Senator pushes for Universal Healthcare

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic
Your emotional arguments and senseless partisan hackery add nothing to the discussion.

Vic has officially entered the thread.... :roll:

And time for leechlerot to be proved the fool again lol

Meh. I'm tired of him. I just can't compete with his stupidity.

He did, however, mention great 70s music in another recent thread and (obviously unbeknownst to him) I am a huge Rush fan (and no, not Limbaugh :roll: ):

"Something For Nothing"

Waiting for the winds of change
To sweep the clouds away
Waiting for the rainbow's end
To cast its gold your way
Countless ways
You pass the days

Waiting for someone to call
And turn your world around
Looking for an answer
To the question you have found
Looking for
An open door

You don't get something for nothing
You can't have freedom for free
You won't get wise
With the sleep still in your eyes
No matter what your dreams might be

What you own is your own kingdom
What you do is your own glory
What you love is your own power
What you live is your own story
In your head is the answer
Let it guide you along
Let your heart be the anchor
And the beat of your own song

You don't get something for nothing
You can't have freedom for free
You won't get wise
With the sleep still in your eyes
No matter what your dreams might be

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Specop 007
This sucks, I really hope this fails miserably.

why? for ideological reasons? the usa is just about the only first world country without universal health care. In the long run, it would save your country money and improve the overall health of the US population.

That is so bogus...im the long run it would bankrupt this nation.......sorry...nice idea...but foolish!!

So I guess that every other country that has socialized or universal healthcare is on the brink of bankruptcy? Can you link me to the national debts of those countries and then compare them to ours? K, thnx.

Also, as for the gripes with the quality of national healthcare compared the the great and wonderful Oz....er....system that we have now....

USA ranked 16/20 behind many, many countries with national plans

US Healthcare...most expensive and least effective

Look at the chart on page 4 of that PDF.....USA....highest cost per capita, highest cost per GDP, highest infant mortality rate, last in fairness of financial contributions, last in overal performance.

Here's another wonderful bit of stats for you:

Even more significantly, the medical system has played a large role in undermining the health of Americans. According to several research studies in the last decade, a total of 225,000 Americans per year have died as a result of their medical treatments:

? 12,000 deaths per year due to unnecessary surgery

? 7000 deaths per year due to medication errors in hospitals

? 20,000 deaths per year due to other errors in hospitals

? 80,000 deaths per year due to infections in hospitals

? 106,000 deaths per year due to negative effects of drugs

Thus, America's healthcare-system-induced deaths are the third leading cause of the death in the U.S., after heart disease and cancer.

as usual melodramitic you be!!
You can pull whatever you wan t out of your hat. It disn`t change the fact that this is a very very bad idea!

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic

Your emotional arguments and senseless partisan hackery add nothing to the discussion.

Vic has officially entered the thread.... :roll:

And time for leechlerot to be proved the fool again lol

Sorry you can't handle your own, maybe get a pair of cajones on loan?

With you it is like taking candy from a baby. The secret is getting you to continue to write. I dont even need to input much, just keep you writing and within a couple of pages you discredit yourself.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic

Your emotional arguments and senseless partisan hackery add nothing to the discussion.

Vic has officially entered the thread.... :roll:

Am I wrong? No. He blats mindless emotional garbage and partisan hackery as though those add in any fashion to sensible discussion, or to the possibility of peaceable resolution of differences. I can understand why you roll your eyes though, as you're no different. And there's no reason to be nice to you (or him) in turn, because you can't reason with or compromise with a hate-filled selfish radical.

You are not one to speak, you can clear a thread faster then anyone else here, and it is not because you are insightful, trust me.

And pray tell, exactly what was not insightful about my very first post in this thread?


edit: and 2 things you may not have noticed.
(1) Wyden is my senator, and I have voted for him everytime he has been up for election.
(2) I have not given a position on the topic at hand.

 

[Steeplerot]

Rush...

I will just have to say no comment here, except that Vic, you are such a maladjusted freak..Rush rofl.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: sandorski
Hehe, "screw us". The lack of such a thing is screwing you over a whole lot more.

Why should I be financially for someone else's health problems?

By the way, I've had about $300,000 in back surgeries over the past couple years and I think I paid $20 in co-pay once because my mom didn't have $20 on her.

Someone else Paid for your Surgery. Those Else's Paid a whole lot more than if it was Paid through a Universal Program. As part of a Co-Pay you are already Paying for someone elses health problems and are financially responsible(believe you missed this word ) for them.

In short, you already are.

Correct, however everyone else that I pay for may also in essence pay for me. Why should I pay for those who won't put in?

Everyone Pays Tax, it is unlikely that no win would put in.

Illegals and various others don't pay taxes.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Genx87

With you it is like taking candy from a baby. The secret is getting you to continue to write. I dont even need to input much, just keep you writing and within a couple of pages you discredit yourself.

Too bad you all have been so wrong on so much in here you have 0 credibility left except the 5 or so other dittohead fanbois who get banned after making asses of themselves within a few months.

