Security Council passes cease-fire resolution

[BBond]

For those who can't figure out the outcome of Israel's attack against Lebanon, please allow me...

If this cease fire is accepted Hezbollah comes out looking like heros across the entire Muslim world because they "defeated" the mighty U.S. financed and armed Israel military. Israel comes out looking like a bunch of murdering religious zealots because their main accomplishment in all this insanity has been to blow up Lebanese civilians and Lebanese civilian infrastructure, and the U.S. comes out looking like a neutered, ineffective paper tiger because our idiot in chief not only didn't have the ability to control or even affect the proceedings, he didn't even have the ability to TALK with all the parties involved.

Security Council passes cease-fire resolution

Associated Press

The U.N. Security Council adopted a resolution Friday that calls for an end to the fighting between Israel and Hezbollah, and authorizes the deployment of 15,000 U.N. peacekeepers to help Lebanese troops take control of south Lebanon as Israel withdraws.

The draft, adopted unanimously, appeared to offer the best chance yet for peace after more than four weeks of war in the Middle East. It was the first significant action by the Security Council, the most powerful U.N. body, to address the crisis.

U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan said hundreds of millions of people around the world shared his frustration that the council had taken so long to act. That inaction has ?badly shaken the world's faith in its authority and integrity,? he said.

?I would be remiss if I did not tell you how profoundly disappointed I am that the council did not reach this point much, much earlier,? he said.

Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert endorsed the resolution late Friday, after a day of dramatic brinksmanship including a threat to expand the ground war in Lebanon. But Israeli officials said Israel would not halt fighting until Israel?s Cabinet has approved the cease-fire deal in its weekly meeting Sunday.

Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Saniora also assured U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice that his country backed the resolution.

Olmert will recommend that his government approve the deal in its upcoming meeting on Sunday, said Gideon Meir, a senior official in the Israeli Foreign Ministry.

Earlier, Israeli troops and tanks assembled along the Israel-Lebanon border, preparing for a possible massive incursion.

Israel had expressed dissatisfaction over an initial cease-fire plan, saying it failed to meet its basic requirements, such as stationing robust international combat troops in southern Lebanon once Israel withdraws.

But after France and the U.S. reached a deal on a revised draft resolution, Israel indicated it may accept the new arrangement and call off its offensive.

The Security Council resolution authorizes the deployment of the 15,000 U.N. peacekeepers in south Lebanon to support the Lebanese army's deployment to the region "as Israel withdraws."

The resolution, obtained by The Associated Press, asks the U.N. force to monitor a full cessation of hostilities and help Lebanese forces gain full control over an area that has previously been under de facto control of Hezbollah militias.

The text says the force's mandate will include several elements: monitoring the cessation of hostilities, accompanying Lebanese troops as they deploy and as Israel withdraws, and ensuring humanitarian access to the area.

About 2,000 U.N. troops and observers are now stationed in Lebanon, as they have been since 1978. The draft would authorize an increase to a total of 15,000 troops.

Concession to Lebanon and Hezbollah
Britain?s U.N. Ambassador Emyr Jones-Parry said the resolution gives a U.N. force in Lebanon an enhanced mandate to help coordinate the eventual withdrawal of Israeli troops. But it would ultimately be deployed under Chapter 6 of the U.N. Charter ? which Israel has previously opposed.

That decision was a key concession to Lebanon and Hezbollah. Israel wanted the force deployed under the Charter?s Chapter 7, which would give the troops more robust rules of engagement.

?You?ll find that the mandate for the force is very robust,? Jones-Parry said.

?Although the government of Lebanon will have gained a certain amount in the changes that we?ve made, it?s also the case that Israel has had concerns and no one has wanted to lose Israel from that equation,? he said.

The two sides sent the new text to the governments of Israel and Lebanon, but a French diplomat said the vote would go ahead whatever the response.

Israel denies wider offensive began
Earlier Friday, Olmert and Defense Minister Amir Peretz decided on the massive new ground campaign after meeting for several hours.

Olmert?s spokesman, Asaf Shariv, told The Associated Press that the expanded incursion had already begun. However, other officials said the army was preparing to move into Lebanon en masse but had not yet begun to do so.

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice telephoned Olmert to ask him if there was any room left for diplomacy to solve the Mideast crisis, said an individual close to the government with direct knowledge of the conversation.

Olmert has indicated he?d be willing to call off the offensive if Israel?s basic demands were met, said the individual, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the private conversation.

