Sim City 5

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MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
22,053
20,259
136
it was pretty bad yesterday. just tried to get on now when i got home, no worky.

the other problem that these connection problems have is that this game is designed so that you work with other cities in your region, but the few times i did get through yesterday i couldn't get on a region with any other players. i can live with the smaller city size (though it should be a bit bigger) only if there is a robust community playing the other cities.

right now it just sucks.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
I will agree consumer protection laws do need to be rewritten for the digital age. Most of the focus has been on protecting corporations from consumer abuses but rarely the other way around. It's not like the old burn and return days anymore.

From a corporate standpoint, I do think EA is biting off their nose to spite their face in this mess. I can see this becoming a case study in future PR classes, of how not to handle things. EA's launch and their repose to the issues are rather amateurish IMO, which is inexcusable for such a big and seasoned company. A lot of these were pre-orders, so they had an idea of how many server slots they needed. Yet they didn't prepare for it? At minimum they should be offering discounts or free games, like Sony did after the PSN outage.

The problem with SimCity is while it does have a hardcore audience, it's primarily a casual game. When you anger casual gamers, they don't come back. It's pretty much the same thing that happened during Spore's launch, when faulty SecuROM broke a lot of peoples' games. This kind of attitude can really hurt you in the long run. You think they'd have learned their lesson after the last time. Guess not.
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,145
10
81
That is so terrible to blame a consumer for something like this.


While EA is a company known for their privacy-abusive DRM, that is totally different from a non-functional product.

It's one thing to bitch that DRM slows down the computer, or I shouldn't have to install origin/steam, or whatever, but in this case the game simply does not work.


Non functional is totally different from knowing that it is 'inconvenient'.

ad in the fact they are removing parts of the game to try to get it to work is even worse. you can't blame the consumer at all in this.

when you buy something you expect to get what you pay for and it to work.
 

RPD

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
5,062
569
126
I don't know what's worse at this point. EA or people still buying EA products and then bitching about it. Stop buying their shit already, it will never change if you do.
 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,816
83
91
in coincidental news, Tropico 4 is 75% off on Steam today :thumbsup:

great snow-day time waster.
 

Chaptorial

Member
Feb 7, 2010
157
9
81
Had some trouble yesterday evening getting on but managed to after a 20 min wait in the queue. Played for about 2 1/2 hours without a glitch.

Got home now and logged onto the same server without a problem and my city was there from last night like I left it. Fully expected another wait tonight but so far so good. Let's see if it lasts.
 

Regs

Lifer
Aug 9, 2002
16,665
21
81

You might be better off just not buying it next time. Why on earth would our government, mixed economy, would want to make a law more draconian than the actual DRM itself, and even more, expect people to sign a petition for it? I gladly did not buy the game, and can use the 50 dollars I saved on something better. \

I think what I am going to do- is- become the richest man in the world buy finding a way to sell you my smelly used underwear. I might not have the marketing budget as EA, but I can still try.
 
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Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,995
776
126
You might be better off just not buying it next time. Why on earth would our government, mixed economy, would want to make a law more draconian than the actual DRM itself, and even more, expect people to sign a petition for it? I gladly did not buy the game, and can use the 50 dollars I saved on something better. \

I think what I am going to do- is- become the richest man in the world buy finding a way to sell you my smelly used underwear. I might not have the marketing budget as EA, but I can still try.

How the hell is that a 'draconian' law? That would be a great law. If you try to do a charge back on Sim City, EA will ban your ENTIRE origin account, meaning you lose ALL your games.
 

tdawg

Platinum Member
May 18, 2001
2,215
6
81
in coincidental news, Tropico 4 is 75% off on Steam today :thumbsup:

great snow-day time waster.

I think I put about 30 minutes into that game and never came back. I think I've bought all 4 when each hit bargain prices to fill the void that SimCity had left, but I never stick with them. Something about the way the game works just doesn't keep me entertained.
 

exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,518
8
91
Just installed. Downloads took 30 minutes (50mbit connection) and then 'servers are down....' when I tried to play.

Congrats to all who can play successfully, but for those of us who cannot, this sucks. I completed my Amazon return label and this will back in the mail tomorrow. Refund confirmed.

Maybe I will buy it again when the always-on internet connection has been either officially removed, or there is an 'unofficial' workaround...

Disappointed SC fan.
 

Kalmah

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2003
3,692
1
76
I don't know if this has been linked yet as I just got back from a mini vacation. After a quick scan through the thread I didn't see it so here it is.

A letter from an EA employee to executives at EA was just found on reddit. It was confirmed to be legit in the thread it originally came from.

