Sen. Warren proposes to cancel student loan debt

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dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
There have to be limits on this.

Please rationalize to me how a single person out of college making $60,000 a year needs to have their $18,000 worth of student debt eliminated. They should be able to pay that off in a year or two.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,346
15,159
136
There have to be limits on this.

Please rationalize to me how a single person out of college making $60,000 a year needs to have their $18,000 worth of student debt eliminated. They should be able to pay that off in a year or two.

Just to be factual, the average debt is about 37k.
 

dasherHampton

Platinum Member
Jan 19, 2018
2,543
488
96
But her plan would eliminate the debt of my example as well (and hundreds of thousands, if not millions, like it).

Which is Kooky.
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
7,596
7,854
136
But her plan would eliminate the debt of my example as well (and hundreds of thousands, if not millions, like it).

Which is Kooky.
Phase it in, it doesn't all need to be instantaneous.

Pay down older debts, and debts of higher-debt students before it pays off a $10k loan that's a year old.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,003
18,350
146
After watching republicans siphon off money to enrich themselves I'm all in on this one.

Same here, even reluctantly. I chose not to pursue a 4 year due to money restraints. But if we're gonna hand out piles of money, I'd rather give it to the people.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
Right, but promising to enact policies that help people in order to get votes is basically the entire point of democracy.
Accusations of vote buying is for when candidates make populist promises that will never see the light of day. Student loan forgiveness and free public universities is treating the symptoms, not curing the underlying cause.

Warren deserves credit for leading the pack in laying out policy, but deserves scrutiny for this particular idea.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
35,603
29,319
136
Woah there Skippy, how much is all that free shit going to cost us? 70% of our income to taxes?

@#$@% that!
70% of your second $10 million. You only have to pay regular tax rates on your first $10 million. I assume there will also be a significant bump in tax rates for your income over $1 million as well, but not 70%. I hope you don't have to lay off too many servants to deal with this hardship. It would be more ethical to keep them on the payroll and cut back to a single private jet.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,885
34,850
136
70% of your second $10 million. You only have to pay regular tax rates on your first $10 million. I assume there will also be a significant bump in tax rates for your income over $1 million as well, but not 70%. I hope you don't have to lay off too many servants to deal with this hardship. It would be more ethical to keep them on the payroll and cut back to a single private jet.

Unacceptable, my stable of purebred Bichons would have to fly a chartered turboprop on the way to their summer beachfront compound instead of the Gulfstream. Have you no shame?
 
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dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
35,603
29,319
136
Unacceptable, my stable of purebred Bichons would have to fly a chartered turboprop on the way to their summer beachfront compound instead of the Gulfstream. Have you no shame?
You are right. Let's cut Medicare and Social Security instead.
 
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Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,415
14,307
136
Woah there Skippy, how much is all that free shit going to cost us? 70% of our income to taxes?

@#$@% that!
It'll cost trillions less than what that pointless war in Iraq you supported cost us.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,912
2,130
126
I just wanted to bring up the real issue. Universities are charging way too much for a 4-year degree. We need to get to the root of the matter.
100% agree with you on this. My engineering degree tuition for example here in Canada by the 4th year was nearly doubled what it had been in 1st year. The universities themselves need to have more funding from the gov't...it is an investment in future workers/spenders IMO. If other 1st world countries can have free/nearly free higher education, why not here in North America? They're not ebil soshulizts by any means!
 
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jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
The GOP has to be anti-education.

The alternative would involve them having to change and they clearly couldn't stomach that.
 

Majes

Golden Member
Apr 8, 2008
1,164
148
106
The GOP has to be anti-education.

The alternative would involve them having to change and they clearly couldn't stomach that.

So being against student loan forgiveness is the same as being against education?

Some would argue that paying back the terrible loan you agreed to is its own form of education...
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
So being against student loan forgiveness is the same as being against education?

Some would argue that paying back the terrible loan you agreed to is its own form of education...
They don't want people bothering with higher education, especially the lower classes.

