SCOTUS rules: gay marriage approved

[Retro Rob]

it wouldn't be the point if Christians didn't lobby the government to have laws enacted based on their religious book...laws that are designed to affect everyone.

Now he gets it!

But they do this, so it is always the point. They aren't such fans of the constitution, so it really isn't surprising that they attract such negative attention when they work to enforce personal, unfounded belief on real, evidence-based law.

LOL -- a lot of our laws come from the 10 commandments.

Need a history lesson?

 

[SlickSnake]

Also for fun create your own Scalia Sick Burn!

The first thing I put in was Frank-N-Furter for a name. And it gave me this gem:

“One would think that frank-n-furter's beliefs are a looming specter of unutterable horror. Ask the nearest hippie.”

So I left with a happy ending.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Congrats to the SC for finally making this right. This is up there with Roe v. Wade and will likely be debated for some time to come, but ultimately it is the proper decision.

 

[Paratus]

mmmmmm toaster love mmmmmmm

 

[DrDoug]

“The Supreme Court is completely out of control, making laws on their own, and has become a public opinion poll instead of a judicial body. If we want to save some money, let’s just get rid of the court.”

- Republican Presidential candidate and Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal

He probably wants to replace it with a bible...lol

 

[Jhhnn]

This is really a huge strawman...I can't see why many so-called "educated" people keep regurgitating this.

Christians do not oppose gay marriage because it affects them one way or the other -- they oppose it because the Bible doesn't support homosexual relationships.

Don't come with the interpretation of Biblical passages red herring nonsense.

Their opposition lies squarely on the belief that God created marriage to between one man and one woman. If you want to use the polygamy angle, still, those unions didn't include persons of the same-sex marrying.

The founders of this country eschewed biblical law. If we followed it, we wouldn't eat pork or shellfish, wouldn't work on the sabbath, wouldn't do a lot of things. We'd be burning & stoning people to death, as well.

I''m sure that the concept of gay marriage would have seemed absurd to those men, but they nonetheless wrote the Constitution in such a way to accommodate it in a secular society.

 

[shira]

As one of our more prominent local political cartoonists has said,



Unfortunately, two counties have stomped their feet and declared that they "are out of the marriage business altogether". Both Pike and Geneva counties have a combined population of 50,000. I hope they enjoy using what little revenue they have defending their positions in court.

And right-wing legislators in some states - Texas, for example - have indicated that they're going to place legislative hurdles in front of same-sex couples who want to marry. Kind of like what they're doing with highly-restrictive laws on abortion clinics. The intent is to delay, delay, delay.

One hopes that same-sex couples seeking to marry in such states will be able to get quick injunctive relief, as the harm to couples waiting for challenges to such laws to get through the courts would be far greater than any harm to a state that was forced to allow same-sex marriages during that waiting period.

Simply put, right wingers will stoop to any level to deny "liberal" rights to others.

 

[sportage]

Marriage equality will soon become a moot subject for all opposed.
Why?
As with Utah, for weeks, months, all that we heard from Utah was damn SS marriage... Damn Damn Damn Damn Damn...

The Mormon church was freaking. The Utah states AG was freaking and insisted on fighting marriage equality tooth and nail in the courts. The courts granted "stay's" blocking SS marriage in Utah. And on and on it went for a long time.

THEN....
Finally, Utah, the Mormon church, and the Utah AG lost the fight.
And today?????
We hear NOTHING.
Absolutely NOTHING about Utah nor their marriage equality i.e. SS marriage.

Because like I said earlier, the real problem with i.e. gay marriage i.e. SS marriage i.e. marriage equality is not the marriage, it is the heated arguments surrounding the idea of SS marriage.
Once that has ended, the matter turns into the most personal and private matter that realistically involves NO ONE besides the two getting married.

No Utah resident will ever be forced to attend a single SS marriage.
No Utah resident will ever know the actual names of a single SS couple seeking to marry.
Unless you personally know two SS people planning their wedding, or unless they are your son or daughter, you'll never know. Not at all. Never ever never...

And the funny thing here is, now that SS people can marry, if you should know of such a couple and you are not invited to their SS wedding, even though you were totally opposed and against SS marriage as a concept, if you are not invited you will most likely be pissed and feel very hurt.
Day after day you will run to the mailbox hoping to see your invitation, and it never comes.
And you would probably ask, WHY WAS I NOT INVITED? BILL? FRED? WHY?
AM I NOT YOUR FRIEND? YOUR NEIGHBOR. YOUR CO-WORKER?

For a while the religious right, as well as all and every one of the many hordes of republican presidential candidates, will rant and kick about the high courts ruling in favor of SS marriage across the land.
But eventually, as with Utah, they will realize all they are doing is crying THE SKY IS FALLING.
And when they actually pause and take the time to actually look up, the blue sky will still be right there, fully intact. And as blue as ever before.

Life is so strange......
No, second thought, republican party people are so strange.....

 

[Fanatical Meat]

The founders of this country eschewed biblical law. If we followed it, we wouldn't eat pork or shellfish, wouldn't work on the sabbath, wouldn't do a lot of things. We'd be burning & stoning people to death, as well.