To the executives at EA, from one of your employees
I am deeply embarrassed by the troubled launch of Sim City and I hope you are too. When I walk around our campus and look at the kind of talent we’ve collected, the amenities we have access to and the opportunities working at such a big company affords us, I can’t imagine how for release after release, EA continues to make the same embarrassing, anti-consumer mistakes. We should be better than this. You should not be failing us so badly.
Another thing I see when I walk around our campus are massive banners that display what are said to be our company values. They are on posters on every floor, included in company-wide emails and hanging above the cafeteria in bright colors. You even print them on our coffee mugs so we see them every day. But somehow when planning the launch of Sim City, you threw them all out the window.
Most important of the values you are ignoring is Think Consumers First. What part of the Sim City DRM scheme, which has rendered the game unplayable for hundreds of thousands of fans across the globe, demonstrates that you are thinking about consumers before you are thinking about yourselves? Does “first” mean something different in boardrooms than it does to the rest of us? Does the meaning of that word change when you get the word “executive” in front of your title?
You can’t even pretend that you didn’t know consumers would be angry about this. Common sense aside, consumers complained about this during your public betas. In fact, when one of them posted his criticisms on the forums, he was banned! You tried to silence your critics. The same thing is happening now as users write in to demand refunds. What part of this behavior aligns with our company value to Be Accountable?
What you’ve demonstrated with this launch is that our corporate management does not believe in our core values. They are for the unwashed masses, not for the important people who forced this anti-consumer DRM onto the Sim City team. This DRM scheme is not about the consumers or even about piracy. It’s about covering your own asses. It allows you to hand-wave weak sales or bad reviews and blame outside factors like pirates or server failures in the event the game struggles. You are protecting your own jobs at the expense of consumers. I think this violates the Act With Integrity value I’m looking at on my own coffee mug right now.
On behalf of your other employees, I’d like to ask you to fix this. Allow the Sim City team to patch the game to run offline. If Create Quality and Innovation is still a core value that you believe in, then this shouldn’t be a hard decision. Games that gamers can’t play because of server overload or ISP issues are NOT quality. Be Bold by giving the consumers what they want and take accountability for the mistake.
Finally I’d like to ask you to follow the last company value on the list in the future: Learn and Grow. When you made this mistake with Spore, the company and all your employees suffered for it. You didn’t learn from that mistake and you are making it again with Sim City.
So please, learn from this debacle. Don’t do this again. Grow into better leaders and actually apply our company values when you make decisions. Don’t just use them as tools to motivate your staff. With the money, talent and intellectual property available to EA, we should be leading the industry into a golden age of consumer-focused game publishing. Instead we’re the most reviled game publisher in the world. That’s your fault. Things can only change if you actually start following the company values and apply them to every title we launch.
Sincerely,
A Disappointed But Hopeful Artist at EARS
EDIT: with regards to proof, I am an employee, so I do not want to jeopardize my standing, but today, all regular EA employees got an e-mail with a note from Gabrielle Toledano in celebration of International Women's Day. Another EA employee would have to confirm, but its the most proof I'm willing to risk providing.

I guess I might as well provide the link. http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/19xb2m/a_letter_from_an_ea_employee_to_executives/
 
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Phobic9

Golden Member
Apr 6, 2001
1,824
0
71
So for the first time ever (at least since the game has been out), I was able to come home and immediately load the game as if nothing was wrong. I'm completely confused here as I've been home for 5 minutes as of this posting and I'm actually playing the game. Did I get lucky or are they actually fixing it?



I did get rolled back though. Big time.
 

Anteaus

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2010
2,448
4
81
I don't know if this has been linked yet as I just got back from a mini vacation. After a quick scan through the thread I didn't see it so here it is.

A letter from an EA employee to executives at EA was just found on reddit. It was confirmed to be legit in the thread it originally came from.



I guess I might as well provide the link. http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/19xb2m/a_letter_from_an_ea_employee_to_executives/

What proof is that? Citing the existance of an email that is distributed company wide is hardly proof. It just means that whoever wrote it might have access to someone who knows about that email. I'm not saying it's not real, but I'm highly skeptical. The game was designed from the ground up requiring server side processing for core game elements. I doubt that offline play would be easy to patch in even if EA wanted to do it.
 

Tegeril

Platinum Member
Apr 2, 2003
2,907
5
81
So for the first time ever (at least since the game has been out), I was able to come home and immediately load the game as if nothing was wrong. I'm completely confused here as I've been home for 5 minutes as of this posting and I'm actually playing the game. Did I get lucky or are they actually fixing it?



I did get rolled back though. Big time.

You got lucky =\
 

Wyndru

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2009
7,318
4
76
What proof is that? Citing the existance of an email that is distributed company wide is hardly proof. It just means that whoever wrote it might have access to someone who knows about that email. I'm not saying it's not real, but I'm highly skeptical. The game was designed from the ground up requiring server side processing for core game elements. I doubt that offline play would be easy to patch in even if EA wanted to do it.

You took the words out of my mouth, almost verbatim lol.
 