Blasting bridges
Israeli warplanes and artillery pounded Hezbollah positions throughout the day in an attempt to gain unchallenged command of strategic high ground and disrupt guerrilla rocket attacks across the border.

Israeli aircraft fired at least five rockets at a convoy of hundreds of cars carrying people fleeing south Lebanon on Friday, killing at least two people and wounding eight, witnesses and rescue workers said.

In far northern Lebanon, Israeli jets blasted a key bridge to Syria, killing at least 12 people, as the conflict for the first time touched the entire length of Lebanon ? from skirmishes on the Israeli border in the south to the airstrike on the northern frontier about 105 miles away.

Hezbollah sent another barrage of more than 150 rockets toward northern Israel, it said. Israeli rescue workers said eight people in the port of Haifa were wounded by shrapnel, but they estimated the Hezbollah attack at about 80 missiles by midday.

The heaviest fighting continued around Marjayoun, an important hub just north of Israel?s Galilee panhandle that juts into Lebanon. An AP reporter briefly entered the embattled city and saw intense Israeli bombardment of dug-in Hezbollah fighters.

The mostly Christian city gives Israeli gunners a view of the Litani River valley and other areas used as launching grounds for Hezbollah rockets. Israeli tanks rolled into Marjayoun on Thursday after coming under withering Hezbollah ambushes along the way.

Mass exodus slowed by violence
Hundreds of civilian vehicles joined a convoy escorted by U.N. peacekeepers leaving Marjayoun. The exodus ? which was slowed by nearby Israeli shelling ? included about 350 Lebanese soldiers and police who were in the city when Israeli forces poured in.

Marjayoun Mayor Fuad Hamra told the AP by telephone from the convoy that he blames the Lebanese government for abandoning state institutions in the region. ?As of tonight and in the coming days, Marjayoun will be a field for destruction,? he said.

By taking Marjayoun, the Israeli army was closer to Beirut than at any time since the fighting began July 12 after a cross-border raid in which Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers and killed three.

Powerful explosions resounded across Beirut. Local media reported Israeli warplanes hit Hezbollah strongholds in the southern Dahieh suburb.

Israel also struck an area close to the Lebanese border crossing at Masnaa in the Bekaa Valley, about 30 miles southeast of Beirut, but there were no reports of casualties. Masnaa is the main crossing into Syria, and the main escape route for hundreds of displaced Lebanese who fled the country over land.

Israeli planes dropped leaflets over parts of Beirut, saying Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah is ?cheating? the Lebanese and hiding the number of losses among the militiamen. The paper included the names of about 90 fighters Israel said were killed.

Israel has imposed a virtual lockdown on traffic across southern Lebanon and key northern routes, seeking to cut off weapons and aid shipments to Hezbollah. The attack on the Abboudiyeh border crossing apparently reflected Israeli fears that Hezbollah was still being supplied via Syria ? which is Hezbollah?s main sponsor along with Iran.

12 die in bridge attack
At least 12 people were killed in the attack on the bridge, spanning the northern border, security officials said. That left the northern coastal road as the only official border crossing to Syria open for those trying to flee Lebanon.

Two other Lebanese civilians were killed elsewhere, officials said.

At the same time, Israeli forces were still locked in relentless clashes with guerrillas along the southern border.

Hezbollah said it killed or wounded 15 Israeli soldiers near the border village of Aita al-Shaab. It also said Israeli forces suffered casualties near the southern village of Rachaf. Israel did not immediately release information on battlefield losses.

Hezbollah said four of its fighters had been killed, but did not say when or where.

The guerrilla group?s Al-Manar TV said Hezbollah fighters hit an Israeli gunboat off Tyre in southern Lebanon, but the Israeli military denied it.

More than 800 people in Lebanon and Israel have died since fighting erupted ? 732 on the Lebanese side and 122 on the Israeli side.

 

[Jaskalas]

I?ll be happy if they actually enforce this cease fire. Their record however, states that they will allow Hizbollah to continue years after Israel pulls out, which is the basis for my objection. Could it be because the UNIFIL flag flies beneath Hizballah's?

When you stop to think about it, what force on earth is going to enforce a cease fire?

 

[linkgoron]

Yeah, Hezbullah come out as winners becuase:

They have to release the two soldiers
They caused the destruction of a 1/3rd of Lebanon
They got saved by the French
They gained nothing.