Warren's plan is more than student debt forgiveness.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
So.. what you suspect and what is reality are 2 very different things. Mortgages aren't car loans. They are subject to very different laws and regulations, some federal, all state.
Most states are non-recourse for primary residence first mortgages with regards to that 'fat bill,' also known in debt circles as the 'deficiency balance.' 'Non-recourse' means that the lender must accept the funds received from the foreclosure auction as settlement of the debt in full, even if those funds are less than the balance owed. In those cases, the lender does charge off the deficiency balance and issue a 1099 to the borrower for that amount, because the IRS does define the portion of a debt not repaid as income. However, if the foreclosed mortgage was used to purchase the property, then that 1099 is not taxable income per the Mortgage Forgiveness and Debt Relief Act.
In those states that do allow lender recourse for primary residence first mortgages, the lender must pursue a more costly and lengthy judicial foreclosure process (required in many states anyway), and then must be awarded a deficiency judgment in court in order to pursue the deficiency balance. These are not that common.
In all cases, this varies by the laws of the state the property is located in. Generally, as the time it takes to foreclose and repossess the property is the most expensive part of the foreclosure process by far (because the process can take years, interest never sleeps, and defaulted borrowers rarely pay the property tax and insurance bills), a lender's primary objectives are to cure the delinquency (ie through loan modification), to settle the account (ie short sale), or to foreclose, as quickly as possible. And yes, in that order, ideally. Keep in mind that settlement of a non-performing asset often makes more sense wasting good money chasing after bad.

But yeah, I don't know anything about how this stuff works.

Fair enough, there are more non-recourse states than I thought. (My house is in PA, which is a recourse state.) And I didn't realize it was that difficult for lenders to pursue a deficiency. I thought it was a simple matter of going to the court for a judgment, that only the foreclosure itself was difficult.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,415
14,307
136
The GOP has to be anti-education.

The alternative would involve them having to change and they clearly couldn't stomach that.
They're not anti-education, they're anti-equal opportunity. They want higher education to be restricted to those who were born into a family wealthy enough to pay for it. All else will have to 'earn' it through a system of indentured servitude intentionally designed to block their upward economic mobility.

All their other narratives on this subject are flat-out bullshit. Conservatives/GOP didn't care about debt and deficit when they're lining their own pockets with pointless multi-trillion dollar wars. They didn't care about debt forgiveness when they were get the principal hacked off their mortgages. And they certainly didn't care about tax rates when those taxes were paying for their own college educations back in the 60s/70s.
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
11,578
1,741
126
70% of your second $10 million. You only have to pay regular tax rates on your first $10 million. I assume there will also be a significant bump in tax rates for your income over $1 million as well, but not 70%. I hope you don't have to lay off too many servants to deal with this hardship. It would be more ethical to keep them on the payroll and cut back to a single private jet.

Why would you want to rob people? That's what you're doing. Right? From an ethical standpoint why would you want to rob someone who took risks, and who worked their ass off to get to that point. I don't know what you think, but most millionaires are self made, and they work looong hours. You just don't get to sit at home watch Netflix and play video games all day when your goal is to do big things.

So again. Why do you think it's OK to rob people and to take their money.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
Why would you want to rob people? That's what you're doing. Right? From an ethical standpoint why would you want to rob someone who took risks, and who worked their ass off to get to that point. I don't know what you think, but most millionaires are self made, and they work looong hours. You just don't get to sit at home watch Netflix and play video games all day when your goal is to do big things.

So again. Why do you think it's OK to rob people and to take their money.
GFY.

Taxes are not theft.
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
11,578
1,741
126
Ah, if used the way that you guys like then yes it is theft. Should the wealthy pay their share. Of course. At 70% though? That's ridiculous. What do you think they'll do? They'll pack up and move to another country. They have that option. We don't.

I believe in personal responsibility. I have school loans myself. I'm trying my best to pay them off. I taught in South Korea because I knew the cost of living in Asia was low, and that would allow me increase my payments. You do what you have to do! If you have a degree in pottery it's not my issue. You should had made a better choice. If we go after the wealthy, that means we are going to be leveling hefty taxes on their businesses. Just look at Amazon and the city of NY. That didn't go very well for NYC did it? You can't just tax the rich because they don't produce income like us. Most of it is in personal investments: stocks, real estate, mutual funds.
 

repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
4,544
3,472
136
What do you think they'll do? They'll pack up and move to another country.

lol. Yes, people with family, friends, regional, and business ties just like everyone else are going to pack up, move, and relinquish their US citizenship because their taxes over $10M are too high. Do you ever think things through?

Edit: not to mention there is an insanely large pool of very well qualified people willing to take those $10M jobs left behind even if they were to leave. There is nothing special about rich people despite your weird fetish for them. If they want to leave, give up their citizenship and buy Southeast Asia currency with the rest of their US dollars then fuck em, hope they don’t let the door hit them on their way out.
 
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