Saddam's lawyer confirms that his client was tortured

[alchemize]

Hmm my comment seems to have stirred a little firestorm up. Re-reading it, I could see how it would be taken as a generalization. So after consulting with my Samoan attorney, here is my official clarified statement.

And a lawyer would never lie (since in my humble opinion a great many lawyers lie regularly as a part of their trade. noting of course that there are perfectly honest lawyers, but as a gneral group there are quite a few lying lawyers.) especially an arabic/muslim one! (since in my humble opinion - and in the opinion of more than a few sociologists and historians - the middle east, arabic cultures, and religion of islam 1) tolerates and even encourages lies as a general part of dealing with non-muslims, and non-arabics, and 2) generally promote and encourage other conspiracies and falsehoods such as "zionist conspiracies" and "the great satan" to "save face" and to generally support the cowardly positions they support, such as suicide bombings, beheadings of journalists and civilians, etc. Noting that when I refer to culture this is of course not all inclusive, but rather a general cultural observation. )

 

[LunarRay]

I liked mine better...

 

[Alistar7]

they should let every person in Iraq torture him a little bit once were done.......

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: umbrella39

Originally posted by: alchemize
And a lawyer would never lie, especially an arabic one!

Is racism something that is condoned around here. I am engaged to a lawyer, she happens to be from Lebanon. You are an ass and a racist and should not be allowed to post here, or something is wrong with this place.

Well... As an officer of the court it is reasonable to presume the attorney would not lie. He may present his client's claim believing it to be true when it may be false. An attorney would not normally suborn perjury. I assume by using the term 'Arabic' alchemize meant 'of a mid eastern nationality' thus adding further creedence to the truthfullness of the attorney.

How can that be construed as racist?

LunarRay

Perhaps you are more versed in Islamic law than I am. Do they have the concept of all lawyers are an "officer of the court" under shariah?

 

[LunarRay]

Etech,

LunarRay

Perhaps you are more versed in Islamic law than I am. Do they have the concept of all lawyers are an "officer of the court" under shariah?

Well how can I answer that one.. let me see... Shariah law is more or less the path to justice under Islamic law or faith. A Shariah lawyer is a facilitator in this path more so than an adversary as might be seen in an American court. So while the term is no doubt not found in Islamic law the notion of justice being truth and the lawyer being its facilitator along with the 'court', I'd say yes! Very much so.. an officer (a holder of trust and or authority) of the 'court'.

Of course, I don't speak the language, practice the faith, nor profess greater than passing knowledge in things Islamic and only had one elective course in International criminal procedure many years ago so I may be a bit off.. but, I think it fair to say that all the members of the 'court of justice' are officers of it.

Is this what you are asking me? Given you are no doubt more versed than I in Islamic law or probably any law, for that matter, you would be able to answer it for me with more clarity. In any event, not hidden from you is what I was saying in my post, I trust. That being; it is far easier to know what one wrote than guess at what they meant.

But, thanks for the question. It made me go back many years and I don't often do that..

 

[Phokus]

It's like alchemize got caught accidentally stepping out of his house with white sheets and a white hood on.

Why don't you just come out and say it? "Can't trust them dirty a-rabs, they're a bunch of liars ya know, YEEEE HAWWWW!"

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Phokus
It's like alchemize got caught accidentally stepping out of his house with white sheets and a white hood on.

Why don't you just come out and say it? "Can't trust them dirty a-rabs, they're a bunch of liars ya know, YEEEE HAWWWW!"

Of course, YOU would never ever ever generalize based on religion would you?

you fundamentalists sure are ignorant.

Uh oh, looks like Mel Gibson and religous right love-fest session is coming to an end

anti-drug warriors are fundamentalist christians

So in other words, Christians and their culture are fair game for generalization, but Muslims are not? Of course, nobody expects you to actually try and refute what was said.

:roll:

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: Phokus
It's like alchemize got caught accidentally stepping out of his house with white sheets and a white hood on.