 

[IrateLeaf]

BBond states - For those who can't figure out the outcome of Israel's attack against Lebanon, please allow me... this war never did have an outcome. The word outcome indicates one party surrendered and one party won!
It was the arabs who went crying to the UN to do something. It was hezzbollah and there cohorts who stated they underestimated what Israel`s resonse would be!

If this cease fire is accepted Hezbollah comes out looking like heros across the entire Muslim world because they "defeated" the mighty U.S. financed and armed Israel military.
No if this cease fire is accepted hezbollah will be thankful that the UN listened to the Arab delegation that went crying to the UN about the Israeli tactics. Syria and iran and the Soviet Union will be happy that Hexbollah can fight another day!!

Israel comes out looking like a bunch of murdering religious zealots because their main accomplishment in all this insanity has been to blow up Lebanese civilians and Lebanese civilian infrastructure, and the U.S. comes out looking like a neutered, ineffective paper tiger because our idiot in chief not only didn't have the ability to control or even affect the proceedings, he didn't even have the ability to TALK with all the parties involved.

First of all GWB and Mrs. Rice were both told by the israeli`s to butt out! the israeli`s dictated 100% what the US responses to the world should be.
Also GWB was very effective where he neded to be! Which was running diplomatic interference while at the same time working with the french
Actually the israeli`s come out looking like the humanitarian people that they are. Giving advanced notice so people could leave there homes.
All the while Hezbollah was hiding amoungst women and children with no care for the Lebanese or Palestinian people.
In fact an Israeli General said - The way to fight Hezbollah, he says, is to outlast them in a war of nerves.
"The name of the game is patience," says Taylor. "You have to be methodical, moving forward slowly and see who makes the first mistake, then capitalize on it."
"This is like a test case," Taylor says. "[Hezbollah] interprets an open society as a weak society. Our response has to be definitive."

Socolovsky agrees and brings up what Israelis refer to as the "cobweb speech" made by Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah a few years back in the city of Bent Jbail.

"He said Israel was like a cobweb," says Socolovsky, "that it looks like a net, but if you touch it with your hand it falls apart."
Israel can't afford to let that perception go unchallenged.

"If there's one thing that pains me about all this," says Taylor, becoming circumspect, "it's the fate of the Lebanese people. Medieval-thinking forces have dragged them into this. If they could be masters of their own destiny, I know there would be peace. But instead of progress and enlightenment these forces drag the Lebanese into darkness."

This is not a war for days or weeks," Nehushtan said during his briefing. "This is a war against terrorism. And since Hezbollah has no responsibilities to any country, you won't see them waving any white flags."

You make some pretty serious claims that in reality are not true! Well maybe your reality but we all know your stance on israel so I guess your reality is accurate.

As I heard people on TV say over and over Israel is prepared to go it again if these peacekeeping troops cannot reign in the Hezbollah Militia.

The next time I doubt seriously that israel will approch this with any sort of restraint.

War is hell and its just a cold hard fact civilians die. Its a sad thing when that happens but a country at war cannot cower because there enemie hides behind women and children like cowards.

Any other country in the world when provoked like Israel was would have been just to respond in the manner Israel responded. But, because it was Israel the world`s response is to moan and cry because civilians get killed.
yet I saw no world outcry because israeli civilians were being killed.

Don`t preach number because we both the true numbers will never be agreed too.

shalom

 

[Moonbeam]

Israel won because the Arabs and the Lebanese love them more now than they did before and will want them to live in peace.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: IrateLeaf
BBond states - For those who can't figure out the outcome of Israel's attack against Lebanon, please allow me... this war never did have an outcome. The word outcome indicates one party surrendered and one party won!
It was the arabs who went crying to the UN to do something. It was hezzbollah and there cohorts who stated they underestimated what Israel`s resonse would be!

If this cease fire is accepted Hezbollah comes out looking like heros across the entire Muslim world because they "defeated" the mighty U.S. financed and armed Israel military.
No if this cease fire is accepted hezbollah will be thankful that the UN listened to the Arab delegation that went crying to the UN about the Israeli tactics. Syria and iran and the Soviet Union will be happy that Hexbollah can fight another day!!

Israel comes out looking like a bunch of murdering religious zealots because their main accomplishment in all this insanity has been to blow up Lebanese civilians and Lebanese civilian infrastructure, and the U.S. comes out looking like a neutered, ineffective paper tiger because our idiot in chief not only didn't have the ability to control or even affect the proceedings, he didn't even have the ability to TALK with all the parties involved.