KentState

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2001
8,397
393
126
What proof is that? Citing the existance of an email that is distributed company wide is hardly proof. It just means that whoever wrote it might have access to someone who knows about that email. I'm not saying it's not real, but I'm highly skeptical. The game was designed from the ground up requiring server side processing for core game elements. I doubt that offline play would be easy to patch in even if EA wanted to do it.

How do you know the game requires "server side processing for core game elements" ? Are you just repeating EA's line or you have first hand knowledge. The game seems to run fine and have all the features when the game goes offline in the middle of a season. I really challenge anyone to point to the "core features" that are running server side.
 

Jeffg010

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2008
3,438
1
0
STAR WARS: The Old Republic, origin and all the hoops I had to go through made me never to buy anther game from EA. Now I hope you all learn your lesson and stop buying the shit EA rolls out. This been a entertaining thread though
 

Jodell88

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2007
9,491
42
91
How do you know the game requires "server side processing for core game elements" ? Are you just repeating EA's line or you have first hand knowledge. The game seems to run fine and have all the features when the game goes offline in the middle of a season. I really challenge anyone to point to the "core features" that are running server side.
I don't own the game but I have been watching streams on twitchtv. Yesterday the region mechanic was not working, thus sims from other cities won't visit and things that were set to region wide was not working either.

Not trying to disprove your theory but the servers do seem to be needed.
 

Pia

Golden Member
Feb 28, 2008
1,563
0
0
What proof is that? Citing the existance of an email that is distributed company wide is hardly proof. It just means that whoever wrote it might have access to someone who knows about that email. I'm not saying it's not real, but I'm highly skeptical. The game was designed from the ground up requiring server side processing for core game elements. I doubt that offline play would be easy to patch in even if EA wanted to do it.
The email's writer claims to be an artist, not a programmer. The writer does not say whether they personally work on SimCity. It's possible the writer is legit but is not informed enough to know that whatever they are requesting is not technically feasible. Who knows.

The one thing I'm absolutely sure of is that the game is not designed to require so much server performance per client that all essential parts of the sim would not also run on a standalone client in a decent system. If they needed significantly more perf than that, the server costs would get ridiculous, there'd be a small server for every handful of players.
 

Dominato3r

Diamond Member
Aug 15, 2008
5,114
1
0
Had some trouble yesterday evening getting on but managed to after a 20 min wait in the queue. Played for about 2 1/2 hours without a glitch.

Got home now and logged onto the same server without a problem and my city was there from last night like I left it. Fully expected another wait tonight but so far so good. Let's see if it lasts.

Just a tip, that 20 minute wait isn't a "queue", it's just 20 minutes before the game will check server status again. You can continue trying to join despite it showing a timer.
 

Wyndru

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2009
7,318
4
76
The email's writer claims to be an artist, not a programmer. The writer does not say whether they personally work on SimCity. It's possible the writer is legit but is not informed enough to know that whatever they are requesting is not technically feasible. Who knows.

The glaring parts of that email that made it sound fake to me were that it seemed too eager to paint a picture of being an employee for no reason. The whole mention of being on the campus, looking at banners in the cafeteria, coffee mugs, etc...it is really going out of it's way to prove it's an EA employee. Why would anyone writing to their own employer go to all that trouble. Seems off to me.

Also, it made a point to hit on every single issue that people are bitching about on the forums. I mean EXACTLY what people are complaining about in every thread on every forum. Even though some of those points didn't seem relevant in the email, they were included in there anyhow.

The one thing I'm absolutely sure of is that the game is not designed to require so much server performance per client that all essential parts of the sim would not also run on a standalone client in a decent system. If they needed significantly more perf than that, the server costs would get ridiculous, there'd be a small server for every handful of players.
This is something that is really unsure, but they have released a number of youtube videos early on explaining how the simulation works, and how sims (agents) actually move things around, i.e. they are vehicles for moving around water, waste, etc...

Canbacon posted some links earlier about the glassbox simulator:



That combined with EA's claims late last year that it was required to be on the cloud not only for multiplayer but also a lot of the simulation.

Well, Maxis' Lucy Bradshaw has responded to this DRM food fight, sort of. Earlier comments on the always-on connection attributed it to the fact Maxis is building what it considers to be a multiplayer game. To this, Bradshaw adds the always-on connection is necessary because there's an enormous amount of cloud computing required to power this game, billed as the most advanced in SimCity's history. It's not something your individual PC will be able to handle on its own, not when the cloud servers are handling up to 100,000 Sims inside each city.
http://kotaku.com/5971235/cloud-com...ity-needs-an-always+on-connection-studio-says


After all of this, I'm still not sure though. As far as I can gather from info available online, the Glassbox is a simulator that runs locally on your PC, so I would assume that only the region simulation needs to be online to keep it synchronized, and would think that your computer handles the current city simulation. Even so, moving the region simulation to the local PC would probably be a difficult task. They would likely have to remove the co-op feature of the regions and revert it back to how SC4 was where after you leave a city it updates the region info (for single player anyhow).
 
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