I''m sure that the concept of gay marriage would have seemed absurd to those men, but they nonetheless wrote the Constitution in such a way to accommodate it in a secular society.

They also wrote it so it can change as society changes

 

[kage69]

Now he gets it!




LOL -- a lot of our laws come from the 10 commandments.

Need a history lesson?

Take your best shot mfer!

You can start by explaining why it is your 10 Commandments are no support at all for The Bill of Rights.

Take your time.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Life is so strange......
No, second thought, republican party people are so strange.....

I know plenty of Republicans who are pro-gay-marriage, even though the party as a whole is not. The issue isn't Republicans, it's social conservatives. Social conservatives are assholes. Every single one of them. It's not that they hold outdated ideas, it's that they expect every other person in the country to live according to their specific narrow-minded viewpoint without exception. I have no problem with people who are opposed to gay marriage on a personal level but still appreciate that it should be legal because we live in a secular society. It's these Bible-thumping jackasses who hypocritically want one passage in Leviticus codified in law while skipping over all the stuff they personally like to do (because shrimp is just delicious, guys). These hypocritical morons hate the Taliban and ISIS for enacting Sharia law and then turn around and try to do the exact same thing with their interpretation of Christian Biblical law here at home. I'm sick of these social conservatives who can't accept that not everyone wants to live according to their specific religious tradition and that part of taking pride in being American is that we have the freedom to choose for ourselves what religion to follow (including none at all). They lost today. And humanity won.

 

[kage69]

Hahahaha, man you guys really chased whatshisface out of here with that, realized I haven't seen him post in forever!

 

[brycejones]

Hahahaha, man you guys really chased whatshisface out of here with that, realized I haven't seen him post in forever!

He got banned I believe, went full retard in some thread.

 

[chubbyfatazn]

He got banned I believe, went full retard in some thread.

You mean in every thread?

nehalem256. I wish I could remember the thread where all the toaster sex started.

 

[DrDoug]

And right-wing legislators in some states - Texas, for example - have indicated that they're going to place legislative hurdles in front of same-sex couples who want to marry. Kind of like what they're doing with highly-restrictive laws on abortion clinics. The intent is to delay, delay, delay.

One hopes that same-sex couples seeking to marry in such states will be able to get quick injunctive relief, as the harm to couples waiting for challenges to such laws to get through the courts would be far greater than any harm to a state that was forced to allow same-sex marriages during that waiting period.

Simply put, right wingers will stoop to any level to deny "liberal" rights to others.

Yup, Jindal is already throwing up a roadblock.

 

[zinfamous]

Now he gets it!




LOL -- a lot of our laws come from the 10 commandments.

Need a history lesson?

so, "blacks aren't people, races can't mix, gay hate is legal, gays can't marry" ...that is all in the 10 commandments?

I wasn't aware of that.

You really want to go through the history of religious lobbying when it comes to legislation?

really?

 

[feralkid]

:wub:

Oh, man ...I would totally wreck that thing all night long!

 

[Retro Rob]

The founders of this country eschewed biblical law. If we followed it, we wouldn't eat pork or shellfish, wouldn't work on the sabbath, wouldn't do a lot of things. We'd be burning & stoning people to death, as well.

Jesus Christ you're clueless. Every Christian with even a rudimentary knowledge of the Bible knows those laws when out about 33 C.E.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

LOL -- a lot of our laws come from the 10 commandments.

Need a history lesson?

Do you? I'm always curious if people who bring this point up are actually familiar with the 10 Commandments. Because not only are there a LOT of laws in the US that have absolutely no relation whatsoever to anything espoused in the 10 Commandments, there is also a hefty percentage of the 10 Commandments that are specifically AGAINST American law. To wit:

1. I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt have no other Gods before me; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

2. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

3. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

4. Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

5. Honor thy father and mother; not a US law, arguably unConstitutional per the 1st Amendment.

6. Thou shalt not commit murder; DEFINITELY A LAW! However, also a law in places that don't follow the 10 Commandments, so a little disingenuous to imply that US law is based on the 10 Commandments here. It's not like if the Bible never existed, we'd be hunky-dory with murdering each other. Benefit of the doubt, the Christians get this one.

7. Thou shalt not commit adultery; not a US law, arguably unConstitutional, though definitely costly to people who do it based on alimony awards.

8. Thou shalt not steal; DEFINITELY A LAW! But, like with murder, this is one of those things that plenty of cultures thought of before the Bible came around to clarify things. But hey, we're running out and we're not doing so hot, so let's give Jesus this one.

9. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor; DEFINITELY A LAW! And one that can mostly be traced back to the 10 Commandments, so well done!

10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house, wife, ass, etc; Not only is this not a law, it's specifically anti-Capitalist, which makes it unAmerican. Why on Earth would I be interested in buying a fancy watch or a bigger house unless I wanted to one-up my neighbor? Absurd.

