Sandy Bridge design flaw - Intel halted on NASDAQ - updated 2/8/11.

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Diogenes2

Platinum Member
Jul 26, 2001
2,151
0
0
Has anyone actually talked to MC about a refund ?
" No refund " is not actually stated in that document.

I have returned MOBOS to MC before for a full refund, no questions asked ..
 

Axon

Platinum Member
Sep 25, 2003
2,541
1
76
Has anyone actually talked to MC about a refund ?
" No refund " is not actually stated in that document.

I have returned MOBOS to MC before for a full refund, no questions asked ..

An unopened MoBo? I have not asked, I am assuming. I'd say 75% no refund, 25% refund. Of course if I can't return the CPU, I'm shooting myself in the foot. Why did I give my cousin my X58? Noooooo!!!
 

wahdangun

Golden Member
Feb 3, 2011
1,007
148
106
this time intel really screw up, thanks good i don't order SB yet for my store, it will be quite pain in the ass if i must ship all the faulty mobo back and don't mention the shipping cost
 

SlitheryDee

Lifer
Feb 2, 2005
17,252
19
81
I suppose as a consumer this might annoy some people, but getting a direct swap to a brand new motherbaord (I can't see stores soldering new chips onto the motherboard) is a pretty decent deal. No downtime apart from pulling out and putting in the new mobo.

At the end of the day why get a refund? Why would anyone want to do that? The only logical explanation would be, Principle.

I'm going to want a refund because I plan on buying a new motherboard when the updated ones come out and then sending my board back for a refund to minimize my downtime. I'm hoping to use this as an excuse to upgrade to Z68 if they appear within the window that newegg is giving me for a refund.
 

ahurtt

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2001
4,283
0
0
... and why if it is unneeded now it will negatively affect the SATA bus if it doesn't work properly.

Because it shouldn't be there at all but it is (probably because it was deemed cheaper to leave it on there unused than to actually remove it) but due to a voltage miscalculation it comes on when it shouldn't...this causes a problem. Having it come on when it was never intended to introduces unforeseen consequences into the system.

Think of it like this...What does the human appendix do? Nothing really. It can be removed with little or no consequence because basically it's some vestigial remnant of evolution. Sometimes people keep them and nothing happens their whole life. But sometimes you get appendicitis and this can become potentially life threatening if the appendix isn't removed and bursts. So here you have a completely useless organ which can be perfectly safely removed and you can still live a perfectly normal life but which can threaten your life if it malfunctions...This is essentially the same thing. Having your appendix is no problem as long as you don't get appendicitis. But the mere fact that you have an appendix is one more "moving part" and therefore one more potential thing that can go wrong.

You can make the same analogy with tonsils...a lot of people just have them removed when they are young so that they don't cause complications or infections later in life. They go on to lead perfectly normal and functionally unimpaired lives without their tonsils.
 
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Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
"The source of the problem is actually not even a key part of the 6-series chipset design, it’s remnant of an earlier design that’s no longer needed."

This is even more disturbing than just saying a transistor was biased wrong .

On a transistor you only have 3 terminals, emitter, collector and base. A transistor is like a shutoff valve on a water line. The base controls how turned on or off the transistor is just like the handle on the water valve. The more voltage on the base the more power flows between collector and emitter just like the more you turn the valve on the water line the more water flows through it. To bias a transistor you give whatever voltage is being used to turn it on some help by mixing some of the supply voltage with the voltage to the base so the base needs less power from whatever is providing the power to turn it on.

Picturing it as a water valve on your home going to the street , if you turn it off you have no water unless something else takes the place of the valve nothing can flow to the connection that is your home. If you had two or three different valves installed then you could maybe put the demand onto another valve, but you can't just remove one and not have something else take up the slack without losing something somewhere.
 

Martimus

Diamond Member
Apr 24, 2007
4,488
153
106
Because it shouldn't be there at all but it is (probably because it was deemed cheaper to leave it on there unused than to actually remove it) but due to a voltage miscalculation it comes on when it shouldn't...this causes a problem. Having it come on when it was never intended to introduces unforeseen consequences into the system.

Think of it like this...What does the human appendix do? Nothing really. It can be removed with little or no consequence because basically it's some vestigial remnant of evolution. Sometimes people keep them and nothing happens their whole life. But sometimes you get appendicitis and this can become potentially life threatening if the appendix isn't removed and bursts. So here you have a completely useless organ which can be perfectly safely removed and you can still live a perfectly normal life but which can threaten your life if it malfunctions...This is essentially the same thing. Having your appendix is no problem as long as you don't get appendicitis. But the mere fact that you have an appendix is one more "moving part" and therefore one more potential thing that can go wrong.

You can make the same analogy with tonsils...a lot of people just have them removed when they are young so that they don't cause complications or infections later in life. They go on to lead perfectly normal and functionally unimpaired lives without their tonsils.

I am an electrical engineer who designed power circuitry for years, so the analogy to anatomy doesn't mean much to me. (This is a circuit, not the human digestive tract). My point was that the explanation was very vague, and would be unacceptable for me if it was given to me. You haven't given me any additional explanation to what was written in the article. I still don't know what the circuitry really was, and why it is not needed, and why it affects the rest of the circuitry when it fails.
 

ahurtt

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2001
4,283
0
0
I am an electrical engineer who designed power circuitry for years, so the analogy to anatomy doesn't mean much to me. (This is a circuit, not the human digestive tract).

