Sandra Bland Dashboard Video Released

[nixium]

Muslims have a hard time here because we are racist as #@%! towards them. It's terrible.

Think about how the good cops (of which are a majority) will feel, when they see you be rude or evasive to them for actions based on a minority? It's almost the same scenario as the "White girl in a elevator with a black guy" She is going to avoid eye contact, clutch her purse, and hold her breath as she rushes out. Think about what that does to the completely normal guy?

http://www.businessinsider.com/obam...mmerman-trial-verdict-racial-profiling-2013-7

There are very few African-American men in this country who haven't had the experience of being followed when they were shopping in a department store. That includes me," Obama said.

"There are very few African-American men who haven't had the experience of walking across the street and hearing the locks click on the doors of cars. That happens to me — at least before I was a senator. There are very few African-Americans who haven't had the experience of getting on an elevator and a woman clutching her purse nervously and holding her breath until she had a chance to get off. That happens often."

See you keep bringing race into this and somehow make it seem like I'm racist when all the evidence of racism is on your side of the fence.

Regardless, your analogy is flawed, because this is not race specific. This is occupation specific. I avoid thugs and criminals as much as possible and want to have the least to do with them. This is the same thing, except with the police, because it appears that a lot of them don't really have my best interests at heart. Intimidation, even lethal force, is used blithely and casually. I don't intend to antagonize them, but there's no reason I have to be friendly either.

You keep saying good cops but how am I suppose to know the difference? There's no yelp or Zocdoc where cops are reviewed and rated. The risk here is physical injury, detainment, even death. When you go into the bad part of town, aren't you on the alert? It's the same thing.

And it's not so much the bad cops themselves that rattle me, its the fact that there are really no consequences for their behavior, unless it is really egregious.

 

[mizzou]

See you keep bringing race into this and somehow make it seem like I'm racist when all the evidence of racism is on your side of the fence.

Regardless, your analogy is flawed, because this is not race specific. This is occupation specific. I avoid thugs and criminals as much as possible and want to have the least to do with them. This is the same thing, except with the police, because it appears that a lot of them don't really have my best interests at heart. Intimidation, even lethal force, is used blithely and casually. I don't intend to antagonize them, but there's no reason I have to be friendly either.

You keep saying good cops but how am I suppose to know the difference? There's no yelp or Zocdoc where cops are reviewed and rated. The risk here is physical injury, detainment, even death. When you go into the bad part of town, aren't you on the alert? It's the same thing.

And it's not so much the bad cops themselves that rattle me, its the fact that there are really no consequences for their behavior, unless it is really egregious.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110510151216.htm

That is what Ostracism does to people. It makes the situation worse.

Also, Bigotry is defined as, " In American English, the term can be used similarly; however, it can also be used to refer to intolerance towards a group of people in general based on their group characteristics"...such as, a profession.

So be careful about how you value other people, because it's a slippery slope.


I just bring these points because we will get nowhere if we continue bigotry, racism, and hate.

 

[nixium]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110510151216.htm

That is what Ostracism does to people. It makes the situation worse.

Also, Bigotry is defined as, " In American English, the term can be used similarly; however, it can also be used to refer to intolerance towards a group of people in general based on their group characteristics"...such as, a profession.

So be careful about how you value other people, because it's a slippery slope.


I just bring these points because we will get nowhere if we continue bigotry, racism, and hate.

How about we get cops to learn this lesson first? I wouldn't be behaving this way if not for the fact that they use violence casually and are bullies, and there's no way to tell the difference between good cop and bad cop.

Also, I suppose you invite local mobsters, riff raff, pimps, etc to your home, shoot the breeze with them, throw them parties? You don't? Bigot.

