Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

[RnR_au]

It does not matter what Zelensky has said. The continuing damage from Russian missile and drone attacks are taking their toll. Which is why more and more people are strongly suggesting a negotiated settlement between Ukraine and Russia to stop them.

And none of these people are in Ukraine. What does the Ukrainian people say? Peace? Or kick the Russians out?

Ukrainians Support Fighting Until Victory

Most Ukrainians favor fighting until the country wins the war. To them, victory means retaking all territory seized by Russia since 2014, including Crimea.

news.gallup.com

So the peaceniks outside of Ukraine in their comfortable democracies should just shut the fuck up and push their politicians to send more aid to Ukraine. Because it looks like that the Ukrainian people are quite happy to fight the Russians to get their own comfortable democracy.

 

[Lezunto]

So one has to be Ukrainian to notice the damage from missile and drone attacks in Ukraine? The damage, unfortunately, is real.

Who noticed the hurriedly buried graves of slaughtered Ukrainian civilians? Folks from Iceland.

Ukraine's power grid sustains record damage in Russian strikes, utility says

Over 1.4 million households have lost electricity after repeated Russian air raids, the president's office says. Ukraine's power utility says the extent of the damage eclipses earlier attacks.

www.npr.org

 

[RnR_au]

So one has to be Ukrainian to notice the damage from missile and drone attacks in Ukraine? The damage, unfortunately, is real.

Who noticed the hurriedly buried graves of slaughtered Ukrainian civilians? Folks from Iceland.

Ukraine's power grid sustains record damage in Russian strikes, utility says

Over 1.4 million households have lost electricity after repeated Russian air raids, the president's office says. Ukraine's power utility says the extent of the damage eclipses earlier attacks.

www.npr.org

What right do you have to impose peace on Ukraine and Russia when large parts of Ukraine would go to Putin under such a peace negotiation? Especially since the people who are actually doing the fighting WANTS TO KEEP FIGHTING!

You are like a good little colonialist who thinks he knows better than the dirty natives imposing your 'enlightened' values on these natives. You want to give huge parts of Ukraine to Russia just so you can sleep better.

These natives do want peace... but they want it on their terms. Not yours. Not Russia's. Theirs.

 

[dank69]

So one has to be Ukrainian to notice the damage from missile and drone attacks in Ukraine? The damage, unfortunately, is real.

Who noticed the hurriedly buried graves of slaughtered Ukrainian civilians? Folks from Iceland.

Ukraine's power grid sustains record damage in Russian strikes, utility says

Over 1.4 million households have lost electricity after repeated Russian air raids, the president's office says. Ukraine's power utility says the extent of the damage eclipses earlier attacks.

www.npr.org

What Ukrainians think about this war matters. What everyone else thinks about it, including Icelanders, does not matter one tiny bit.

 

[brycejones]

So one has to be Ukrainian to notice the damage from missile and drone attacks in Ukraine? The damage, unfortunately, is real.

Who noticed the hurriedly buried graves of slaughtered Ukrainian civilians? Folks from Iceland.

Ukraine's power grid sustains record damage in Russian strikes, utility says

Over 1.4 million households have lost electricity after repeated Russian air raids, the president's office says. Ukraine's power utility says the extent of the damage eclipses earlier attacks.

www.npr.org

Ok Neville, 1938 Munich says hello.

 

[zinfamous]

zinfamous, Kage and the rest of the warmongers:

It does not matter what Zelensky has said.

Maybe then you should advise Zelensky on how it is best to surrender his nation to Nazis, than to defeat the Nazis. Do this from the comfort of your own home.

 

[uallas5]

Oh boy

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584600236671967233

archive.ph

Sure, let's have peace talks only between the US and Russia and not include the country where the war is actually occurring, look how well that turned out for Afghanistan.

 

[kage69]

zinfamous, Kage and the rest of the warmongers:

No one here supports the Russian invasion you silly drunk fuck. Stop embarrassing yourself.

It does not matter what Zelensky has said.

He's the president of Ukraine. It matters very much what he says. You acting like an ideological prick does not change any of this.

The continuing damage from Russian missile and drone attacks are taking their toll. Which is why more and more people are strongly suggesting a negotiated settlement between Ukraine and Russia to stop them.

Oh shit, strongly suggesting! Well then.

You don't get to speak for Ukraine, and they don't want to negotiate with terrorists. What Putin appeasers like you and Kissinger want is entirely irrelevant. Russian attacks have been taking a toll since last March, what is your point? You can't even make sense here on a forum, why you think you can speak for Ukraine's defenses and sentiment of it's warfighters is beyond me. Asking you to elaborate here, again, probably won't matter, will it?

