Should I change to Push setup from Pull?

[essential]

All my parts came in and I built over the weekend. The screws that came with the Kraken x41 weren't long enough to go through the case and hold the fan/radiator. I tried mounting the fan on the outside to save some internal space, and tried to mount the fan in a push orientation inside the case but the screws wouldn't allow it. I ended up doing a pull like you see, because the screws were just long enough to hold the fan to the radiator, then the radiator is mounted to the case with different screws.

It's not in the picture but I've added the top part of the HD cage because I'm adding 4 internal HDs.

I can go to the hardware store and try and find longer screws, but is it worth changing everything to get a push through the radiator as opposed to the pull? Am I missing much? Will the gains be worth the effort or will it be minimal if even noticeable?

On day one I was idling in the high 20's low 30's with the Kraken on quiet mode (900rpm and whisper quiet, can't even tell it's running). After a bit of burn in I seemed to level out in the mid 30's on idle. Last night I was high 30's low 40's but I think that has more do to with higher ambient temps in the room. I put the Kraken on performance mode and the fan ramps up to about 1400rpm, it can be heard at that point and the CPU temps didn't seem effected at all, again, could just be due to higher room temps in general.

So far:
BitFenix Prodigy
i7-4790k stock (no OC)
230mm front intake
140mm rear intake through Kraken
120mm top exhaust
Adding a second 120mm top exhaust but I ordered a fan filter because the Kraken tubing gets close to where that fan is going to be and I don't want the tubing to be getting clipped by the fan.

 

[dougp]

Why not move the radiator to the top and put it in push/pull and have the exhaust go out the back?

 

[BonzaiDuck]

All my parts came in and I built over the weekend. The screws that came with the Kraken x41 weren't long enough to go through the case and hold the fan/radiator. I tried mounting the fan on the outside to save some internal space, and tried to mount the fan in a push orientation inside the case but the screws wouldn't allow it. I ended up doing a pull like you see, because the screws were just long enough to hold the fan to the radiator, then the radiator is mounted to the case with different screws.

It's not in the picture but I've added the top part of the HD cage because I'm adding 4 internal HDs.

I can go to the hardware store and try and find longer screws, but is it worth changing everything to get a push through the radiator as opposed to the pull? Am I missing much? Will the gains be worth the effort or will it be minimal if even noticeable?

On day one I was idling in the high 20's low 30's with the Kraken on quiet mode (900rpm and whisper quiet, can't even tell it's running). After a bit of burn in I seemed to level out in the mid 30's on idle. Last night I was high 30's low 40's but I think that has more do to with higher ambient temps in the room. I put the Kraken on performance mode and the fan ramps up to about 1400rpm, it can be heard at that point and the CPU temps didn't seem effected at all, again, could just be due to higher room temps in general.

So far:
BitFenix Prodigy
i7-4790k stock (no OC)
230mm front intake
140mm rear intake through Kraken
120mm top exhaust
Adding a second 120mm top exhaust but I ordered a fan filter because the Kraken tubing gets close to where that fan is going to be and I don't want the tubing to be getting clipped by the fan.

Do you mean "fan filter?" Or "fan grille?" Grilles are ubiquitous, and don't much restrict airflow.

I'm the first to admit that I'm in uncharted territory, trying to wrestle with the same issues as I plan and "design" my first water-cooled system. I won't even order the parts until after New Year's.

AigoMorla is the unquestioned water-cool guru here, and we'd had some exchanges about static fan pressure, fan size and airflow. I'll argue that your BitFenix 230mm intake could pressurize the case and improve airflow through the radiator configured as exhaust. How much? I can't be sure.


And -- I'll guess that if the intake fan has such an effect, it would matter less to use the cooler's fans as "pull" rather than "push." How much less it would matter? I can't be sure -- either.

Did you consider -- or do you think it's possible -- to use rubber fan mounts on your AiO cooler?

 

[essential]

Why not move the radiator to the top and put it in push/pull and have the exhaust go out the back?

That makes sense but the Kraken x41 is 140mm, the rear is the only place with 140mm mounts, top is 120mm. Also if I top mount (with adapters maybe?) I think I'd lose the option of the additional HD case that isn't in the current picture, which I need.

Do you mean "fan filter?" Or "fan grille?" Grilles are ubiquitous, and don't much restrict airflow.

I'm the first to admit that I'm in uncharted territory, trying to wrestle with the same issues as I plan and "design" my first water-cooled system. I won't even order the parts until after New Year's.