 

[nixium]

Limitless authority
The Sandra Bland car stop didn't show legal experts and civilians anything we didn't already know: If an officer really wants to stick it to a driver during a stop, he can find a way. That's not an indictment against law enforcement at all. Rather, the permissive law of traffic stops, searches and arrests leaves much to individual judgment and personal observations of law enforcement officers. It's that limitless authority of an officer that turns the rest of us into functional cowards and sycophants during a car stop. It's all about self-preservation. Bravery has no place when you're pulled over. Bland was no coward. But she also ended up arrested. With lots of force.

Every driver who has been pulled over by the police has faced the same Hobson's choice: Be brave and argue with the officer about your asserted constitutional rights, or shut up and try to avoid any trouble. Most of us take the latter option, because it's really no choice at all. Even if you are about to be arrested, defense attorneys would tell you to eat the bust and fight it later in court.

Trying to litigate yourself out of being arrested pro se usually only makes matters worse -- even if you have a good argument. Being constitutionally in the right is little consolation when you're contemplating your next court date from a jail cell.

It often comes down to economics: It's more expensive to sit in jail and hire an attorney to vindicate those rights, than it is to simply avoid an arrest -- or even a ticket -- with a few well-timed "yes sirs." And while some may admire another's act of fearless civil disobedience, nearly all of us would opt instead for fearful obedience -- and avoid a night in jail.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/23/opinions/cevallos-sandra-bland-traffic-stop/

Most of us would be the cowardly sycophant type, just to get past the inconvenience, but if you boot licking apologists think that means we have to be friends with the Police and treat them no differently from normal people, you're deluded. No one likes bullies.

 

[TheSlamma]

Oh teh noes. Hostility.

No shit people are hostile to cops. Cops are assholes who treat everyone like a shit and are proving that they fly off the handle at the slightest provocation. Hell, they're practically (actually?) criminals. Why WOULDN'T you be hostile to them?

If they'd stop doing things like picking a fight with a person whose crime was failing to signal a lane change properly, maybe people wouldn't be so hostile.

Exactly, this not only never had to be escalated the way it was, he had chance after chance to deescalate this situation and he didn't take the opportunity once. All because his limited intelligence sees that as form of backing down and no way that ego was going to have that.

One thing I really want to know is in all of these cases why are the people always asking time after time "What am I in trouble/being arrested for?" and the cop time after time refuses to answer that question. The person never gets an answer until their head is smashed into the ground and they are cuffed.

 

[HomerJS]

Muslims have a hard time here because we are racist as #@%! towards them. It's terrible.

Think about how the good cops (of which are a majority) will feel, when they see you be rude or evasive to them for actions based on a minority? It's almost the same scenario as the "White girl in a elevator with a black guy" She is going to avoid eye contact, clutch her purse, and hold her breath as she rushes out. Think about what that does to the completely normal guy?

http://www.businessinsider.com/obam...mmerman-trial-verdict-racial-profiling-2013-7

There are very few African-American men in this country who haven't had the experience of being followed when they were shopping in a department store. That includes me," Obama said.

"There are very few African-American men who haven't had the experience of walking across the street and hearing the locks click on the doors of cars. That happens to me — at least before I was a senator. There are very few African-Americans who haven't had the experience of getting on an elevator and a woman clutching her purse nervously and holding her breath until she had a chance to get off. That happens often."

The closest people to bad cops are good cops. I have yet to see the rush of good cops turning in bad cops.

 

[PokerGuy]

She may also still have been alive IF the jail had followed procedure and performed hourly checks like they were supposed to.

But it's always easier to blame the victim, especially when they're dead.

Blame the victim? Victim of what? She killed herself, what is she the victim of?

Sounds like the jail might have not followed some protocols, but I don't see how that makes her a victim?

 

[soundforbjt]

Blame the victim? Victim of what? She killed herself, what is she the victim of?

Sounds like the jail might have not followed some protocols, but I don't see how that makes her a victim?

Haven't read the whole thread? She also stated to the jail she was suicidal when she was processed, once in their custody, they are responsible for her safety.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Haven't read the whole thread? She also stated to the jail she was suicidal when she was processed, once in their custody, they are responsible for her safety.