First of all GWB and Mrs. Rice were both told by the israeli`s to butt out! the israeli`s dictated 100% what the US responses to the world should be.
Also GWB was very effective where he neded to be! Which was running diplomatic interference while at the same time working with the french
Actually the israeli`s come out looking like the humanitarian people that they are. Giving advanced notice so people could leave there homes.
All the while Hezbollah was hiding amoungst women and children with no care for the Lebanese or Palestinian people.
In fact an Israeli General said - The way to fight Hezbollah, he says, is to outlast them in a war of nerves.
"The name of the game is patience," says Taylor. "You have to be methodical, moving forward slowly and see who makes the first mistake, then capitalize on it."
"This is like a test case," Taylor says. "[Hezbollah] interprets an open society as a weak society. Our response has to be definitive."

Socolovsky agrees and brings up what Israelis refer to as the "cobweb speech" made by Hezbollah leader Sheik Hassan Nasrallah a few years back in the city of Bent Jbail.

"He said Israel was like a cobweb," says Socolovsky, "that it looks like a net, but if you touch it with your hand it falls apart."
Israel can't afford to let that perception go unchallenged.

"If there's one thing that pains me about all this," says Taylor, becoming circumspect, "it's the fate of the Lebanese people. Medieval-thinking forces have dragged them into this. If they could be masters of their own destiny, I know there would be peace. But instead of progress and enlightenment these forces drag the Lebanese into darkness."

This is not a war for days or weeks," Nehushtan said during his briefing. "This is a war against terrorism. And since Hezbollah has no responsibilities to any country, you won't see them waving any white flags."

You make some pretty serious claims that in reality are not true! Well maybe your reality but we all know your stance on israel so I guess your reality is accurate.

As I heard people on TV say over and over Israel is prepared to go it again if these peacekeeping troops cannot reign in the Hezbollah Militia.

The next time I doubt seriously that israel will approch this with any sort of restraint.

War is hell and its just a cold hard fact civilians die. Its a sad thing when that happens but a country at war cannot cower because there enemie hides behind women and children like cowards.

Any other country in the world when provoked like Israel was would have been just to respond in the manner Israel responded. But, because it was Israel the world`s response is to moan and cry because civilians get killed.
yet I saw no world outcry because israeli civilians were being killed.

Don`t preach number because we both the true numbers will never be agreed too.

shalom

Yeah, "shalom" -- uh huh -- as Israelis bomb civilian convoys attempting to obey Israeli instructions. Murdering filthy cowards.

And check out the polls. Your war isn't as popular as it used to be EVEN AT HOME!

Here, read a brief synopsis of the events and their effects on Olmert and Israel and please WTFU.

Saturday, August 12, 2006

Israeli Response to UN Ceasefire Call: Invades with 30,000 more Troops, Races for Litani

The United Nations Security Council finally called for a cessation of hostilities
between Israel and Lebanon late Friday.

A "cessation of hostilities" means that Hizbullah has to stop its attacks, but Israel doesn't have to stop its attacks or withdraw from Lebanon.

Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert responded to the resolution by promising to take it up (late) on Sunday but in the meantime to invade Lebanon with 30,000 more troops and to rush to the Litani river.

Olmert also decided to destroy the power plant providing electricity to the city of Tyre, depriving ordinary people of potable water, medical care, the ability to preserve food from spoiling. This move at this point in the conflict seems especially petty. Since the reports are that Hizbullah safe houses and caves have their own power generators, it is hard to see how hitting this plant helps the Israeli war effort, and I think it is a war crime.

The Israeli officer corps is apparently furious that the UN is now calling for a ceasefire of sorts, before they could accomplish their military goals. Gee, that is the problem with ceasefires, isn't it? Get in the way of further warmaking, if you pay attention to them.

The Israeli public, especially in the north where they have been taking daily rocket fire, is on the other hand rather less gung ho now. Approval among the public for how Olmert is handling the war has plummeted from 80 percent early on to 48 percent in a recent poll. Some 40 percent of Israelis disapprove of the war now. While hawks are saying that if he stops now, he is finished politically, the trend line of the polling suggests the opposite. If he doesn't find a way to stop the war soon, it looks as though his support will go on down to zero.

The Globe and Mail describes some other Israeli activities on the eve of "peace":


' Meanwhile, Israeli warplanes bombed southern Beirut and the south of the country again in the 31st day of violence.

