Skylake, worth using?

[Raftina]

I have somewhat... unusual goals.

• Build should last 6+ years without replacing the mobo or CPU
• mini ITX format, probably in a Silverstone ML07 case
• Not very demanding CPU wise: my i7-920 rarely gets over 50% load, and I'm unlikely to place more demand on it. The only reason I am replacing the build is because I hate how big, heavy, and power-hungry my current build is.
• I prefer to not have to delid at any point.

Option 1: Build a Skylake based build with a mITX board
Option 2: Build a build using the ASRock X99E-ITX/AC motherboard and a 85W Xeon

Main reason I am considering the Xeon is that it has a soldered IHS, so I don't need to worry about having to delid because the TIM between the die and IHS dried out over the next 3-5 years.

Related: Do all LGA 2011-3 Xeons have soldered IHS, or is it just the higher end models?

 

[i7Baby]

Depends on your budget and intended future use.

If your i7 only runs to 50% usage then there doesn't seem to be a need to update it.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Why care about delid if you are not going to do some heavy OC? Assuming its an issue at all.

Of the 2 options, Skylake is the way to go.

 

[nenforcer]

Your i7 920 is a 130W, chip no? With a much higher idle usage than a Skylake.

You could cut your power usage almost in half (65W) if you use the iGP of Skylake but the Xeon version doesn't come with an IGP does it?

What graphics card are you using with your i7 920 currently?

 

[know of fence]

Most compute tasks actually even opening up Firefox place a 100% load on your CPU even if it is for a split second. The 50 % is probably a meaningless sliding average. For a PC to feel slow or unresponsive you don't need to hit 100%.

Anand has beaten the importance of single thread speed into his readers heads for the last 10 years, before he rode off into the sunset. Some random thoughts.

Having a ton of RAM and tripple/quad channel however does idly consume lots of power, with little benefit really.

But Skylake will not be able to really replace discrete graphics in a "future proof" manner, due to lack of Freesync, G-sync and lack of a fast (120Hz+) interface standard for 4K resolution monitors. Desktops will have to remain big and power hungry due to dGPUs.

Maybe spending less for more frequent updates is the way to go: a modest/mobile Skylake build perhaps, even though without competition and after 3 disappointments in a row, the only sure thing is that Skylake is not going to be cheap.

Windows 10 will help speed up the boot sequence of PCs from 2009, which are still plenty capable, so at least you will be willing to power it off more often.

 

[PhIlLy ChEeSe]

Most compute tasks actually even opening up Firefox place a 100% load on your CPU even if it is for a split second. The 50 % is probably a meaningless sliding average. For a PC to feel slow or unresponsive you don't need to hit 100%.

Anand has beaten the importance of single thread speed into his readers heads for the last 10 years, before he rode off into the sunset. Some random thoughts.

Having a ton of RAM and tripple/quad channel however does idly consume lots of power, with little benefit really.

But Skylake will not be able to really replace discrete graphics in a "future proof" manner, due to lack of Freesync, G-sync and lack of a fast (120Hz+) interface standard for 4K resolution monitors. Desktops will have to remain big and power hungry due to dGPUs.

Maybe spending less for more frequent updates is the way to go: a modest/mobile Skylake build perhaps, even though without competition and after 3 disappointments in a row, the only sure thing is that Skylake is not going to be cheap.

Windows 10 will help speed up the boot sequence of PCs from 2009, which are still plenty capable, so at least you will be willing to power it off more often.

So he should upgrade cause it boots faster? LOL

 

[Raftina]

Why care about delid if you are not going to do some heavy OC? Assuming its an issue at all.

I was under the impression that the stock thermal paste, like every other thermal paste, dries out and degrades significantly in performance over a matter of a few years, even if there is no OC. Is that not true?

What graphics card are you using with your i7 920 currently?

I am using a GTX 960. The system is being used to play games--and more or less only to do that. My primary machine has a L7500 whose snappiness I am perfectly happy with in everyday tasks.

 

[ShintaiDK]

I was under the impression that the stock thermal paste, like every other thermal paste, dries out and degrades significantly in performance over a matter of a few years, even if there is no OC. Is that not true?

Never heard about that. And I havent seen any of such issue on my 3570K or 4670.

 

[Hi-Fi Man]

TIM drying out has happened on some older CPUs such the lower clocked 65nm Athlon 64s. It's not common but has happened.

 

[frozentundra123456]

I have somewhat... unusual goals.