AigoMorla is the unquestioned water-cool guru here, and we'd had some exchanges about static fan pressure, fan size and airflow. I'll argue that your BitFenix 230mm intake could pressurize the case and improve airflow through the radiator configured as exhaust. How much? I can't be sure.


And -- I'll guess that if the intake fan has such an effect, it would matter less to use the cooler's fans as "pull" rather than "push." How much less it would matter? I can't be sure -- either.

Did you consider -- or do you think it's possible -- to use rubber fan mounts on your AiO cooler?

Yes fan grille works too, same thing. If you see the AIO tubing, it is pushing up in to the area where a fan will be. I just want a filter on the bottom of the fan so the tubing isn't pushing into the actual blades of the spinning fan, it shouldn't impact airflow at all.

I had rubber fan mounts that came with the 230mm fan, they were long enough but not secure enough for the weight of the fan/radiator, it def needs actual screws in my opinion.

I'll see if AigoMorla chimes in. I'm willing to change any orientation really, I just don't want to waste time or effort if any change will result in a minimal gain, if any. I don't quite understand all the dynamics either.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

. . . .

Yes fan grille works too, same thing. If you see the AIO tubing, it is pushing up in to the area where a fan will be. I just want a filter on the bottom of the fan so the tubing isn't pushing into the actual blades of the spinning fan, it shouldn't impact airflow at all.

I had rubber fan mounts that came with the 230mm fan, they were long enough but not secure enough for the weight of the fan/radiator, it def needs actual screws in my opinion.

I'll see if AigoMorla chimes in. I'm willing to change any orientation really, I just don't want to waste time or effort if any change will result in a minimal gain, if any. I don't quite understand all the dynamics either.

The rubber mounts that came with the 230mm fan -- I'm familiar with those if they're the same as those shipping with the 200mm Spectre Pro fan. But they're not the one's you'd want, or even bother to experiment with as pertains to your 120mm rad fans.

Look at the rubber fan mounts sold by the handful at Sidewinder [heck -- I'll find a link for you]:

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/ak20rucafamo.html

[Those are EXPENSIVE!]

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/setof4rufanr.html

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/setof4fanrid.html

I can tell you there are moments of stress and tedium installing fans with these things in tight spaces, and I can't completely anticipate your trials and tribulations with the AiO cooler.

However! If you can make it work, you can likely use beefier fans for either push or pull -- with less noise arising from vibration transmitted through the radiator metal. I have "wide experience" with fans of different sorts, but humbly admit it is still limited experience. Based on that limited experience, I'd wonder if you couldn't replace those fans with 120mm Akasa Vipers. I'd think -- if the cooler fans are PWM type, you'd pick PWM replacements. I think the Akasas fill the bill. You also might still be able to find a variety of Gentle Typhoon fans. I think most folks would say your upper limit of RPM and CFM would be the AP-15. [Myself -- I might even CONSIDER using AP-30's if using PWM fan control, and many would tell me I'm either deaf or totally nuts!]

At this point, I can imagine that fewer AiO cooler users are likely or inclined to replace the fans. Personally, I'd consider it as an option, if you're worried about "push" versus "pull."

 

[Flapdrol1337]

Having a fan pull will make more noise (that's why all fans have their "legs" to the center below the fan, so the air pushes over it).

Also, having the fan push on the radiator will make the air a bit more turbulent, which makes the radiator->air heat transfer better.

You're running your cpu at stock though, and your cooling system is massive overkill, even with the fan running slowly and pulling it'll easily outperform the stock fan, so I wouldn't bother changing it unless you want to run a very high overclock and it starts to become noisy.

 

[Cerb]

I can tell you there are moments of stress and tedium installing fans with these things in tight spaces

For the fan mounts, specifically, pliers like these are the thing to use, so the ends can be grabbed and pulled out, even without straight access.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

For the fan mounts, specifically, pliers like these are the thing to use, so the ends can be grabbed and pulled out, even without straight access.

Agreed . . . and anyone who had DIY modding aspirations for at least a few years should have a pair of those.

I don't think -- if it's even possible to use rubber mounts on AiO's (can't see why not) -- it would be nearly the trouble I've gone to with a fan installation behind my D14 cooler without removing the cooler first.

I see that specs and info for custom-water radiators often warn of screws that are too long, or the need for care in applying screws. With the different designs of rubber mounts, the rubber itself or the possibility of trimming the mounts, I doubt they present any of the same risk.