OK, so the final tally is 30% of the 10 Commandments are ACTUAL LAWS in the United States, and it's generous to claim that any of them are laws solely because of their place in the Commandments list. That means 70% of the 10 Commandments aren't actually laws in the United States, five being specifically unConstitutional, and one being anti-Capitalist, which is arguably worse. So, fine, "a lot of our laws come from the 10 Commandments," but VASTLY more don't, and of the 10 Commandments themselves, only three of them actually pertain to any part of our legal system. How does that fit into your history lesson?

 

[Retro Rob]

so, "blacks aren't people, races can't mix, gay hate is legal, gays can't marry" ...that is all in the 10 commandments?

I wasn't aware of that.

You really want to go through the history of religious lobbying when it comes to legislation?

really?

Red herring.

 

[Retro Rob]

Do you? I'm always curious if people who bring this point up are actually familiar with the 10 Commandments. Because not only are there a LOT of laws in the US that have absolutely no relation whatsoever to anything espoused in the 10 Commandments, there is also a hefty percentage of the 10 Commandments that are specifically AGAINST American law. To wit:

1. I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt have no other Gods before me; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

2. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

3. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

4. Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy; illegal to codify in US law, per the 1st Amendment.

5. Honor thy father and mother; not a US law, arguably unConstitutional per the 1st Amendment.

6. Thou shalt not commit murder; DEFINITELY A LAW! However, also a law in places that don't follow the 10 Commandments, so a little disingenuous to imply that US law is based on the 10 Commandments here. It's not like if the Bible never existed, we'd be hunky-dory with murdering each other. Benefit of the doubt, the Christians get this one.

7. Thou shalt not commit adultery; not a US law, arguably unConstitutional, though definitely costly to people who do it based on alimony awards.

8. Thou shalt not steal; DEFINITELY A LAW! But, like with murder, this is one of those things that plenty of cultures thought of before the Bible came around to clarify things. But hey, we're running out and we're not doing so hot, so let's give Jesus this one.

9. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor; DEFINITELY A LAW! And one that can mostly be traced back to the 10 Commandments, so well done!

10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house, wife, ass, etc; Not only is this not a law, it's specifically anti-Capitalist, which makes it unAmerican. Why on Earth would I be interested in buying a fancy watch or a bigger house unless I wanted to one-up my neighbor? Absurd.

OK, so the final tally is 30% of the 10 Commandments are ACTUAL LAWS in the United States, and it's generous to claim that any of them are laws solely because of their place in the Commandments list. That means 70% of the 10 Commandments aren't actually laws in the United States, five being specifically unConstitutional, and one being anti-Capitalist, which is arguably worse. So, fine, "a lot of our laws come from the 10 Commandments," but VASTLY more don't, and of the 10 Commandments themselves, only three of them actually pertain to any part of our legal system. How does that fit into your history lesson?

Well, you do have an idea of where I was going with that!

 

[VirtualLarry]

good thing this has nothing to do with the bible. it has to do with laws in the US. Where you can't discriminate against people.

One might argue that our laws, and our system of gov't, is inspired by the Bible, and the Ten Commandments.

Edit: I see that debate has been covered, I was still reading two pages back in the thread.

Anyways, I'm a fan of both Religious Freedom (including the right of choosing not to have one, or choosing not to participate, but not of the right to prevent others from choosing to participate), and Constitutionally-protected (But God-given! - "Endowed by our Creator" - See the Declaration) Rights and Liberties.

I guess I'm getting more "liberal" as I get older, and I can see how preventing SS couples from entering into civil unions and denying them federal benefits might be discriminatory. So lets not discriminate.

But by the same token, if I were a Pastor (I'm not), I wouldn't want to be forced by the State to officiate a SSM. I'm glad to hear that there is plenty of case law supporting the right of religious officials to deny officiating over any process that they don't agree with. I do see this as a potential slippery-slope though.

Just a Nota-Bene: Microsoft's EULA speaks of the operating-system being "married" to the hardware. I was of the opinion that a Federal definition of marriage, being ONLY "Between a Man and a Woman", would invalidate millions of EULAs nationwide. So perhaps Microsoft was behind this SC ruling.

 

[Victorian Gray]

One might argue that our laws, and our system of gov't, is inspired by the Bible, and the Ten Commandments.

Ok, make your argument then. For example, how did the Bible and 10 Commandments lead to the form of govt. that the United States uses, a representative democracy in the form of a republic.

 

[Moonbeam]

Christianity won in America today. We real Christians have extended our wish to love and be loved in the holy bonds of matrimony, to proclaim that love as sacred to God, to others as we wish it extended to us. We have fixed into law the Golden Rule that pervades the Bible. We now extend to others what we have had extended to us. God has blessed America.

 

[Lonyo]

Ok, make your argument then. For example, how did the Bible and 10 Commandments lead to the form of govt. that the United States uses, a representative democracy in the form of a republic.

Well, the Greeks had democracy and republics. And then the Bible was at some point written down in Greek (especially the NT) and then we got to now. Obvious if you think about it.

Also the US doesn't have a representative democracy. But that goes for many "democracies".