Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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NTMBK

Lifer
Nov 14, 2011
10,269
5,134
136
You're assuming they've sold out of the better stock before getting to the T-62's. You sure about that? Telling me that 12.5K -> 10.5K, that 10.5K is T-62's, worse, or rust?

Some will need massive amounts of repair to bring back into service (with parts that they may not be able to source), some will be so far gone that they are never being reactivated, some may have never even existed except on paper. Why else send in an old tank with worse armament, worse armour, and higher crew requirements (4 crew instead of 3)? I'm sure a trickle of various T-72s and T-80s will still come through as they get patched up, but it's not like they're ready to send to the fight right now.

An analysis of Google Maps satellite images of 19 Russian military storage facilities mainly located east of Russia’s Ural Mountains by the Ukrainian Military Center, a Ukrainian military defense news site, estimates that 2,299 tanks appear unrestorable.

Stored in the open for decades, they are basically heaps of rusty scrap metal ready for nothing but disposal.


 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,551
13,116
136
Some will need massive amounts of repair to bring back into service (with parts that they may not be able to source), some will be so far gone that they are never being reactivated, some may have never even existed except on paper. Why else send in an old tank with worse armament, worse armour, and higher crew requirements (4 crew instead of 3)? I'm sure a trickle of various T-72s and T-80s will still come through as they get patched up, but it's not like they're ready to send to the fight right now.




Yes I know all this, and the only card I have is “Readiness” … They havent pouched all their best gear, cause they cant constitutionally unless its *real war*. Cause you cant compromise your readiness for a “retracted military operation”.
I am not saying *it is so*, we’re playing odds here, and when the analysts here discusses it, they dont count it out.
 
Reactions: Leeea

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
Germany two months from now:
‘They will be there any minute, we can’t find the keys’

The pace of German supply is maddeningly slow. This instance that everything be washed through KMW or Rheinmetall is simply ridiculous. They're only halfway done sending the Gepards. Even if that's the case they should stop actively interfering with Ukraine trying to buy Marder IFVs or negotiating a tank deal. Apparently the US privately told the German government to stop blaming them for their decision not to make these contracts, essentially to grow some balls and take responsibility.
 

Dave_5k

Golden Member
May 23, 2017
1,664
3,224
136
You're assuming they've sold out of the better stock before getting to the T-62's. You sure about that? Telling me that 12.5K -> 10.5K, that 10.5K is T-62's, worse, or rust?
There are several photos of hundreds of stockpiled tanks - stored in the open, not maintained, with engines removed (stolen), which I've taken to be representative of most of their tank reserve. And at least 7300 of the tank "reserve" was indeed T-64, T-62, or T-55's.

Here's a bit of an investigative thread on the issue - 1 in 10 of the Russian "reserve" tanks mobilized from storage was usable according to Ukraine intelligence.
 

Dave_5k

Golden Member
May 23, 2017
1,664
3,224
136
Yes I know all this, and the only card I have is “Readiness” … They havent pouched all their best gear, cause they cant constitutionally unless its *real war*. Cause you cant compromise your readiness for a “retracted military operation”.
I am not saying *it is so*, we’re playing odds here, and when the analysts here discusses it, they dont count it out.
Yeah, I don't doubt Russia has reserved at least a small core of latest modern armor & particularly has reserved strategic air defense assets against the phantom NATO menace, but I'd wager nothing short of an invasion threatening Moscow would get those deployed at this point.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
Oh man Russia must figure the 30th time they issue that threat that people are going to take them seriously.

If Putin would like to declare war on NATO that is technically an option available to him I guess.


Obviously, if they have trouble with a mobile artillery system that has a range of 70-80km, what kind of problems would they have with one that has several hundreds km.

All of the problems.
 

deustroop

Golden Member
Dec 12, 2010
1,916
354
136
Ehh.. perhaps you haven't listened to the Russians?
"The Ukrainian people do not exist".

This is simply an internal matter, Russia is securing Russia.
That is their propaganda.

What's interesting about this PR melodrama is that now these morons all disagree on Ukraine policy whereas one week ago they all agreed . I suggest their relations mirror the political state of the Russian intelligentsia and elites. Nevertheless, for all the obvious strife, no one faults Pukin, his murderous self. Not a whiff of turning on the leader, the one they know started the catastrophe. So presuming this ultimate solidarity, based on the love of a dictatorship as long as its yours, remains, even in the face of the fast approaching military surrender in Ukraine, the issue becomes, how to take him out and deliver his criminal ass to Brussels when he appears untouchable by political pressure alone ? I haven't seen a plausible scenario for this likely endgame.
Nothing less than taking Putin and his cronies into ICC custody will satisfy UKR nor should it the West. But do they/them/ us have the courage of our convictions here? This may be the only opportunity to reform the persistent historical Russian love for fascist order and discipline pursued over and above individual rights, freedoms and responsibilities.
Just an aside but between Belgorod and Moscow is~ 350 miles. Just an aside .
 
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