• Build should last 6+ years without replacing the mobo or CPU
• mini ITX format, probably in a Silverstone ML07 case
• Not very demanding CPU wise: my i7-920 rarely gets over 50% load, and I'm unlikely to place more demand on it. The only reason I am replacing the build is because I hate how big, heavy, and power-hungry my current build is.
• I prefer to not have to delid at any point.

Option 1: Build a Skylake based build with a mITX board
Option 2: Build a build using the ASRock X99E-ITX/AC motherboard and a 85W Xeon

Main reason I am considering the Xeon is that it has a soldered IHS, so I don't need to worry about having to delid because the TIM between the die and IHS dried out over the next 3-5 years.

Related: Do all LGA 2011-3 Xeons have soldered IHS, or is it just the higher end models?

If you dont like how power hungry your current build is, I definitely would not go x99.
What do you use the computer for? It actually sounds like an i3 would be sufficient for your use. What gpu are you using? If you arent gaming, the igp should be more than sufficient. I would not worry about the TIM drying out.

But TBH, from an economic standpoint, it would take you many, many years to recoup the cost of a new system from energy savings. Now if you just want to be efficient for its own sake, or for less noise, heat output, etc. that is another matter.

 

[Pheesh]

I was under the impression that the stock thermal paste, like every other thermal paste, dries out and degrades significantly in performance over a matter of a few years, even if there is no OC. Is that not true?

No that is not true. The thermal paste between the IHS and CPU is really only a concern for the top 1% of overclockers who want to push their chips as much as possible, and even then the majority of OC'ers manage just fine with the stock paste.

Even for OC'ers they don't need soldered chips...its just nice because its easier to cool when overclocking...so really there's no reason you should need to get one when you won't be OC'ing at all. Go for skylake.

 

[know of fence]

But TBH, from an economic standpoint, it would take you many, many years to recoup the cost of a new system from energy savings. Now if you just want to be efficient for its own sake, or for less noise, heat output, etc. that is another matter.

Say 1000 W power supply is optimized to run at about half of that, that's 10 cents an hour, with about 9 thousand hours in a year 24/7, that is 900 EUR.

Another quick rule of thumb is that for Europe 1 W is pretty much 2 EUR/a, for the US it's maybe 1 USD/a though there is considerable variation.
As a product of wattage and time costs can blow up quickly into the order of magnitude of PC prices.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Well, I am always arguing for the more efficient solution, but it doesnt sound like the OP runs his system maxed out 24 hours a day, and your math doesnt add up in any case. Lets assume the OP can save 100 watts per hour of heavy use, 5 hours per day, 20cents per kwh that is 10 cents per day, or less than 40 dollars per year. Worth it to buy a more efficient cpu if you need a system, but hardly enough to justify replacing an existing system based on cost alone.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I was under the impression that the stock thermal paste, like every other thermal paste, dries out and degrades significantly in performance over a matter of a few years, even if there is no OC. Is that not true?
. . .

Just to clarify, "some-a-do, and some-a-don't." IC Diamond doesn't degrade or dry out: micronized diamond doesn't change, doesn't pump out, doesn't "go anywhere." The metal formulations are also likely to work indefinitely with unwavering effectiveness.

 

[escrow4]

Passmark is only a vague indicator but current Haswell i3's score well over 5000 marks, that 920 can barely crack 5000. An i3 4370 would run @ 3.8GHz, have HD 4600 and 4MB of cache and would satisfy your demands. The i3 41xx are clocked slightly lower, have 3MB cache and HD 4400 if you can't find a 43xx model.

It would also dump way way less heat and suck way less power on a way more modern platform. You could wait for Skylake i3s but a Haswell one is half decent. And yes I am using one. It is just as fluid as a 4770 I had. Desktop/browsing is more or less indistinguishable.

 

[know of fence]

Well, I am always arguing for the more efficient solution, but it doesnt sound like the OP runs his system maxed out 24 hours a day, and your math doesnt add up in any case. Lets assume the OP can save 100 watts per hour of heavy use, 5 hours per day, 20cents per kwh that is 10 cents per day, or less than 40 dollars per year. Worth it to buy a more efficient cpu if you need a system, but hardly enough to justify replacing an existing system based on cost alone.

It's clear what you are saying, I just don't like these conservative estimates and the usual implication "Well it's 36.5 $, and maybe +X amount for an OC."
My math and everyone else's math, really doesn't add up when it comes to energy costs, it actually multiplies, with time by far being the biggest multiplier (8766 h/a).
I'm interested in questions like when is it worth it to buy a separate PC for games and when does an old desktop become a money drain. If I were a real nerd I'd probably make a spread sheet/web page for that, then offset my energy cost with advertising income.