To be fair, I believe what she disclosed was not that she was suicidal but that she had attempted suicide in the past (not the same thing). I do think the jail had a duty to act reasonably to protect her, even from herself, while she was in custody, though. It's not clear whether they did so or not. I believe they had done a welfare check less than an hour before she died and she said she was fine.

I remain confused by the bag she used to hang herself. If it's something that had the potential to be used in that manner, she probably shouldn't have been left with it. Since I don't know what it was (i.e., was it a garden-variety plastic grocery bag or something more obviously hazardous), though, it's hard to be certain whether her access to the bag reflects negligence.

 

[soundforbjt]

To be fair, I believe what she disclosed was not that she was suicidal but that she had attempted suicide in the past (not the same thing). I do think the jail had a duty to act reasonably to protect her, even from herself, while she was in custody, though. It's not clear whether they did so or not. I believe they had done a welfare check less than an hour before she died and she said she was fine.

I remain confused by the bag she used to hang herself. If it's something that had the potential to be used in that manner, she probably shouldn't have been left with it. Since I don't know what it was (i.e., was it a garden-variety plastic grocery bag or something more obviously hazardous), though, it's hard to be certain whether her access to the bag reflects negligence.

I had a friend who was in jail for a DUI and he said the inmates used to fill the plastic bags with water and use them for weights to work out, so they must be pretty strong.

 

[Blackjack200]

If it's something that had the potential to be used in that manner, she probably shouldn't have been left with it.

It's definitely something that had the potential to be used in that manner since it was used in that manner.

 

[HomerJS]

Blame the victim? Victim of what? She killed herself, what is she the victim of?

Sounds like the jail might have not followed some protocols, but I don't see how that makes her a victim?

If the arrest was illegal that makes it kidnapping. If someone dies while being held the kidnapper is culpable to some degree.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

The arrest was legal, the officer violated department courtesy policy and that's why he's on desk duty. He will be given remedial training and then back to normal duty in a matter of weeks. The jailer failed to follow policy as well, they will also receive remedial training.

Sandra Bland family will more than likely file suits though I'm not sure how they will fair considering no laws were broken by the officer or jailers.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

Another transcript for another stop,----- from the *Onion* :biggrin:

Good afternoon, sir. Go ahead and roll your window all the way down for me. My name is Officer Daniel McEwen from the Greene County Police Department. Now, do you know why I’m pulling you over today, being overly aggressive, and charging you with a felony count of assaulting a police officer?

I’m going to need to see your driver’s license, vehicle registration, and proof of insurance. Thank you, sir. Now, just sit tight in your car while I take a look here and grow increasingly hostile. I’m just going to start addressing you in an unmistakably threatening tone that is specifically meant to intimidate and provoke, and then drastically escalate the situation so that it quickly gets out of hand.

Are you aware of the speed limit on this road, sir? It’s 35. I had you clocked at 52 miles per hour, which is why I had to stop you and exhibit a nakedly confrontational, antagonistic, and condescending attitude, practically daring you to challenge my authority in any way whatsoever. You can’t be driving that fast around here, so I’m going to have to write you a ticket and then violently place you under arrest the moment you do or say anything that isn’t in complete and utter compliance—or which could even be remotely construed as noncompliant—with every single instruction I give to you.

Do you understand all that, sir?

If you have any questions about this ticket, I’d be happy to wildly overreact to anything you say that shows the slightest hint of resentment, annoyance, or resistance. Really, while you have me here, I can easily interpret any snide remark or frustrated comment as a potential threat to my safety—even so much as an angry look—and respond in a disproportionately combative way by erupting in unwarranted rage, taking out either my 50,000-volt Taser or my handgun, and pointing it directly at you through the driver’s side window.

