Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,867
34,814
136
Yes, but can Russia hold anything long term right now, particularly given the large economic consequences of this war. I don't think these sanctions are going to end any time in the foreseeable future. They can have fun fighting an undermanned insurgency war there for another 10 years.

The export controls are basically cancer for the Russian economy and military industry, slow but ultimately crippling and fatal. Putin needs an outcome that sees these relaxed or removed but that's nowhere on the horizon right now.
 
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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,576
7,637
136
Yes, but can Russia hold anything long term right now, particularly given the large economic consequences of this war. I don't think these sanctions are going to end any time in the foreseeable future. They can have fun fighting an undermanned insurgency war there for another 10 years.

There would be no insurgency.
  • Make 1/3rd, maybe up to 1/2 the population flee.
  • Kill half of the remaining population.
  • Deport half the survivors.
  • Import hundreds of thousands of Russians.
All you have to do is commit Genocide and massacre entire populations, as Russia has repeatedly done throughout history up to and including right now in Ukraine.
Soon as there is a sign of trouble, they'll ratchet up the massacre and replacement regime. Dead people do not fight back. And freshly imported Russians will keep the few survivors (handpicked) in line.

Not saying there wouldn't be trouble... but so long as Genocide is on the table, Russia can hold stolen land. Locals do not defeat an army when the army is actually killing the locals.
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,613
3,459
136
There's a huge slave labor economy that's propping up the business professionals in the country. They fly in philipinos, and other south asians to do everyone's dirty work. seems like a crappy society to me, not that the US is much better.

There was a big reddit thread about this, where someone from Singapore was whining that their indentured servant had run away and asking whether they should call the police to have them captured and brought back. Zero self-awareness.
 
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nicalandia

Diamond Member
Jan 10, 2019
3,331
5,282
136
There would be no insurgency.
  • Make 1/3rd, maybe up to 1/2 the population flee.
  • Kill half of the remaining population.
  • Deport half the survivors.
  • Import hundreds of thousands of Russians.
All you have to do is commit Genocide and massacre entire populations, as Russia has repeatedly done throughout history up to and including right now in Ukraine.
Soon as there is a sign of trouble, they'll ratchet up the massacre and replacement regime. Dead people do not fight back. And freshly imported Russians will keep the few survivors (handpicked) in line.

Not saying there wouldn't be trouble... but so long as Genocide is on the table, Russia can hold stolen land. Locals do not defeat an army when the army is actually killing the locals.

Look what we have here, a Russian Asset..! Get Out of Here.

The West Will prevail, no matter what. Putin Can't Win This. You, Russia and Every Commie out there have allready lost this war of aggression
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,050
38,554
136
There's a huge slave labor economy that's propping up the business professionals in the country. They fly in philipinos, and other south asians to do everyone's dirty work. seems like a crappy society to me, not that the US is much better.

Middle East is like that too, what I saw in Qatar made me mad. UAE and Bahrain are similar, Sa'udi Arabia might be the worst. Filipinos and Pakistanis were treated as disposable, lived in tightly packed dorms and worked really hard in brutal heat for not a lot of money. After surrendering passports to their employers, that part always bugged me. I heard things have improved since I was there, certainly hope so though I have doubts. I always felt guilty, white expats were treated like honored guests for the most part. If you respected Ramadan and made an effort at Arabic you were almost royalty.

And you're right, America still has a problem. Trump himself used illegal workers, the Polish Brigade, made those poor bastards sleep on the worksite. Mehmet Oz, running for office right now, given the largest fine EVER by ICE for hiring illegal workers. It would be easier to take repugs seriously on illegal immigration if only they were interested in confronting businesses who use it, though to be fair in places like Texas, selling out to pro-business concerns and swallowing those border security qualms is a bipartisan affair.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,050
38,554
136

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,681
7,180
136
They're getting riled and assisted by Moscow. Russia does this in a number of European countries.