My apologies...I did not realize that the fact you are an electrical engineer means you are a robot and that therefore you and I do not have a human anatomy in common. My goal was to draw an analogy that was easily understandable by humans. Here is the definition for the word Analogy in case the meaning of the term does not currently reside in your memory banks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analogy

and why it affects the rest of the circuitry when it fails.

This is the only thing my layman's analogy was attempting to answer. I was not attempting to address any of the other concerns or questions you were posing. I think only Intel can answer the rest of your questions.
 
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Martimus

Diamond Member
Apr 24, 2007
4,488
153
106
My apologies...I did not realize that the fact you are an electrical engineer means you are a robot and that therefore you and I do not have a human anatomy in common. My goal was to draw an analogy that was easily understandable by humans. Here is the definition for the word Analogy in case the meaning of the term does not currently reside in your memory banks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analogy



This is the only thing my layman's analogy was attempting to answer. I was not attempting to address any of the other concerns or questions you were posing. I think only Intel can answer the rest of your questions.

I just meant the analogy has nothing to do with the subject matter. Beyond that, I am far more of an expert on the actual transistor than I am about either the appendix or the tonsils, so the analogy was lost on me.

I remember studying them in school and learning that the tonsils were indeed used although I can't remember for what (the appendix not so much, as it is more for breaking down pectin IIRC, and is used more in animals that eat a lot of plants.)

And I agree that Intel is likely the only one that can answer me, and I do not expect them to. I was posting originally to warn people not to take what they say about the consequences of their fix as gospel. It is in their best interest to make their costumers believe that they aren't losing anything with their rapid change. I don't expect any major consequences to what they are doing, but I still wonder what the consequences are. It is just simple curiosity on my part - the same reason I even frequent these boards and learn about the details of the computer parts. I don't need to know them, but I enjoy learning about them anyway.
 

PreferLinux

Senior member
Dec 29, 2010
420
0
0
this will cost intel TWICE as much; and not too mention that was back in 94, the computer market has more than quadrupled since then...CATASTROPHIC
Twice the number of dollars, but the dollars are worth only about half as much now, so it definitely won't cost them twice as much. Also, the "cost them" could be taken as the amount compared to what they have/get, and that would be significantly less, too.

How to see if you have degraded SATA ports:

http://translate.google.com/transla...ab501.ro/stiri/p67-s-ata-bug-cum-se-manifesta





5% error rate in 3 weeks, not 3 years??
Hard drive failure, not SATA failure.
 

Idontcare

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
21,118
59
91
This is even more disturbing than just saying a transistor was biased wrong .

On a transistor you only have 3 terminals, emitter, collector and base. A transistor is like a shutoff valve on a water line. The base controls how turned on or off the transistor is just like the handle on the water valve. The more voltage on the base the more power flows between collector and emitter just like the more you turn the valve on the water line the more water flows through it. To bias a transistor you give whatever voltage is being used to turn it on some help by mixing some of the supply voltage with the voltage to the base so the base needs less power from whatever is providing the power to turn it on.

Picturing it as a water valve on your home going to the street , if you turn it off you have no water unless something else takes the place of the valve nothing can flow to the connection that is your home. If you had two or three different valves installed then you could maybe put the demand onto another valve, but you can't just remove one and not have something else take up the slack without losing something somewhere.

Whoa boy, talk of emitters and bases really takes me back...that's the bipolar transitor you are talking about there, we haven't seen those in our x86 CPU's since the early days of the Pentium. These days its all about the field-effect transistor (FET) and we use the terms source, drain, and gate.

Unless...do you mean to say Intel is actually using bipolar xtors in their 65nm chipsets?
 

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
20,882
3,230
126


So i FINALLY got everything ready.
Going to use that as my main while the 990X undergoes a complete rejob internally.

Anyone want to take bets on how long the controller will last?
 

Diogenes2

Platinum Member
Jul 26, 2001
2,151
0
0
Actually it's not, for most.
So far, I haven't seen one confirmed report of a user with a SATA 2 port problem, though there have been several documented cases of short circuits, between the keyboard and the chair.. ..
 
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T5KCaNNoN

Junior Member
Sep 2, 2004
18
0
0
Am I correct in thinking that for users who just use the 2 6gb ports, then the current issue with the p67 / h68 chipsets is a non-issue?
 

videoclone

Golden Member
Jun 5, 2003
1,465
0
0
Am I correct in thinking that for users who just use the 2 6gb ports, then the current issue with the p67 / h68 chipsets is a non-issue?

YES its not an issue

But when the new boards come out and your offered a FREE upgrade or refund.. you would be silly not to go for it! You maybe happy to settle with 1 hard drives + 1 Optical drive in your 6GB ports but what about later on or the next person to use that system.
 

drizek

Golden Member
Jul 7, 2005
1,410
0
71
Ya, I have 0 problems on mine with delllaayyed performaanncee orrr data corrrrr#!#@!$###!!#%!###!% 31###
 
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