Now, I have to head back to my patrol car real quick, so please bear with me here for a few minutes. Then you can be on your way to jail in no time as soon as I come back and forcibly remove you from your vehicle, slam you into the asphalt, cuff you, and jam my knee into your back as I radio in that I need backup right away because you’re resisting arrest—all the while both outright ignoring your vocalized concerns for your safety and directing my own petty, barbed insults at you. Just so we’re on the same page here, you’ll be getting three points on your license for speeding and also assault charges that carry a minimum sentence of one year in prison, but you’ll be assumed guilty of both while I automatically receive the benefit of the doubt despite any and all evidence to the contrary.

You know what, why don’t you step out of the car, sir? And put that goddamn cell phone away.

 

[PokerGuy]

If the arrest was illegal that makes it kidnapping. If someone dies while being held the kidnapper is culpable to some degree.

Ummmm okay then. You're truly delusional if you think an unlawful detention/arrest is "kidnapping". Hint: it's a tort, a civil wrong.

Don Vito -- thanks for providing your perspective, nice to see a sane one in the middle of all the drivel. The jail has some responsibility to make sure she is safe while she's in their custody. We don't know to what extent they did or didn't do what they were supposed to do yet. None of that has anything to do with the actual arrest.

 

[Blackjack200]

Ummmm okay then. You're truly delusional if you think an unlawful detention/arrest is "kidnapping". Hint: it's a tort, a civil wrong.

Don Vito -- thanks for providing your perspective, nice to see a sane one in the middle of all the drivel. The jail has some responsibility to make sure she is safe while she's in their custody. We don't know to what extent they did or didn't do what they were supposed to do yet. None of that has anything to do with the actual arrest.

The purpose of my kidnapping hypothetical was to illustrate that you have responsability for the safety of someone in your custody, and if someone is wrongfully in your custody, your culpability increases if they do end up harmed. Even if they harmed themselves.

But while the arrest appears wrongful to me, I agree it's not kidnapping.

 

[JSt0rm]

The arrest was legal, the officer violated department courtesy policy and that's why he's on desk duty. He will be given remedial training and then back to normal duty in a matter of weeks. The jailer failed to follow policy as well, they will also receive remedial training.

Sandra Bland family will more than likely file suits though I'm not sure how they will fair considering no laws were broken by the officer or jailers.

lol if you dont think the state is going to settle on 7 figures for this retarded cop/jails fuck up.

 

[Perknose]

The arrest was legal...

We'll see about that.

...the officer violated department courtesy policy...

He did a lot more than that.

 

[nixium]

We'll see about that.



He did a lot more than that.

It's useless talking to this guy. If you follow his posts here he's one of those false conservative authoritarian assholes who cheers on these actions against those he considers malcontents. These types never learn unless it's them at the receiving end, but because of their lickspittle/bend over attitudes they tend to get away. Doesn't stop them from moralizing and sermonizing though.

 

[werepossum]

I see two lessons here, and many people seem unable to learn them. First and most important, DON'T BE AN ASSHOLE! Especially don't be an asshole with cops. Virtually every one of these sad tales begins with the deceased being an absolute flaming asshole, followed by the usual suspects insisting on his or her right to be an asshole. If you are an asshole, your experiences with other people will usually be negative. If you are polite and personable, your experiences with other people will usually be positive. Period. It really is that simple. If you feel you have been unfairly treated, take it up in court with a professional advocate who is qualified to do so and you'll have a much better chance of getting satisfaction than by simply showing your ass.

Second, any arrest for resisting arrest absent other charges sufficient for an arrest should be immediately thrown out. That would not have affected Bland since she was charged with assaulting an officer, but it would likely have saved her at trial had she not decided to kill herself.

 

[bradley]

Any officer who cannot act professionally or adequately adapt to stress should be terminated, asap. Any officer who escalates routine stops into death (or false arrest) needs to be prosecuted.

Any police force that doesn't use dash and body cams to retrain police personnel needs to be disbanded. Authority without any reasonability or common sense is totalitarianism

In fact, forget the police academy, I would give every officer something more reminiscent of Navy SEAL or combat soldier training.