Because I don't see any evidence that anything other than this will. You're not going to war and if you have children, you're not sending them to Ukraine either.

Luckily, no one gives a shit about the observational skills you fail at. Russia is losing, have already kissed thier future goodbye. What you don't see doesn't matter at all, the rest of us see objective reality for what it is, while you haven't a clue and want to rant at nameless posters over it online. You do realize I am not Ukrainian, right? That I live in a different hemisphere? Do yourself a favor and stop flapping your gums, it's getting sad.

None of you were writers which is why the only garbage you can spew are personal insults.

You really need to stop drinking. You're embarrassing yourself with these posts. I've asked you to back up your own words, repeatedly, but it's something you can't or won't do, so you get a befitting title. Don't like it? Then quit lying.

But according to you, NATO, increased U.S. military aid and world opinion were supposed to have halted this invasion already.

Quote it up liar. I'm happy to explain whatever it is that can't penetrate into that wet brain of yours. Your butthurt over no one wanting to negotiate with war criminals and terrorists is duly noted, summarily ignored though.

 

[Commodus]

On top of what others have said: the unfortunate reality is that Russia is not only uninterested in sincere negotiations with Ukraine, it can't be trusted to honor a deal even if it agrees to one. Why enter talks with a country that will likely only use any treaty to regroup until it finds another excuse to invade?

While I don't want to use too many analogies, this really does sound like Chamberlain ahead of WWII (as brycejones pointed out while I was writing this) — that is, trying to secure peace by making concessions to a dictator who has no intentions of playing by the rules. Sometimes we have to accept that war is here, and that lasting peace will only come when one side is thoroughly defeated.

Besides, I can't really see a negotiated peace that would be anything but insulting to Ukraine. The only acceptable solution is that all Russian solders withdraw from Ukraine, and that Russia drop its false annexation of that territory; this should include Crimea, too. Otherwise, we're telling Putin that the invasion was worthwhile by giving him land he wouldn't otherwise have.

 

[kage69]

Maybe then you should advise Zelensky on how it is best to surrender his nation to Nazis, than to defeat the Nazis. Do this from the comfort of your own home.

Supporting the defense of a nation fighting for it's very survival against a fascist, genocidal invader makes us warmongers zin.

Who knew?

 

[Indus]

zinfamous, Kage and the rest of the warmongers:

It does not matter what Zelensky has said. The continuing damage from Russian missile and drone attacks are taking their toll. Which is why more and more people are strongly suggesting a negotiated settlement between Ukraine and Russia to stop them.

Because I don't see any evidence that anything other than this will. You're not going to war and if you have children, you're not sending them to Ukraine either.

None of you were writers which is why the only garbage you can spew are personal insults. But according to you, NATO, increased U.S. military aid and world opinion were supposed to have halted this invasion already.

You were wrong. Rage away.

Yeah and we should just take Russia at its word since they've been so honorable before!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584842711315533825

Yes the damage is real but until Russia is totally destroyed of its ability to make war of any kind.. you can't trust it.


And while you're in America and calling us all warmongers when in fact we like peace and were very opposed to a war in Iraq for oil or staying in Afghanistan indefinitely..

The Ukraine war actually has a purpose..

If you're wondering what I'll explain:
(might be long but I'll simplify it)

The #1 national security interest for America long term is water/ food security for its citizens.

- Ukraine is the bread basket of Europe.

- If Russians take over Ukraine they can use food as a weapon.

- Europe isn't so poor. They won't starve like a 3rd world country.

- They can afford to buy food and say fuck you to Russia! (like they're trying to do now with the natural gas)

- But this means food that we grow in America will be sold in Europe at exorbitant prices!

Hence Americans will be the ones hurting as they won't have access to cheap food.

Hell we're complaining about not having dollar meals at McDonalds anymore. Do you want burgers costing $20 because Europeans will be willing to pay $25 for em.

So it is very much in American interests to make sure Ukraine isn't in Russian hands.. and you can transpose that about Taiwan and semiconductors too.

If anything food is more important since you eat everyday vs semiconductors you buy once every 4-5 years unless you buy new phones every year!

I'm just about as anti-war as anyone but even I get it.. this war is necessary and there will be losses.. a lot more losses than the other American thread with actual people we know dying but at least its not just for oil corporations in Iraq.

 

[nicalandia]

Why can't we just level Iran and stop Iranian Suicide Drones from Killing Europeans?

 

[kage69]

Why can't we just level Iran and stop Iranian Suicide Drones from Killing Europeans?