Why don't you just come out and say it? "Can't trust them dirty a-rabs, they're a bunch of liars ya know, YEEEE HAWWWW!"

Of course, YOU would never ever ever generalize based on religion would you?

you fundamentalists sure are ignorant.

Uh oh, looks like Mel Gibson and religous right love-fest session is coming to an end

anti-drug warriors are fundamentalist christians

So in other words, Christians and their culture are fair game for generalization, but Muslims are not? Of course, nobody expects you to actually try and refute what was said.

:roll:

"Arabic" is a religion now?

Edit: And besides that, i qualified it with 'fundamentalist'. I'm not saying all christians suck, just the fundies

 

[BugsBunny1078]

Uh oh don't ever argue with an archivist because they have logs of everything you ever said . You cannot win phokus you are a bigot as much as anyone else.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: BugsBunny1078
Uh oh don't ever argue with an archivist because they have logs of everything you ever said . You cannot win phokus you are a bigot as much as anyone else.

Right, complaining about fundamentalist christians is the exact same thing as generalizing all arabs as liars and untrustworthy. :roll:

 

[DevilsAdvocate]

Good.

 

[NesuD]

Originally posted by: maddogchen

Muhammad al-Rashdan, the lawyer of the former Iraqi President Saddam Hussein said that he had received a report from the International Committee of the Red Cross confirming that Saddam Hussein -- who is held by the American forces -- has painful wounds in various parts of his body.

Al-Rashdan explained in a press statement that the report he had received two days earlier in Amman confirms that Saddam Hussein is hit by several wounds in his body on January 21, this year.

Al-Rashdan -- who is officially authorized to defend Saddam by his wife Sajeeda on her own behalf and for her daughters Raghad, Rana and Hala -- considered that this confirmed that Saddam was exposed to material and moral torture, a matter which constitutes a flagrant violations of the Geneva agreements, renewing his demands to immediately release Saddam.

The Jordanian lawyer stressed that the international law stands with his client and that he intends to head to the US to meet with officials at the US administration to follow up the issue of Saddam's continued detentions and his material and moral torture.

Al-Rashdan said " I have asked the US justice secretary and the Defense and secretaries of state and did not receive an answer to that." He also extended a message to them demanding the release of Saddam's money confiscated during his detention estimated at USD 750,000 and handing over the sum to his wide Sajeeda.

link

Is from arabicnews.com. and its one of Saddam's lawyers. So believe what you want. I just thought it was interesting news.

What? Did they make him pose nekkid with a goat or something? :camera:
show me the proof.

 

[DeeKnow]

Originally posted by: Ldir

Originally posted by: alchemize
And a lawyer would never lie, especially an arabic one!

How racist of you. So far the main lies came from the US and our buddies like Chalabi.

that's not racist.
politically correct it may not be, but it ain't racist ...

 

[Klixxer]

Originally posted by: BugsBunny1078
Uh oh don't ever argue with an archivist because they have logs of everything you ever said . You cannot win phokus you are a bigot as much as anyone else.

He said *fundamentalist* christians, i agree with him, all fundamentalists are equally bigoted and stupid, which religion they profess to follow does not really matter.

 

[LunarRay]

Saddam's lawyer was probably not in a position to independently verify the incidence(s) of torture. He represents Saddam, his client. So he simply is reporting what someone else has said. Assuming they said what he said they said he is not lying to create a case for his client. He is stating that (more or less): If a trial were held this person or persons would testify under oath (assuming that is the criteria for testimony) that the events occurred (assuming they have 'first party' information to the assertion and that hearsay is not permitted)... I still don't know the venue for the 'trial' nor the law applicable with certainty.
So who said what and what is their credibility is the debate... not the attorney, IMO.

 

[heartsurgeon]

Saddam was exposed to material and moral torture

WTF? Did that "female soldier" force him to have sex as well?