In the far north, one of the last remaining bridges to Syria was destroyed in a strike that killed at least 12 people;

in the south, heavy fighting continued around the Christian town of Marjayoun, a key point overlooking the Litani River for Israeli artillery positions.

A convoy of hundreds of civilians and about 350 Lebanese soldiers and police, escorted by UN peacekeepers out of Marjayoun, was hit by several Israeli missiles when part of the convoy detoured from the approved route, apparently to avoid traffic jams. At least four people were reported killed and 40 others wounded.

Aid agencies tried again in vain to get supplies to cut-off towns south of the Litani River, and the mayor of Tyre warned the city would run out of food in two days. '



That's right. The Israelis bombed a civilian convoy attempting to obey their instructions, the departure of which had been coordinated with them through UNIFIL.


'In one of the most dramatic development in the fighting Friday, an Israeli unmanned plane fired at the convoy, which included a 350 joint Lebanese army and police force as well as 500 civilian cars. They left Marjayoun after hours of U.N. mediated negotiations which succeeding in receiving Israeli assurances for the convoy's safety.

The attack came as the convoy was en route from Jib Jannin to Kefraya in the south of the Bekaa valley, security officials said. They said most of the casualties were civilians.

"The Israeli forces had been told in advance of the convoy's passage, and had given it the green light," UNIFIL spokesman Milos Strugar said. '



The famed Israeli intelligence can't be much good if they don't know hundreds of civilians are heading out of the south at their orders, especially after UNIFIL told them about it. I'm afraid this further attack on civilians is more proof that the Israelis just don't care if they kill Arab civilians.

The Israelis launched 10 air raids on Baalbak, and hit south Beirut again.

As with every day, Hizbullah fired over a hundred rockets into northern Israel. They wounded some civilians with shrapnel. On Friday, they killed two Palestinian-Israelis with their rockets. It cannot be said too often that deliberately targeting civilians in war is a war crime.

Peace activists attacked the UNSC resolution as weak and favoring Israel, and criticized Olmert's decision to keep fighting for two more days.

Mark Joyner cartoon: Deterrence.

Israel is singlehandedly doing more damage to themselves than all the Arab nations in the world could possibly do combined.

:laugh:

 

[fallenangel99]

Looks like Israel Gov't is going to vote on resolution on Sunday (Saturday off) and Lebanon on Saturday? So, we'll see what happens on Monday. Israel is already continuing its offensive, it has 2 more days to try to do more damage (after all, they said they would be done in a month.. and they have barely gotten 5 miles past the border!). Nasrallah accepts the resolution, but he says as long as Israel is in Lebanon, they will fight Israel.

So, looks like it will end on Monday!!!


P.S.: Any word on the 2 captured soldiers? i didn't read the resolution, but are they going to be returned?

 

[Aisengard]

I read that the soldiers were to be returned unconditionally. It better happen, at any rate, or it will tell every single terrorist that it's okay to attack Israel, because the UN will protect their rights.

I hope that this 'peacekeeping force' fares better than all the other peacekeepers the UN has deployed. I hope that Hezbollah never attacks Israel ever again. This whole thing would not have happened if Hezbollah didn't attack Israel in the first place.

Unfortunately, my prediction goes as such:

The UN peacekeeping force is effective for about a month. After that, Hezbollah will probably fire some rockets at Israel in retaliation for some made-up charge that the pathetic gullible fools of the world will eat up like candy. Israel, seeing that the UN is doing NOTHING regarding peace, builds up forces to defend itself. Hezbollah keeps firing rockets while the UN force tells everyone to 'please stop.' No one will listen. Israel is forced to invade Lebanon once more on the ineptness of the UN force. The UN force pulls out, and starts chiding Israel again for whatever made-up reason they can come up with. Status quo.

Hopefully though, once Hezbollah breaches the cease-fire, the UN resolution gives Israel full rights to defend itself. I think I read somewhere that that was the case. If that happens, there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind that Hezbollah is a cancer on the Middle East, and just really needs to be cut out, like any malignent tumor. Unfortunately, peaceniks around the world will be against this invasive surgery, and will recommend 'alternative medicine' which really, just never works.

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: Aisengard
If that happens, there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind that Hezbollah is a cancer on the Middle East, and just really needs to be cut out, like any malignent tumor. Unfortunately, peaceniks around the world will be against this invasive surgery, and will recommend 'alternative medicine' which really, just never works.