And in the USA we have Trump, his goons and a base of support that's all primed up to receive Putin as their closest ally in their fight against the Jews, the Gays, the non-Caucasians, the Unclean and the socialist heathen who demand free stuff from the gov't.
 
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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,548
13,115
136
I do not like where the attrition is heading.
  • Putin has already killed 70,000 Russians.
  • Russians do not care. They are slaves for a meat grinder of their master's choosing.
  • He can throw another 100,000 Russians to their deaths.
It will greatly hurt Ukraine.

Especially if it delays the Ukrainian advance until western nations give up supplying Ukraine. Or we refuse to continue to do so at a level that is required. And how long will Ukraine command and control function without electricity? How long will their trained men and equipment last before their NATO quality forces are spent? You can mobilize a million men, but at some point Ukraine will be battered and bloodied to a point where attrition degrades them down to Russia's level. Or worse, as Russia is largely unharmed and Ukrainian cities are bombed daily.

It's a lot easier to blow something up than to rebuild it. Ukraine's infrastructure is suffering. Winter is upon us, and many may freeze or flee.
I respect that many of them will want to fight. I am concerned over their ability to take this beating and I am GREATLY concerned over our willingness to be their ally for however long it takes. America has a sickness that will grow over the next few years. By 2025 we might openly declare for Putin. This war must come to a favorable and decisive conclusion long before we can betray Ukraine.
What's up with the Czechs?

Czechs rally to demand resignation of pro-Western government

Los Angeles Times|25 minutes ago
Thousands of Czechs rally in the capital against the pro-Western government and its support for Ukraine's fight against the Russian invasion.


..
This is Putins psyops game, its been going on for a decade with increasingly efficiency. Its why Russia must fall now or this shit will continue to increase in size and effectiveness.
Russia must fall.
 
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nicalandia

Diamond Member
Jan 10, 2019
3,331
5,282
136
Russia must Fall, we can't let up on the pressure. Let's get rid of that menace that have plagued the world long enough. Lets end them now. And deal with China as a united front.!
 
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RnR_au

Golden Member
Jun 6, 2021
1,822
4,454
106
I do not like where the attrition is heading.
  • Putin has already killed 70,000 Russians.
  • Russians do not care. They are slaves for a meat grinder of their master's choosing.
  • He can throw another 100,000 Russians to their deaths.
It will greatly hurt Ukraine.

A couple of points.
1) Current casualties ratio is reportedly 6.7:1 ie Ukraine kills almost 7 Russians for every Ukrainian lost. This is likely to get worse for Russia as it pushes the untrained, under equipped, bad morale mobilised troops into the fray while Ukraine not only keeps getting more NATO weapons but also more familiar with the weapons systems.
2) Ukraine has already won the war. See this excellent summary (in English) from a French interview with General Michel Yakovleff;


3) All the good stuff is still flowing to Ukraine. Australia is still sending its Bushmasters to Ukraine (up to 90 gifted now), Italy is sending heavy artillery and ofcause the USA is still sending its high precision wonderness with other goodies;

Breakdown of new US $275 million security pkg for #Ukraine:
- #HIMARS ammo
- 500 155mm precision guided artillery rounds
- 2,000 155mm rounds of remote anti-armor mine systems
- +1300 anti-armor systems
- 125 HUMVEES
- Small arms, 2.7 million ammo rounds
4 satellite comm antennas
 

RnR_au

Golden Member
Jun 6, 2021
1,822
4,454
106
Just one more point to the above. Russia's GDP (2021) is $US1.7T. The European Union's GDP is $US17T (2021) with USA coming in at $US22T.

The notion that a country with a GDP of less than Canada (eh?) could be a long term rival for NATO in any shape or form is kinda iffy.

I mean ffs... Australia's GDP is $US1.5T and I reckon we could take on Russia by ourselves with some help from a few trained Bunyips and Razorbacks to clear out trenches.......
 