Now keep on topic, once vic comes in the thread is crapped out, wow big surpirise.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Rush...

I will just have to say no comment here, except that Vic, you are such a maladjusted freak..Rush rofl.

The only musicians ever to be awarded the Order of Canada are not great 70s music, rot?

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Genx87

With you it is like taking candy from a baby. The secret is getting you to continue to write. I dont even need to input much, just keep you writing and within a couple of pages you discredit yourself.

Too bad you all have been so wrong on so much in here you have 0 credibility left except the 5 or so other dittohead fanbois who get banned after making asses of themselves within a few months.

Hilarious, just hilarious.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Rush...

I will just have to say no comment here, except that Vic, you are such a maladjusted freak..Rush rofl.

The only musicians ever to be awarded the Order of Canada are not great 70s music, rot?

Par for the course, there used to be another left wing loon on here a couple of years ago named infohawk who didnt know who Lynard Skynard was but claimed to know great music like Madonna and Briteny Spears lmao.

 

[Steeplerot]

Lol at Lynard Skynardand Rush fan dittoheads, no wonder you all are so twisted.

Thanks for making my day! I needed a big laugh.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lol at Lynard Skynardand Rush fan dittoheads, no wonder you all are so twisted.

Thanks for making my day! I needed a big laugh.

List off some of your favorite bands so we can laugh right back.

 

[shrumpage]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lesse, things that the govt has done that have been efficient: The world wars, our freeway system, large dams and bridges, SS is still trucking along regardless of the doomsayers, and well, we are still here after all these years with a pretty much intact constitution.

You might be able to say that on projects done 100-50 years ago. Lets stick with more modern times, like the last twenty years.

I watched the Oregon's DoT run projects into the the billions that had zero effect on traffic - and only affected a small % of the population. Brilliant use of taxpayers monies.

If i remember correctly Oregon dumped billions in to a DMV computer program that didn't work.

Thats just they state level.

How about the billions the IRS spent on its 'upgrade' program?


What about the Boston "dig" project how many billions dumped into that - way over budget and years over due - and it ended up killing a lady.

Government is wasteful, inefficient and screws up.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lol at Lynard Skynardand Rush fan dittoheads, no wonder you all are so twisted.

Thanks for making my day! I needed a big laugh.

List off some of your favorite bands so we can laugh right back.

I wouldn't expect you to have any clue whatsoever, so I will not waste our time.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lesse, things that the govt has done that have been efficient: The world wars, our freeway system, large dams and bridges, SS is still trucking along regardless of the doomsayers, and well, we are still here after all these years with a pretty much intact constitution.

You might be able to say that on projects done 100-50 years ago. Lets stick with more modern times, like the last twenty years.

I watched the Oregon's DoT run projects into the the billions that had zero effect on traffic - and only affected a small % of the population. Brilliant use of taxpayers monies.

If i remember correctly Oregon dumped billions in to a DMV computer program that didn't work.

Thats just they state level.

How about the billions the IRS spent on its 'upgrade' program?


What about the Boston "dig" project how many billions dumped into that - way over budget and years over due - and it ended up killing a lady.

Government is wasteful, inefficient and screws up.

You are giving examples of stuff that was contracted out, not the government building it.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lol at Lynard Skynardand Rush fan dittoheads, no wonder you all are so twisted.

Thanks for making my day! I needed a big laugh.

List off some of your favorite bands so we can laugh right back.

I wouldn't expect you to have any clue whatsoever, so I will not waste our time.

Must be some obscure no talent titless wonders then.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lesse, things that the govt has done that have been efficient: The world wars, our freeway system, large dams and bridges, SS is still trucking along regardless of the doomsayers, and well, we are still here after all these years with a pretty much intact constitution.

You might be able to say that on projects done 100-50 years ago. Lets stick with more modern times, like the last twenty years.

I watched the Oregon's DoT run projects into the the billions that had zero effect on traffic - and only affected a small % of the population. Brilliant use of taxpayers monies.

If i remember correctly Oregon dumped billions in to a DMV computer program that didn't work.

Thats just they state level.

How about the billions the IRS spent on its 'upgrade' program?


What about the Boston "dig" project how many billions dumped into that - way over budget and years over due - and it ended up killing a lady.

Government is wasteful, inefficient and screws up.

You are giving examples of stuff that was contracted out, not the government building it.

Semantics, you think the govt will have govt employee's running the hospitals?
Anything the govt touches nearly turns to ******. The military is about the only successful program but even that has a laundry list of programs that wasted Billions while providing nothing in return.

 

[Steeplerot]

titless wonders? :laugh: wtf is that?

Like I said, you wouldn't have a clue.

Can you be a titless wonder and still have nipples?

I think I am feeling pretty middle 'merica culturally challenged here.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lol at Lynard Skynardand Rush fan dittoheads, no wonder you all are so twisted.

Thanks for making my day! I needed a big laugh.