 

[NoStateofMind]

I see two lessons here, and many people seem unable to learn them. First and most important, DON'T BE AN ASSHOLE! Especially don't be an asshole with cops. Virtually every one of these sad tales begins with the deceased being an absolute flaming asshole, followed by the usual suspects insisting on his or her right to be an asshole. If you are an asshole, your experiences with other people will usually be negative. If you are polite and personable, your experiences with other people will usually be positive. Period. It really is that simple. If you feel you have been unfairly treated, take it up in court with a professional advocate who is qualified to do so and you'll have a much better chance of getting satisfaction than by simply showing your ass.

If I (nostateofmind) saw you driving and forced you off the road and when I came to your door stated that the reason for my aggressive behavior was because "you didn't use your turn signal when changing lanes" you'd rightfully call me a lunatic and probably be quite upset. Heck, one might even label you an asshole! D:

 

[werepossum]

If I (nostateofmind) saw you driving and forced you off the road and when I came to your door stated that the reason for my aggressive behavior was because "you didn't use your turn signal when changing lanes" you'd rightfully call me a lunatic and probably be quite upset. Heck, one might even label you an asshole! D:

Lucky that a cop pulling someone over for a legitimate traffic violation and a non-cop forcing someone off the road are such quite different things, else someone might actually confuse the two.

 

[Pipeline 1010]

I see two lessons here, and many people seem unable to learn them. First and most important, DON'T BE AN ASSHOLE!

Does this apply to the cop too, or is the cop above your lessons because those are for mere mortals and aren't for God-cops.

Especially don't be an asshole with cops.

How about especially cops shouldn't be an asshole to people? That seems like the direction where the "especially" should apply. When a cop initiates contact with people, they do so as part of their profession. They are being paid for it and they are doing their job. I can't be an asshole on the job or else I get fired. You seem to be cool with the cop being an asshole on the job and the person he is being an asshole to has to sit there and just take it. Hopefully I misunderstand you, because according to my understanding, you seem to be attempting to paint yourself as a colossal douche.

Virtually every one of these sad tales begins with the deceased being an absolute flaming asshole, followed by the usual suspects insisting on his or her right to be an asshole.

Not this time. The cop started the assholery. So why even bring up all those other tales, which are about people not named Sandra Bland and who did things that she didn't do?

If you are an asshole, your experiences with other people will usually be negative.

I guess this is true unless you are a cop being an asshole? Cops being assholes = totally legit. Cops being assholes should expect POSITIVE experiences with other people. Gotcha.

If you feel you have been unfairly treated, take it up in court with a professional advocate who is qualified to do so and you'll have a much better chance of getting satisfaction than by simply showing your ass.

Either way you don't have a very good chance of getting satisfaction, because the system is so strongly tilted in the favor of cops that you are more likely to be harassed when filing a complaint than you are to ever see the cop punished in any meaningful way. Even when successfully suing the cop, that cop will never have to pay a dime...only the taxpayers. What the fuck is he supposed to learn from that? How will he feel punished if the person receiving the punishment is his whipping boy (the taxpayer)? Hell, there is a recent story of a cop in IA being fired for finding another cop to be in violation of some rule or the other. THIS is where you see justice being done? In snitching on a cop to his drinking buddies? And expecting them to say something like "well, this guy IS a part of the thin blue line, I WAS in his wedding, we DO back each-other up, and we're like BFFs, but what the hell...what he did was WRONG so I'll recommend he goes to jail"? You entertain strong delusions.

 

[NoStateofMind]

Lucky that a cop pulling someone over for a legitimate traffic violation and a non-cop forcing someone off the road are such quite different things, else someone might actually confuse the two.

Badges grant extra Rights?

Have you ever pondered on how these things could be resolved in a non-violent manner? If so, what do you think the scenario would look like?

If you haven't thought about this I'd encourage you to do so.