I would amend that by surmising that the entire Islamic world is a malignant tumor.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Israel won because the Arabs and the Lebanese love them more now than they did before and will want them to live in peace.

They certainly couldn't love them less.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: BBond
... the U.S. comes out looking like a neutered, ineffective paper tiger because our idiot in chief not only didn't have the ability to control or even affect the proceedings, he didn't even have the ability to TALK with all the parties involved.

Hmmm - who *has* met with Hezbollah's leaders? How do you make any sort of an agreement with a non-state terrorist organization? How would any agreement be enforced?

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: Aisengard
If that happens, there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind that Hezbollah is a cancer on the Middle East, and just really needs to be cut out, like any malignent tumor. Unfortunately, peaceniks around the world will be against this invasive surgery, and will recommend 'alternative medicine' which really, just never works.

I would amend that by surmising that the entire Islamic world is a malignant tumor.

That's just stupid. There are over a billion Muslims in the world, a lot of them average people who are just living their lives, raising their children, doing their jobs. If those people can figure out how to weed out the extremists they'll be in good shape. Many would argue that the US needs to do the same.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: Aisengard
If that happens, there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind that Hezbollah is a cancer on the Middle East, and just really needs to be cut out, like any malignent tumor. Unfortunately, peaceniks around the world will be against this invasive surgery, and will recommend 'alternative medicine' which really, just never works.

I would amend that by surmising that the entire Islamic world is a malignant tumor.

That's just stupid. There are over a billion Muslims in the world, a lot of them average people who are just living their lives, raising their children, doing their jobs. If those people can figure out how to weed out the extremists they'll be in good shape. Many would argue that the US needs to do the same.

I think he meant in the middle east. If that were the case I agree with him.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Israel won because the Arabs and the Lebanese love them more now than they did before and will want them to live in peace.

They certainly couldn't love them less.

It's quite psychologically interesting how people who believe they are hated manage to act is ways that guarantee it.

I believe they can and are loving them less and less. I believe the radicalization of the Islamic world is accelerating thanks in no small part to the behavior of both Israel and the West.

 

[Aisengard]

No, it's accelerating thanks to the maniacal actions of Hezbollah and Iran. They know they can whip their sheep into a frenzy by doing this ******. It's sad, because I thought that maybe, just maybe, the Middle Easterners were smarter than that. I guess I overestimated them again.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Israel won because the Arabs and the Lebanese love them more now than they did before and will want them to live in peace.

They certainly couldn't love them less.

It's quite psychologically interesting how people who believe they are hated manage to act is ways that guarantee it.

I believe they can and are loving them less and less. I believe the radicalization of the Islamic world is accelerating thanks in no small part to the behavior of both Israel and the West.

That is of course you belive that the last 800 or so years of history mean nothing. I hope it accellerates, so people actually deal with the problem rather than pretend it does not exist.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Israel won because the Arabs and the Lebanese love them more now than they did before and will want them to live in peace.

They certainly couldn't love them less.

It's quite psychologically interesting how people who believe they are hated manage to act is ways that guarantee it.

I believe they can and are loving them less and less. I believe the radicalization of the Islamic world is accelerating thanks in no small part to the behavior of both Israel and the West.

It's equally interesting to see people who poke at bee's nests act surprised when the bees sting them.

 

[Termagant]

It is clear that Hezbollah won. Someone recently posted a Stratfor analysis which basically outlined this.

Hezbollah has fought Israel in a "war" now for longer than any Arab state, and not been totally defeated. Israel may have damaged Hezbollah's capabilities but they can quickly be rebuilt. A guerrilla movement can adapt to the UN peacekeeper situation and start attacking Israel in some new method without the use of Southern Lebanon. Maybe by sea or something. The Lebanese are seen as victims of unnecessary hostility.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: BBond
... the U.S. comes out looking like a neutered, ineffective paper tiger because our idiot in chief not only didn't have the ability to control or even affect the proceedings, he didn't even have the ability to TALK with all the parties involved.

Hmmm - who *has* met with Hezbollah's leaders? How do you make any sort of an agreement with a non-state terrorist organization? How would any agreement be enforced?

Hmmm - who refuses to meet with Hezbollah's leaders? Why do they refuse to make any sort of agreement with an organization that holds seats in Lebanon's government? Knowing thatm, why would you think any agreement would be unenforcable?

bush calls Hezbollah a terrorist organization at the behest of Israel as an excuse not to deal with them.