Dittoheads

:roll:

I'm not much of a Skynard fan. I prefer the Allman Brothers when it comes to Southern rock. You realize that ALL rock music is southern music, right? If it's not derived from Robert Johnson and Muddy Waters, then it's Elvis and Johnny Cash.


Anyway, musicianship, not politics, influences my musical preferences. If you are the other way around, then I think that says something pretty sad about you, rot.
Still, I had my mp3 player on at the gym last night, and I asked my GF if it was appropriate to listen to Pink Floyd's Animals and Rush's 2112 back-to-back.

 

[dmw16]

I can't believe a person of the right wing leanings would ever say that people DONT have a right to medical treatment. What happened to sanctity of life?

Also, Im not sure that it's as bad as people say it is in Canada. I have a friend of the family who is from Canada and swears if he ever gets really sick he wants to be in Canada and not the states.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lesse, things that the govt has done that have been efficient: The world wars, our freeway system, large dams and bridges, SS is still trucking along regardless of the doomsayers, and well, we are still here after all these years with a pretty much intact constitution.

You might be able to say that on projects done 100-50 years ago. Lets stick with more modern times, like the last twenty years.

I watched the Oregon's DoT run projects into the the billions that had zero effect on traffic - and only affected a small % of the population. Brilliant use of taxpayers monies.

If i remember correctly Oregon dumped billions in to a DMV computer program that didn't work.

Thats just they state level.

How about the billions the IRS spent on its 'upgrade' program?


What about the Boston "dig" project how many billions dumped into that - way over budget and years over due - and it ended up killing a lady.

Government is wasteful, inefficient and screws up.

You are giving examples of stuff that was contracted out, not the government building it.

Governments contract out most everything these days, rot. Remember what you said about Sweden and its high percentage of private industry ownership in the socialism thread? How do you think that's possible? Jeez... get with the times... :roll:

 

[shrumpage]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Lesse, things that the govt has done that have been efficient: The world wars, our freeway system, large dams and bridges, SS is still trucking along regardless of the doomsayers, and well, we are still here after all these years with a pretty much intact constitution.

You might be able to say that on projects done 100-50 years ago. Lets stick with more modern times, like the last twenty years.

I watched the Oregon's DoT run projects into the the billions that had zero effect on traffic - and only affected a small % of the population. Brilliant use of taxpayers monies.

If i remember correctly Oregon dumped billions in to a DMV computer program that didn't work.

Thats just they state level.

How about the billions the IRS spent on its 'upgrade' program?


What about the Boston "dig" project how many billions dumped into that - way over budget and years over due - and it ended up killing a lady.

Government is wasteful, inefficient and screws up.

You are giving examples of stuff that was contracted out, not the government building it.

Give me one recent example of a government building project that wasn't contracted out.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
You are giving examples of stuff that was contracted out, not the government building it.

How would "the government" run universal healthcare, then? Convert all doctors, nurses, administrators, technicians and other personnel to the civil service?

 

[Steeplerot]

Please Vic, your killing me with the soft redneck corp-rock, pink floyd sucked ass after their first album. They were about as edgy as wet oatmeal compared to real bands they ripped off back then.

I have a perfect song for you and your taste in music. ENJOY!

(A 350 pound homeless schizophrenic black man singing who thinks you suck too.)

 

[BoomerD]

I don't see why so many people are against this idea. EVERYONE, regardless of income should have access to basic medical care. Just because someone is poor, shouldn't mean they can't see a doctor when they need to.

Look at it this way, those without insurance go to hospital emergency rooms, where they are guaranteed some medical treatment. WE pay for it in increased medical costs anyway, so why not provide a certain level of basic medical care for EVERYONE? When did the ability to see a doctor become available for only the rich or well off? More and more people in this country are going without medical insurance every year, whether becauae of job loss, companies dropping insurance, escalating cost of medical insurance, whatever...

I don't advocate giving everyone FULL medical coverage that takes care of every possible procedure, want a face lift or tummy tuck? YOU pay for it. Want Viagra? YOU pay for it...Have pneumonia? Go to the doctor, get the necessary medical care without having to choose between seeing a doctor and eating. Have a ruptured appendix? Same thing...get it fixed.

It's getting to the point, where I'd vote to tax people on the medical benefits they get from their employer...at FULL cash value...I know in my case, working construction, my employer pays about $5.50/hr into my medical plan, for every hour I work. Then, the H&W plan uses 110 hours/month out of my hours bank to pay my medical insurance....That's about $600/month. Tax that amount to help pay for medical costs for everyone in the USA.

I don't think the US citizen should have to pay for those who are here illegally, or who are not citizens, (maybe a separate plan to provide medical for those here on visas), since having medical coverage would just be another draw for people to come to the USA, (legally and illegally) but there is NO REASON that American citizens shouldn't have BASIC medical coverage available to them. A plan like this would give employers the option of providing "supplemental" insurance to their employees that would cover things above what the basic plan covers...