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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,576
7,637
136

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
35,597
29,300
136
More Silly Putty blather:

U.S., allies slam Russia for wasting U.N. Security Council time

Reuters on MSN.com|16 hours ago
The United States and allies slammed Russia on Thursday for wasting the time of the U.N. Security Council and spreading conspiracies by again raising its accusation that the United States has "military biological programs" in Ukraine.



They really need to be kicked out.

The UN must find a way.
The UN can do whatever it wants. If they are unwilling to just ignore Russia's veto and kick them out because they want to pretend the rules really matter they could dissolve the whole thing and reform without Russia as UN 2.0 or whatever. Easier to just not let Russia participate anymore. What's Russia going to do about it? Threaten nukes some more?
 
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K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,867
34,814
136
Smoke 'em if you got 'em.
In this case, Ukraine has struck back. Proving that a fleet is no match for modern bombs. AKA Drones.

"Makarov" damaged, there are dead and wounded soldiers - a source about the state of emergency with the Russian fleet in Sevastopol
The Black Sea Fleet received very serious damage during a night attack by drones.


The Russians say just an old minesweeper was damaged. Given their propensity for lying probably a bit more damage than that.

If Ukraine used the same kind of seagoing drone that washed up a couple months back they'd be tough to spot at night unless you're really looking with thermal cams.
 
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pmv

Lifer
May 30, 2008
13,281
8,201
136
I think it's just absolutely hilarious and terrifying that Putin is now channeling Dana Carvey's church lady character.


That's actually a very interesting article. I guess it's Puin's Russian Orthodox Christianity coming through there? Damn, it's depressing how that superstitious nonsense hangs on through thick-and-thin.

I also feel obliged to confess that I myself, before this all started, had an inflated idea about the degree of Nazi presence in Ukraine. There does seem to be a grain of truth in it (the Azov lot, not to mention the historical record going back to WW2), but it now looks as if Putin's propaganda was filtering out and influencing the picture to greatly exaggerate that factor.


I don't get this bit of that article, though

According to the American Jewish Committee, calling Jewish people “Satan” comes from a deliberate misreading of a Biblical passage:

Referring to Jews as Satan or the devil stems from the interpretation of John 8:41-44 in the Christian Bible. Here Jesus says to his fellow Jews, “For you are the children of your father the devil, and you love to do the evil things he does…. When [the devil] lies, it is consistent with his character; for he is a liar and the father of lies.”

In what sense is it a "misreading"? I mean, I'm not any sort of Biblical scholar, but that kind of sounds like Jesus being anti-Semitic. At the bare minimum he's being pretty sloppy and leaving himself open to that interpretation. Reminds me of that Mitchell and Webb sketch pointing out how politically-questionable the tale of the "Good Samaritan" is. Jesus was apparently quite naive about politics.
 
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Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,001
14,528
146
That's actually a very interesting article. I guess it's Puin's Russian Orthodox Christianity coming through there? Damn, it's depressing how that superstitious nonsense hangs on through thick-and-thin.

I also feel obliged to confess that I myself, before this all started, had an inflated idea about the degree of Nazi presence in Ukraine. There does seem to be a grain of truth in it (the Azov lot, not to mention the historical record going back to WW2), but it now looks as if Putin's propaganda was filtering out and influencing the picture to greatly exaggerate that factor.


I don't get this bit of that article, though



In what sense is it a "misreading"? I mean, I'm not any sort of Biblical scholar, but that kind of sounds like Jesus being anti-Semitic. At the bare minimum he's being pretty sloppy and leaving himself open to that interpretation. Reminds me of that Mitchell and Webb sketch pointing out how politically-questionable the tale of the "Good Samaritan" is. Jesus was apparently quite naive about politics.

I always get so tickled with the "Ukraine is full of Nazis/Ukraine is a Nazi state" propaganda. What majority or even significant minority Nazi country elects a Jew be their leader with 74% of the vote???

Shit like this just shows the utter lack of any and all critical thinking among far too many people.
 
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