SecuROM Discussion Thread

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: Chosonman
So which anti virus program can I use to detect this?

Microsoft's Rootkit Revealer should do the trick (at least for NWN2 era SecuROM).

 

[Piuc2020]

DRM is such a tricky beast, I'd like to see the SecuROM advocates support their system when Sins of a Solar Empire is brought up in the conversation, ZERO protection, and the game sold pretty well, with SecuROM it might have even sold less.

A pirate will pirate a game no matter how hard it is to do so, sure there are a few pirates who out of impatience go and buy the game but those are a very little minority and are far outgrown by the large community of legit users getting shafted by these stupid DRM implementations.

I don't understand why the industry can't see this, it's just mindblowing, it's more than a theory, it's a FACT and even recent games like Sins of a Solar Empire PROVE it, DRM is no good for anyone, block pirates out of online and updates or DLC with cd-keys (which don't bother legit users) and be done with it, everything that has been done has been cracked to the point where pirates play the game with less hassle than real users. Publishers should start giving paying consumers some real advantage to having paid full price, not add another reason to consider pirating, it's ironic, DRM has led many people to either not buy the games or pirate them.

 

[Schadenfroh]

Dailytech has a new blog post about product activation in regards to SecuROM related titles.

 

[mindcycle]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Dailytech has a new blog post about product activation in regards to SecuROM related titles.

Interesting article. Publishers are definitely trying to get around the first sale doctrine to try and put a hamper on used game sales. SecuROM is just another method of achieving that goal since it obviously does nothing to stop piracy. It's been publicly admitted by both EA and Epic at this point.

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/55828

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/55828

I personally have a big problem with this. We should have the right to sell our product like any other physical good. ..actually we already have this right, the first sale doctrine. I hope the current lawsuits prove once again that they don't have the right to skirt around these laws.

What these publishers need to do is create better products and/or include better incentives for pirates to actually buy games. Not punish the people who are already buying them.

 

[Regs]

I personally have a big problem with this. We should have the right to sell our product like any other physical good.

Software is easily replicated though with little or no cost to the seller. Compare it to a car, house, or any other tangible gift. If you sold your car, you don't have it anymore. You gave up ownership to use it. It's a little different than software installed on hard drive.

 

[Modelworks]

Originally posted by: Chosonman
So which anti virus program can I use to detect this?

http://www.moreawesomethanyou....29.msg270742#msg270742

 

[mindcycle]

Originally posted by: Regs

I personally have a big problem with this. We should have the right to sell our product like any other physical good.

Software is easily replicated though with little or no cost to the seller. Compare it to a car, house, or any other tangible gift. If you sold your car, you don't have it anymore. You gave up ownership to use it. It's a little different than software installed on hard drive.

So EULA's should specifically state that if you sell the disk then you aren't allowed to use the software. They probably already do. Plus, most disc based media has cd checks and have had those for as long as I can remember. If you don't follow the EULA then you are breaking the copyright agreement and thus the law. Plain and simple. Most average consumers don't know how to bypass cd checks, so if they sell the disc they can no longer play the game. Punishing customers by including "extra" software that you can't remove and has the potential to cause other problems on your computer is not the solution.

Fact of the matter is that the first sale doctrine has held up in court. Until that changes, we have the right to sell the product we paid for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F...rine#Computer_software

If these publishers want to continue to be as greedy as they have proven to be, then they can expect more people to resort to pirating and more lawsuits. The game industry is going down the same path the music industry already went down. We all know how well that turned out.

http://www.shacknews.com/tag.x/used+games

 

[Shmee]

I hate securom as much as the next guy, and have decided not to buy anymore EA games, as I hate them too. I did however get farcry 2 with my GTX 260, installed and activated it fine on my vista 64 comp, went to play it, but double clicking the icon simply resulted in a microsoft error saying the app had stopped working. I tried various compatibility options, even played with DEP settings(helps with starcraft mods), but it wouldnt work. So, I figure it might be a securom problem. I finally fixed it by getting a no-DVD patch(legal if you OWN the game) and it worked fine. Securom FTL.

 

[pmv]

I was about to start a new thread with the following post, but then figured it belonged on the end of this one. Probably it's repeating things already said, but there's a question in there also.

I haven't bought any new PC games from Crysis onwards. Partly because I've lost interest a bit, but its also because I just can't be bothered with all this DRM nonsense, particularly limited installs and the need to put my main PC on the net, and also having all sorts of weird crapware concealing itself in Windows and not ever uninstalling properly. Note I didn't say I pirated anything, I've just given up on PC games (except I haven't finished Oblivion yet).

Is there any likelihood the DRM nonsense on the likes of Bioshock etc will eventually be removed if they get a budget re-release at some point? I.e. then it might be worth buying them?

I'm not mad keen on Steam, again because I don't want my main PC on the net (and am not wildly enthusiastic about having the internet at home at all, but it just happens to have finally dropped to a price I can justify) and anyhow prefer to have a stand-alone physical copy of whatever I've paid for, thanks.

It seems to me, by the way, that this DRM stuff is more about killing the second hand market, rather than piracy. I'd be reluctant to buy any of the securom games second hand - yes some may have had limited installs removed but I can't be bothered to have to research that any time I'm considering buying something. If its anything more than a disk-in-drive check, forget it.

Personally I can no more be bothered with dodgy cracks and warez (and associated risks of malware or unpatchable games etc) than I can be with DRM. I'm not 12 years old. I can afford to pay a reasonable price, I just want to be able to buy a stand alone product that works without taking over my PC.

Anyway, sorry I must be going over extremely well-trodden territory, but at least does anyone know the answer to the question in my 3rd paragraph?

 

[Martimus]

Originally posted by: pmv

Is there any likelihood the DRM nonsense on the likes of Bioshock etc will eventually be removed if they get a budget re-release at some point? I.e. then it might be worth buying them?

This has happened in the past. Stalker got rid of their DRM after a patch a few months after release. It isn't the only game that has done this, but the only one I can think of off the top of my head. They often do it after the game stops selling well, if they bother to do it at all.

 

[mindcycle]

Originally posted by: pmv
Is there any likelihood the DRM nonsense on the likes of Bioshock etc will eventually be removed if they get a budget re-release at some point? I.e. then it might be worth buying them?

The install limits have already been removed from Bioshock. You still have to install SecuRom when you initially install the game though. http://forums.2kgames.com/foru...howthread.php?p=296125

I actually researched a lot of DRM systems included with recent games and compiled a list of what games contain what DRM and descriptions of them as well. You can find the thread here: http://forums.anandtech.com/me...ord1=pc+games+drm+list

Might be useful if you're basing your buying decisions off DRM. It's exactly what I do and is why I created the list in the first place.

 

[pmv]

@mindcycle

That's a useful thread, bookmarked for future reference. ta for the work done.

What I was hoping would eventually happen is an actual 'budget label' reissue of some of these titles, without any DRM included, rather than a later patch to remove some of it. Not sure if any of the newer nastier DRM titles have been around long enough that one could expect budget reissues by now or not. Otherwise I'll probably just never play most of them.

 

[Tristicus]

It has been fully removed off of GTAIV.