 

[Aisengard]

It's amazing that anything less than total destruction of Hezbollah is deemed a 'victory'.

Glad to see that Hezbollah considers the destruction of southern Lebanon and minor casualties on the Israeli army as a victory. Helpful to see what their interests really are. Hint: it's not the Lebanese people. No one could care less about them than the terrorist group Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Nasrallah says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

And BBond, even your beloved European governments refuse to deal with Hezbollah. They talk to the Lebanon prime minister, who has allowed himself to be handcuffed by the terrorist group. I think the only nation who talked directly to Nasrallah was Taiwan.

As a side note, I think it's a good lesson that if you allow terrorist groups to operate inside your country unchecked, you leave your citizens open to terrible amounts of danger. And most of the blame lies on your shoulders for not dealing with the problem yourself.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Aisengard
It's amazing that anything less than total destruction of Hezbollah is deemed a 'victory'.

Glad to see that Hezbollah considers the destruction of southern Lebanon and minor casualties on the Israeli army as a victory. Helpful to see what their interests really are. Hint: it's not the Lebanese people. No one could care less about them than the terrorist group Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Nasrallah says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

And BBond, even your beloved European governments refuse to deal with Hezbollah. They talk to the Lebanon prime minister, who has allowed himself to be handcuffed by the terrorist group. I think the only nation who talked directly to Nasrallah was Taiwan.

As a side note, I think it's a good lesson that if you allow terrorist groups to operate inside your country unchecked, you leave your citizens open to terrible amounts of danger. And most of the blame lies on your shoulders for not dealing with the problem yourself.

Your Israeli bias is showing. Israel destroyed Lebanon, not Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Israel says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

I don't think it's a good lesson that you support terrorist governments like Israel that intentionally targets civilians and civilian infrastructure for retribution in direct violation of international law.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: Aisengard
If that happens, there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind that Hezbollah is a cancer on the Middle East, and just really needs to be cut out, like any malignent tumor. Unfortunately, peaceniks around the world will be against this invasive surgery, and will recommend 'alternative medicine' which really, just never works.

I would amend that by surmising that the entire Islamic world is a malignant tumor.

That's just stupid. There are over a billion Muslims in the world, a lot of them average people who are just living their lives, raising their children, doing their jobs. If those people can figure out how to weed out the extremists they'll be in good shape. Many would argue that the US needs to do the same.

it isn't stupid. religion is a malignancy. it is the best description for it. and of course there are some religions more malignant than others. there are "good" people in any corrupt ideology you know. they are good despite of it. you could say they are in remission. it doesn't make the ideology good.

It's quite psychologically interesting how people who believe they are hated manage to act is ways that guarantee it.

right moonie. and i'm sure u think those trials of black people in the old segregated south infested with kkk were getting fair judgement from their all white juries.

 

[Aisengard]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Aisengard
It's amazing that anything less than total destruction of Hezbollah is deemed a 'victory'.

Glad to see that Hezbollah considers the destruction of southern Lebanon and minor casualties on the Israeli army as a victory. Helpful to see what their interests really are. Hint: it's not the Lebanese people. No one could care less about them than the terrorist group Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Nasrallah says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

And BBond, even your beloved European governments refuse to deal with Hezbollah. They talk to the Lebanon prime minister, who has allowed himself to be handcuffed by the terrorist group. I think the only nation who talked directly to Nasrallah was Taiwan.

As a side note, I think it's a good lesson that if you allow terrorist groups to operate inside your country unchecked, you leave your citizens open to terrible amounts of danger. And most of the blame lies on your shoulders for not dealing with the problem yourself.

Your Israeli bias is showing. Israel destroyed Lebanon, not Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Israel says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

I don't think it's a good lesson that you support terrorist governments like Israel that intentionally targets civilians and civilian infrastructure for retribution in direct violation of international law.

Oops, you're wrong. Par for the course, though. And while it's flattering that you imitate me, please try to be original in your attempts at rebuttal next time.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Aisengard

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Aisengard
It's amazing that anything less than total destruction of Hezbollah is deemed a 'victory'.

Glad to see that Hezbollah considers the destruction of southern Lebanon and minor casualties on the Israeli army as a victory. Helpful to see what their interests really are. Hint: it's not the Lebanese people. No one could care less about them than the terrorist group Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Nasrallah says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

And BBond, even your beloved European governments refuse to deal with Hezbollah. They talk to the Lebanon prime minister, who has allowed himself to be handcuffed by the terrorist group. I think the only nation who talked directly to Nasrallah was Taiwan.