 

[LunarRay]

As well as what? What other forms of torture might we be talking about? You don't suppose they forced him to read the Republican Platform being readied for the Convention... Nah.. that would be beyond the pale... of decent torture.

 

[LordMagnusKain]

Torturing Saddaam would make you feel better?

no, as you can see from the context I was being facetious.

The 'crusades' have nothing to do with what I was saying.

Should I bring out quotes from the Bible where raping a Gentile is deemed appropriate?

show it.
I know full-well that God never said rape was acceptable.

Please, I?m calling your bluff.

 

[Cobalt]

Wth is wrong with you. Why must you always start labels on a thread like this, which isn't even directed toward a certain partisan group. You make me sick.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: LordMagnusKain

Torturing Saddaam would make you feel better?

no, as you can see from the context I was being facetious.

The 'crusades' have nothing to do with what I was saying.

Should I bring out quotes from the Bible where raping a Gentile is deemed appropriate?

show it.
I know full-well that God never said rape was acceptable.

Please, I?m calling your bluff.

Bump. I'd like to see it also.

 

[Dedpuhl]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: LordMagnusKain

Torturing Saddaam would make you feel better?

no, as you can see from the context I was being facetious.

The 'crusades' have nothing to do with what I was saying.

Should I bring out quotes from the Bible where raping a Gentile is deemed appropriate?

show it.
I know full-well that God never said rape was acceptable.

Please, I?m calling your bluff.

Bump. I'd like to see it also.

"Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
..........Numbers 31:17 (Moses)

"Behold the day of the Lord is coming, when the spoil taken from you will be divided in the midst of you. For I will gather the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken and the houses plundered and the women ravished..."
..........Zachariah 14:

"...I will take your wives before your eyes and give them to your neighbor, and he shall lie with your wives in the light of this sun."
..........2 Samuel 12:11

 

[judasmachine]

Man I don't know about this. If there ever was a guy in recent history that deserves to be knocked around a bit it's Saddam Hussien. However it's really sad that we've sunk to his lever.

Eye for an eye
Tooth for a tooth
Leaves us all blind and tootless - Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.

Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone - Jesus Christ



I think the worst punishment for a tyrant would be to condemn them to a life in the 'burbs. Make his ass get a job like the rest of us schmoes.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Dedpuhl

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: LordMagnusKain

Torturing Saddaam would make you feel better?

no, as you can see from the context I was being facetious.

The 'crusades' have nothing to do with what I was saying.

Should I bring out quotes from the Bible where raping a Gentile is deemed appropriate?

show it.
I know full-well that God never said rape was acceptable.

Please, I?m calling your bluff.

Bump. I'd like to see it also.

"Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
..........Numbers 31:17 (Moses)

"Behold the day of the Lord is coming, when the spoil taken from you will be divided in the midst of you. For I will gather the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken and the houses plundered and the women ravished..."
..........Zachariah 14:

"...I will take your wives before your eyes and give them to your neighbor, and he shall lie with your wives in the light of this sun."
..........2 Samuel 12:11

LMK your response please, you are the bible scholar around here

 

[przero]

"Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
..........Numbers 31:17

That was God's command to rid the Israelites of the Midianites, that had corrupted the Children of God.

"Behold the day of the Lord is coming, when the spoil taken from you will be divided in the midst of you. For I will gather the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken and the houses plundered and the women ravished..."
..........Zachariah 14:

That describes Jerusalem in the last days of the Battlr of Armeggedon, being ravaged by enemies.

"...I will take your wives before your eyes and give them to your neighbor, and he shall lie with your wives in the light of this sun."
..........2 Samuel 12:11

That was Nathan telling King David what God was going to do, since he stole Bathsheba, from Uriah and had him murdered. In that scripture God was speaking of David's concubines.

Rape was never intended.

And for Saddam....There is a group of people in northern Iraq that would take quite good care of him. Let the Kurds have him.