Mountain complexes. Civilians. The Strait. The fact we aren't psychos like certain Russians. How many reasons you looking for?

35mm in quantity and more Gepards would be an easier, less costly tactic for the Iranian model airplanes I think.

 

[fskimospy]

Why can't we just level Iran and stop Iranian Suicide Drones from Killing Europeans?

Why can't we genocide a country because they are providing modest amounts of fairly crummy drones to Russia?

I would hope that question answers itself. We COULD, but we won't because we aren't nuts.

 

[K1052]

I figured these were dismantled but the US appears to have held on to the MIM-23 HAWK surface to air systems.
These would also be useful to have against Iranian ballistic missiles which are reportedly being supplied to Russia.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584799754407464960

 

[Perknose]

On top of what others have said: the unfortunate reality is that Russia is not only uninterested in sincere negotiations with Ukraine, it can't be trusted to honor a deal even if it agrees to one. Why enter talks with a country that will likely only use any treaty to regroup until it finds another excuse to invade?

@Lezunto Came here to say this. For me, it's the absolute crux of the matter.

 

[fskimospy]

@Lezunto Came here to say this. For me, it's the absolute crux of the matter.

Absolutely correct. Putin is faced with the Trump Problem - he can't make credible commitments because everyone knows he's a shameless liar.

If, as part of a deal, Russia promised to respect the territorial integrity of Ukraine at all times going forward the rational response is 'you already made that promise and then broke it'. You would have to be nuts to trust them again so the only logical response is to make this experience so painful for Russia that either Putin is overthrown and replaced with more credible leadership or you so thoroughly decimate Russia's military and economy that they can't rebuild for many, many years, leaving a very sharp lesson to the country that the world has had it with their shit.

Anything else and exactly as Commodus said you have yourselves another war in a year or whatever.

 

[nOOky]

Why can't we genocide a country because they are providing modest amounts of fairly crummy drones to Russia?

I would hope that question answers itself. We COULD, but we won't because we aren't nuts.

Iran would not be a cakewalk using conventional military, and of course nuking them is out of the question. Targeting specific drone making facilities would be the best bet.

 

[K1052]

Absolutely correct. Putin is faced with the Trump Problem - he can't make credible commitments because everyone knows he's a shameless liar.

If, as part of a deal, Russia promised to respect the territorial integrity of Ukraine at all times going forward the rational response is 'you already made that promise and then broke it'. You would have to be nuts to trust them again so the only logical response is to make this experience so painful for Russia that either Putin is overthrown and replaced with more credible leadership or you so thoroughly decimate Russia's military and economy that they can't rebuild for many, many years, leaving a very sharp lesson to the country that the world has had it with their shit.

Anything else and exactly as Commodus said you have yourselves another war in a year or whatever.

More importantly probably at this juncture is that Putin has not even shown any interest in pulling back from his maximalist demands. There's just nothing to negotiate.

 

[trenchfoot]

I remember some famous Brit named Winnie saying something about you don't negotiate with a tiger when your head is in it's mouth. Seems as if some folks in the media think you can end up with favorable terms while being in such a predicament.

May not be the precise situation that the Ukrainians are presently in, although it does still seem a bit apropos for them at this moment in time.

 

[K1052]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584814651086626819

Dirty bombs, wiping whole cities off the face of the Earth. Why won't those peace loving Europeans force the Ukrainians to the peace table? Its for the Ukrainian own good...

/s

I'm not going to post it here but there is some nice very recent footage of many dead and wounded Kadyrovites in Kherson who took some videos of their new bunking accommodations and got the building HIMARSed.

 

[Zorba]

Why can't we just level Iran and stop Iranian Suicide Drones from Killing Europeans?

I think ultimately Iran has just as much right to sell their shit to Russia as we do to sell our shit to the Saudis.

 

[Dave_5k]

Why can't we genocide a country because they are providing modest amounts of fairly crummy drones to Russia?

I would hope that question answers itself. We COULD, but we won't because we aren't nuts.

Unlike Russia, sadly, which will genocide a country just because it had a bad hair day.

 

[K1052]

I think ultimately Iran has just as much right to sell their shit to Russia as we do to sell our shit to the Saudis.

I doin't think I disagree with this. I'm actually more annoyed at Israel withholding surface to air defense systems and generally prohibiting transfers of arms European nations bought from them.
Especially since the US bankrolled, sometimes directly, the development and acquisition of many Israeli made arms in close cooperation with US defense companies.

 

[K1052]

All indications are that Congress will pass a big slug of aid in the lame duck, likely enough to keep Ukraine going into at least 2024.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584925973610483716