As a side note, I think it's a good lesson that if you allow terrorist groups to operate inside your country unchecked, you leave your citizens open to terrible amounts of danger. And most of the blame lies on your shoulders for not dealing with the problem yourself.

Your Israeli bias is showing. Israel destroyed Lebanon, not Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Israel says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

I don't think it's a good lesson that you support terrorist governments like Israel that intentionally targets civilians and civilian infrastructure for retribution in direct violation of international law.

Oops, you're wrong. Par for the course, though. And while it's flattering that you imitate me, please try to be original in your attempts at rebuttal next time.

Hey genius, saying I'm wrong does not make it so. Provide something other than your own Israeli biased bullsh!t.

Oh, and here's more. The bush administration -- you remember, the administration that couldn't get relief into New Orleans after Katrina -- seems to be able to rush order anything that their masters in Israel need with no problem whatsoever.

Tells you a lot about priorities in Washington and Israel.

Report: US To Deliver Israel New Cluster Munitions
Meanwhile, the New York Times is reporting the Bush administration is set to approve an Israeli request to speed delivery of missiles armed with cluster munitions. State Department officials are reportedly trying to delay the approval amid concerns of a diplomatic fallout over likely civilian casualties. The M-26 rockets carry hundreds of grenade-like bomblets that explode over a wide area. Israel says it needs them to strike Hezbollah missile launchers. Cluster sales were momentarily suspended during the Reagan administration following disclosures Israel used them against civilian targets during its first invasion of Lebanon in 1982. Last month, Human Rights Watch said Israel is shelling civilian areas with US-made cluster bombs in violation of international law. According to the group, a cluster bombing of the village of Bilda killed one civilian and wounded twelve others, including seven children. US officials say Israel will likely get the rockets but will be told: to ?be careful.?

LINK

Killing civilians seems to be Israel's claim to fame.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Aisengard
It's amazing that anything less than total destruction of Hezbollah is deemed a 'victory'.

Glad to see that Hezbollah considers the destruction of southern Lebanon and minor casualties on the Israeli army as a victory. Helpful to see what their interests really are. Hint: it's not the Lebanese people. No one could care less about them than the terrorist group Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Nasrallah says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

And BBond, even your beloved European governments refuse to deal with Hezbollah. They talk to the Lebanon prime minister, who has allowed himself to be handcuffed by the terrorist group. I think the only nation who talked directly to Nasrallah was Taiwan.

As a side note, I think it's a good lesson that if you allow terrorist groups to operate inside your country unchecked, you leave your citizens open to terrible amounts of danger. And most of the blame lies on your shoulders for not dealing with the problem yourself.

Your Israeli bias is showing. Israel destroyed Lebanon, not Hezbollah.

You pathetic gullible idiots lapping up every word Israel says are too far gone to be reasoned with.

I don't think it's a good lesson that you support terrorist governments like Israel that intentionally targets civilians and civilian infrastructure for retribution in direct violation of international law.

its amazing you can type and breath at the same time. hezbollah is the terrorist group. if israel were intentionally targeting civilians how many do you think they would kill eh? target a few shelters full of hundreds and well you can save a whole lotta bombs!! you are disengenuous or just ignorant. for the number of bombs isreal has dropped the collateral damage is low. and if they really just wanted to kill civilians they would not have risked their jewish lives by sending ground troops. and as you've seen, they've taken losses instead of simply flattening entire areas.

i'm sick of hearing about people claim hezbollah is "defending" lebanon. theres no way around it, hezbollah destroyed lebanon. a terrorist group with ties to the government and a militia and a stated terrorist objective of genocide. it built up thousands of weapons for targeting civilians and then went on a military strike into another country to provoke war. then it relied on tactics involving civilians as shields, fighting in populated areas, and then complaining so niave fools like you would defend their cowardly tactics. they use the faux news tactic..the right wing radio tactic. claim the mainstream media is severely biased to the left when its not so they can push their own extremist media out under this cover as justification. and thats essentially the tactic of hezbollah. their rockets have no military targets, just civilians. so you are a gullable idiot. worse actually you are a terrorist sympathiser, an apologist for terrorists. a niave fool who thinks rewarding such tactics and ideology encourages peace when it does exactly the opposite. people like you ensure war. you legitimize the terrorists methods.