru cat5 cable. A lot cleaner to to mount on top floor ceiling can cover great range for your phone/tablets. Mine is only N speed but that's enough for mobile devices.

 

[Eug]

I have a 4000 sq ft L-shaped house. One latest model Apple AirPort Extreme is enough for the whole house, for reliable internet access and Netflix streaming for my iPads and laptops. Occasionally I have some dropouts with my iPhones at the furthest spots in the house, but usually it works fine. I guess the antennae of the iPhones are not as strong as the iPads and laptops.

Note that I had many more reception problems with a previous model AirPort Extreme and some older non-Apple wireless routers too.

So yeah, a single good consumer wireless router can cover an entire big house, but it depends on the equipment. However, the speeds will be good for internet access but not good for large file transfers in the more distant locations. I have Gigabit Ethernet to all my desktops and to my NASes.

 

[brshoemak]

This might not be an option for you, but have you considered re-purposing your phone lines in each room? I assume you do have phone jacks in each room, right?

Many (if not most) builders anymore wire phone lines to each room with CAT5 (4-pair) and only punch down 1 or 2 pair to RJ11 outlets for phone service. I really wanted gigabit ethernet so I replaced the RJ11 jacks with RJ45 and punched them down for ethernet. I located where the phone entered the house and found the phone splitter with all the lines from each room connected to it.

I just disconnected the active phone line and left it hanging. I bought a cheap CAT5 patch panel and wall mount from Monoprice and punched down the lines from all the rooms into. Then it was simply a matter of connecting the runs to a switch with short patch cables and I had my gigabit ethernet.

Obviously you lose the utility of those connections as phone lines, but many people use cell phones in lieu of a landlines these days. If you still want a landline for emergency purposes (or whatever) you can just connect a cheap corded phone to the phone line you previously left disconnected.

 

[azazel1024]

This might not be an option for you, but have you considered re-purposing your phone lines in each room? I assume you do have phone jacks in each room, right?

Many (if not most) builders anymore wire phone lines to each room with CAT5 (4-pair) and only punch down 1 or 2 pair to RJ11 outlets for phone service. I really wanted gigabit ethernet so I replaced the RJ11 jacks with RJ45 and punched them down for ethernet. I located where the phone entered the house and found the phone splitter with all the lines from each room connected to it.

I just disconnected the active phone line and left it hanging. I bought a cheap CAT5 patch panel and wall mount from Monoprice and punched down the lines from all the rooms into. Then it was simply a matter of connecting the runs to a switch with short patch cables and I had my gigabit ethernet.

Obviously you lose the utility of those connections as phone lines, but many people use cell phones in lieu of a landlines these days. If you still want a landline for emergency purposes (or whatever) you can just connect a cheap corded phone to the phone line you previously left disconnected.

Good point on something to check. Most homes built from about the mid 2000's on do typically use Cat5 for phone wiring. You can convert it to a LAN drop easily by replacing the connector and moving it from the phone bus bar to a patch panel and wiring it in to a switch.

On Eug's post, "enough to cover" and "good converage" are certainly different things. My basement router, if centrally located, would cover roughly 6-8,000sq-ft of interior space based on its current coverage (it is located in the far corner of the basement, and CAN cover the ENTIRE house in 2.4GHz, 5GHz peters out without being able to cover the whole house). That said, GOOD performance is really only had over about 2/3rds of the house on 2.4GHz and about 1/2 the house on 5GHz. Centrally located, that would be maybe a 3,000sq-ft house at best.

Which is why I have an AP setup on my 1st floor opposite side of the house, so my entire house is blanketed in very good to excellent coverage instead of simply "some kind of coverage".

Of course, some kind of coverage might be all some people need because they just need to get a 5Mbps connection over the entire residence. I have a 75/75 I want to cover the entire house with, combined with desiring the ability to hit awesome speeds in a few locations with my laptop/tablet (realistically, I don't need to get the 400+Mbps I can in my basement office on the laptop everywhere, but I have done my best to get >150Mbps over most of the house for the laptop).

 

[CA19100]

You might also consider a hybrid solution. I have an apartment in a big complex, meaning I get a lot of wireless interference, particularly on one end of the apartment where my office is. Switching to the 5GHz band helped the issue, but did not eliminate it. The worst signal was to my desktop PC, which I keep on the floor. (A cheap PCI-E card got that machine onto the wireless network; that part was very easy.) I tried improve the wireless with an external antenna up higher, and while that helped significantly, it still wasn't consistent enough for me.

What I ended up doing was putting the wireless router (ASUS RT-N56U) on the side of the apartment with the cable modem, Roku, printer, etc. Those are all right nearby and connected with ethernet to the router, and wireless devices on that side of the house get very strong, fast coverage.

From one port of my main router, I then ran a single Cat 6 cable to my office tucked under the edge of the carpet, and stuck a 5-port gigabit switch at the end for my various devices on my desk. It accomplished what I needed, and was a much smaller job than wiring up several rooms.

Maybe something like that would do what you need for a lower cost?

With all that in mind, if the wireless had worked, I'd have been perfectly happy with it. Without interference, it can saturate my 50Mbit cable connection without issue. I'd definitely start with the wireless and see if it meets your needs, possibly with the external antenna I linked above for the desktop machine.